GUILTY CA - Sophia, 2, Yazmine, 1, & Xenia Coronado, 2 mos, murdered, 20 May 2014

[blue22]

BBM. I have no idea what you mean with this comment. She was in the house alone with the children, that is fact, not assumption. She phoned her mother and her mother came over because she sensed something wrong. To me, that is an indication the young mother didn't have the support she needed and the situation had escalated.

Her husband was right across the street yet she phoned her mother. I don't give him a free pass. Marriage is an equal partnership; the safety and care of children are supposed to be a priority.

JMO

First of all, how many women tell their friends, sisters, mothers serious things...and never tell their husbands? If I had an issue after my pregnancy or with my baby, or my mind...I would likely call a friend or my mother first. Why? Because, they have been there. I feel more comfortable freaking out to someone who has been through the process. I have a wonderful marriage. With that said, my husband has never carried a child or dealt with all the hard stuff that comes with that.

I'm not giving anyone a pass. I'm saying that it happens A LOT, that a spouse does not realize the other has a severe problem. It's not uncommon, and it doesn't mean the person is a bad spouse. I don't know, he could be the worst husband ever. I'm just not willing to assume that, because he was across the street working on a car, and she CHOSE to call her mother instead. Her mother gave birth to her. Not that this situation is normal, but it IS normal for a daughter to call a mother first in a dark time. Not only that, the husband could have easily stopped her and overpowered her. Have you not realized, that she could have not called the husband, because she deep inside didn't want to truly be stopped?

 

[Ebee]

Another unwilling member of the ppd club here. I suffered from debilitating anxiety after birth of my first child and was admitted twice to the psych ward. Even living in a major city, NYC and having doctors in my family it was a struggle to get good care or to be recognized for how severely I was suffering. Thankfully I am well today.

I'm a big advocate for the website www.postartum.net. You can search by state to locate a psychiatrist or therapist who specializes in treating reproductive mental health. It's really important to get care from someone who knows what they are doing. Recovery can be really speedy then. Or it can drag out for years when a doctor doesn't really know what they are doing.

Family members or mothers can contact the state coordinator through that site to find good caregivers. It's how I found my support group that helped me process the entire experience.

 

[1&2&3]

I must have missed it. How did CC try to murder her mother?

 

[kimi_SFC]

I must have missed it. How did CC try to murder her mother?

LA Times:

Woman accused of killing 3 daughters could face death penalty

Murder charges filed against a West Carson mother accused of killing her three young daughters carries a special allegation that could bring the death penalty, prosecutors said.

But the Los Angeles County district attorney's office said Friday it would decide later whether to seek the death penalty against Carol Coronado, 30.

(snip)
"Right now, he's (husband RC) giving her the benefit of the doubt," relative (JC) said. "He just said he didn't believe he saw Carol — he saw a demon inside her. He said he doesn't blame Carol. He blames the … demon."

(snip)
"I don't know how I feel about the woman right now," he (JC) said. "I don't understand what was going on in that woman's head."

(More@Link)
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-children-killed-death-penalty-20140523-story.html


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(snip from linked LA Times article)

Coronado also was charged with one count of attempted murder for allegedly trying to kill her mother, according to the felony complaint filed in the case. Investigators said it was Coronado's mother who found her daughter naked and "covered with blood" on a bed next to the bodies of her own girls.



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[borndem]

Another unwilling member of the ppd club here. I suffered from debilitating anxiety after birth of my first child and was admitted twice to the psych ward. Even living in a major city, NYC and having doctors in my family it was a struggle to get good care or to be recognized for how severely I was suffering. Thankfully I am well today.

I'm a big advocate for the website www.postartum.net. You can search by state to locate a psychiatrist or therapist who specializes in treating reproductive mental health. It's really important to get care from someone who knows what they are doing. Recovery can be really speedy then. Or it can drag out for years when a doctor doesn't really know what they are doing.

Family members or mothers can contact the state coordinator through that site to find good caregivers. It's how I found my support group that helped me process the entire experience.

Thanks, Ebee (love that name!), for sharing your story. It's like other cases we see together here -- more than one member has a personal true story to tell that helps others better understand what is going on with whatever the situation may be: child abuse, partner abuse, AIDS, alcoholism, gambling, etc., etc., etc. It is usually helpful for the teller and certainly for the "listeners." I am glad that you found good care and are healthy again!

