CANADA - Lucas Fowler, Australian & g/f Chynna Deese, American, murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019

[PingTheRouter]

gary hughs has had like 4 or 5 pizza deliveries to his him while his stream has been going, i am scared the next this is swatting

 

[Snoop Sister]

In the other photo of the Texas escapee, I see more similarities to the composite drawing, but in this side-by-side, I do not think they look very similar. In my subjective opinion, the eyes are different, as is the nose, the ears, and the overall shape of the head. I do realize that a lot of people here think they look remarkably similar.

In the side by side that Otto posted, they look similar..Not so much in this one.

 

[Ran]

yes possibly
the other thing to remember is this is an old van its a good possibility the glass is not saftey glass and could be the old style plate glass which would shatter easier

yes it sure could be a gun. Easily a pistol or rifle. Shotgun less likely but it is possible. Or a head smashed on the window from inside. There are several scenarios where there could have been a violent struggle in the van, for example if the young man had been killed and the woman taken into the van to be assaulted. I have my doubts though as this would be a heck of a risk, the road is not that well traveled but people are on it.
The fact that the witness said a small hole in the back of the head of the young man indicated that is probably an entry wound of a rifle or pistol, not a shotgun

 

[Kittybunny]

I can think of several dozen forensic elements some of which the police certainly have, and some of which they likely have that we don't.

But keep in mind at the presser as well as what they leak, the police don't only have different motives/interest in the messaging than we wish, but they have competing interests within their own interests. They don't want to let on all of what they know or suspect since this could compromise catching the perp(s), or even beyond that, successfully prosecuting them.

Of the two known victims, they have bodies meaning prints, blood type, DNA, any transferred DNA, cause and means of death and almost certainly projectile ballistics.
At the first scene they have the victim's vehicle, and may have shell casing (which very often have prints of whoever loaded the gun, and which would narrow type of gun more closely), possible third party prints.

At the scene of the other deceased they almost certainly already have an preliminary finding as to time, cause and means of death, possibly an idea as to whether he died there or where the camper truck was, and prints, dental and DNA which may or may not help identify him. They'd check his hands for powder residue. That would not be definitive, but we can't exclude that he is the murderer, there is no slam dunk exclusion of him unless his time of death is clearly established as before the couples death. he could have killed the couple, and the two missing guys and offed himself in remorse. Likely? No. I doubt he would have ditched his ID before suicide, if that were the case. But completely excluded from what we know at this point? No.

For the missing young men, they could have criminal records if any, possible ownership or access to firearms (if any relatives firearms are missing), cell tower records, their DNA or prints from their family homes etc.

As far as robbery or meth-heads, sure that is possible. I guess from the police asking about the ID of the lone body, that there was no wallet or nothing with his name, which is very unusual nowadays.

I think this is too messy to be a serial killer. Now, sure, they are not all evil geniuses like in the movies. But this would be a pretty sloppy serial killing. Spree yes, serial killer no.

I think an escaped prisoner makes sense, since if he was desperate, he might well try and rob for some food and a junk van and kill the witnesses before learning the van was not running, and gotten in his own car. I'd be interested in if the ballistics or casings show the gun to be a pistol or a rifle. Rifles among locals there would be very common, ruger mini is probably in half the households there, whereas an escaped US fugitive more likely would have a pistol. Just the odds of how murders occur makes an escaped prisoner rare, but that cant be exluded.

Regardless of who did this, it is really tragic that this couple was victim of criminal violence at such a sweet time in their lives. And if the other lone guy and the other two young men are victims, this is really a big swath of cruelty.

Brilliant post! Agree with your very thoughtful deductions.

 

[zecats]

What I wrote is it depends, and cooperating with someone even at gunpoint is often a mistake, it depends on several factors. We don't know a lot of information about how this unforced, in fact it is as possible they did not cooperate.

And saying law enforcement input would suggest that one always cooperates is not true. You do NOT for example allow yourself to taken somewhere because that massive increase risk of being killed.

