Deceased/Not Found CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Morgan Hill, 16 March 2012 #7 *A. Garcia-Torres guilty*

[GrainneDhu]

We have not been told everything about the property. I will never understand why certain things have to be kept secret. Years ago we would have known more. Strange, we now have all this media, yet no investigative reporting.

When I was there I was told many of the neighbors refused to talk with reporters...darn shame. This is becoming an epidemic. People not willing to talk.

SBM

A lot of times, LE specifically asks that witnesses not talk to the media, so as not to help the perp (many perps watch media coverage obsessively). The last thing LE wants is for a potentially valuable witness to inadvertently impeach themselves via a media appearance that sounds different from what they said in an interview.

People can inadvertently open themselves up to being impeached with no dishonesty or intent to mislead. It can be as simple as saying that the car they saw was black in the LE interview and then saying it was "dark coloured" in the media interview. To the witness, the two terms may both be true: they thought it was a black car initially but who knows, maybe it was really midnight blue, so after some time for reflection, they say it was dark coloured.

An innocent change of detail, no big deal most of the time. But in court, an aggressive defence lawyer (and there should be no other kind) will pounce on the difference to show that the witness's memory is obviously not as clear as presented by the prosecutor.

There's also the whole "does anyone *really* want to be famous for something like this" question.

I know I wouldn't.

If you allow yourself to be interviewed, then it can become open season on you, your past, your relationship, your family, etc. At the very least, you open yourself up to the suspicion that you are inserting yourself into the investigation for no good reason (either you're the perp or you're suspected of getting sick jollies from the excitement).

Who needs it?

And if the reason you moved to a neighbourhood bordering on a rural area was because you wanted peace and privacy, you may well not want to encourage the media to hang around in your yard, block your street, run their loud generators day and night, throw their trash in your yard and worse.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Hi,

this is my first post here. I too have been puzzled by the bag, but have a slightly different theory/thought. The phone is tossed out of the car, a little further on the bag is also tossed. However someone comes past and finds the bag. At this point no one has been reported missing, it's just a very nice bag lying beside the road, (or caught in bushes etc.). The finder thinks, well this is nice, I might keep this - or give it to my sister, girlfriend or whatever. Or they put it in the car and think they will hand it in to the police later. Then the news breaks, the bag is mentioned and it is no longer something to keep but to get rid of quickly. Some panic ensues. They take the bag and place it with the idea of the search party finding it.

I just throw this in, or some variation on the above theme, as another possibility.

Welcome to WS, Korrigan!

I agree, that's a possibility and one I hadn't thought of.

I think particularly if another teen found the bag, they might be spooked and do exactly what you outlined, not really realising how it could compromise the investigation. They'd be thinking "I'll just put it as close to where I found it as I can and it will be like nothing really happened."

 

[JDB]

If she was attacked in the driveway of that property, a scream would have alerted people. Either the dogs are wrong and she was abducted on the way to the bus,..or all the stars lined up for the perp and no one heard her yell.

Once again if she knew the person why would there be a scream. Or if it was someone she met online there would be no scream.

 

[SurfieTX]

Hi,

this is my first post here. I too have been puzzled by the bag, but have a slightly different theory/thought. The phone is tossed out of the car, a little further on the bag is also tossed. However someone comes past and finds the bag. At this point no one has been reported missing, it's just a very nice bag lying beside the road, (or caught in bushes etc.). The finder thinks, well this is nice, I might keep this - or give it to my sister, girlfriend or whatever. Or they put it in the car and think they will hand it in to the police later. Then the news breaks, the bag is mentioned and it is no longer something to keep but to get rid of quickly. Some panic ensues. They take the bag and place it with the idea of the search party finding it.

I just throw this in, or some variation on the above theme, as another possibility.

Welcome to Websleuths. I think this is a very viable theory. Someone finds the bag and tosses the books out (who wants school books?). News breaks, and they take the bag back to where the books are. It also could explain the neatly folded clothes .

 

[LisaB]

I wonder if the bag and/or clothing were somewhat damp when found and whoever was speaking behind the scenes to the reporter who asked the question speculated that perhaps they were damp with urine.

I think it's an excellent filtering device for false confessions.

If water running off the roof had been falling directly on the bag (and the existence of vegetation suggests this area does get wet) it may have been SOAKING WET when found. The rain had not been very significant, so the sopping wet bag may have seemed too wet to "just have been rained on" prompting the searchers to remark that it was VERY WET when they found it.

 

[TxLady2]

This also makes it appear Sierra left first. I don't think she did but it looks like they were given information she did.

"Sierra's family reported her missing Friday afternoon after last seeing her around 6 a.m. when was she heading off to Ann Sobrato High School, Cardoza said."