And one more thang:

Welcome

:cheers:

to

:websleuther:Websleuths:websleuther:

:cheer:Ebee:cheer:

We're glad you're here!!!



:thewave:​

 

[SapphireSteel]

I am deeply disturbed by how quickly this woman's actions are being diagnosed as a psychotic break.

There is an excellent chance that she is NOT psychotic, [modsnip].

The fact they are contemplating the DP for her should scream that this is NOT a mentally ill individual.

Yes PPD exists, yes it's devastating to all involved - but if this woman does not have it (my bet) then you are doing a massive disservice to those who truly do suffer by stating that PPD can make you a child murdering maniac at the drop of a hat.

 

[kimi_SFC]

I am deeply disturbed by how quickly this woman's actions are being diagnosed as a psychotic break.

There is an excellent chance that she is NOT psychotic,[modsnip].

The fact they are contemplating the DP for her should scream that this is NOT a mentally ill individual.

Yes PPD exists, yes it's devastating to all involved - but if this woman does not have it (my bet) then you are doing a massive disservice to those who truly do suffer by stating that PPD can make you a child murdering maniac at the drop of a hat.

With all due respect, PPD is not Post Partum Psychosis. You have used the terms interchangeably in several posts, and that does a disservice to women suffering from either diagnosis.

The links posted regarding the DP have clearly stated CC could be charged with the death penalty. The DA hasn't made that decision yet. IMO it's far too soon. She hasn't been fully evaluated, nor has the investigation been completed. All we know is that the potential exists for the DP to be on the table. I posted the link earlier today.

If no MI exists, CC should be held fully accountable.

I strongly urge you to educate yourself on the differences between PPD and PPP. They are not the same, and the differences between the two are profound. There has been some excellent research posted upthread, and I implore you to read it. I will post more as soon as time permits.

Frankly, as Salem stated, we are projecting potential diagnoses onto this case, based on the possibility CC may have PPD and/or PPP, the past history of previous cases (Andrea Yates, for example), and the bravery of other WSers who shared their stories. As I have stated a few times on the thread, just because I understand d these cases forensically does not mean it makes it any easier for me to process as a mother and a human being. It angers AND infuriates me as well, but my field of study has taught me a great deal about MI. With education comes empathy and understanding.

This thread has become a place where women who are researching this case may come to gain knowledge about PPD and PPP. It might not have been the intent when the thread was started, but that's where we are. I had a classmate who was writing a paper about PPP who found this thread.

CC may be what you project her to be.

She also may not.

It's too soon to tell.

:twocents:



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[SapphireSteel]

With all due respect, PPD is not Post Partum Psychosis. You have used the terms interchangeably in several posts, and that does a disservice to women suffering from both diagnoses.

The links posted regarding the DP have clearly stated CC could be charged with the death penalty. The DA hasn't made tha decision yet. IMO it's far too soon. She hasn't been fully evaluated yet. The investigation hasn't been completed yet either. All we know is that the potential exists for the DP to be on the table. If no MI exists, CC should be held fully accountable.

I strongly urge you to educate yourself on the differences between PPD and PPP. They are not the same, and the differences between the two are profound. There has been some excellent research posted upthread, and I implore you to read it. I will post more as soon as time permits.

Frankly, as Salem stated, we are projecting potential diagnoses onto this case, based on the possibility CC may have PPD, the past history of previous cases (Andrea Yates, for example), and the bravery of other WSers who shared their stories. As I have stated a few times on the thread, just because I understand d these cases forensically does not mean it makes it any easier for me to process as a mother and a human being. It angers me as well, but my field of study has taught me a great deal about MI. Empathy comes with education and understanding.

This thread has become a place where women who are researching this case may come to gain knowledge about PPD and PPP. It might not have been the intent when the thread was started, but that's where we are.

CC may be what you project her to be.

She also may not.

It's too soon to tell.

:twocents:



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You realise I'm from another country, right?

We don't HAVE PPD, or what ever you wish to call it.

We have Post Natal Depression.

PND.

Would you rather I confused everyone even more by using the only term I am familiar with?

