Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #5

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I doubt murder/suicide would have even entered our heads had it not been for that rumor. Based on that rumor, I tried hard to figure out why and how murder/suicide could happen IF it did, while perching precariously on the fence, but I hated to think it happened that way. At worst, it seemed possible that it could have been unintentional manslaughter/suicide, but again, that thought only came from the rumor of murder/suicide. Otherwise, double murder was the more obvious conclusion. The Frank Report was quite accurate and I wonder who was feeding them info.

But I’d really love to know who planted this rumor. What did they have to gain, if anything? Perhaps someone who hoped LE would be stupid enough to accept that explanation? Or someone who set it up to look like a double suicide, but knew LE would quickly figure out it wasn’t? Or just someone who spoke out of turn and the press ran with it? I do understand why LE couldn’t reveal anything to the family to ease their minds without compromising the investigation. Hopefully, the rumor caused the murderer to relax their guard.

JMO
I honestly think it was a rookie mistake from someone who spoke too soon from 33 division. But you are right, I wonder if that rumour caused the perpetrator(s) to relax, possibly mess up somewhere, or leave a trail over the last 6 weeks.
 
Did the CEO resign after the homicide announcement? Wonder if he was scared.

No, the announcement came just before the press conference, although I think it's likely those immediately concerned, like the family and the principals at Apotex, already knew what was going to be said. But I don't think he resigned; I'm sure he was pushed. The "pursue other opportunities" line is standard boilerplate in such situations, in my experience.

IMO, the decision to let him go may have been made sooner, and likely relates to the Teva mess, but was announced on the same day as the press conference in order to limit media attention rather than stir up yet another feeding frenzy sooner.
 
No, the announcement came just before the press conference, although I think it's likely those immediately concerned, like the family and the principals at Apotex, already knew what was going to be said. But I don't think he resigned; I'm sure he was pushed. The "pursue other opportunities" line is standard boilerplate in such situations, in my experience.

IMO, the decision to let him go may have been made sooner, and likely relates to the Teva mess, but was announced on the same day as the press conference in order to limit media attention rather than stir up yet another feeding frenzy sooner.

I agree.
 
The fact that they appeared "semi-seated" could indeed mean they died in the sitting position, and rigor mortis set in.

Rigor was long gone by the time the bodies were found. I took "semi-seated" to mean they were bent at the waist, supported by the belts, but with their legs straight out.
 
How frightening what this couple endured.


I absolutely agree to carry out a ritualistic murder to one person is depraved but to do it to a couple thereby forcing them to witness their loved one being smashed and restrained (bound)then strangled is demonic.

I thought the legal investative team really laid it on the line with their press conference. That is 'their private autopsy evidence was irrefutable'.Their exact words in the release were crystal clear,"[FONT=.SFUIText-HeavyItalic]BS & HS wrists showed evidence,at one point ,bound together".The logic being that there was another CS where BS and HS wrists were bound with i.e. tie wraps. That statement made it plain BS & HS were brutally murdered.
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What makes people think that Honey put up a fight versus that she was beaten and her face smashed on the floor to torture Barry? As for motive, as he said himself he was surprised that he hadn't been killed to date. I'm guessing he thought he might get a bullet in a parking lot instead of someone having the nerve to come into his home etc
 
What makes people think that Honey put up a fight versus that she was beaten and her face smashed on the floor to torture Barry? As for motive, as he said himself he was surprised that he hadn't been killed to date. I'm guessing he thought he might get a bullet in a parking lot instead of someone having the nerve to come into his home etc
Yes it sounds as if she was smashed to the floor face first. Hopefully the blow knocked her out and she was saved from experiencing the horror.
 
Glad to see the BBC article on my news feed with the police confirming it was murder a few minutes ago. It must've been horrible for the family to have to endure murder-suicide rumours.
 
What makes people think that Honey put up a fight versus that she was beaten and her face smashed on the floor to torture Barry? As for motive, as he said himself he was surprised that he hadn't been killed to date. I'm guessing he thought he might get a bullet in a parking lot instead of someone having the nerve to come into his home etc
It was this post in the previous thread

I heard on CBC TV news an hour ago that the private investigators said Honey had put up quite a fight as there were cuts and scrapes on her hands.

post #861 thread 4
 
I am only now getting up on this case. I heard about it when they were initially found and heard the investigation was ongoing but didn't pay much attention. But I will now. Wow! But I have to say that this doesnt sound like a business hit to me. This seems much more personal, or else the work of someone very demented. Or someone trying to get information out of him.
 
Come to think of it however, a release just means that the investigators are finished investigating and they are releasing the scene. How does that indicate that it was or wasn't a suicide? We don't even know yet. JMO
Has any murder suicide investigation ever taken THIS LONG?
MOO

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
 
What are your thoughts on the recently departed CEO? There are a lot of possibilities.

