Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020 #4

[kittythehare]

The Chief said in his 1st PC that neighbors in Cal City said they’d never, ever, seen any children at the Cal City home since the family moved there in September, 2020. Chief also confirmed that the AP’s 4 other children were at Grandma’s on vacation when the boys were reported missing, and that after Orrin and Orson were reported missing, the 4 other children were removed from AP’s care and placed in Protective Custody.

In his 1/22 interview with Bayan, Chief said they subsequently had a chance to speak with some more of the Cal City neighbors who said they had seen kids at the Cal City home but these neighbors couldn’t positively ID any of the kids as being Orrin or Orson. Also in the 1/22 interview, the Chief said Orrin and Orson were last seen by their Grandmother in Bakersfield before the move to Cal City, but wouldn’t say when, also that someone else other than family saw the boys in Bakersfield, but wouldn’t say who that was or when they saw the boys. So, last sighting of the boys according to the Chief was by Grandmother and another non-family member(s) in Bakersfield, but no confirmation as to when these sightings were. It’s also been confirmed by the Chief that the dogs picked up the boys scent inside the Cal City home but no scent of the boys outside the home.

IMHO

were the references to neighbors not about sightings in S cal?

 

[kittythehare]

How far is Bakersfield from most recent family home in SC, please?

 

[Dre]

How far is Bakersfield from most recent family home in SC, please?

From what I’ve understood this whole time, they’ve for sure been seen in Bakersfield, were not sure how long ago grandma said. And so far, no sure sightings of the youngest in Cal City
Moo

 

[fcavanaugh]

were the references to neighbors not about sightings in S cal?

I interpreted it to mean that upon their initial canvas of the Cal City neighborhood, the neighbors officer’s spoke to at that time, said they’d never seen any children at the Cal City home. Then upon a second, more thorough canvas of the neighborhood, they interviewed more neighbors who said they did see children at the Cal City home, they didn’t specify how many kids they saw (there are 6 kids total), just that they couldn’t identify any of the children as Orrin or Orson specifically.

IMHO

 

[Seattle1]

EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW: Police chief reveals new details about missing California City toddler brothers

Jan 22, 2021-- ABC/23 YTube


While the police chief stated it's not exact, the dogs finding no sent outside the home leads investigators to believe the children did not wander outside the back yard (as parents allege and/or believe).

05:26
there were uh scent dogs used correct
05:29
correct
05:30
what was the purpose of that uh
05:33
to the to locate the children you know
05:36
if they pick up the scent of the kids in
05:37
the house
05:38
once they get the center of the kids in
05:39
the house then they they
05:41
like us start to widen their search but
05:44
uh the dogs never picked up any scent
05:46
outside the house
05:47
can you put that in terms of uh
05:51
why that is important to know that there
05:53
was no scent of the kids outside of the
05:55
home
05:57
uh it doesn't necessarily
06:00
mean anything in particular but it does
06:02
lead us to believe that
06:04
you know the kids did not wander outside
06:05
of the house
06:07
but once again that's not necessarily uh
06:11
you know 100 but the dogs didn't detect
06:14
any sense outside the house
06:16
these dogs are fully trained for this
06:17
correct correct um
06:19
there was no extreme weather patterns
06:21
that day that we know of
06:22
there was an extreme wind like there is
06:24
now no um
06:26
did you guys find that a bit alarming or
06:28
of interest
06:29
of course of course now scent dogs are
06:33
trained to do a particular
06:34
thing they're they're unless they're
06:36
dual trained they're you know trained to
06:38
do one specific thing
06:39
pick a scent and and find where it's
06:42
gone
06:43
um was there any other dogs used
06:48
in the home in yes we had a cadaver dog
06:51
come in as well
06:52
and what are cadaver dogs trained to do
06:54
fine dead bodies
06:57
so none found they didn't detect
07:01
anything at all
07:02
no okay uh

 

[kshultz06082]

I'm guessing the witnesses who said they last saw the boys in Bakersfield were asked to take a polygraph. This might indicate that LE is questioning whether or not they are being honest about when they last saw them.

If LE was sure about the date they were last seen by anyone besides the parents, I would think they would release that date to the media.

However, if the family member or others said they last saw the boys before the parents moved to Cal City, that might be the reason the chief is withholding that information.