Also, getting the acronym right makes absolutely zero difference to whether this woman murdered her children, or was not responsible due to mental illness.

The Murder charge says it all. They are even contemplating the DP.

What ILL woman gets the death penalty?

 

[SapphireSteel]

With all due respect, PPD is not Post Partum Psychosis. You have used the terms interchangeably in several posts, and that does a disservice to women suffering from either diagnosis.

The links posted regarding the DP have clearly stated CC could be charged with the death penalty. The DA hasn't made that decision yet. IMO it's far too soon. She hasn't been fully evaluated, nor has the investigation been completed. All we know is that the potential exists for the DP to be on the table. I posted the link earlier today.

If no MI exists, CC should be held fully accountable.

I strongly urge you to educate yourself on the differences between PPD and PPP. They are not the same, and the differences between the two are profound. There has been some excellent research posted upthread, and I implore you to read it. I will post more as soon as time permits.

Frankly, as Salem stated, we are projecting potential diagnoses onto this case, based on the possibility CC may have PPD and/or PPP, the past history of previous cases (Andrea Yates, for example), and the bravery of other WSers who shared their stories. As I have stated a few times on the thread, just because I understand d these cases forensically does not mean it makes it any easier for me to process as a mother and a human being. It angers AND infuriates me as well, but my field of study has taught me a great deal about MI. With education comes empathy and understanding.

This thread has become a place where women who are researching this case may come to gain knowledge about PPD and PPP. It might not have been the intent when the thread was started, but that's where we are. I had a classmate who was writing a paper about PPP who found this thread.

CC may be what you project her to be.

She also may not.

It's too soon to tell.

:twocents:



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If she had been in a psychotic state she would have been detained in a psych ward.

She was not. The cuffs went on, she was dragged to jail, just like any other common murderer.

You can say "oh she was unwell" all you like but it DOESN'T APPEAR THAT SHE WAS.

 

[kimi_SFC]

Post Natal Psychosis is recognized by the Royal College of Psychiatrists

Postpartum Psychosis: Severe mental illness after childbirth


http://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/healthadvice/problemsdisorders/postpartumpsychosis.aspx?theme=mobile


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[SapphireSteel]

Post Natal Psychosis is recognized by the Royal College of Psychiatrists

Postpartum Psychosis: Severe mental illness after childbirth


http://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/healthadvice/problemsdisorders/postpartumpsychosis.aspx?theme=mobile


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So....if she kills her babies, it follows that she has Postpartum Psychosis?


Or, more accurately, she killed her babies, and may or may not have PPP.

We don't know and I personally think rushing to the PPP "excuse" is ridiculous when this woman's actions scream planning and malice.

 

[Disguiseduser0308]

New mothers kill their babies all the time. Psychosis isn't the only thing that kills babies. That's absolutely false.

I agree -- however for mother's suffering from PPP -- it's the psychosis that kills the child (if that happens) not the mother. I think that's what lost when things are taken literally and not in the context of what Melanie's mother is saying.

This was not a teen who flushed her baby down the toilet. Or a woman who hid her pregnancy and thus had to do away with it. The above video does not discuss that. It specifically discusses PPP.

 

[Disguiseduser0308]

So....if she kills her babies, it follows that she has Postpartum Psychosis?


Or, more accurately, she killed her babies, and may or may not have PPP.

We don't know and I personally think rushing to the PPP "excuse" is ridiculous when this woman's actions scream planning and malice.

PPP is not an excuse. It's a severe mental illness that has the potential to be deadly to mothers and their babies. If the mothers here sharing their story don't incite some type of thought that it's possible that something was mentally wrong, then I just don't know what else I can say.

No one knows what happens. The women here who share their stories only do so so people can know how very real this disease is. What is ridiculous is to assume this woman planned to kill her children with malice and forethought.

Lets see what comes out with regards to her mental health and evaluations. But... I can't not tell my story when these things happen.

 

[Disguiseduser0308]

If she had been in a psychotic state she would have been detained in a psych ward.

She was not. The cuffs went on, she was dragged to jail, just like any other common murderer.

You can say "oh she was unwell" all you like but it DOESN'T APPEAR THAT SHE WAS.

Andrea Yates was also arrested, cuffed, and detained in the regular jail for a period of time. Psych evals don't happen overnight. This woman isn't even speaking according to reports. Can't eval someone who can't speak.

