CA - Massive fire at Oakland warehouse party, 36 dead, 2 Dec 2016 #2

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Here's an interesting article in the New York Times - it has a team that is promising in-depth investigation of the fire and the impact on Oakland in terms of safety, housing, etc.:

Less than one week after a blaze ripped through a ramshackle warehouse known as the Ghost Ship, this shocked city is grappling with an array of questions about what precisely happened, many of them deeply troubling.

To try to answer them, The New York Times is deploying a team of journalists across Oakland as part of an investigative reporting effort.

We would typically reveal our findings in an article published at the end of our reporting.

This time, though, we are doing something different: We are going to share regular updates on what we uncover as we do our reporting.

We’ll tell you about the interviews that our journalists conduct, the documents we obtain and what we learn as we learn it — as part of our effort to piece this story together.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/08/us/the-oakland-fire-delving-into-what-happened-and-why.html

In that article is a story about a similar warehouse, called the Deathtrap. Yikes! :scared:

No one answered the door at a building known as the Deathtrap, another warehouse inhabited by artists in West Oakland. Residents at many such collectives operating in the gray areas of the law are now very concerned about a crackdown.
 
My guess is at the time it sold last it was empty. So an inspection wouldn't have shown the issues that are the cause here.

Where I lived in MN the bank has requirements before they will finance a home. That is when problems are found. Thry have to be brought up to code or no bank money, The bank wants the return on lending money.

But if something is bought for cash, not sure what the stop gaps are
 
LinasK said:
I've been a Californian all my life. Moved from So. Cal to Nor Cal, knowing it was more expensive. Many of us like the environment here. I do have an nephew who moved from Calif. (Not Cali) to Minnesota and he and his wife and kids live there.
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rsd1200 said:
That's me, with where I'm from. I was born here, and raised here, and will likely live the rest of my life here. I've had the good fortune to have a good job and be able to travel, but this is my home. It's got its faults but so does everywhere else. One thing about humans, we are very adaptable. When times get tough I just cinch my belt a little tighter, figure something out, and go on.

I too was raised in California from age 4; moved from Marin County to Yolo County to So. Calif; then back to Nor Calif (Bay Area); had to move out of Mtn. View as the landlord raised our rent from $800/mo to $1400/mo!!! Then thankfully moved to Auburn for my job (rent $900/mo). But now I have had to move out of the U.S., as it was WAY to expense to live on my Social Security benefits after my husband died back in June. Rent was $1300/mo when I left. I live now in my parents' homeland. Rent $250/month in my bro's apartment house! But I sure miss California! It's COLD here! LOL!

Jax49 said:
Building inspectors had not been inside Oakland warehouse in 30 years, officials say

Boy - that doesn't seem right - worse and worse, as HMSHood said... unbelievable!

I too was wondering how many did survive this fire....

Gitana :grouphug: Thanks for posting that lovely picture of your SIL.

Late here - off to bed....
 
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I too was raised in California from age 4; moved from Marin County to Yolo County to So. Calif; then back to Nor Calif (Bay Area); had to move out of Mtn. View as the landlord raised our rent from $800/mo to $1400/mo!!! Then thankfully moved to Auburn for my job (rent $900/mo). But now I have had to move out of the U.S., as it was WAY to expense to live on my Social Security benefits after my husband died back in June. Rent was $1300/mo when I left. I live now in my parents' homeland. Rent $250/month in my bro's apartment house! But I sure miss California! It's COLD here! LOL!



Boy - that doesn't seem right - worse and worse, as HMSHood said... unbelievable!

I too was wondering how many did survive this fire....

Gitana :grouphug: Thanks for posting that lovely picture of your SIL.

Late here - off to bed....

I so agree , I would like to know how many people were there that night.

The best that I can ascertain, is the doorman who stated around 70 BUT one would think we ought to be able to get a confirmed close number???
 
This is all so strange to me. I am a why person. That is why NTSB stuff has been fascinating to me all my existence.

