CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #6

[mrjitty]

Didn't know you were a kiwi... knew you were way off of our time, but didn't realize that far

I'm actually in germany!

Cali is the worst time zone for me as most of the trial happens long after i have given up for the day

 

[asyousay]

I really think until then he thought he could continue to manipulate Joey just like he had done for several years.

He thought he could give Joey some excuse, and he would believe it.

Oh this was very personal no doubt.

He was going to show Joey what happens when Joey shuts him out from being able to be a part of the cash cow.

He had milked the old cow before already for thousands he never repaid. But now there was going to be a new much fatter cash cow flowing with lots money that would give him many more opportunities to con Joey out of even more money.

Imo CM had been able to manipulate Joey for years. He thought Joey would continue to be that same easygoing guy who was all talk, but really wouldnt do anything about it.

Joey even loaned him thousands to pay his huge gambling debts. I don't think one other person would have done that. So he knew Joey was an easy target, and easy to manipulate.

He underestimated Joey's response on the 4th. His manipulation con game of Joey wasn't working like it had for years.

It had worked for several years on Joey. He wouldnt have any reason to believe it wouldnt work now. Just spin another tale like so many times before.

Imo

I think there is a big difference in Joey helping Chase out than Chase forging a cheque and trying to persuade Joey it was nothing major.

One is a complete betrayal of trust and was never gonna be forgiven. Joey may of been soft but I don’t think he was a complete idiot.

I have lent friends money before (small amounts lol) but trust me it would be a whole different kettle of fish if they went into my bank account,

 

[mrjitty]

But if what JMarsh has been theorizing... he didn't have access to the other account and if Joey was gone, no one to record them on the other account. The defense is saying hey look... every time he did something, he called Joey right after to tell him.

The defence needs to place this theory in evidence

Otherwise "telling him" is wild speculation, yet knowledge within the purvey of the accused to which he must testify.

You can't on the one hand claim that Chase told Joey about all these cheques, yet on the other hand refuse to testify to it.

 

[mrjitty]

I think there is a big difference in Joey helping Chase out than Chase forging a cheque and trying to persuade Joey it was nothing major.

One is a complete betrayal of trust and was never gonna be forgiven. Joey may of been soft but I don’t think he was a complete idiot.

I have lent friends money before (small amounts lol) but trust me it would be a whole different kettle of fish if they went into my bank account,

Exactly.

That is why this is highly relevant as motive.

Of course the defence wants to explain it away as no big deal but I would be pissed!

 

[Longtimenoc]

deleted, duplicate and nonsensical post

 

[Longtimenoc]

The only account Chase is ever thought to have accessed is the CUSTOM account. So I don't know what you mean that we are not talking about that account.

Check # 4093 does not show up in any of the court records, cashed or otherwise. So my guess, it was never cashed. My guess is that it is never generated under that check #. Only the 4200 series checks were (I have to look it up but Chase's check # were 4237-4244 I think . This information is in the affidavits for the search warrants.

Having a hard time trying to reply this morning, so if you see mumbo jumbo here and elsewhere please ignore.

What I wanted to reply concerns item 828 from Scroeders prior testimony. This is a check record item # 4093 listing a balance at top of $89724, vendor charles merritt for 4k. Dated Feb 4th. It can be found on You Tube part 1 of the sergeant's testimony.

 

[Bernina]

7:03 JM paid for lunch on his credit/debit card at Chick-fil-a

 

[geevee]

7:03 JM paid for lunch on his credit/debit card at Chick-fil-a

"I'm almost positive that he paid for Chik Fli A with his credit card..."

If so, then we should see a credit card statement to that effect at some point? Or that the investigators went through all of his cc accounts and found no transaction?

 

[Bernina]

FYI during this recent recording.
It was Chase claiming to have a heart attack years ago.
The way this post was published today, I thought Chase had a heart attack in the courtroom. Not the case.
He is still very much alive and kicking.

