Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020

[Mistree]

I didn't see anything that stands out.

Thank you. It might just be my eyesight but it looks as if the coloring is too laterally exact and touched up.

 

[Kiranerys]

I recall a couple of locals/neighbors giving a few comments. One was complaining the parents didn't come outside to say "boo" or whatever when some of the neighbors were out searching.
I haven't seen anything yet that suggests the neighbors regularly see or even know the kids.

Thats odd in itself isn't it? I mean you usually get worried locals commenting on what lovely awful kids they are and how they watched them playing in the yard with their siblings etc when children go missing. IMO

 

[Kiranerys]

Thank you. It might just be my eyesight but it looks as if the coloring is too laterally exact and touched up.

I see it,like the top of his lip is red or sore looking?

 

[Ontario Mom]

Thats odd in itself isn't it? I mean you usually get worried locals commenting on what lovely awful kids they are and how they watched them playing in the yard with their siblings etc when children go missing. IMO

Yes and no. Yes, neighbors usually comment on how they see the kids.
But also no, if the kids played out back regularly, and considering it looks like they don't have neighbors on either side, and the fact they've only been in that house for a few months, it not at all unusual for neighbors to have not seen or known the kids.

jmo

 

[imstilla.grandma]

According to the Megan's Law website, a California Department of Justice's operated domain, there are 14 convicted sex offenders within two miles of the missing boys' home. Two offenders live less than a mile away from the home.

"There is a lot of factors that are working against the investigators in the community so that's again the reason so many resources are brought in immediately," Carruesco said.

One major factor -- hundreds of miles of sprawling desert surrounding the small town of California City.
Former BPD Lt. weighs in on missing California City boys case, gives insight into investigation

 

[cvaldez1975]

Which is why I wondered if there were pics.
I think they can stand on the sidewalk but not the driveway.
People are concerned but like I stated there are more productive ways to get involved.
What about looking in the area past the house ?
Where would the boys have walked ?
Kids can walk farther than one would expect !
Yes I realize the SAR dogs didn't pick up a scent past the house, but searching is better than standing in someone's driveway.
That helps no one, and is going to upset the adoptive parents.
That sort of thing.

There are tons of places two small boys can 'hide' in and those people need to start looking and stop harassing.
Let LE do their job-- which they already are !
A search warrant isn't easily procured and a judge has to sign off on it.
Had to be something fairly important to be granted a search and seizure and the digging.
Imo.

this is late but i dont think there are sidewalks.

 

[MoeInVA]

After watching the shorter of the interview videos I was more suspicious of the adoptive parents. Once I saw the interview in its entirety I'm leaning more towards believing them. Just my two cents, but I'm leaning towards the adoptive parents knowing, or having a good idea, who it was who took them. I think that's why it turned to searching the property and phones etc so quickly. I think the adoptive parents and LE are looking towards certain leads and that's partly why they're instructing the parents to remain inside and why LE is remaining so quiet. I think they have a good idea of who would've taken them.

EDIT: Do we know if there was a search warrent for the search of the backyard and electronics? Or if they were voluntarily given to LE? I'm not too familiar with the process but it seemed like it went from missing to searching/seizing phones too quickly for a warrant. This is partially why I'm leaning towards above scenario.

I always think the bedate on whether or not there was firewood nearby is useless. Don't see any reason the dad would say that if he were making it up. Doesn't add to his story or "benefit" him.

In the 13 minute version posted by the reporter, TW says LE did have a warrant, but he doesn’t know why because they (TW and JW) would have given them anything they asked for voluntarily.
ETA link Bayan Wang 23ABC

 

[Dre]

If LE believed they had been abducted, there would be more searches, daily updates, BOLO,etc. they also wouldn’t have been able to get a warrant signed to dig up the back yard if evidence was pointing to abduction.

the firewood is in fact important to the case as it was the exact reason why the gate was open and why kids could have gotten out. The firewood is very important to the narrative as there would be too many questions as to why and how they were unattended and left the yard.

Moo

After watching the shorter of the interview videos I was more suspicious of the adoptive parents. Once I saw the interview in its entirety I'm leaning more towards believing them. Just my two cents, but I'm leaning towards the adoptive parents knowing, or having a good idea, who it was who took them. I think that's why it turned to searching the property and phones etc so quickly. I think the adoptive parents and LE are looking towards certain leads and that's partly why they're instructing the parents to remain inside and why LE is remaining so quiet. I think they have a good idea of who would've taken them.