Once arson was basically ruled out ( the first 24 hours I had issues with all them being in a hotel- but in his own way he did explain that)

On a jetliner it does matter if it was a toilet motor or a coffee pot.

For some reason in this tragedy, its electrical, I am not concerned if it was a speaker or a toaster oven, obviously lots of electrical opportunities.

Does this make sense??
 
my step daughter, her fiancée and her daughter live in a garage studio apt and pay 1300.
My niece lives in San Francisco. I'm not sure what she's paying, but she managed to get into some sort of subsidized low income co-op place... before she found that she was renting someone's couch for 500!

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
 
I think for the most part people either got out with relatively no injuries or they didn't get out at all. I remember someone talking about it in one of the early interviews but I can't recall which one.

There were several that night that did go to hospital - but we never got as real number
 
I am in Ca cna start at minimum and can work up but I haven't known any that made 25. My husband's devil ex wife is an MA and makes 24 an hour by she works in a doc office cuz she likes the set hours. She may be able to make more at a hospital idk.

I am sorry that is FUNNY!!
 
$25/ hr for a CNA is very inflated, IMO, due to the union. $25/ hr is about $50K/ year. CNAs in our area make about $10-15/ hr, and I can't imagine any hospital system paying $25/ hr, even with an aggressive union. That is more than associate degree RNs and LPN's starting wage.

OT: At the bottom are some of nurses' hourly rates in California.
http://www.nationalnursesunited.org/site/entry/101-salaries

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5227/5730503683_03dfe5a056_z.jpg
 
Oh--then that explains the inflated wages for CNAs. The Bay Area is not really representative of those kind of typical CNA wages in other areas of the country, if that is what hospital systems there are willing to pay. (Geesh-- are generalist RNs making $100+ an hour at that rate? I have to call my friends in CA to get the scoop!)

OT chart is at bottom. Here are what some of the unionized nurses make in CA.
http://www.nationalnursesunited.org/site/entry/101-salaries

5730503683_03dfe5a056_z.jpg

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5227/5730503683_03dfe5a056_z.jpg
 
a very high percentage of properties are bought in cash around here.

Where I lived in MN the bank has requirements before they will finance a home. That is when problems are found. Thry have to be brought up to code or no bank money, The bank wants the return on lending money.

But if something is bought for cash, not sure what the stop gaps are
 
I am in Ca cna start at minimum and can work up but I haven't known any that made 25. My husband's devil ex wife is an MA and makes 24 an hour by she works in a doc office cuz she likes the set hours. She may be able to make more at a hospital idk.
Really? I'm in San Francisco, and nannies make more than that!
 
I'm not sure if this has been shared, but I took this photo at the memorial people set up on Castro in SF, yesterday. Gitana, I thought of you and your family when I left a note.
922ca5f2dbcd70c3fa9c9e553d215fbb.jpg
 
Our beautiful Jennifer has been identified. She died without suffering. She was unconscious in 15 minutes and was not touched by the fire. She died of smoke inhalation.
attachment.php

Thank you all for your incredible support. And love. And assistance. And a special thanks to Tricia and Linask who kept my confidences and communicated for me. A special thanks to Linask who drove over two hours round trip to pick me up and taken me to the Family Assistance Center and who saw things there that were incredibly difficult for her to see and who used such discretion in protecting the privacy of the families and officials she saw and spoke to and whose intense pain she witnessed. I know it shook her. But she was there for me.
You are all my cyber family.

Oh Gitana, my heart is breaking for you all over again. You have been in my thoughts and prayers all week. Sending you love and peace.

La Louve
 
I am so sorry for your loss, Gitana.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
 
Our beautiful Jennifer has been identified. She died without suffering. She was unconscious in 15 minutes and was not touched by the fire. She died of smoke inhalation.
attachment.php

Thank you all for your incredible support. And love. And assistance. And a special thanks to Tricia and Linask who kept my confidences and communicated for me. A special thanks to Linask who drove over two hours round trip to pick me up and taken me to the Family Assistance Center and who saw things there that were incredibly difficult for her to see and who used such discretion in protecting the privacy of the families and officials she saw and spoke to and whose intense pain she witnessed. I know it shook her. But she was there for me.
You are all my cyber family.