IMO, it's just shoddy reporting. There would be no reason for any child to leave for school at 6 a.m. unless they lived 50 miles away from the school and the bus does many stops between.
I watched some program several years ago, about people living on big farms and ranches and their kids having to ride a schoolbus for almost 2 hours every morning and afternoon.

 

[TxLady2]

Guess times have changed. I have to wonder why mothers indulge their young daughters on such expensive and useless accessories for school. Cell phones w/internet, etc., fancy small bags. How sad for the girls whose parents can't afford this kind of stuff...it definitely draws the line between the have and have nots.

Yes, it has. I don't know any teenagers in public schools around here who have the expensive accessories. The wealthy parents send their kids to private schools, and a few of them may carry expensive purses, but not all. As for indulging their daughters... I guess the logic is, the more money you pay for it, the better it is and the longer it lasts. But girls get tired of stuff pretty easily, so next thing you know there is a newer and more expensive style they want. It never ends.

 

[NJGuy]

A couple of interesting things I've found at Hinkymeter and other places. (Now, none of these things has been verified so take it with a grain of salt) however, in one post, there are quotes attributed to Sierra's sister on the night before she disappeared. Sister says her and her father were speaking to Sierra and Sierra seemed happy, talking about dying her hair next time she was in Fremont and the essay topic she was working on. So, if true, nothing out of the ordinary seemed to be going on the night before. Of course, that's only a small sample of the night, but Sierra didn't mention she was unhappy etc.

Also, if you search youtube, there is one video by a young girl who says she is Sierra's friend, (very believable imho), and on the video she says Sierra was wearing a black SJ Sharks sweatshirt (different from a jersey) and gray shoes. Does this friend have accurate information? I have no idea, but it seemed like she did.

Anyway, take all that for what it's worth. Could help in the overall process of things, or could mean nothing at all.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Well, yeahbut, Marlene also said the pic was taken at 7:15.

So, she could be mistaken.
Have you seen LE say they were mistaken about the timestamp?

Meaning they used to think it could have been taken a day or two before, but whoops, looked at the timestamp and decided they made a mistake?

I do think LE/FBI knows that is what she was wearing that morning.

The description of what she was last seen wearing is in the FBI Flyer.

Sierra Mae LaMar was last seen at approximately 6:00 a.m. on March 16, 2012, in the area of Santa Teresa Avenue and Dougherty Avenue in Morgan Hill, California. At that time, she was preparing to leave her home on foot on her way to catch the bus to school. Sierra never made it to the bus or school that morning and has not been heard from since that time.

Sierra Mae LaMar was last seen wearing a black "San Jose Sharks" (hockey team) sweatshirt with the Sharks logo on the front and "STONEHOUSE" and the number "16" on the back. She currently attends Sobrato High School in Morgan Hill, California, and used to attend Washington High School in Fremont, California.

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/kidnap

It is very easy to ascertain when a photo was taken. LE didnt know at the time when asked but by now they have long known when it was taken.

IMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

IMO, it's just shoddy reporting. There would be no reason for any child to leave for school at 6 a.m. unless they lived 50 miles away from the school and the bus does many stops between.
I watched some program several years ago, about people living on big farms and ranches and their kids having to ride a schoolbus for almost 2 hours every morning and afternoon.

The article is true. She was last seen by her mother at 6:00 am when her mom left for work.

IMO

 

[Ransom]

A couple of interesting things I've found at Hinkymeter and other places. (Now, none of these things has been verified so take it with a grain of salt) however, in one post, there are quotes attributed to Sierra's sister on the night before she disappeared. Sister says her and her father were speaking to Sierra and Sierra seemed happy, talking about dying her hair next time she was in Fremont and the essay topic she was working on. So, if true, nothing out of the ordinary seemed to be going on the night before. Of course, that's only a small sample of the night, but Sierra didn't mention she was unhappy etc.

Also, if you search youtube, there is one video by a young girl who says she is Sierra's friend, (very believable imho), and on the video she says Sierra was wearing a black SJ Sharks sweatshirt (different from a jersey) and gray shoes. Does this friend have accurate information? I have no idea, but it seemed like she did.

Anyway, take all that for what it's worth. Could help in the overall process of things, or could mean nothing at all.

link for speakerphone, etc. here: http://m.mercurynews.com/sjm/db_101037/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=xlj4PxM0&full=true#display

link for clothing here: http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/kidnap

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Well this is getting confusing. I thought her mom said she last saw her in her pj's? Did that change? Or are the clothes she was wearing in the alleged last photo, her pj's? If mom left at 6 am, would a 15 year old be already dressed for school?

:waitasec:

The FBI is going by what she was wearing when she sent the pic to her friend later that morning.

So at 6am she was still in her PJs when her mom left for work.

But she changed into the other clothing shown in the pic she sent.

