Cadaver Dogs Hits and Info

[floridamom]

OT somewhat but remember when Danille VanDam's body was found? She was discovered by just regular volunteer searchers. Her body had just been dumped, and was covered with bugs, etc. (yea gross to think about) I just can't imagine seeing something like that, it would have to haunt you forever. One of the young men that found her said that he just woke up that a.m. and felt the need to volunteer in the search. And to think he's one of the ones to have found her, wild.

Anyway, they were just starting to make a deal with David Westerfield when her body was discovered. End of that deal! Yet he's was just getting ready to talk and then shut up. And has never talked again and I'm guessing never will. The thing with Casey is she just won't even get that far, she won't talk even for a deal. She will go to her grave without ever telling what happened to Caylee, JMO. And she's only 22, she's got a long life behind bars. What a waste as she would say.

 

[Lovejac]

Not a word. Or, from anybody else, down there, who would have a clue.

It's hard to say, because one can't be sure whether the cops would let the media know, in any case. They just reminded us, the other night, that they are keeping a lot of their forensic evidence unannounced.

So, it either: 1) WAS animal bones, 2) the bones were human, and for reasons of legality or procedure or whatever, the cops decided to say otherwise. If #2, it was either Caylee, or some other homicide victim, or even somebody who just died out there.

This case is SO weird, I'm not sure that we'll know anything, until the trial. If then! There could STILL be a plea deal, for some reason, and we might never hear the whole story.

Honestly, Brini, I don't think Casey will ever tell. And I keep remembering what soulscape, neptunian and housemouse said. That with all the Neptunian influence, we might never know the whole truth. But I am still praying that the truth will be revealed and I am excited about what the planets have in store for the 15th thru the 18th.:crazy:

 

[Stacy O]

I'm confused... If these were real cadaver dogs why would they hit on an animal????

I was thinking the same thing. Wasn't there a whole lesson we got on news or here on WS......my brain is fried........that cadaver dogs only hit on human decomp?

 

[Brini]

There is also a debate in the dog training community regarding training cadaver dogs on synthetic smells vs. actual. This is a very complicate training.

In the medical field, there are a few excellent cancer sniffers, as well as diabetes, seizure sniffers, and others...

One REALLY good melanoma dog. Who unfortunately has since passed.

The dog alerted on a "benign" lesion. The biopsy "proved" the dog wrong. The dog insisted. A second biopsy confirmed that it was benign. The dog persisted. Third time was the charm! Very early melanoma.

Another cancer sniffer alerted on the guy who was certifying him.

Gotta go watch NG!

 

[Brini]

Honestly, Brini, I don't think Casey will ever tell. And I keep remembering what soulscape, neptunian and housemouse said. That with all the Neptunian influence, we might never know the whole truth. But I am still praying that the truth will be revealed and I am excited about what the planets have in store for the 15th thru the 18th.:crazy:

Oh, yeah!

BTW-- Another f.a. that I know of suggested the same timeline.

 

[kyiala]

I was thinking the same thing. Wasn't there a whole lesson we got on news or here on WS......my brain is fried........that cadaver dogs only hit on human decomp?

thats what I thought too. I thought Gale said they were trained certified cadever dogs that would only hit on Decomp from a human...I am so confused...


anyway I have lurked for awhile and finally am able to post.. I have been posting on another site but had to leave was going crazy with all the negativity... I am glad I am here :woohoo:

 

[Brini]

I was thinking the same thing. Wasn't there a whole lesson we got on news or here on WS......my brain is fried........that cadaver dogs only hit on human decomp?

That's what I always heard.

 

[Brini]

NG is all about the chloroform, so far.

 

[memorylane01]

I was thinking the same thing. Wasn't there a whole lesson we got on news or here on WS......my brain is fried........that cadaver dogs only hit on human decomp?

Typically, yes. However, dogs smell in a cone shape .. as in, they start catching a "whiff" if you will in a broad area. They continue sniffing and smelling until they narrow it down to what they detect the smell the strongest. That is why when you see a dog work, they will smell from side to side. So there COULD have been another oder out there that the dog detected, they just happened on the bones and stopped. Totally logical. Cadaver dogs can smell up to 6 feet underground and even in some instances can detect in water. So there could be something out there that is more than just animal bones. LE knows this and may be searching further in the area because of it.

 

[Brini]

I do agree wholeheartedly with you and I think pretty much everyone else does too. Again, I think the issue is whether the tip about a possible cadaver dog hit was credible or not, not whether any search team is worthy of our gratitude. They all are as long as they follow the parameters set by LE!

Yes. The parameters are critical!

