Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #5

[Wondergirl]

I urge everyone to watch the presser.

The Detective was more than commanding and convincing (I've watched more than my share of pressers, and I say this with full confidence, fwiw.)

I think the loose leaf comment/speculation by an officer about the "murder-suicide" angle was just that.

I think the extremely high profile of the victims made for instant media sensationalism and the speculation and rumours were running rampant.

I have full confidence in LE, and if there is a possibility of capturing the murderer(s), they will.

I have my thoughts on the motive and who is at the top of the suspect list. But there is really no point in tossing it around.

I hope this presser results in a witness or five coming forward with information that may assist to break the case.

Regrettably, we will likely have to settle in for a long haul on this one.

JMO

 

[pamelado2]

So.....what about TPS claiming right away this was M/S. THAT in itself is awful, for everyone involved. Shame on them for releasing that statement when it was with little knowledge.

I am happy that we can now put this argument to rest, and now focus on who did it.

LE never claimed that. Although they didn't come out and refute it either

I'm just very happy they've finally said something!.

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[kay74]

From the start it was a no-brainer, they were murdered.

 

[Grey-St]

I urge everyone to watch the presser.

The Detective was more than commanding and convincing (I've watched more than my share of pressers, and I say this with full confidence, fwiw.)

I think the loose leaf comment/speculation by an officer about the "murder-suicide" angle was just that.

I think the extremely high profile of the victims made for instant media sensationalism and the speculation and rumours were running rampant.

I have full confidence in LE, and if there is a possibility of capturing the murderer(s), they will.

I have my thoughts on the motive and who is at the top of the suspect list. But there is really no point in tossing it around.

I hope this presser results in a witness or five coming forward with information that may assist to break the case.

Regrettably, we will likely have to settle in for a long haul on this one.

JMO

Susan Gomes is a phenomenal investigator. They have the best of the best on this case.

I agree, settle in for the long haul folks.

Also, I say toss away. Your theories on suspects and motives are just as good as any of ours .

 

[JDG]

Obviously but....they have no right to say it is M/S to their family when that was false. Murder or suicide doesn't jeopardize the investigation.

It was a rumour, started before the bodies were even removed from the scene. It was never told to the family by TPS

 

[kay74]

Did the CEO resign after the homicide announcement? Wonder if he was scared.

 

[JDG]

RBBM- They may have been seated on chairs or cushions when restrained by the belts and then the seats were removed leaving them in a semi-seated position.

Didn't the police say their legs were out in front of them? Possibly bent a bit at the hips but not as if on a chair. IMO

 

[AllyJane]

It was a rumour, started before the bodies were even removed from the scene. It was never told to the family by TPS

However for the family to feel that they had to address it at the funeral sounds like the police weren't telling the family much of anything. If the police had told the family early on that they suspected double murder, then I am not sure if the family would have hired the PI.

Also, I am wondering the the murder suicide came from a leak at 33 division vs the Homicide squad. 33 Division was the first on the scene and the "no forced entry" and "not looking for suspects" came from their detectives I think. Wonder if someone there had their own theory and leaked the m/s. JMO

 

[AllyJane]

Did the CEO resign after the homicide announcement? Wonder if he was scared.

I think he resigned this morning. The press conference was at 1pm so he had resigned prior to the conference. Not sure if he resigned before the press conference was announced around 11am.

 

[Researchnut]

Susan Gomes is a phenomenal investigator. They have the best of the best on this case.

I agree, settle in for the long haul folks.

Also, I say toss away. Your theories on suspects and motives are just as good as any of ours .

I agree too. I thought the investigation was sloppy at the onset of the murders, however,I believe that when pressed the TP did a thorough investigation and will solve this now.

They say that they have sent evidance to the forensics unit. If the Shermans were murdered for information, this may show by someone extracting the information from their PC's. If no one touched the computers it would narrow the list of suspects dramatically IMO

Whomever murdered them seems to initially have had the intention of making it look like a suicide or murder-suicide and may have overlooked the fact that it would be put under a very thorough investigation.Personally, think the killer (s)made mistakes but unless someone leaks more information we are in for the long haul foresure .

 

[Jealoushe]

LE never claimed that. Although they didn't come out and refute it either

I'm just very happy they've finally said something!.

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Where did it come from?

I read an article that said Police source....??

 

[NaanOfYourBusiness]

And there you have it, finally! A double murder. Hopefully, that will put an end to the bizarre murder-suicide theories some posters were coming up with and were adamant about. This case never read like murder-suicide IMO even with the little facts we were given.

This reads like a contract hit either by their cousins or by some much more powerful person or agency. Who knows if it will ever be solved. Probably not.

Agreed. This has always sounded to me like a contracted hit to deliver a message. What the message is and whom the message is for remains be determined.