EDIT: Do we know if there was a search warrent for the search of the backyard and electronics? Or if they were voluntarily given to LE? I'm not too familiar with the process but it seemed like it went from missing to searching/seizing phones too quickly for a warrant. This is partially why I'm leaning towards above scenario.

I always think the bedate on whether or not there was firewood nearby is useless. Don't see any reason the dad would say that if he were making it up. Doesn't add to his story or "benefit" him.

 

[Mistree]

I see it,like the top of his lip is red or sore looking?

Yes, and also to the sides of his little nose and down to his top lip.

 

[floridamomma]

Toddlers and small people who are daredevils and little risk takers, get hurt on a regular basis. Source: experience with raising 8 kids, 5 of which were reckless little people that got hurt a lot, and to this day, are still into risky sports & adrenaline rushes & have adventurous stories to brag about. Pliable or not, little kids can easily fracture a bone if they whack it in just the wrong way & with enough force.

My daughter was 3 when she had a large truck door slammed on her wrist. Due to her age, there was little damage, no long term damage. A wreck at 21 and my son lost several inches of femur...compound fracture.

Just mentioning it leads me to believe it was serious enough to leave a scar or limp, something obvious a stranger might recognize.

My craziest dare devils never broke a leg that young! Knock on wood, lol

MEO

 

[PommyMommy]

Idk about the firewood, another member posted that in the Zillow pics there is a fireplace in the house; but we know there were no chalk drawings.
Since someone pointed out that the adoptive dad has his arms wrapped around himself in the interview (which I took to be defensive posture but was probably due to the extreme cold) so he was just feeling the chill --- the kids may not have wanted to stay outside for long and went back into the house ?
MOO

No chalk marks in the yard?, my kids get that stuff everywhere in minutes!.
Have we heard any neighbours give interviews to msm yet?,any one in the vicinity who remembers seeing the boys recently if at all?.
The no recent photos is a bad sign IMO, if they are on JW phone as she suggests why would LE not use them?,makes no sense.

BBM My apologies, but I missed this and have been unsuccessful in finding the source of this information. Who said there were no chalk drawings? Can somebody link for me, please? MOO

 

[PommyMommy]

DEC 29, 2020
Police Chief gives update

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=677866299765472

• The chief was not aware that Orrin had a fractured leg.
• The chief says they do suspect foul play based on the fact that they don't know how the children left the yard.
• The search warrant was obtained easily - the kids were missing.
• The other children were removed as is routine until there is an investigation done by CPS.
• 11:05 Reporter: Did the luminol find anything? Chief: Not that I know of.
• Interesting facial expression when responding to a question about whether they are searching in Bakersfield. About 13:05.
• About 16:30 - the chief confirms that there has never been a sighting of any of the children since the family has been there (since September).
• He says near the end that he will have to look into whether or not the investigators want to release the 911 call.

 

[PommyMommy]

DEC 29, 2020
California City boys remain missing, no suspects identified, police chief says | KGET 17
... police on Tuesday said no suspects have been identified and asked the public to come forward with any information regarding the case.

California City Police Chief Jon Walker said “there are things in the works” but he declined to say what they were as he didn’t want to compromise the investigation. He said he does suspect foul play, but didn’t comment on whether he believed the boys were alive.

[...]

 

[margarita25]

(Slightly o/t, I had never heard of California City until I listened to the podcast:

California City

*posting in case there is any geographical reference, etc. which may be helpful)

 

[PommyMommy]

DEC 29, 2020
Two California boys, 3 and 4, vanish after adoptive father said he went to gather firewood | Fox News
[...]

... They said the adoptive parents have been cooperative and willingly came in for questioning and have stayed out of the home while police investigate.

The couple's four other children – two adopted and two biological – have been taken into protective custody. ...

[...]

The boys' biological mother, Ryan Dean, arrived from Bakersfield to help with the search. In an interview last week, she told KERO-TV that she blamed the couple for the boys' disappearance.

[...]