Somebody on NG is saying that it's possible that the FBI may have contaminated the test sample with chloroform? Or, ethanol and bleach which = chloroform?

 

[Diamond]

~snip~Whereas some dogs, expecially those trained by and used by non LE private individuals may only be trained on mamalian decomposition, as the aquisition and use of actual human corpses to train the dogs on tends to be somewhat frowned apon.

I suspect that the psychics dogs are of the later type. These are the ones that will find a dead rabbit or racoon in the woods.

Where are you getting this information? It's not true at all, civilian owners/trainers/handlers don't train on mammalian decomposition...rather human decomposition (for instance, coroner rags). All cadaver dogs are trained to exclude animal remains...LE or civilian owned/trained/handled.

 

[Brini]

Typically, yes. However, dogs smell in a cone shape .. as in, they start catching a "whiff" if you will in a broad area. They continue sniffing and smelling until they narrow it down to what they detect the smell the strongest. That is why when you see a dog work, they will smell from side to side. So there COULD have been another oder out there that the dog detected, they just happened on the bones and stopped. Totally logical. Cadaver dogs can smell up to 6 feet underground and even in some instances can detect in water. So there could be something out there that is more than just animal bones. LE knows this and may be searching further in the area because of it.

Ah! More interesting educational info! Thanks!

 

[Socre8tv]

OK - the cadaver dogs' hit is a bust it was a dead dog- (fox Orlando news at 10:00) there were some other items found in the woods (breastfeeding/nursing equipment) but YM said it had nothing to do with this case.

 

[Brini]

OT somewhat but remember when Danille VanDam's body was found? She was discovered by just regular volunteer searchers. Her body had just been dumped, and was covered with bugs, etc. (yea gross to think about) I just can't imagine seeing something like that, it would have to haunt you forever. One of the young men that found her said that he just woke up that a.m. and felt the need to volunteer in the search. And to think he's one of the ones to have found her, wild.

Anyway, they were just starting to make a deal with David Westerfield when her body was discovered. End of that deal! Yet he's was just getting ready to talk and then shut up. And has never talked again and I'm guessing never will. The thing with Casey is she just won't even get that far, she won't talk even for a deal. She will go to her grave without ever telling what happened to Caylee, JMO. And she's only 22, she's got a long life behind bars. What a waste as she would say.

Yeah, I don't think so, either. But, one can dream!

 

[mkath59]

This can't be good for the prosecution - "proof" that cadavar dogs hit on animals?

 

[Baznme]

Yes. The parameters are critical!

Somebody on NG is saying that it's possible that the FBI may have contaminated the test sample with chloroform? Or, ethanol and bleach which = chloroform?

Yeah.....it's the so called "expert" for forensics. He's forgetting that the FBI are not the people that were on line researching chloroform!

 

[Baznme]

This can't be good for the prosecution - "proof" that cadavar dogs hit on animals?

If it was Body Hunters dogs, this isn't the first time they have hit on animal remains. Cadaver dogs are just that..........trained to find "CADAVERS".

 

[faefrost]

Where are you getting this information? It's not true at all, civilian owners/trainers/handlers don't train on mammalian decomposition...rather human decomposition (for instance, coroner rags). All cadaver dogs are trained to exclude animal remains...LE or civilian owned/trained/handled.

You probably do know cadaver dogs better then I do, and I'll take your word that they are at least supposed to be trained to discriminate between human and animal/mamal remains. Most of what I have had experience with have been search and rescue trained animals. Those who look for living people.

But true cadaver dogs are very expensive to train. In most cases I suspect that they are only purchased and handled by LE. The psychics dogs kind of show that there are poorly trained animals out there in the lower tiers, that have simply been trained on decomposition. Not as specifically on human decomposition.

 

[Cagney]

Yes. The parameters are critical!

Somebody on NG is saying that it's possible that the FBI may have contaminated the test sample with chloroform? Or, ethanol and bleach which = chloroform?

NG asked him what the innocent reasons for chloroform being in the car were.
He was giving examples of why they might be in there. He was saying that he needed to know how much was in there because chlorine from the pool mixed with ethanol IE wine, liquor etc could make chloroform.
In reference to the statement about the FBI contaminating, yeah it was a pretty dumb statement. I think at that point, he lost most of his credibility....

 

[Chilly Willy]

Yeah.....it's the so called "expert" for forensics. He's forgetting that the FBI are not the people that were on line researching chloroform!

I don't understand this. The FBI takes evidence samples to the lab and where they are tested under very controlled conditions. They don't take Chloroform to the evidence and test it on the scene. How could the FBI contaminate the trunk with Chloroform? It's ridiculous.