Lastly the were not victims of gun violence but of criminal violence. probably half of rural BC owns guns without killing anyone

Cause of death is by shooting. And by a criminal who used a gun.

 

[LoisLane]

I’m curious if the couple would have been heading to or already been to Dease Lake, if it was on the travel plans. Chynna Deese heading to Dease Lake could have been a romantic idea as part of their travel and adventure.

 

[1987]

I am wondering if the man could have been laying between the seats with the inside engine cover off working on the van and the female been sitting or laying in the back, killer has argument and or physical fight with man and exit threw front or side doors is blocked, female is trapped in the back of van and she broke the window during trying to get out.

 

[Ran]

I am torn, in this respect. I can't find any info that would lead me to accept that these two young men are experienced bushmasters, experienced at living off the grid, and on foot!.. if you count the vehicles , so far, those two boys are hoofing it, unless they had a spare vehicle stashed somewhere local, and this is unlikely.

There appears to be no record of them buying up big on supplies, or of any previous jaunts they have done. Unless I missed that somewhere. They are, to me, the WTF factor in this crime, or series of crimes, in these multiples of homicide on a Canadian highway. Not your usual place of this kind of activity.

Not even on the 401. Victims or perpetrators?.. it requires a big leap to get to perps, on the grounds that the factors that lead to two individuals both reaching the same degree of rage over two other strangers , or more, is very very rare. Rare indeed, and in people so young, also, but not a never ever scenario, only rare. This kind of impulsive , unplanned explosive murder doesn't sit well with the planning necessary, and the foresight imperative to then survive, without a vehicle , for days, in the woods, while a huge search is underway.

Well we would not know if they bought supplies.

As far as murders committed by pairs it is not uncommon at all. It is common enough in impulse killings, spree killings, robbery killings, sex crimes

Again I think all of us want to be careful since odds are they are victims. but there is also nothing at all to exclude them as perps. We are in the dark as to priors since the way canada treats criminal records they are private information. In the US the media would be able to check very quickly.

 

[zecats]

I’m curious if the couple would have been heading to or already been to Dease Lake, if it was on the travel plans. Chynna Deese heading to Dease Lake could have been a romantic idea as part of their travel and adventure.

They were headed north from Hudson's Hope. The only way for them to visit Dease Lake seems to be continuing north on 97 quite a ways and then heading back south on 37. There aren't any crossover roads. It is a little addition to the story that her name and the lake's are so similar. I also found a McLeod Lake in the northern area and one of the teen's last name is McLeod.

 

[Ran]

He is a POI

Exactly, he could very well not be the perp.
A dozen people could have stopped at that stalled van, what sets that guy apart is someone else saw him.
Yeah, the highway worker drove by and later -- after the murder was known, in hindsight said she was spooked, but what does that mean? she certainly was not spooked enough to call for law enforcement help or even roadside assistance for the couple.

 

[Tee404]

Well we would not know if they bought supplies.

As far as murders committed by pairs it is not uncommon at all. It is common enough in impulse killings, spree killings, robbery killings, sex crimes

Again I think all of us want to be careful since odds are they are victims. but there is also nothing at all to exclude them as perps. We are in the dark as to priors since the way canada treats criminal records they are private information. In the US the media would be able to check very quickly.

Agree re: being careful. My post here was removed due to the missing teens still being classed as victims. And that is fair enough.

 

[FunkyMonkey]

Thank you..yes! Both have those biker type caps as well. Don’t you think there is an uncanny resemblance? What do you think sleuths
.

I see resemblances to both. Nose to one, eyes and brows to the other. They could pass for being related to each other! MOO

 

[Ran]

Cause of death is by shooting. And by a criminal who used a gun.

the death was caused by a criminal, and criminals can use anything. Guns don't shoot themselves. Plenty of people in BC are murdered with knives, bludgeons etc., what is causing their deaths is criminality, not some object

And again in lots of circumstances law enforcement will strongly recommend NOT to cooperate. it depends on several factors.