 

[Dawookie]

DEC 29, 2020
California City boys remain missing, no suspects identified, police chief says | KGET 17
... police on Tuesday said no suspects have been identified and asked the public to come forward with any information regarding the case.

California City Police Chief Jon Walker said “there are things in the works” but he declined to say what they were as he didn’t want to compromise the investigation. He said he does suspect foul play, but didn’t comment on whether he believed the boys were alive.

[...]

With all the information that is out there, I'd be shocked if they said they didn't suspect foul play.

 

[MsMarple]

DEC 29, 2020
Police Chief gives update

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=677866299765472

• The chief was not aware that Orrin had a fractured leg.
• The chief says they do suspect foul play based on the fact that they don't know how the children left the yard.
• The search warrant was obtained easily - the kids were missing.
• The other children were removed as is routine until there is an investigation done by CPS.
• 11:05 Reporter: Did the luminol find anything? Chief: Not that I know of.
• Interesting facial expression when responding to a question about whether they are searching in Bakersfield. About 13:05.
• About 16:30 - the chief confirms that there has never been a sighting of any of the children since the family has been there (since September).
• He says near the end that he will have to look into whether or not the investigators want to release the 911 call.

@PommyMommy thanks for posting the update and some highlights from chief Walker! Finally we hear from LE! A couple of things I'd like to add:

In the very beginning a reporter mentioned that some video was taken from neighbors. The chief didn't respond directly to his comment. So does LE have video?

Also, the chief made it clear that LE isn't currently searching beyond the house and the neighborhood, IOW no searches of the surrounding desert. That makes me think LE may have evidence that the kids didn't leave the yard although the chief didn't say anything either way. But usually when a child goes missing from the home one of the first searches involves setting up a grid search of the surrounding area so this is interesting.

 

[Knox]

DEC 29, 2020
Police Chief gives update

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=677866299765472

• The chief was not aware that Orrin had a fractured leg.
• The chief says they do suspect foul play based on the fact that they don't know how the children left the yard.
• The search warrant was obtained easily - the kids were missing.
• The other children were removed as is routine until there is an investigation done by CPS.
• 11:05 Reporter: Did the luminol find anything? Chief: Not that I know of.
• Interesting facial expression when responding to a question about whether they are searching in Bakersfield. About 13:05.
  
• About 16:30 - the chief confirms that there has never been a sighting of any of the children since the family has been there (since September).
• He says near the end that he will have to look into whether or not the investigators want to release the 911 call.

My heart dropped - NEVER been a sighting of ANY children since the couple moved in September? Oh FRACK! Speaks to NO toys in the backyard, not a single one to be seen.

My point yesterday about the plain clothes detectives from BPD being at the home with CCPD this week, makes sense in light of these new revelations.

 

[MsMarple]

My heart dropped - NEVER been a sighting of ANY children since the couple moved in September? Oh FRACK! Speaks to NO toys in the backyard, not a single one to be seen.

My point yesterday about the plain clothes detectives from BPD being at the home with CCPD this week, makes sense in light of these new revelations.

And so much for that early report about neighbors seeing the kids before they went missing. That puts a real crimp in the timeline IMO.
FBI interviewing adoptive parents of missing California City boys | KGET 17
ETA to add link where reporter said neighbors haven't seen the boys in the last day, day and a half.

 

[MoeInVA]

DEC 29, 2020
Police Chief gives update

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=677866299765472

• The chief was not aware that Orrin had a fractured leg.
• The chief says they do suspect foul play based on the fact that they don't know how the children left the yard.
• The search warrant was obtained easily - the kids were missing.
• The other children were removed as is routine until there is an investigation done by CPS.
• 11:05 Reporter: Did the luminol find anything? Chief: Not that I know of.
• Interesting facial expression when responding to a question about whether they are searching in Bakersfield. About 13:05.
• About 16:30 - the chief confirms that there has never been a sighting of any of the children since the family has been there (since September).
• He says near the end that he will have to look into whether or not the investigators want to release the 911 call.

Great find and run down. Along with @MsMarple i noted that comment from the reporter that BPD collected video from neighbors. One more note to add :

• Chief says they Dug backyard for any clues and to rule out that kids were in the yard... when asked if backyard search found anything useful, Chief said No.