GUILTY CA - Leila Fowler, 8, murdered, 12yo charged, Valley Springs, 27 Apr 2013 - #4

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MsFacetious said:
I would let her realize the truth at her own pace... and support her along the way.

This mother has both fought for justice for her daughter and treatment for her son.
She has also fought for him to remain incarcerated because she believes he's still a danger.

http://www.theellafoundation.com/biography/charity-lee/

The thread here on this case with more links:

2007: 4-year-old fatally stabbed; 13 yr old brother arrested - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

I would read about her... and maybe even contact her for advice on how to support Priscilla. :twocents:
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No one can truly know what any of those parents are going through right now, but the only people who could come closest would be a parent who has gone through the same thing. I second MrsF's suggestion that you make contact with her. Perhaps arrangements could even be made for the parents who wished to make contact with her also.
 
mysteriew said:
No one can truly know what any of those parents are going through right now, but the only people who could come closest would be a parent who has gone through the same thing. I second MrsF's suggestion that you make contact with her. Perhaps arrangements could even be made for the parents who wished to make contact with her also.
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It is a blessing that there are people out there that can be turned to for guidance at a time like this but it is also horrifying that this has happened so many times that there are parents who have travelled this road and survived the trip. Children should not be killing children and no parent should ever find them self having to weigh justice for one child against supporting another.
 
vasportsmom said:
If I post something on a completely open Facebook then you can assume that I am proudly displaying it.
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Words have meaning. When I say something in public, it doesn't necessarily mean I am speaking with an attitude of "PRIDE". As in: "Boy am I proud to be talking about my tonails!"

Again, facebook posts made AFTER the murder are no indication of how their family life really worked. The stresses those families are under are exponentially greater and their fuses unmeasurably short.

vasportsmom said:
If the "face" I am so proudly displaying in that way is unflattering at best and bordering on something much worse then you can guarantee that the "face" I hide behind closed doors is much worse.
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No you cant. Again, posts made after such a huge trauma give no indication of how their family life really worked.

vasportsmom said:
If I'm raising kids in that environment then you can be assured that my kids deserve much better.
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Faulty logic. You assume you are right and then draw a conclusion. I'm telling you that reactions displayed after the murder give no indication on how they really lived.
 
Jhon said:
Words have meaning. When I say something in public, it doesn't necessarily mean I am speaking with an attitude of "PRIDE". As in: "Boy am I proud to be talking about my tonails!"

Again, facebook posts made AFTER the murder are no indication of how their family life really worked. The stresses those families are under are exponentially greater and their fuses unmeasurably short.



No you cant. Again, posts made after such a huge trauma give no indication of how their family life really worked.



Faulty logic. You assume you are right and then draw a conclusion. I'm telling you that reactions displayed after the murder give no indication on how they really lived.
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I just wanted to post and thank you for all of your posts like the one above! I had to step away from posting here because I don't want to violate TOS. Keep up the great work and thank you!

Hitting the button just wasn't enough!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Jhon said:
Words have meaning. When I say something in public, it doesn't necessarily mean I am speaking with an attitude of "PRIDE". As in: "Boy am I proud to be talking about my tonails!"

Again, facebook posts made AFTER the murder are no indication of how their family life really worked. The stresses those families are under are exponentially greater and their fuses unmeasurably short.



No you cant. Again, posts made after such a huge trauma give no indication of how their family life really worked.



Faulty logic. You assume you are right and then draw a conclusion. I'm telling you that reactions displayed after the murder give no indication on how they really lived.
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Idk about faulty logic but it is rather hypocritical to declare that I assumed that I was right and then drew a conclusion while you did the exact same thing.

You believe that grief can explain the inappropriate behavior and that's fine. I do not believe that grief changes who we are at the core. If you are in the habit of speaking of someone in a kind, mature, respectful way (and if you are co-parenting their children you darn well should be) then grief, especially shared grief, is not going to turn you into a cruel, vindictive person in regards to that person.
 
I also think it depends, many times people don't hide their feelings under stress, and express how they feel when normally they've learned to hide them. Especially in anger, I've always found people say exactly how they really feel when angry. At the time they just don't care, when normally to keep up appearance, they'll keep it to themselves.

However in this instance, concerning fb, it was the gf who was talking about the birth mother who just lost her child and another one arrested. The gf still has her how ever many children, so it was thoughtless, jmo.
 
vasportsmom said:
Idk about faulty logic but it is rather hypocritical to declare that I assumed that I was right and then drew a conclusion while you did the exact same thing.
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Respectfully, how did I do the exact same thing? I'm not assuming things about the family dynamic.

vasportsmom said:
You believe that grief can explain the inappropriate behavior and that's fine. I do not believe that grief changes who we are at the core.
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I believe that stress can explain short fuses. Grief is a major stress (edit: and this is not JUST grief, but a major trauma). I can tell you with absolute certainty that this happens (and has happened to my family). There's a REASON why many families don't survive such a tragedy -- they start biting each others heads off -- sometimes at the most irrelevant things. Financial stress also can lead to marriages falling apart (again, short fuses) and trust me -- an event like this is SOOO much bigger than too many bills.

vasportsmom said:
If you are in the habit of speaking of someone in a kind, mature, respectful way (and if you are co-parenting their children you darn well should be) then grief, especially shared grief, is not going to turn you into a cruel, vindictive person in regards to that person.
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Divorces can be dirty and ugly and messy. There can be a lot of anger between parting spouses -- and that DOESN'T automatically mean those issues are openly discussed in any given house.