Imo

I wonder if the person, not related, that saw the kids last was a CPS worker... that would definitely get people speculating... things that make you go hmmmm.... and moo

 

[kittythehare]

I interpreted it to mean that upon their initial canvas of the Cal City neighborhood, the neighbors officer’s spoke to at that time, said they’d never seen any children at the Cal City home. Then upon a second, more thorough canvas of the neighborhood, they interviewed more neighbors who said they did see children at the Cal City home, but couldn’t identify any of the children they saw as Orrin or Orson specifically.

IMHO

I'm sorry,you did say that precisely.
I misread.
So they could have been taken away from SC house any time before date they were reported missing as far as we know?
No timeline to track at all.

 

[fcavanaugh]

I'm sorry,you did say that precisely.
I misread.
So they could have been taken away from SC house any time before date they were reported missing as far as we know?
No timeline to track at all.

Yes they could have, in fact, some of us speculate that perhaps Orrin and Orson never made the move to Cal City, i.e., maybe they went “missing” prior to September 2020, and the parents reported them missing 12/21/20 due to having to produce the boys for some reason, Christmas coming up and family requesting to see them?, upcoming DCFS visit?, ?, ?......

IMHO

 

[Luckyzmom]

What a mess for LE where the heck are these little guys?????

 

[Seattle1]

So, basically we are back at square one. No actual named "Person of Interest". It is odd that the children in the home were removed, without any charges against the parents. Especially the biological children.

According to Police Chief, this was the decision of Child Services.

EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW: Police chief reveals new details about missing California City toddler brothers

23 ABC News -- Jan 22, 2021

16:46
why until we can we can determine
16:50
uh what happened to the other two kids
16:52
um
16:53
and determine well then it's up to uh
16:56
children's services
16:57
when they want to release the children
16:59
back to the parents
17:01
so at this point it's not really in
17:02
authority's hands you guys share
17:04
information with cps
17:06
they look at the situation and at this
17:08
point they're acting on their own and
17:10
deciding
17:10
what happens with the children correct

 

[Eloise]

I wonder if the person, not related, that saw the kids last was a CPS worker... that would definitely get people speculating... things that make you go hmmmm.... and moo

Ohhh yep that could be it. That would definitely cause a lot of speculation, to say the least. If he'd said it was a preschool teacher or something, that would be expected.

 

[mickey2942]

When I read these stories, it makes me feel badly. I feel like I don't know the neighborhood children very well. People keep their kids in the house, and you just don't see kids playing outside much. I can't even tell you the names or ages of the kids who live across the street. Just the way it is...

 

[PommyMommy]

JAN 27, 2021 (Video)
New Security Cam footage on the day Orrin and Orson West went missing | KBAK (bakersfieldnow.com)
[...]

Police Chief Walker says the security cam footage is consistent with the statements from Trazell and Jacqueline West.

The security camera footage shows on December 21st at 5:33P.M., Trazell starts looking for the boys around the neighborhood.

[...]

Trazell comes back to the home 6 minutes later. Fast forward to 5:53 P.M., California City Police arrive.

"5:53 P.M. is consistent, we received the call at 5:48 and we were on scene, within 5 minutes, so that makes absolute sense and it looks like, I'm assuming Trazell and Jacqueline walking up to the police car and discussing with my officer, giving him information of what they reported," Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Police Department, said.

[...]

Walker confirmed you can see what appears to be a dog on the other side of the fence, on the footage from December, 21st, but from the angle of the camera, you cannot see children in the backyard, during any point of the footage.

[...]

He spoke at the vigil that was held for the boys at their house in California City on Monday evening. ... He says a man posted a video on YouTube of him in the backyard of the West's house. Walker said they are looking for this man and will arrest him, if he is found.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=463837431322801

 

[PommyMommy]

JAN 27, 2021 (Video)
Security camera footage from two days before Orrin and Orson West went missing | KBAK (bakersfieldnow.com)
[...]

Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Department, says the boys' adoptive parents claim they left their California City house on Dec. 19 with their six children, to go do Christmas shopping in Bakersfield.

Security camera footage from a neighbor shows an adult holding the door open while four children go into the van. Then later that day two adults, which appear to be Trazell and Jacqueline West, come back to the house without any kids.

Chief Walker says the parents claim they dropped off four of their children, not including Orrin and Orson, at a family member's home that day. Walker says Dec. 19 was the last day the other four children say they saw Orrin and Orson.

[...]