(LOL, KALI!) I was just going through his interview will LE and will probably pick through it more in the next few days.....his claim of a heart attack was a question raised awhile back when the trial started, so there it is. I could swear, years back when we were dissecting this case on the old WS platform, that LE got a warrant for the hospital to verify his claim.
I'm looking for when he claimed he didn't have passwords to email and all that .
I DID hear that he said JM gave him some checks when he saw him at the restaurant (you know, the one's CM backdated) and I'll snag that.
BTW: Good catch on the President's Day/gf stuff.
What REALLY makes me angry? If California had made him do his full sentences back in the day, this wouldn't have happened. His PO's gave him enough rope to tighten the noose, but they never hung him. Violation after violation, and they let him slide. Regardless if you believe Chase is innocent or not, he's a vile human being and isn't fit to walk among us. I despise liars and thiefs.

 

[Longtimenoc]

Having a hard time trying to reply this morning, so if you see mumbo jumbo here and elsewhere please ignore.

What I wanted to reply concerns item 828 from Scroeders prior testimony. This is a check record item # 4093 listing a balance at top of $89724, vendor charles merritt for 4k. Dated Feb 4th. It can be found on You Tube part 1 of the sergeant's testimony.

And then I want add, we know that this was the trial run check never cashed.

But, the real check 4093 was produced on 2-5-10 and cashed at Union Bank. By chase. He had opened the acount with a 200 real check from JM

 

[asyousay]

"I'm almost positive that he paid for Chik Fli A with his credit card..."

If so, then we should see a credit card statement to that effect at some point? Or that the investigators went through all of his cc accounts and found no transaction?

I definitely want to see proof of him paying and the cost of the meals as I’m not still convinced Chase met him for Lunch.

 

[Longtimenoc]

@Tortoise - I believe you are the "keeper" of the check #s - ??

I've put this together - and have some questions on which check #s go with the amounts, if you don't mind my asking?
re check #s

Monday, February 1 continued –
12:24pm – user Joseph McStay added Charles Merritt as a vendor. Per Preliminary hearing – page 104: this transaction did NOT happen from either the McStay’s desktop or laptop. It looks like CM created vendor account ("charlesmerritt" lower case) in Quickbooks using his computer and printed a couple test checks for $2,500 that he never cashed.
12:34pm – a check made out to charles merritt, all lower-case letters, for amount of $2500 – memo line “deposit” per Preliminary hearing – page 104
12:37pm – another check added to charles merritt, for same amount $2500 – memo line “deposit” per Prelim. Hearing – page 104. Check #s 4093 & 4092. (ref: CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #4 post #906 by Tortoise.

12:38pm – user printed check written at 12:24pm. Check #s?
12:47pm – user deleted check written at 12:37pm. Check #s?
12:52pm – user deleted check written at 12:34pm. Check #s?

ck 4092 = $2500; ck 4093 = $2500 - both deleted.


Tuesday, February 2
*11:27am – CM - check for zero dollars created, printed, deleted. Per Prelim hearing (page 106) user added check to Charles Merritt in the amount of zero dollars – memo line “deposit, sa. 1001”.
11:28am – user printed the check written at 11:37am.
11:29am – user added check to charles merritt amount of $2495 – memor line “deposit sa, 1001”, check dated 2-2-10 per Prelim hearing page 107 and none of this occurred on McStay’s desktop or laptop. (CM then printed out and CASHED a check for $2,495 to a Union Bank account. It's possible this first check was actually CASHED against Joseph McStay's Union Bank account, but it was not clear. Not sure if CM also had a Union Bank account.)
11:34am – user printed check written at 11:29am – per Prelim hearing (page 108) – check cashed on 2-2-10 at Union Bank by CM.

check # for $2495?


Wednesday, February 3–
CM opens a Bank of America account with $200 check; $100 deposited and another $100 taken as cash; check from EIP consistent with Joseph McStay handwriting - per Prelim hearing page 129-130.

check # for $200?


Thursday, February 4
1pm - Joey called his Union Bank. The same bank where CM had cashed the $2,495 check two days earlier. IMO, this is when JM first found out Chase had cashed the fraudulent check. This also would be around the time of the lunch meeting in Rancho Cucamonga.

1pm – 3pm - per CM received a legitimate $200 handwritten check from JM. CM used that check to open a B of A account.