 

[blue22]

I agree -- however for mother's suffering from PPP -- it's the psychosis that kills the child (if that happens) not the mother. I think that's what lost when things are taken literally and not in the context of what Melanie's mother is saying.

This was not a teen who flushed her baby down the toilet. Or a woman who hid her pregnancy and thus had to do away with it. The above video does not discuss that. It specifically discusses PPP.

She said mothers don't kill babies, psychosis does. She was making a blanket statement, and I responded to that.

 

[blue22]

Andrea Yates was also arrested, cuffed, and detained in the regular jail for a period of time. Psych evals don't happen overnight. This woman isn't even speaking according to reports. Can't eval someone who can't speak.

I find it very interesting, that she won't speak. They didn't say she can't, they've said she refuses. I think that's telling. I don't recall a case with a mother who was in psychosis that didn't speak a lot. The couldn't see that they did anything wrong, so there wasn't anything to be quiet about.

 

[Disguiseduser0308]

I am deeply disturbed by how quickly this woman's actions are being diagnosed as a psychotic break.

There is an excellent chance that she is NOT psychotic, but a murdering witch.

The fact they are contemplating the DP for her should scream that this is NOT a mentally ill individual.

Yes PPD exists, yes it's devastating to all involved - but if this woman does not have it (my bet) then you are doing a massive disservice to those who truly do suffer by stating that PPD can make you a child murdering maniac at the drop of a hat.

RBBM -- Actually, PPP can. That's why it's a medical emergency. I'm sorry you feel we might be doing a disservice to women suffering from postpartum mental health issues. Just know, our hearts are in the right place. To try to save anyone who might be going through this. To let them know they're not alone.

In respect to the mod who previously posted, I won't share anything else about this subject. I'll be keeping my eye on the thread though and if anyone has any questions, I'll do my best to answer them. Thank you all for your understanding and support.

 

[Disguiseduser0308]

I find it very interesting, that she won't speak. They didn't say she can't, they've said she refuses. I think that's telling. I don't recall a case with a mother who was in psychosis that didn't speak a lot. The couldn't see that they did anything wrong, so there wasn't anything to be quiet about.

Last reply -- I think that's the thing we can't predict. Each mental health event is unique to the sufferer. It's possible she's refusing to talk (we're getting this from LE, not psychiatrists) or that she physically can't talk. We don't know her mental state at this point in time.

I can see both possibilities. I'm anxious for information to come out about this -- if it ever does.

 

[blue22]

Last reply -- I think that's the thing we can't predict. Each mental health event is unique to the sufferer. It's possible she's refusing to talk (we're getting this from LE, not psychiatrists) or that she physically can't talk. We don't know her mental state at this point in time.

I can see both possibilities. I'm anxious for information to come out about this -- if it ever does.

Oh, I agree. I just find it interesting. I've not seen this in any of the major cases. (I would never claim to know about every case of a mother in psychosis killing their child(ren.) Just in the ones I"ve followed, the mother can and does speak fluidly about the situation. In all that I've read, it's been made clear that she has chosen not to speak with police...not that she is physically incapable. Whether that's the whole truth, who knows. If it is, I think it's strange. That's all.

 

[kimi_SFC]

So....if she kills her babies, it follows that she has Postpartum Psychosis?


Or, more accurately, she killed her babies, and may or may not have PPP.

We don't know and I personally think rushing to the PPP "excuse" is ridiculous when this woman's actions scream planning and malice.

We don't know enough to make a valid judgment either way. Your rush to assume she is guilty (which she may be) is no more justified than the assumption excuses are being made for her by posters sharing facts about potential diagnoses she could or not be suffering from.

The only people equipped to make that judgment are the properly trained mental health clinicians who are or will see CC at the jail or at a mental health facility in the future. We only know what LE or MSM tells us, which isn't much.

I haven't ever excused her actions. The conjecture of your response was yours, not mine.

I understand your anger, but it is displaced. Those innocent children should be alive today. I am wrestling with the need for punishment at this very moment, but this negativity isn't helping.

All I did was present the fact that in addition to Post Natal Depression, Post NatalPsychosis exists outside of the U.S., because you brought it up.

We can just agree to disagree.



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