CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #2

[oceanblueeyes]

The problem for DuGal is he couldn't get any more search warrants. So therefore he only had whatever DK would give him

The difference with the murder police in 2014 is they have way more scope and resource.

For instance, I would suggest, with 4 bodies on their hands, that they were able to get at least phone records for close business associates of Joey McStay

We need to wait to hear from those detectives before we start buying in to the whole DK did it stuff too heavily

While it's not the state's place to prove someone else is innocent like DK for example they do know by trial time what the defense theory is going to be.

When the defense case is SODDI in every trial I've seen the prosecutor had compelling evidence in their arsenal to disprove those claims.

Recently the same SODDI strategy was used in the Daron Wint quadruple murder trial.

Over and over the defense espoused to the jury DW was innocent and his 2 brothers were the ones involved. The problem for the defense was they had no evidence to support any of their claims. Juries know just because attorneys claim something it doesn't make it true no matter how many times its said.

Imo this case took a much different turn than when SD was investigating a missing persons case where they decided all 4 left willingly on their own.

So what the SD police did or did not do will not be nearly as important as what the SB homicide investigators did. It's a completely different ball game from then on out.

I dont have one doubt that DK was investigated throughly along with his alibi by the homicide investigators.

I also believe the state has evidence done during the homicide investigation that will show DK had no involvement in the murders just like the state did in Wint's trial.

Imo one of the most common defense tactics used in murder trials is the SODDI defense and prosecutors have long been aware of that tactic and they make sure they are fully prepared to refute those claims at trial.

Jmo

 

[Lilibet]

Good post OBE. But I haven’t had my coffee yet. SODDI? Some other dope did it?

 

[mrjitty]

While it's not the state's place to prove someone else is innocent like DK for example they do know by trial time what the defense theory is going to be.

When the defense case is SODDI in every trial I've seen the prosecutor had compelling evidence in their arsenal to disprove those claims.

Recently the same SODDI strategy was used in the Daron Wint quadruple murder trial.

Over and over the defense espoused to the jury DW was innocent and his 2 brothers were the ones involved. The problem for the defense was they had no evidence to support any of their claims. Juries know just because attorneys claim something it doesn't make it true no matter how many times its said.

Imo this case took a much different turn than when SD was investigating a missing persons case where they decided all 4 left willingly in their own.

So what the SD police did or did not do will not be nearly as important as what the SB homicide investigators did. It's a completely different ball game from then on out.

I dont have one doubt that DK was investigated throughly along with his alibi by the homicide investigators.

I also believe the state has evidence done during the homicide investigation that will show DK had no involvement in the murders just like the state did in Wint's trial.

Imo one of the most common defense tactics used in murder trials is the SODDI defense and prosecutors have long been aware of that tactic and they make sure they are fully prepared to refute those claims at trial.

Jmo

Completely agree with all this.

I guess what is unfortunate right now, is because the state is calling witnesses essentially to paint a timeline in chrono, they called the worst detective first.

But I also suspect the idea was to get him out of the way early and then have the juicy stuff closer to closing time

 

[Force Ten]

Trouble is there is no way to know if the security camera timestamp is accurate

I've played around with this idea of the time stamp being off by a few minutes or more. We now know it to be a newer system, not an old or possible faulty one. I would also venture to say LE probably corroborated the time stamp on the hard drive.

 

[Force Ten]

Remember DuGal basically worked a missing persons case on his lonesome.

In 2014 come the murder police from a different department and spend a year on painstaking gathering of evidence with a well resourced investigation.

We have not heard from them yet as the Prosecution is basically calling the witnesses in chrono order.

Do we really believe they spent no time on DK?

They did spend some time investigating DK and I'm confident this will come out in testimony from the SB detectives. They confiscated DK's computers at least. There was no "confirmation bias" as the defense claims. I'm certain the defense will be eating quite a bit of crow in the coming days and weeks.

 

[mrjitty]

I've played around with this idea of the time stamp being off by a few minutes or more. We now know it to be a newer system, not an old or possible faulty one. I would also venture to say LE probably corroborated the time stamp on the hard drive.

If they did corroborate it - that fact should be in evidence somehow?

 

[la2cabo]

TY. I want to see this in person.

The address for the court is:
247 W Third
San Bernardino, CA

It's a new building with plenty of parking. Be cautious though, it's in a crappy part of town.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Completely agree with all this.

I guess what is unfortunate right now, is because the state is calling witnesses essentially to paint a timeline in chrono, they called the worst detective first.