By now the FBI has had plenty of time to analize the computer to see when the photo was taken, and imo, they have concluded that it was taken that morning shortly before she sent it to her friend. Thank God for that photo for it tells them what she was wearing that morning to school and now they know those are the same clothes found in her purse tossed away.

IMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Or she didn't scream at all.

Having read many victim accounts, my rough estimate is that about half of all victims of stranger assaults don't scream or yell. Many times it's because the perp has a weapon and the victim is instantly terrified of doing anything that might anger the perp.

Sadly you are right.

As I have already mentioned with Carlie Brucia's case.......she didnt scream or try to free herself from Joesph Smith when took her by the arm and lead her away and I didnt see that he had any kind of weapon.

It has to be the most terrifying experience imaginable. I think some just freezes because they are so traumatized when something like this happens right out of the blue with no warning and they just do what the perp tells them to do.

Here is a video of Carlie's abduction.

Carlie Brucia Abduction - YouTube


IMO

 

[nutkin]

Or she didn't scream at all.

Having read many victim accounts, my rough estimate is that about half of all victims of stranger assaults don't scream or yell. Many times it's because the perp has a weapon and the victim is instantly terrified of doing anything that might anger the perp.

Yeah, most of the time there is no scream when an abduction DOES actually happen. Statistics show that when a commotion IS made (screaming, etc.), the perp is more likely to be deterred and leave without the victim. Even if the perp shows a weapon or makes a threat, your chances of survival are much, much less if you go with the person. Plus, if they ARE going to kill you it is better they do it at the abduction site. When that occurs, a body is more likely to be found and the offender caught.

 

[nursebeeme]

wow.. after seeing that picture of where the purse was found ( posted upstream) "secreted" surely fits the bill imhoo... wedged between a building and a cactus...

wow..

Santa Teresa Blvd & Laguna Ave, Coyote, Santa Clara, California 95037 - Google Maps

this was not thrown from a car imhoo... this was planted... and hidden at that (yet out in a relatively open area where people would be able to see someone hanging around the area)

great thoughts going on here about the bag, etc... great sleuthing peeps. I tell ya.. this bag is driving me nutz. Considering the amount of time that went by between when she allegedly vanished and when her mother was notified she was not at school (nearly 12 hours right???) there are lots of possibilities with this darn bag.


Right now I am leaning toward
1) someone who knows the house/Sierra/etc packed the bag after the fact
2) the phone was tossed from the get go but the bag was placed in that area under the cover of darkness. And that being said, the perp (if a stranger) would have no way of knowing if anyone saw Sierra or what she was wearing before she left the house... so putting her same clothes that she was wearing into the bag would not make it look like she was running away, per se... So this tells me those folded clothes in that bag mean something else to the perp but darn if I know what... maybe a loose screw? Like the perp is sorry for what he/she did and was returning the items to a place near her home? (folded neatly and possibly have urine on them and secreted next to her books)


just thinking a little bit this morning on this bag thing... (someone please pass that plastic sheeting for the tomatoes lolol)

 

[oceanblueeyes]

So I wonder about the photo, not tweeted, not sent to her friend ... it was originally said she sent it to her mother was it not? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2121938/Sierra-LaMar-Missing-girl-15-held-police-say.html

That is the only media site I have seen in almost a month that has ever stated that.

Imo, they got it wrong which is not uncommon. You will notice in the article it is not quoted words of Marlene's.

I have never seen Marlene say the photo was sent to her. It has always been said it was sent to one of her friends which is understandable, imo.

It is irresponsable journalism. That one article has caused Marlene to be called a liar when she has never said it was sent to her nor has she changed her story.

 

[nutkin]

A perp folding the victim's clothes neatly after the fact would be considered an act of remorse. This may be someone who feels inadequate socially and this would be the only way he could get "attention" from a woman. Or, a sexual assault may have been the perp's plan, but he didn't plan on killing her, so he feels bad about that. The other thing it points to is family or a close friend - someone who cared about her genuinely.

 

[Foxymona]

Hi,

this is my first post here. I too have been puzzled by the bag, but have a slightly different theory/thought. The phone is tossed out of the car, a little further on the bag is also tossed. However someone comes past and finds the bag. At this point no one has been reported missing, it's just a very nice bag lying beside the road, (or caught in bushes etc.). The finder thinks, well this is nice, I might keep this - or give it to my sister, girlfriend or whatever. Or they put it in the car and think they will hand it in to the police later. Then the news breaks, the bag is mentioned and it is no longer something to keep but to get rid of quickly. Some panic ensues. They take the bag and place it with the idea of the search party finding it.

I just throw this in, or some variation on the above theme, as another possibility.

Hi Everyone,
This is my first post too but I have been lurking for days. This is an interesting theory- but IMO if that was the case- and the person who had found the bag was innocent- surly they would have said- or indeed handed the bag in and said where they found it?