7:59pm - someone used the McStay Desktop computer to create (@ 7:59pm) and delete (@ 8:05pm) a Quickbooks check for $4,000. This check was never deposited or cashed. The memo line on this check said, Paul Mitchell check dated 2-4-10. Per Prelim hearing page 109 – transaction from McStay’s desktop;

check # for $4000?
Note:
DEVICE 4 -
Index 2 - intuit - 8:03:23 pm (file name is check[1].htm screenshot of webpage showing check made out to chase merritt $4000.
Index 3 - intuit - 7:59:42 (selectprint[1].htm) Print Checks Setup shows check again made to charles merritt $4000.00, check #4093 (showed current balance as $89, 724.50)

Is that correct - I have this from the prelim hearing....

But then we have this - below - ??


Friday, February 5
12:06pm – user added check (#4093) to charles merritt for $4500 – memo line: Paul Mitchell, dated 2-5-10 per Prelim hearing page 111. Per Prelim hearing page 114 – check was cashed on 2-5-10 by Charles at Union bank. (Flurry of checks created, printed, deleted. A $4,500 check was CASHED at Union Bank. Metro Sheet Metal checks were written ($1650 & $250) and later delivered in person to Metro by CM. $2,350 check was printed and deposited in B of A. The checks on this date that were cashed/deposited appeared to have forged Joseph McStay signatures.)
12:12pm – user printed check written at 12:06pm; date changed 2-4-10;
12:19pm – user added metro sheet metal as vendor.
12:21pm – user added check to metro sheet for $1650 (check #4236) – memo line: “Misc. Manufactuer”, check backdated to 2-4-10 per Prelim hearing page 113.
12:25pm – check written to Metro Sheet Metal for $250 (check #4238, backdated to 2-4-10 and printed.
12:29pm – user added check to charles merritt for $6505 – memo line: “Balance SA (1001)”, check backdated to 2-4-10. This check is printed.
12:33pm – another check written to Charles Merritt for $2350, backdated to 2-4-10. This check deposited at Bank of America by CM (page 114 Prelim hearing).
12:38pm – user deleted check written at 12:29pm – per Prelim hearing page 112. ($6505 ck)

Do I have the correct check #s?
check # 4093 = $4500
check # 4236 = $1650
check # 4238 = $250
check # for $6505 ?
check # for $2350?

February 8 –
2:20pm – QuickBooks activity – user added check to Charles Merritt for $6,500 memo line: “saudi arabia final”, check backdated to 2-4-10 per Prelim hearing page 115; check was printed and deleted and deposited into CM’s BofA account on the next day Feb. 9th.
2:44pm – user canceled QuickBooks online subscription.

check # for $6500 ?


Thanks a bunch. I shall put the check #s on my Timeline list.

This is sooo helpful Niner

 

[Bernina]

I find it so hypocritical to say that it's suspicious that Chase couldn't remember what he did on what day when we hear 2 officers asking him what he did on the 8th and to help him remember they tell him it's President's day.. a holiday... kids weren't in school. President's day was only 2 days previous and they couldn't remember that? but they expect him to remember every detail.

But what's telling is he didn't correct them, and neither did his GF. It threw him off of his pre-scripted line of babble and his GF got sucked right into it, even though she had kids who obviously had that day off from school.
LE doesn't have to be truthful in these interviews.

 

[Longtimenoc]

If this was true though he would never of forged the cheque on the 2nd. He knew when he did that his goose would be cooked, not even Joey would forgive that after everything he had done for Chase.

That’s why this is more than just greed it was personal. Something happened that made Chase think to hell with it all and the Mcstays.

I think he's a predator and uses people to get what he wants. Look how smoothly he ripped his customers off and just walked away. JM was played by this guy for a couple years and never really knew him until it was too late.

 

[asyousay]

I think he's a predator and uses people to get what he wants. Look how smoothly he ripped his customers off and just walked away. JM was played by this guy for a couple years and never really knew him until it was too late.

Yes this I agree with he used people but he never used violence or murdered people. Which is why this was personal and not simply greed.

Something happened that made this escalate out of control and end in a family losing their lives.


Maybe it all does simply boil down to Summer and his complete and utter hatred of her that set him over the edge.

 

[Bernina]

If this was true though he would never of forged the cheque on the 2nd. He knew when he did that his goose would be cooked, not even Joey would forgive that after everything he had done for Chase.

