Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 June 2014 - #7

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If you are moving to Edmonton from Calgary, which is approx 3 hours north, why would you be selling off the bulk of your possessions? I can see that if you were making a permanent move to another country, but not for such a short distance.

A person who has gone missing from their home may have been determined to be in medical distress because they left without taking life essential medications with them.

Musings from a long time Calgarian - hoping for a happy and peaceful resolution for all family members.
 
Gailey said:
A person who has gone missing from their home may have been determined to be in medical distress because they left without taking life essential mediations with them.
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Great point!
 
ztzt said:
The following video shows the "suspicious stains on the walkway beside the house" at 0:59~1:05. They do look like blood stains. :(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgXr5W3P4Qg
Click to expand...

If you pause it at 2:53 there is a clear view of the side door that a few people were questioning.

You can also see the drag marks coming from that door to the front of the house.

My brain is computing this and how a stain like that would be created.

Someone must have had significant blood spewing from their body to create a continuous and wide area drag mark. The it appears the dragging stopping the driveway and the bleeding continued, resulting in the larger, final blood stain. Then the person was obviously moved into a vehicle from there.

Whose blood was it? Surely they know by now. I wonder why they don't say.
 
Gailey said:
If you are moving to Edmonton from Calgary, which is approx 3 hours north, why would you be selling off the bulk of your possessions? I can see that if you were making a permanent move to another country, but not for such a short distance.

A person who has gone missing from their home may have been determined to be in medical distress because they left without taking life essential medications with them.

Musings from a long time Calgarian - hoping for a happy and peaceful resolution for all family members.
Click to expand...

Not trying to be judgemental but maybe because their furniture was hideous and they wanted to buy nicer stuff? It all looked 20 years old. I wouldn't take it either.
 
Could the new house they bought have included furniture?
 
bakerlady said:
the larger, final blood stain. Then the person was obviously moved into a vehicle from there.
Click to expand...

The largest, final stain could be caused when, at the end of the dragging, the perp left the victim on the ground for a few minutes while he went to access the vehicle.

If those were blood stains, I suppose they had been treated with chemicals to make them lighter.
 
According to this article, forensic scientists use bleach to remove contaminating DNA from teeth and bones:

from:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16182949

The extraction of DNA from archaeological or forensic skeletal remains can provide quite powerful data for analysis, but is plagued by a unique set of methodological problems. One of the most important methodological problems to overcome in such analyses is the presence of modern contamination on the surfaces of bones and teeth, which can lead to false positives and erroneous results unless it is removed before DNA extraction is initiated. Ancient DNA (aDNA) researchers and forensic scientists have employed a number of techniques to minimize such contamination. One such technique is the use of bleach (sodium hypochlorite--NaOCl) to "destroy ...
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The hose at the side of the house appeared to be neatly stored. Would a perp tend to that fine detail? Instead of hosing down the walkway, I wonder if buckets of bleach were used on the blood.

Sodium hypochlorite? Need to read up on it, but IIRC, somewhere along the line DG was also ordering sodium (not sure it was specified sodium hydrochlorite).
 
sillybilly said:
The hose at the side of the house appeared to be neatly stored. Would a perp tend to that fine detail? Instead of hosing down the walkway, I wonder if buckets of bleach were used on the blood.

Sodium hypochlorite? Need to read up on it, but IIRC, somewhere along the line DG was also ordering sodium (not sure it was specified sodium hydrochlorite).
Click to expand...

DG's company is in the business of dealing with (manufacturing or trading) "Mercury, Sodium". See DG's company's website:

P2 Solutions Ltd.

The several trips of the green truck into that area could be explained to be going back and forth to get the chemicals from the truck to do "cleaning".
 
Torontonian said:
Any reason why the parents are not in front of the media more begging for the return of their son? I find it odd that they are not speaking more publicly asking whoever has nathan to return him. Are LE telling them not to do this?
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I would say they are definitely being guided by the LE. Examples, would be that there was initially talk of a reward, and then that dissolved. The update where the parents and other family members spoke and answered reporters questions, some of which were "no comment". At the vigil, where the parents, especially the mother, JO, thanked everyone, and I also noted, it was reported that she hoped that whoever had them, specifically Nathan, that he/they were being given food and water. Now, the fact that KL's brother Randy Provost spoke to the media at the vigil quite freely, might indicate he felt more at ease to speak and maybe viewed it as not being under direct instructions so to speak from LE? Just a thought.
 
