Found Alive CA - Sherri Papini, 34, Redding, 2 November 2016 - #15

[Redux]

People are trying really hard to implicate CG in this abduction. The guy may be a self-promoter, but that's a far cry from engineering this kind of sick crime. Unless he's fabricated everything, he does have some significant credentials. Is there any evidence he's ever been involved in criminal activity?

It appears, based on more than one article, that CG did not seek out this case. Someone at his church, who had an earlier connection with Sherri, suggested to the Papinis that CG might be able to help. Nothing unreasonable about that. CG said this was a unique case, not the kind he's usually involved in. By that, he most likely means he is usually involved in cases involving hostage-taking with clear ransom demands. This case was not like that.

All of which begs the question: If he engineered Sherri's abduction, why not engineer a simple abduction followed by a ransom demand? Wouldn't that be easier? He could've accomplished his purpose without subjecting Sherri to unimaginable abuse? It would also make his entry into the case more natural. None of the reverse ransom weirdness would be needed.

I just don't see it. Unless there is evidence CG has a serious criminal background, I think this theory is not only extremely unlikely; I think it's a colossal waste of time.

Thank you, I agree with everything you've said here.

I find CG a bit cheesy, but that's a far cry from being some devious individual who plots some intricate kidnapping to promote his business or whatever.

I was a little skeptical of his credentials at first, but I'm sure the government would be all over it if they were downright false. Those aren't credentials that you flaunt in a high profile case without getting stomped on very quickly by the FBI, Secret Service, etc.

 

[cady]

While it may be a waste of time, I *do* think it is worth thinking on. The key players that have been identified are KP, SP and CG. And yes, CG is a key player. KP and SP have been cleared. It is only natural to investigate whether CG is on the up and up.

And LJ and Anonymous. JMO

 

[sumzero]

Thank you, I agree with everything you've said here.

I find CG a bit cheesy, but that's a far cry from being some devious individual who plots some intricate kidnapping to promote his business or whatever.

I was a little skeptical of his credentials at first, but I'm sure the government would be all over it if they were downright false. Those aren't credentials that you flaunt in a high profile case without getting stomped on very quickly by the FBI, Secret Service, etc.

Good point. Remember, the same people who are spinning outlandish theories about CG are probably the same people who imagined that KP and/or SP orchestrated an epic hoax.

 

[Gardener1850]

People are trying really hard to implicate CG in this abduction. The guy may be a self-promoter, but that's a far cry from engineering this kind of sick crime. Unless he's fabricated everything, he does have some significant credentials. Is there any evidence he's ever been involved in criminal activity?

It appears, based on more than one article, that CG did not seek out this case. Someone at his church, who had an earlier connection with Sherri, suggested to the Papinis that CG might be able to help. Nothing unreasonable about that. CG said this was a unique case, not the kind he's usually involved in. By that, he most likely means he is usually involved in cases involving hostage-taking with clear ransom demands. This case was not like that.

All of which begs the question: If he engineered Sherri's abduction, why not engineer a simple abduction followed by a ransom demand? Wouldn't that be easier? He could've accomplished his purpose without subjecting Sherri to unimaginable abuse? It would also make his entry into the case more natural. None of the reverse ransom weirdness would be needed.

I just don't see it. Unless there is evidence CG has a serious criminal background, I think this theory is not only extremely unlikely; I think it's a colossal waste of time.

:ditto:

 

[yllek]

It's just my opinion that LE isn't holding back information that could help ensure public safety. I personally have no cause to believe that LE is willingly putting people at risk.

Rather, LE can only share what it knows and what evidence supports. If Sherri is unable to provide the details about how she was abducted at this time, Sheriff Bosenko cannot do anything more than release what he's been told and continue to search for more evidence.

Snips:
Bosenko said Sherri Papini was unable to recall any details about her abduction when first questioned soon after being found.

He said victims of traumatic experiences sometimes suffer from memory loss regarding the events.

Papini told investigators the younger woman had long curly hair, thin eyebrows and a thick accent. The older suspect had straight black hair with some gray and thick eyebrows.

The sheriff warned residents to remain cautious until the suspects are identified.

http://www.ksbw.com/article/watch-live-sherri-papini-update-from-shasta-county-sheriff/8384717

 

[soanyway]

Still catching up with this thread, but a few comments from the 2020 special last night (apologies if they've already been stated):

1. I can't imagine KP's horror in finding SP's phone. Important to note, his children were also missing. My understanding is, he didn't call the day care to see what time she picked them up until after tracked her phone, taking her car with the car seats to bring all 3 of them home. Knowing that he may have thought his wife AND children had been harmed, I think he had extreme composure in taking pics of the phone and sensing that something was very wrong. I also stated early on that it was likely he had tried calling her on the way home when he noticed she didn't reply to her text at 1:39. So he may have already been concerned.