We hurt with you and your Family. May you get strength from each other and us.
 
http://journal.burningman.org/2016/12/news/global-news/oakland-fire/

A long post from December 5th on the Burning Man Journal, including an exhaustive list of fundraisers, supply donation sites, housing and counseling resources etc. etc. etc. Very much exemplifies the gift economy ethos of Burning Man participants and the creative energies of the Bay area.

OT but having spent my high school and university years in Sacramento and San Francisco in the late 60s and into the 70s, the Bay area is a true Cultural and Artistic touchstone for me. I would not be the person and artist I am today without the influence of the Bay Area art and music scene. Oakland and SF have always been gritty and beautiful at the same time. That's a big part of the appeal, I think. In my very humble opinion it would be a loss for the world if that creative heart was gone.

Anyway, I pray that something good comes out of this awful tragedy. I recognize small mercies already, like the fact that Gitana's sister-in-law was found and identified and passed the way she did.

Blessings to all touched and affected by this tragedy.

Many in the Burning Man community have been deeply affected by this tragic event, and many more across our global network have reached out to ask how we’re doing. In our tight-knit community of creatives, each of us has been touched if not directly, through friends of friends. The degrees of separation are minimal and the collective sense that “it could have been any of us” is as real as it is heartbreaking. We’re deeply saddened by this loss and we’re holding the victims and their friends and families close to our hearts.

True to the Burning Man spirit, we’re also asking ourselves what we can do, how we can help.

For those immediately affected, the Alameda County Coroner’s Bureau has established a Family Assistance Center with the American Red Cross at 2425 East 12th Street in Oakland. If you are trying to locate a loved one, you may go to the center or call 510-382-3000 for information.

Secondly, there are several active crowdfunding campaigns, including this one being hosted by the Gray Area Foundation for the Arts and this one, through which funds are being matched by the Oakland A’s, the Oakland Raiders, and the Golden State Warriors. For those of you in the Bay Area, there will be a vigil tonight from 8 PM – 10 PM at the Lake Merritt Pergola in Oakland. Below is a list of resources collected by some East Bay Burners. Please review and share with those in need.

We also must take a moment to consider what we can do as individuals to try to prevent disasters like this from occurring.

Our resident fire safety manager reminded us this morning that it’s very much about egress, exits, adequate fire suppression, and safety plans. There are little things we can all do to ensure the safety of ourselves and others, and it starts with being alert, aware and not afraid to speak up when we see something that impedes safety.

This is a time that calls for compassion, community support and learning. We can work collaboratively to inform and educate in an effort to prevent these kinds of accidents in the future. This can begin with encouraging venues and community spaces to review their safety protocols and fire response plans. Similarly, we can ask policymakers and agencies to work collaboratively with community spaces, landlords and venues of all kinds in a way that does not drive cultural spaces out of existence, but rather seeks to make a safe and welcome place for them in our cities.

We have already taken steps to reach out to those who have been displaced by this fire and are grieving, and in the days and weeks to come we will consider other ways to support those most affected by this tragedy. If you know of an event, fundraiser, or additional resource to add to this list, please let us know in the comments below.

Update: on December 5th the Kenneth Rainin Foundation announced $1.7 million in funding to support sustainable, long-term solutions to creating safe, affordable space for Oakland’s artists and arts organizations. Read the details here.

Lots lots more at the link.
 
]No one answered the door at a building known as the Deathtrap, another warehouse inhabited by artists in West Oakland. Residents at many such collectives operating in the gray areas of the law are now very concerned about a crackdown.[/I]

I understand why. They don't want to be forced to change or examine their lifestyle; they can't afford to live anywhere else and stay in the area. But really, they should be grateful someone out there cares about their living conditions and lives, tbh. JMO.
 
My condolences, Gitana ; for the loss of your loved one.
May Jennifer rest in love and peace.
 
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