 

[kittythehare]

JAN 27, 2021
Security camera footage from two days before Orrin and Orson West went missing | KBAK (bakersfieldnow.com)
[...]

Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Department, says the boys' adoptive parents claim they left their California City house on Dec. 19 with their six children, to go do Christmas shopping in Bakersfield.

Security camera footage from a neighbor shows an adult holding the door open while four children go into the van. Then later that day two adults, which appear to be Trazell and Jacqueline West, come back to the house without any kids.

Chief Walker says the parents claim they dropped off four of their children, not including Orrin and Orson, at a family member's home that day. Walker says Dec. 19 was the last day the other four children say they saw Orrin and Orson.

[...]

The obvious question is how long were the little ones left alone , or were they left alone during the trip?

 

[kittythehare]

JAN 27, 2021 (Video)
New Security Cam footage on the day Orrin and Orson West went missing | KBAK (bakersfieldnow.com)
[...]

Police Chief Walker says the security cam footage is consistent with the statements from Trazell and Jacqueline West.

The security camera footage shows on December 21st at 5:33P.M., Trazell starts looking for the boys around the neighborhood.

[...]

Trazell comes back to the home 6 minutes later. Fast forward to 5:53 P.M., California City Police arrive.

"5:53 P.M. is consistent, we received the call at 5:48 and we were on scene, within 5 minutes, so that makes absolute sense and it looks like, I'm assuming Trazell and Jacqueline walking up to the police car and discussing with my officer, giving him information of what they reported," Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Police Department, said.

[...]

Walker confirmed you can see what appears to be a dog on the other side of the fence, on the footage from December, 21st, but from the angle of the camera, you cannot see children in the backyard, during any point of the footage.

[...]

He spoke at the vigil that was held for the boys at their house in California City on Monday evening. ... He says a man posted a video on YouTube of him in the backyard of the West's house. Walker said they are looking for this man and will arrest him, if he is found.

Did he not say dogs, pleural?
How many dogs?

 

[PommyMommy]

Did he not say dogs, pleural?
How many dogs?

It sounds like "dogs" to me but that was the reporter, right? Approx 1:45

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=463837431322801

 

[Seattle1]

Did he not say dogs, pleural?
How many dogs?

Walker confirmed you can see what appears to be a dog on the other side of the fence, on the footage from December, 21st, but from the angle of the camera, you cannot see children in the backyard, during any point of the footage.

^^rsbbm

Video sounds like dogs, plural, and news report is singular.

 

[MsBetsy]

JAN 27, 2021 (Video)
New Security Cam footage on the day Orrin and Orson West went missing | KBAK (bakersfieldnow.com)
...
Police Chief Walker says the security cam footage is consistent with the statements from Trazell and Jacqueline West.

The security camera footage shows on December 21st at 5:33P.M., Trazell starts looking for the boys around the neighborhood.

"What it appears, right here is someone, I'm by his statement it's Trazell, getting into a white van in front of the property and exiting and it looks like he makes a left turn and goes eastbound on Aspen," Jon Walker, Police Chief, California City Police Department, said.

Trazell comes back to the home 6 minutes later. Fast forward to 5:53 P.M., California City Police arrive.

"5:53 P.M. is consistent, we received the call at 5:48 and we were on scene, within 5 minutes, so that makes absolute sense and it looks like, I'm assuming Trazell and Jacqueline walking up to the police car and discussing with my officer, giving him information of what they reported," Jon Walker, Police Chief for the California City Police Department, said.

[...]

Walker confirmed you can see what appears to be a dog on the other side of the fence, on the footage from December, 21st, but from the angle of the camera, you cannot see children in the backyard, during any point of the footage.

[...]

He spoke at the vigil that was held for the boys at their house in California City on Monday evening. ... He says a man posted a video on YouTube of him in the backyard of the West's house. Walker said they are looking for this man and will arrest him, if he is found.

The only problem with that video is that TW said the boys went missing around 4:30 or 5:00, before it got dark. It doesn't show either of them looking before that so we don't know what they were doing for the 30 or 40 minutes before he got in the van and drove around for six minutes.

Then when he gets back to the house JW doesn't appear to come out to see if he has found them, and neither of them appear to search for the ten minutes it takes for police to arrive. IMO

 

[kittythehare]

It sounds like "dogs" to me. Approx 1:45

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=463837431322801

I listened again, definitely dogs pleural... no way it was dolls,, no.. dolls don't run around.