 

[FunkyMonkey]

Killing spree , sounds about right, and no indication that the 'spree ' has ended. Or when it could start up again. And too messy , for an organized serial killer, however, a disorganized one could flail around Highway 97 until the cows come home, or until caught. Whichever comes first. …

It is , to me, a reasonable assumption to make, that it is a man.

There is nothing so far that indicates it's a woman, unless the road worker lady is extraordinarily clever and cool. And further, a lone man. Who could overpower two people, surprise being the deciding factor, risky, but not impossible. Nothing so far that indicates more than 2 killers travelling and acting in concert, unless, of course, it is the teenagers. I just don't get why they would burn their truck , in that case, vehicular possession being the difference between life and death 'out there'.

Where are those bloody boys!!. the longer this element of this crime remains mysterious the more convoluted the crime becomes...

Unfortunately I am afraid the boys are near wherever he stole their vehicle... MOO

 

[zecats]

Exactly, he could very well not be the perp.
A dozen people could have stopped at that stalled van, what sets that guy apart is someone else saw him.
Yeah, the highway worker drove by and later -- after the murder was known, in hindsight said she was spooked, but what does that mean? she certainly was not spooked enough to call for law enforcement help or even roadside assistance for the couple.

Someone saw him out of his vehicle and in a confrontation with the couple. Correct he is only a POI at the moment, but there is enough to be suspicious of him. Plus, LE have said they want to talk to him. If he was harmless and only there to assist them, he doesn't have a reason for not coming forward as a witness.

 

[zecats]

the death was caused by a criminal, and criminals can use anything. Guns don't shoot themselves. Plenty of people in BC are murdered with knives, bludgeons etc., what is causing their deaths is criminality, not some object

And again in lots of circumstances law enforcement will strongly recommend NOT to cooperate. it depends on several factors.

All I'm saying is when a death certificate needs a COD, it will say gunshot. Not criminal.

 

[otto]

Well we would not know if they bought supplies.

As far as murders committed by pairs it is not uncommon at all. It is common enough in impulse killings, spree killings, robbery killings, sex crimes

Again I think all of us want to be careful since odds are they are victims. but there is also nothing at all to exclude them as perps. We are in the dark as to priors since the way Canada treats criminal records they are private information. In the US the media would be able to check very quickly.

The only question that I can see at this time is whether the person who murdered the couple also murdered the unidentified man and burned the vehicle belonging to the two teens. The two teens are missing, and it's very likely that they are deceased.

I cannot see any connection between the missing teens and the murder of the couple where the teens are the murderers. There is no reason to include them as suspects.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Sorry if this has been said already, I'm trying to catch up! Maybe there were two men together, one killed the other and was on the run and the younger 2 missing guys witnessed the crime or something connected so they were rid of (although strange their bodies not found yet). If a killer is on the run, might've then run into the couple as well and killed as collateral damage too.

Robbery can't be the motive - the younger people looked like nothing to rob. Curious if the woman was sexually assaulted or not.

 

[MesquiteO21]

I’m curious if the couple would have been heading to or already been to Dease Lake, if it was on the travel plans. Chynna Deese heading to Dease Lake could have been a romantic idea as part of their travel and adventure.

I was going to mention the same thing. It probably has no direct significance to CD’s and LF’s murders and the missing boys, but Chynna Deese not being far from Dease Lake probably wasn’t a coincidence. I bet they were hoping to go to that lake just for the novelty of it. My surname isn’t that common and it’s the name of a town in WI so of course when I was a kid my dad had to take us there lol

 

[Ran]

Agree re: being careful. My post here was removed due to the missing teens still being classed as victims. And that is fair enough.

Agreed they could be either. From the police presser I don't see them classified as either. simply as missing persons. Plenty of POI or suspects in murder are classified initially as missing.

I think we want to keep reiterating that there is nothing to implicate them, and odds are most likely they are victims, but also that there is nothing at this point to exclude them. Just as the dead man 2 miles from their vehicle is also likely a victim, but not completely excluded as a perp either.