But I also suspect the idea was to get him out of the way early and then have the juicy stuff closer to closing time

Exactly.

They have no choice but to put the SD 'keystone' cops on the stand.

That's the lousy hand the SD police has dealt them.

The evidence will get much more compelling once the timeline changes from a missing person investigation to an all out quadruple homicide investigation.

We just have to be patient although hard to do.

The state always waits to put their best witnesses and evidence in at the end of their CIC.

I hope the defense puts on their own CIC because many times the state's rebuttal witnesses reveal even more evidence against the defendant.

The judge may have ruled certain evidence can only come in if the defense puts on their own CIC and opens the door.

Imo

 

[Emi]

Good morning everyone! I am going to post the tweets and am marking my spot

 

[Tortoise]

My live feed has just come to life

Watch Live: McStay Family Murder Trial Day 9

 

[Emi]

Cathy Russon on Twitter
#McStay - Our camera is ready to go. Waiting for judge to take the bench. Watch Live: Watch Live: McStay Family Murder Trial Day 9

Cathy Russon on Twitter
#McStay - Defense attorney Rajan Maline just walked in. Should be getting started soon.

 

[Tortoise]

I'm convinced the defense keeps trying to get info to the jury by asking questions they know will be disallowed on objection.

 

[Emi]

Cathy Russon on Twitter
#McStay - Joe Sequeida continues his testimony from last Thursday. He's under cross examination by Rajan Maline. Watch Live: Watch Live: McStay Family Murder Trial Day 9 Cathy Russon on Twitter

 

[oceanblueeyes]

They did spend some time investigating DK and I'm confident this will come out in testimony from the SB detectives. They confiscated DK's computers at least. There was no "confirmation bias" as the defense claims. I'm certain the defense will be eating quite a bit of crow in the coming days and weeks.

Refresh my memory please.

How long did it take for them to arrest Merritt once the bodies were discovered?

Tia

 

[Texas Red]

Yes - great anecdote.

IMO there is no serious possibility CM is innocent. Even if you can believe the stealing of the money is just bad timing for poor chase, the backdating cannot be explained.

Interesting, two varied standards, guilty beyond a reasonable doubt or innocent beyond a serious possibility. If I were the defendant, I know which one I would want the jury to use.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I'm convinced the defense keeps trying to get info to the jury by asking questions they know will be disallowed on objection.

Of course. That is SOP for defense attorneys. Shows what sneaky snakes many of them are and one of the reasons defense attorneys are so disliked.

Most dont play by the rules set forth by the judges.

Imo

 

[wary]

Refresh my memory please.

How long did it take for them to arrest Merritt once the bodies were discovered?

Tia

They arrested him almost exactly a year later. And considering that they had a brutal murder of a family of four to deal with, I feel confident that they spent that year in serious investigation.

ETA: In contrast, the San Diego police had a vaguely possible scenario of voluntary departure to tempt them to inaction.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Interesting, two varied standards, guilty beyond a reasonable doubt or innocent beyond a serious possibility. If I were the defendant, I know which one I would want the jury to use.

Defendants are never found innocent in any criminal trial.

Its either G or NG. If its NG all that means is the jury felt they didnt have enough evidence to find him G....not that they believe he/she was innocent.

The only way anyone can be found innocent is if they are exonerated later on due to irrefutable evidence showing they are innocent.

That only happens after the defendant has been found guilty in the criminal justice system.

Imo CM if convicted he will never be ruled innocent.

I've never heard of the other standard you post about being innocent.

May I ask what legal site you got that from. That seems more like in a civil trial were it's a preponderance of the evidence threshold which is much lower than in criminal cases. It means more likely than not (49/50) etc the defendant can be found guilty in a civil trial Tia

 

[oceanblueeyes]

They arrested him almost exactly a year later. And considering that they had a brutal murder of a family of four to deal with, I feel confident that they spent that year in serious investigation.

ETA: In contrast, the San Diego police had a vaguely possible scenario of voluntary departure to tempt them to inaction.

Thanks. That certainly isnt a quick arrest by any means.

Ita...they thoroughly investigated every aspect of the case before they arrested CM.

So where in the heck is confirmation bias coming from?

Seems out of thin air.

 

[Texas Red]

Agree, esp. when the passenger was in the habit of taking off their shoes/flip flops/sandals when going on drives, as seen in their video on the way to the new house (about the 5 min. mark bare toes are visible propped on the dashboard):

Wow, first time I’ve heard their voices, I find it freaky and rather haunting.