2. Information regarding the actual abduction was limited by both KP and LE, understandably. But I can think of many scenarios in which SP would not have been able to identify the women (even without masks). While SP was jogging (with headphones in), the passenger of the SUV could've opened her door into SP, knocking her down and then throwing something over her head and forcing her into the vehicle. KP stated she DID NOT voluntarily enter the vehicle. One abductor could have been appearing to change a tire or have her hood up, and SP may have seen her by herself while jogging and offered to help (with the woman's back to SP, the 2nd woman could've been lurking in the bushes waiting to grab her from behind. My point is....there are any number of ways she could have been forced into the vehicle. She may have even been knocked out during the process which would make her memory very fuzzy about what actually happened as well.

3. A couple threads ago, I questioned the sheriff discounting the sighting of SP at the truck stop, wondering if his choice of words alluded to her being held at only one location for the full 22 days. Now that it has been reported that she was in the vehicle for 2 1/2 hours following the abduction, IMO, it confirms that she was taken to an area close to where she was dropped and held there the duration of her captivity (about 150 miles from her home). LE would know that she was transported for 2 1/2 hours if this was the only time she was in the vehicle, other than the day of her release. This could be confirmed based on the amount of time she told LE she was in the vehicle before being dropped off. But it doesn't appear to me that she was shuffled between stash houses, possibly to conceal her identity with the wide spread media coverage. The abductors may have even used backroads partially to get to their destination following the abduction if they thought someone had seen them. All of which makes it look very premeditated.

The Sheriff added that detectives are also no further forward in establishing the location of where Papini was held.
He told DailyMail.com: 'Right now we don't know where that location is, it is still an active and ongoing investigation, my investigators did talk with her, I don't have the information of whether they have been able to narrow down where she may have been held, but we are still working on this.'

But the Sheriff added: 'After she was abducted, Miss Papini was driven to an unknown location which would have been not at the truck stop and she would not have been contacted by anybody because this particular reporting person (RP) said that she spoke to the woman and that didn't occur.'

4. KP was put in touch with CG through a mutual friend who used SP for babysitting. IMO, the family believed she was taken so it's no surprise that CG would have expertise in this field. There's no irony in SP being abducted in a town that just happened to have a program such as his. The reality is, these programs are in most cities that have acknowledged the rise in trafficking and its correlation to missing persons. IIRC, KP also mentioned psychics as he was willing to do whatever it took to bring his wife home. This is from End Slavey in Nashville, TN:

• We hold ten week small group sessions, facilitated by a therapist and a survivor, with high risk youth in group homes, juvenile detention, schools and low income youth programs. During these sessions we work with staff to get appropriate care for issues that arise that would heighten risk for exploitation (child abuse, trauma, addiction, suicidal ideation etc.) These groups often also identify youth who have already been trafficked and we take them on as clients and work to avoid re-victimization.

5. SP did previously travel to Eureka, in Humboldt county, for her job. This area is known for human trafficking and heavy crime. It's possible she caught the attention of someone in the grow industry. But IMO, she would not have been a trimmer or involved in the grow world in any capacity. If anything, I could see her being an advocate against drug use or exploitation. PLEASE NOTE: I am not trying to convince anyone that trafficking is involved. Being able to respectfully express our opinions in a victim friendly environment is one of the biggest reasons I follow the cases here on WS. Thanks to the mods for keeping it that way!

Lastly, I pray daily for SP and her entire family that has been affected by this horrific experience. KP recanting how he told his son that mommy was missing is heart wrenching but also very telling of the incredible parenting (and extended family's involvement) for these little ones. IMO, a 4 yr. old saying, "dad, you can tell me anything" is attributed to nurturing, loving, parents who would do anything for their children. Everything expressed is MOO.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...AX-rogue-employee-says-haven-t-ruled-out.html

https://www.endslaverytn.org/prevention/

 

[glassheater]

I agree with you sumzero regarding CG.

CG definitely seems to live his life like he's in a movie all the time. He has a flare for drama and showmanship, and this is one reason I don't think he was involved in the abduction. I spoke about this in another thread but I believe if he was involved to boost his business, things would of been a bit different.

One of the things is, he would of actually negotiated a ransom. The abductor would of met the original deadline and given Sherri up because he would of just been an amazing superhero negotiator.