What we know is that the father had sole custody. That usually doesn't happen without a reason. It's much more reasonable to expect the fathers household was a much better environment to the courts than the mothers. This is what we know. We do *NOT* know if there was open hostility under that roof. That is nothing but an unfounded guess.
 
The DSM-V is more of an insurance manual than what it was. It is more about coding than explaining the actual disorders as with DSM-IV. It does not even have the two axis. I have been reviewing it the past couple of days and it will be absolutely useless for students in an abnormal psych class.

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Jhon said:
Divorces can be dirty and ugly and messy. There can be a lot of anger between parting spouses -- and that DOESN'T automatically mean those issues are openly discussed in any given house.

What we know is that the father had sole custody. That usually doesn't happen without a reason. It's much more reasonable to expect the fathers household was a much better environment to the courts than the mothers. This is what we know. We do *NOT* know if there was open hostility under that roof. That is nothing but an unfounded guess.
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RSBM

The facebook was public and at least two of the children (one a minor) were on her friends list.
It's wonderful if things are not discussed IN the house and I would give a lot of credit for that.

However, with all the technology, it's more than just not saying things directly TO the kids.
You have to watch what you say around them, say online where they could read it, etc.

If you then put them on a PUBLIC facebook... anyone in the house can access that. (Including kids.) :twocents:
 
MsFacetious said:
RSBM

The facebook was public and at least two of the children (one a minor) were on her friends list.
It's wonderful if things are not discussed IN the house and I would give a lot of credit for that.

However, with all the technology, it's more than just not saying things directly TO the kids.
You have to watch what you say around them, say online where they could read it, etc.

If you then put them on a PUBLIC facebook... anyone in the house can access that. (Including kids.) :twocents:
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On top of that the whole nation and world could see it on her PUBLIC facebook comments. If they didn't see it directly on facebook, they could read or hear about it from anyone who saw it. How she even used her time to write that, after (what she calls) her daughter was savagely stabbed to death...I simply don't understand. I DO think it says quite a bit about the dynamics in that household.
 
MsFacetious said:
We got some Justice for Shaniya Davis today...
Her killer was found GUILTY on 6 out of the 7 charges against him...
He was found guilty of 1st degree murder. :woohoo:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=204207&page=20

For those who might have missed it.:seeya:
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Thank you so much for bringing this news over here! Justice for Shaniya and one more monster off the streets is such wonderful news. Justice isn't always as swift as we would like but hopefully this day will come for all our little lost angels.
 
MsFacetious said:
RSBM

The facebook was public and at least two of the children (one a minor) were on her friends list.
It's wonderful if things are not discussed IN the house and I would give a lot of credit for that.

However, with all the technology, it's more than just not saying things directly TO the kids.
You have to watch what you say around them, say online where they could read it, etc.

If you then put them on a PUBLIC facebook... anyone in the house can access that. (Including kids.) :twocents:
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I'm I missing something? Is there a history of public displays of anger or outrage between the families? I haven't seen it if it is.

I keep pointing out that if these posts everyone is so focused on were AFTER the trauma of the murder it doesn't say a SPECK of what happens NORMALLY under their roof. <modsnip>
 
That would be impossible, you never know how different any person is after a traumatic event, if you knew nothing about them before. Some people just like attention and fb or anywhere public can be used for the purpose of conveying their feelings to alot of people.

Maybe it's past issues, pain, guilt, mean spirited or to distract from themselves to try and make the other person appear as a liar. I'm just very glad we never heard it from either parent towards one another publicly. The record.net article was written without comments from the parents to the public and what was said by the reporter on part 1 of PR's video might have been in private and why she didn't give the second part. IMO

However, there are ways to speak without confronting or belittling. In every case it can and often does get worse, there's still a trial, maybe the lawyer put a stop to it before it does. Actually it was a very smart move on his part.
 
Jhon said:
I'm I missing something? Is there a history of public displays of anger or outrage between the families? I haven't seen it if it is.

I keep pointing out that if these posts everyone is so focused on were AFTER the trauma of the murder it doesn't say a SPECK of what happens NORMALLY under their roof. Please accept your two cents, back.
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I will say it again, I believe the respect you show your family after a tragedy...is very indicative to the respect you showed before. Instead of sparing her family from more grief and chaos, she contributed to it. I do think that is significant. You have every right to disagree, but I think her actions did show her attitude and bitterness.

How people behave after, can be very crucial in determining the state of their lives before. That's exactly why police use people's behavior during investigations. (Not that I'm saying the family is being investigated. Just that, behavior after does show very much.)
 
Dinaslala, since you are our link to P, can you please answer some questions to give some insight on her life?

Does P have family in N. CA? Wondering if L&I ever had a relationship with their maternal grandparents and aunts and uncles, etc...and if her family is comforting her at this time when she certainly must need support.

Did her family attend the funeral?

Did you know her before she fell on hard times? Has B had physical custody of the kids since their split or were they living with her?

Has she shared why/who kept her from attending the funeral? Hopefully, others are not trying to make her feel like she is to blame for this.

Sorry if these questions were already asked/answered. If so, I didn't see the posts.
 
Am I correct that police took into evidence a mattress, a TV and some firewood?

So that a scenario of someone stabbing this little girl in her bed, then, as they waited for her to die, watching some TV while they burnt evidence in the fireplace, would be possible?
 
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