Say there is no (personal) link between the CEO resigning and Barry and Honey's deaths... The company has to know that their business dealings will be put under the spotlight during the investigation. Maybe he knows that some shady information will come out and is preempting it by resigning now. Or maybe internal politics inside the company mean the Shermans' death were used for leverage to finally oust him?

If he knows something about the murders, is he withdrawing because he had a hand in their deaths, or because he's afraid for his own life? With both Barry and Honey dead, was he the person who the 'message' was directed at?

...Also possible he just wanted to leave and this was a perfect time to jump ship.
 
So scenario time.

Who knew they would be going to the architect( we don’t know that is true but we do know they were seen alive Weds evening)

They were found with clothes but no mention of the jackets

What are LE looking for on the roof?

BS could have been atracked alone somewhere. Why include Honey?

Restraining, beating, hanging. Lots of effort.

Did Honey come in the front door and Barry the garage?

Were the perps in the house waiting?

Was anything stolen?
 
What they must have endured. I hope they find who did this, ASAP. With all these lawsuits, they definitely should have had state of the art security, but hindsight is 20/20. Then there's that lockbox to add to the lack of security.
 
Bet the killers are fairly young. I could imagine them saying to each other : " let's leave them hanging out by the pool " a sadistic joking kind of vibe. Just my opinion though...

With all due respect, I see your point, but
I doubt that inexperience, and/or youth was involved, as far as the killers were concerned. This was IMO a very professional, contract hit, and they sent some of their best. Like the FBI Profiler said from the beginning, someone was sending a message by leaving them hanging. They could have just quickly shot them in the back of the head, and left the bodies where they fell.What is the message, and to whom was it sent ? I certainly think it was a warning that others, like the Shermans, need to obey certain cultural expectations, and business rules. IMO the message was to the very rich, who fund raise in the millions, and get involved with politicians, and Big Pharma high level decisions, and deals. I don't mean to repeat myself, but I still think that leaving them hanging on display, side by side, in a half sitting postion, with their necks tied to pool railings by men's leather belts, makes a statement about shaming this couple, and their family. That shame may be evident to the Jewish Community at large, because in their culture, death by hanging implies a divine curse. Possibly whoever ordered the hit felt that somehow they deserved a curse, which justified their deaths. Why, I do not know. It could be family ( the orphans ), angry business associates, or because of deep political issues. It bothers me too that Honey suffered injuries before death that caused so much bleeding, and that she was quite possibly already tied up when it happened. Did someone especially hate her, even more than Barry ? She had such a good, kind reputation, it hardly seems possible, but we know so little. Was she tortured to make her give her killers some information, or maybe call Barry on the phone, so he would come home, or was it done just so Barry would see that horror as the last thing before he died ? The people who ordered this hit were very angry, full of hate, and wanted to make sure that everyone understood that even the privileged elite have to live by certain rules, and obey a chain of command. It may even be more about power and control of those who move in those circles, than it is about hate. The professional assassins who left no trace, have left long ago. It takes real talent, planning, and expertise, to enter and leave a house in a wealthy neighbourhood without ever being seen, or captured on video. They may even have been in another country before the bodies were discovered. Those who sent them are so powerful, rich, and protected that I doubt they will ever be found. I have no idea if they are in Canada, or another country, or who they are. Unless there are some real surprises, I don't think we will ever know what exactly happened to The Shermans that night, or who killed them. It will likely remain a great Canadian mystery. IMO
 
So scenario time.

Who knew they would be going to the architect( we don’t know that is true but we do know they were seen alive Weds evening)

They were found with clothes but no mention of the jackets

What are LE looking for on the roof?

BS could have been atracked alone somewhere. Why include Honey?

Restraining, beating, hanging. Lots of effort.

Did Honey come in the front door and Barry the garage?

Were the perps in the house waiting?

Was anything stolen?
Could there have been a "trusted" thrid party there unrelated to the family to serve as a witness for any transactions/ discussions regarding the new home?
Say, to follow them home and continue a discussion?
MOO
ETA: that 8:30 pm email must have been a doozy!
Regardless of who sent it!
MOO
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
 
FWIW, I had a dream about the Shermans, on the morning their bodies were found. I described it online a few days later (Dec 19).

In it, I saw the murder of an elderly couple, committed by several people (either 3 or 4), and there was some connection to horse stables. ...

IMO, the resignation of Apotex CEO Jeremy Desai minutes prior to TPS confirmation of double homicide lends further credence to the theory that Teva's lawsuit against Apotex may somehow be key to the killings.

It's been alleged that Desai's girlfriend, Teva employee Barinder Sandhu, provided him with a significant amount of confidential company information.

Both Apotex and Teva make generic versions of products (such as Avandia and Premarin) that are derived from horse urine. That may explain why I saw horse stables in my dream about the Sherman murders.
 
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