Ransom was never paid. Negotiation never took place. The only credit he took was saying that the ransom worked when it turned into a reward for her release.

Also, he would of have to collaborate with several people to set up the kidnapping of SP, who he was not acquainted with to begin with. He would of had to hear about her from other people and somehow know her enough to ensure she was the right target. It just seems like a far reach for me.

Regarding KP, I appreciate how expressive he is. I think crying is 'manning-up'. If he was stone-faced, people would of slammed him for that. I do agree that he is a terrific storyteller, and that has worked against his believability.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

People are trying really hard to implicate CG in this abduction. The guy may be a self-promoter, but that's a far cry from engineering this kind of sick crime. Unless he's fabricated everything, he does have some significant credentials. Is there any evidence he's ever been involved in criminal activity?

It appears, based on more than one article, that CG did not seek out this case. Someone at his church, who had an earlier connection with Sherri, suggested to the Papinis that CG might be able to help. Nothing unreasonable about that. CG said this was a unique case, not the kind he's usually involved in. By that, he most likely means he is usually involved in cases involving hostage-taking with clear ransom demands. This case was not like that.

All of which begs the question: If he engineered Sherri's abduction, why not engineer a simple abduction followed by a ransom demand? Wouldn't that be easier? He could've accomplished his purpose without subjecting Sherri to unimaginable abuse? It would also make his entry into the case more natural. None of the reverse ransom weirdness would be needed.

I just don't see it. Unless there is evidence CG has a serious criminal background, I think this theory is not only extremely unlikely; I think it's a colossal waste of time.

According to the interview he did just a couple days ago, it was his FB work he did for SP that resulted in the anonymous donor hiring him. By CG's own account it was his effort to draw attention to the case on FB that resulted in him getting the job, so it is actually him who is saying he sought out this case:
http://m.onenewspage.com.au/video/2...-Gamble-Speaks-About-Sherri-Papini-Return.htm

 

[truecrimereview]

Ok. Let's keep it real.

If there was a random rapists on the loose that abducted a sahm; Then wouldn't this be mentioned as a motive for lone female joggers?

So should we be worried of why a motive has yet to be mentioned?

While a victim was held captive for 3 weeks?

So imo. The motive should be top priority to end the mindframes of other women that may feel that these perps may be a danger to them as well. Jmo

LE owes it to the public to either say that it was isolated or it wasn't .

Plus they owe it to the public to say why.

But they can only state this if the victim says why.

My theory is they took her for human trafficking / forced sex work but when they saw the intense and increasing media attention the case was getting they decided to let her go before they got caught, fearing that killing her or not letting her go would keep LE attention on finding them. They probably felt safer letting her go because their faces had been covered, they mostly spoke Spanish, and maybe they threatened her to keep her mouth shut.

I admit a gaping whole in this theory is that they branded her, which isn't something you do as part of a plan to minimize your chances of being caught.

 

[glassheater]

Yes, this is the TV station who said they had received it but refused to run the story back then:
http://www.krcrtv.com/news/local/sh...sherri-papini-website-offers-reward/168229851
This has been a huge detail to me ever since I found out about it given what was going on that early into the missing persons case.

This could also mean that the family quickly received information that she was abducted.

 

[bonjoviblonde]

Good point. Remember, the same people who are spinning outlandish theories about CG are probably the same people who imagined that KP and/or SP orchestrated an epic hoax.

I have never been suspicious of SP or KP and I haven't spun any outlandish theories yet, but until I know for sure, I can't help but wonder a little more about CG. I guess the way some people feel something off about the P's, I feel that way about him. I haven't really posted anything about him though. I guess I will just sit back and see what comes of it, if anything. We may never know anything more about this case than we do right now. I'm just glad everyone is safe and home.

 

[bluesneakers]

Perhaps he got the training he needed to pursue a private enterprise. It seems like helping missionaries is important to him. Not something the military is usually involved doing.

Have you checked out his resume? Missionaries don't usually teach counterintelligence, work with Navy SEALs or hang out with Secretaries of State. And you don't reach those types of positions during a six-year career.

 

[truecrimereview]

Really, this poor family can't win for losing.

If Keith is unemotional, he'd be accused of being cold and not caring about his wife (and so he surely did something to her) . But if he is too emotional then he's not believable.

If he didn't do the interview, people would be accusing him of hiding something or of being closed off after everything the public did to help him. But then when he decides to do an interview, he's slammed for exposing Sherri's ordeal to the world or potentially hindering the investigation.

Oy.