 

[human]

I agree too. I thought the investigation was sloppy at the onset of the murders, however,I believe that when pressed the TP did a thorough investigation and will solve this now.

They say that they have sent evidance to the forensics unit. If the Shermans were murdered for information, this may show by someone extracting the information from their PC's. If no one touched the computers it would narrow the list of suspects dramatically IMO

Whomever murdered them seems to initially have had the intention of making it look like a suicide or murder-suicide and may have overlooked the fact that it would be put under a very thorough investigation.Personally, think the killer (s)made mistakes but unless someone leaks more information we are in for the long haul foresure .

It looked sloppy because they played it close to the vest. We knew nothing except for some leaks such as in the Frank paper.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Didn't the police say their legs were out in front of them? Possibly bent a bit at the hips but not as if on a chair. IMO

Yes. I'm just wondering about the wording of 'semi-seated' as if their (sorry) rear ends were not fully resting on the floor.

 

[Snoopster]

From this article it sounds like the resigning CEO was crooked from the very beginning of his employment at Apotex.
He was hired in 2014 and the trade secret stealing from Teva started in 2014 it sounds like Hmmm (by his then "girlfriend"
https://www.fiercepharma.com/legal/...ormer-regulatory-exec-for-theft-trade-secrets

I've had a sneaking suspicion for a while that he was a plant. Not the leafy variety. I'm sure I posted about it very early on but I'd rather save it for a rainy day to go back through the old threads.

I believe he was with the company a long time, but just got appointed as CEO in 2014.

I find it odd that LE specifically made the point that the search warrants at the company were problematic and difficult to effect. Why mention that? Why point at the company? And then for a senior executive to suddenly leave the company that very morning causes one to go.... :thinking::waitasec:

Could be for many reasons (obstruction; disapproves of how someone else is handling the matter; knows something or just found out something; is involved in something that's about to be uncovered, etc.), but difficult to imagine it's not related to the case.

JMO naturally.

In any case, what a day. My thoughts are with the Sherman family. Even though they are likely happy with the LE direction, it still must be incredibly emotional.

 

[Lilibet]

It was a rumour, started before the bodies were even removed from the scene. It was never told to the family by TPS

I doubt murder/suicide would have even entered our heads had it not been for that rumor. Based on that rumor, I tried hard to figure out why and how murder/suicide could happen IF it did, while perching precariously on the fence, but I hated to think it happened that way. At worst, it seemed possible that it could have been unintentional manslaughter/suicide, but again, that thought only came from the rumor of murder/suicide. Otherwise, double murder was the more obvious conclusion. The Frank Report was quite accurate and I wonder who was feeding them info.

But I’d really love to know who planted this rumor. What did they have to gain, if anything? Perhaps someone who hoped LE would be stupid enough to accept that explanation? Or someone who set it up to look like a double suicide, but knew LE would quickly figure out it wasn’t? Or just someone who spoke out of turn and the press ran with it? I do understand why LE couldn’t reveal anything to the family to ease their minds without compromising the investigation. Hopefully, the rumor caused the murderer to relax their guard.

JMO

 

[pamelado2]

Where did it come from?

I read an article that said Police source....??

Right, what's a police source? Definitely not an official statement. Definitely not someone who is willing to go on the record. Could be anyone.

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[Grey-St]

However for the family to feel that they had to address it at the funeral sounds like the police weren't telling the family much of anything. If the police had told the family early on that they suspected double murder, then I am not sure if the family would have hired the PI.

Also, I am wondering the the murder suicide came from a leak at 33 division vs the Homicide squad. 33 Division was the first on the scene and the "no forced entry" and "not looking for suspects" came from their detectives I think. Wonder if someone there had their own theory and leaked the m/s. JMO

Brandon Price, Homicide detective, was the one to make the statement of "no outstanding suspects". To me, I believe that was the one irresponsible move of TPS Homicide Unit.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/barry-sherman-honey-sherman-homicide-deaths-1.4456170

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Agreed. This has always sounded to me like a contracted hit to deliver a message. What the message is and whom the message is for remains be determined.

I was in Culiacan, Sinaloa, Mexico for a few weeks years ago and the large drug cartel there used to display their murder victims in horrific ways. Part of the message in the display was to say 'they deserved this death', 'they *had* to have done *something* to be treated so inhumanely'. The death was somehow justified.

It oddly worked. For the most part, there wasn't an outcry for justice for the dead. And people thought if they kept to themselves and didn't bother with drug activity that they were immune to the violence.

 

[Grey-St]

Where did it come from?

I read an article that said Police source....??

It may have been someone from 33 Division, or someone in contact with 33 Division. It was always from a "source". TPS Homicide Unit never made a public statement claiming such a theory, nor did 33 Division directly.