Now just some speculation I have- there's no doubt in my mind that this is a runaway. No teenager would throw away the phone. If they were worried about it being tracked they would turn it off. At a later time they could sell it or swap it as they would have limited supplies. Also 15 year old girls DO confide and DO like to keep party to what is going on in their group. This has gone on too many weeks for mouths to stay shut.

Now this is just IMO but does the Mother's behaviour strike anyone else as odd? I am not accusing or anything- no mother needs false accusations on top of their daughter missing but something is odd about the way she acts and it struck me watching this news report:

http://www.kron.com/Article.aspx?ArticleID=3472

At 2.44 when asked if she thinks this is an abduction she calmly replies she THINKS it is? If everything was all happy at home she should have no doubt in her mind no? Be frantic to get the point across that someone has taken her daughter?

Also at 4.22 she stops a car and hands them a flyer and asks them to look at it etc. If someone stopped I would, as a mother, interrogate them. Did they see her? Was she there that morning? Were they driving by at that time ETC ETC? But I guess we are all different.

Now another thing- what if she never left the house? She got as far as the driveway, realised she had forgotten something and went back? Maybe somebody had entered the house? Maybe this is why the trail ended in the driveway and she never made the bus? And nobody say anything suspicious but what about people that wouldn't cause suspicion like post man, milk man, maintenance men, gardeners, neighbours? If Sierra was used to seeing these people around and vaguely familiar with them then she may well get into a car willingly with them if she had missed the bus. This is a cul de sac in the middle of a remote area- how unlikely would it be for a stranger to be there? It would be like a needle in a haystack- possible certainly... but likely?

Finally a bra? Why pack a spare bra? Knickers (panties) sure- she may have had her period and therefore likely to pack a spare but a spare BRA? Makes no sense unless it was a fancy one and she was planning on going out or meeting someone after school- rest of the clothes don't really indicate that though do they?

Okay sorry if I broke any rules or repeated things others have said etc. This is all just speculation on my behalf and things that strike me as weird. :seeya:

 

[nursebeeme]

welcome to websleuths foxymona! :cheer:

 

[oceanblueeyes]

wow.. after seeing that picture of where the purse was found ( posted upstream) "secreted" surely fits the bill imhoo... wedged between a building and a cactus...

wow..

this was not thrown from a car imhoo... this was planted... and hidden at that (yet out in a relatively open area where people would be able to see someone hanging around the area)

great thoughts going on here about the bag, etc... great sleuthing peeps. I tell ya.. this bag is driving me nutz. Considering the amount of time that went by between when she allegedly vanished and when her mother was notified she was not at school (nearly 12 hours right???) there are lots of possibilities with this darn bag.


Right now I am leaning toward
1) someone who knows the house/Sierra/etc packed the bag after the fact (bag never left the house with Sierra)
2) the phone was tossed from the get go but the bag was placed in that area under the cover of darkness. And that being said, the perp (if a stranger) would have no way of knowing if anyone saw Sierra or what she was wearing before she left the house... so putting her same clothes that she was wearing into the bag would not make it look like she was running away, per se... So this tells me those folded clothes in that bag mean something else to the perp but darn if I know what... maybe a loose screw? Like the perp is sorry for what he/she did and was returning the items to a place near her home? (folded neatly and possibly have urine on them and secreted next to her books)


just thinking a little bit this morning on this bag thing... (someone please pass that plastic sheeting for the tomatoes lolol)

Morning Nursebeeme!

I guess that shows how different individuals can be. I agree with Marc Klass and believe the purse was thrownout from the window of a car. LE has also said that the items could have been tossed from a vehicle.

Imo, the perp would throw it toward a bush like the bushy cactus and it landed behind the cactus wedged up against the building, out of sight, like they intended for it to be then they would drive away.

Why place it 2 miles away from where she disappeared if it was to plant it there? Why not closer to where she caught the bus or her home? And plant it for what reason? Imo, the perp or perps simply knew they had to get rid of the items that would link them to Sierra and that is the place they chose. Maybe as they were leaving the area since the cell phone was found much closer to her home and it makes sense they would get rid of her phone ASAP.

The FBI believes these are the clothes Sierra was wearing when she left for school and finding those clothes along with her bra and panties does not feel like a plant to me but someone who was getting rid of evidence.

The one break the police have that the perp(s) didnt know they would get is Sierra sent a picture of the clothes she was wearing that morning. That is priceless. I am so glad that Sierra was like a lot of teenage girls who snaps pics all the time and sends them to their friends. Our teen granddaughters do it before school too. Why I dont know. Fun, I guess.

Clothes folded are much easier to get into a space than balled up. If balled or wadded up they would not have fit.

IMO