This is what I call the spousal paradox. Maybe it has a real name and I just don't know it. You're right: there is no way for a spouse or partner to act that won't draw suspicion from at least a small vocal subset of observers.


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[manormuskeg]

Thank you, I agree with everything you've said here.

I find CG a bit cheesy, but that's a far cry from being some devious individual who plots some intricate kidnapping to promote his business or whatever.

I was a little skeptical of his credentials at first, but I'm sure the government would be all over it if they were downright false. Those aren't credentials that you flaunt in a high profile case without getting stomped on very quickly by the FBI, Secret Service, etc.

The idea that CG might be involved in the abduction is way too far out, but he still comes across as iffy. What do you think the FBI or whoever made of this tidbit from his missionary page:

Cameron’s been training the U.S. Military Special Ops community on survival tactics since shortly after September 11, 2001.

He's 36 years old.

 

[vlpate]

This was in 2007. Do you know if he was still in the military when they set this up?

He moved to Enterprise to go to work for a company "Tate".

 

[glassheater]

Answering missgulfsouth's question:

The motive may be known, but it may involve that the motive being known will also verify that a sexual assault has occurred. SP may not emotionally be ready for that information to come out. I do think her and her husband seem to be very image oriented, looking at her wedding blog and gorgeously perfect family photos. I know not all victims or families of deceased victims want to divulge that information. I know this must be incredibly difficult if it indeed occurred and I would understand not wanting to disclose that information just yet.

This may be way out there, but it could of been two amateur women down on their luck wanting to sex traffic someone for money.

 

[bluesneakers]

And LJ and Anonymous. JMO

But not Anonymous Anonymous. As far as we know.

 

[Redux]

2. Information regarding the actual abduction was limited by both KP and LE, understandably. But I can think of many scenarios in which SP would not have been able to identify the women (even without masks). While SP was jogging (with headphones in), the passenger of the SUV could've opened her door into SP, knocking her down and then throwing something over her head and forcing her into the vehicle. KP stated she DID NOT voluntarily enter the vehicle. One abductor could have been appearing to change a tire or have her hood up, and SP may have seen her by herself while jogging and offered to help (with the woman's back to SP, the 2nd woman could've been lurking in the bushes waiting to grab her from behind. My point is....there are any number of ways she could have been forced into the vehicle. She may have even been knocked out during the process which would make her memory very fuzzy about what actually happened as well.

Snipped for focus.

Agreed! I can also see a situation where everything just happened so quickly that Sherri just didn't have time to take it in and get a good look her captors (and especially if they were wearing sunglasses, hats or whatever).

Or, if the captors gave her anything to subdue her right after grabbing her, a muscle relaxant, a sedative, or some other drug, it could have left the capture fuzzy in her mind.

Or just straight up trauma can cause blocking out of events.

 

[Tynk]

Why is that so amazing? I used the same app to find hubby's phone a few times already, with no help from gamble. Hubby always loses his phone.

My daughter taught me how because she used to use it to find out where her no good rotten ex used to disappear to?

Keith is an IT guy. I am sure he knew how to look for a lost phone without the help of CG.

All very true. I don't find it at all odd that SP used the Find My Iphone app. Lots of people use it or other GPS locator apps. I had a friend who found her cheating husband at his GF's house using Find My Iphone. And my hubby, kids and I all have a location app called Life360 on our phones so we can know where everyone is. It may seem weird to some, but it gives us all comfort to have it available if needed.

 

[IdeMae]

From the Matt G pre-show facebook live video posted before last night's 20/20 episode, these three things stuck out to me:

1. LE has no suspects, but they have not eliminated KP/SP because they are not ruling out anything at this point
2. The interview was KP'S idea, not ABC'S
3. Finally an explanation per SP of what actually happened and how she was snatched

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10154421822094934&id=163497464933

4:35
Question: were the police upset that he sat down with you?
MG: Police AREN'T upset--I don't know if they're UPSET, but they certainly want to know what he said, and they're curious about his body language as well...the police don't have any suspects, but they tell me they haven't eliminated anyone, including Keith Papini and Sherri

6:30
MG: Keith came to us he wanted to do this interview because he wants to clear his name

10:40
MG: Sherri says she was jogging down the road two women pulled up, at gunpoint, and with some force, got her into the car obviously against her will and we're to understand she put up a fight...

MG mentions many times that KP came across as very genuine and sincere, he also seems to mention very briefly that LE has one other piece of information they haven't released, but I'm not sure I heard that right so left it out.

Someone else might get more out of this than I did, these are the things that stuck out as new info to me.



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