That’s why this is more than just greed it was personal. Something happened that made Chase think to hell with it all and the Mcstays.

He thought he could help himself to JM's account and he wouldn't get found out by JM. JM busted him almost immediately. Thus the calls back and forth between JM, the bank, and CM. JM told his dad that morning that things were fine, by mid day the proverbial stuff hit the fan. I really think JM was pissed and ready to get the authorities involved. And CM panicked.

 

[asyousay]

He thought he could help himself to JM's account and he wouldn't get found out by JM. JM busted him almost immediately. Thus the calls back and forth between JM, the bank, and CM. JM told his dad that morning that things were fine, by mid day the proverbial stuff hit the fan. I really think JM was pissed and ready to get the authorities involved. And CM panicked.

Chase was not stupid he knew would get caught. It was his F*ck you to Joey.

Anybody who did what Chase did would get caught.

What makes you think Chase would get away with that it’s totally traceable and easily detected?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think there is a big difference in Joey helping Chase out than Chase forging a cheque and trying to persuade Joey it was nothing major.

One is a complete betrayal of trust and was never gonna be forgiven. Joey may of been soft but I don’t think he was a complete idiot.

I have lent friends money before (small amounts lol) but trust me it would be a whole different kettle of fish if they went into my bank account,

I understand why you think this way.

I do not, this is very same man who was able to con this same man out of 43k to his pay his gambling debts, even though Joey knew he went right back to feeding his addiction losing more money.

I would guess to say there arent that many that could be manipulated in doing such a thing for a gambling addict. Yet we know Joey did.

He had to fully believe CM sob story, hook, line, and sinker. Just like when he gave CM money which included funds CM was supposed to pay to the material supplier. So Joey knew this wasn't done, and he wound up having to pay the supplier after already giving it to CM.

But what did Joey do even then? Kept CM as his subcontractor anyway.

So yes, I do believe CM thought he could just tell one of his tale tales, and Joey would buy it just like he had always done for years.

Imo

 

[asyousay]

I understand why you think this way.

I do not, this is very same man who was able to con this same man out of 43k to his pay his gambling debts, even though Joey knew he went right back to feeding his addiction losing more money.

I would guess to say there arent that many that could be manipulated in doing such a thing for a gambling addict. Yet we know Joey did.

He had to fully believe CM sob story, hook, line, and sinker. Just like when he gave CM money which included funds CM was supposed to pay to the material supplier. So Joey knew this wasn't done, and he wound up having to pay the supplier after already giving it to CM.

But what did Joey do even then? Kept CM as his subcontractor anyway.

So yes, I do believe CM thought he could just tell one of his tale tales, and Joey would buy it just like he had always done for years.

Imo

I think the flaw is that Joey was such a lovely guy that If Chase asked him to borrow him money then he would have.

So the fact he stole is a clue to knowing that something had happened that meant Joey wasn’t going to be the sugar daddy any longer or Chase could of just asked to borrow more money instead of ruining everything.


I think Summer had finally had enough of Chase and Joey and her had a discussion (argument) about finances and Chase had to go.

IMO

 

[Cricket28]

So we need to see if the checks created in the Custom account were ever recorded in the Contact account, where the balance would be tracked.

It makes no sense that those check amounts would be deleted, if they were not noted or recorded in the main account.

BBM

Exactly. Also, According to OS on 2/4/2010 JM gave CM a handwritten check for $100.00. The same day JM's QB was accessed by a computer not belonging to the McStays and that check to CM for $2,595.00 was created and cashed. Why would JM give CM a check for $100.00 then say, now go and write yourself a check from my QB for $2,595.00. Doesn't make sense. IMO. I think maybe his rent was due and he was desperate because he didn't have the money to cover it. But that is just my speculation.
A few other things:
-CM has claimed that JM would give him blank checks for supplies. But if you look at their phone logs, JM was the one calling and probably ordering the supplies. I don't remember any suppliers listed on CM's log. I'll have to go back and see just how much of CM's phone log we've seen.
-It's kind of curious that the QB activity stopped around 2/8/10. The day the Trooper was dropped off at the border and the day before CM notified JM's mom that he couldn't get a hold of JM.

ALL MOO