I'm still puzzled by the investigators saying the case was "less of a mystery" in the early days of the disappearance. They must have considerable certainty about what/who was the culprit to be so confident as to announce that to the public.
 
ztzt said:
DG's company is in the business of dealing with (manufacturing or trading) "Mercury, Sodium". See DG's company's website:

P2 Solutions Ltd.

The several trips of the green truck into that area could be explained to be going back and forth to get the chemicals from the truck to do "cleaning".
Click to expand...

This could make sense, yet I find it hard to fathom in the first place that somebody took the time to "clean" - at least on the outside of the home that we've been made aware of, as the so called stains could not be confirmed by LE (obviously until they investigated further). Otherwise, they surely would have at least confirmed, and said something like, what looks to be blood was found at the scene. We don't know if the same was done inside the house or not, as that hasn't been revealed. Only that a "violent incident" occurred.

I am personally puzzled why "someone" took the time. There has to be more of a reason other than "discovery of the scene" due to the time frame involved. Just so very risky. And, to go back and forth? There must have been something more than the perpetrator(s) didn't want found out (DNA? and whose?), and could only remove by doing some kind of cleanup. IMO I can't see just one person responsible for all that happened - and that's just for what little we know, and possibly surmise happened.
 
Questions:

Did anyone contact the reporter Francis Silvaggio of Global National news re: accuracy of the footage from July 7 newscast of the green truck?

Did Global news have the inside edge on reporting this footage from making deal with LE?

Example: Police have POI in mind and already know about the green truck via tips. Global news is asked by police on July 2nd or 3rd to fly over the G's farm/surrounding area in their media helicopter to see if they can observe a green truck on the premises. In return, Global National can use the footage on Monday July 7th newscast. The Global news helicopter flies all over Calgary and surrounding areas at least 2 times a day for a couple of hours at a time. If it was seen in the sky by an Airdrie resident at that time they wouldn't think twice about it especially because Airdrie had yet to be in the news on those dates.

This buys the police some time, allows them to arrest DG, secure the G property for search and impound truck and take away.

If the Hawcs Police helicopter however had been buzzing around the G property on July 2 or 3rd , several people in Airdrie would/may take notice including anyone on the G farm.

------------------------------------
Did JO call 911 at 10 am? Did she call anyone else first, like her husband? Did RO rush over? Did she stay at house or run to a neighbour's house? How many people/who was at house when police arrived?

Example: If she called her husband first, he could have said call 911 and get out of there, I'm coming right over.
As JO is 33 and AL and KL lived in that house for 17 years it is entirely possible she has lived in that house and may know an old time neighbour very well enough to run over after and call from there. The neighbour may even have gone over and checked the house themselves. If this happened LE could have told the neighbour to keep quiet about what they know.

Did CL brother of AL go through the house with police when he arrived unannounced at 12?

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The recent Lake Bonavista murders had a very contaminated crime scene as the initial call was for carbon monoxide poisoning and the scene wasn't secured until about 12 hours later after many people had traipsed through.

In the Parkhill case the Amber Alert was issued around 5 pm. How quickly was the scene secured as a crime scene? How many hours before the Amber Alert was issued was it secured?
 
Menci said:
This could make sense, yet I find it hard to fathom in the first place that somebody took the time to "clean" - at least on the outside of the home that we've been made aware of, as the so called stains could not be confirmed by LE (obviously until they investigated further). Otherwise, they surely would have at least confirmed, and said something like, what looks to be blood was found at the scene. We don't know if the same was done inside the house or not, as that hasn't been revealed. Only that a "violent incident" occurred.

I am personally puzzled why "someone" took the time. There has to be more of a reason other than "discovery of the scene" due to the time frame involved. Just so very risky. And, to go back and forth? There must have been something more than the perpetrator(s) didn't want found out (DNA? and whose?), and could only remove by doing some kind of cleanup. IMO I can't see just one person responsible for all that happened - and that's just for what little we know, and possibly surmise happened.
Click to expand...

I can only assume the reason a perp would possible stick around and clean up a "blood mess" is if he/she and been cut as well and bleeding
 
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