Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #14

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Just my opinion, but I the way I read this when I first saw it is a little different; the "if this is true..." part wasn't about the Ritalin snorting incident (that seems to be given as a first hand account) but rather regarding the killings.

I'm not surprised that, even if many of their peers witnessed such behavior as this one claimed, they would be reluctant to come forward - especially if they too were engaged in such behavior or similar. On the other hand, having only one anonymous witness makes it very, very plausible to doubt the veracity.

Thanks for your comment. I went back and read the story again and you're probably right. I got the wrong impression when I read it.

On the other hand, having only one anonymous witness makes it very, very plausible to doubt the veracity.

Yes, Ritalin and Adderall, snorting etc. have been an interesting subject to read about here.

But it did occur to me tonight - if we narrow it down - that the one and only thing that brought that topic into our conversation here at Websleuths was based on one anonymous comment in the Globe and Mail article.

I've never read about a hint of drug use anywhere else.
 
We don’t know how Mr Dyck was murdered at this point. There hasn’t been a clear statement by the RCMP about how he died. They found his body burnt. But if it’s a bullet and they recover the slug, it’s usually fairly easy to tie a slug from one murder to a slug from another murder if it’s all been fired from the same gun.

This is incredibly interesting. He's saying something which hasn't been disclosed, that LD's body was found burnt, while speculating that the COD could be something else entirely.
 
This is incredibly interesting. He's saying something which hasn't been disclosed, that LD's body was found burnt, while speculating that the COD could be something else entirely.

This is the only time LD's body being burnt has been mentioned by anyone, so I wouldn't place much credence on it. I have no idea where he got his information from but RCMP has certainly not mentioned it nor any of the reporters.
 
This is the only time LD's body being burnt has been mentioned by anyone, so I wouldn't place much credence on it. I have no idea where he got his information from but RCMP has certainly not mentioned it nor any of the reporters.

Hmm... perhaps he was told in confidence from someone attached to the investigation and let it slip in the interview. It's not hard to imagine a criminal defense attorney having contacts in LE.

Why would he say that if there was no basis in fact?

I feel that for the family of LD to have requested that the circumstances of his death not be reported, they would have to be more that a simple gunshot killing.
 
am on Sydney time, hence delay in response.

this series of murders cannot in any way be sheeted home and lumped in with school shootings, except on the very shaky ground that the ages of the perpetrators is similar. And, I suppose, the fact that they both had left school, which is , I gather, a trait, somewhat of some school shooters.

These were young men who were on an adventure. They said so. They claimed they were off to Yukon for work, or Whitehorse.. It had nothing to do with their school, or the underlying 'causes' that 'multitudes ' of researchers say on this topic, and I might add, most of the research is done by Americans, about Americans, because that is where these school shootings, in the main , occur, despite one in Finland last year. If anything, once the political aspect is removed, it has more to mirror in the antics of Breivik in Norway than any school shooting in the USA. Random victims, but in Breiviks case, not a random location.

Therefore, it just isn't logical to transpose that research, into that subject, into these murders and these two murderers. They had no connection whatsoever to their eventual victims, nor to the location , which appears to be random to both killers and victims. Totally random. Nothing to read or extract from a school shooting, or a mall shooting , for that matter into this event.

In many ways, it is surprising that Kam and Bry chose to do their killing on the lonely highway, without an audience, without the expectation of a 'statement of intent' , without the hue and cry of far more potential victims.

And like Breivik, like the kid in Finland, like the bloke in Charlotte, like the mall shooter in Dayton, like ( and so on and so on ) all white males, all having been well fed and housed and clothed and compulsorily educated , in the Western philosophy and tradition
and in the main, educated quite professionally for at least 12 years of their lives, unlike, as I can say with utter accuracy, billions of young men around the world. Billions. They had , despite parents divorcing , which is certainly the norm , more than parents staying to gether, really, a protected life in comparison.

Since this kind of thing has been going on for a very long time , (remember the one girl who was a perpetrator decades ago, the girl from the song " I don't like Monday' by the Boomtown rats? So far, she is the only female school shooter ) , it doesn't seem that research has got very far, the same old 'causes' are trotted out. The mothers is the first howl, usually, then video games, then horror DVDs , then the School, wherever it may be , then the brutality of teenage friends who pick on this sad child, then the 'system' and somewhere some one says 'what about the fathers?" and that's quickly moved on from, then the Government, then the voters, then the doctors, and then it's back to the Mothers fault, again.

I don't think anyone is comparing these guys to "school shooters". And we don't know what happened at both murder sites. We do know they were charged in Mr. Dyke's murder, and wanted for the murder of Lucas and Chynna.
 
It seemed at the time, that the body of Professor Dyck had been placed in the vehicle belonging to Kam McLeod ( or a relative of his ) and then both the vehicle and the body were set alight, and it took the RCMP some time to definitively work out who that body belonged to. .. and one is entitled to suppose the plan was to present as a car accident and the burnt remains to be mistaken for Kam, or Bry. Perhaps. Otherwise, why heave the body up into the vehicle?

Mr. Dyck's body was not found in Kam's burning truck.

"Their disappearance was first noted when the truck they'd been driving was found burning on the side of Highway 37. As Mounties searched the area, they uncovered the UBC lecturer's body two kilometres away."


UBC botany lecturer: What we know about the man found near teen murder suspects' truck
 
Thanks for your comment. I went back and read the story again and you're probably right. I got the wrong impression when I read it.



Yes, Ritalin and Adderall, snorting etc. have been an interesting subject to read about here.

But it did occur to me tonight - if we narrow it down - that the one and only thing that brought that topic into our conversation here at Websleuths was based on one anonymous comment in the Globe and Mail article.

I've never read about a hint of drug use anywhere else.

I've been wondering on the possibility of drugs being involved since before I heard of that Ritalin-snorting story. However, I was more wondering if it could be a case of bad reaction to a prescribed psyche med. It was the long chain of seemingly random, bizarre actions that made me wonder if drugs (legal or otherwise) were a factor. Basically, nothing else made any sense, so I was looking for something that might. I'd still think the drug angle was a possible factor even if the Ritalin-snorting story is totally debunked at some point. I'm not convinced by any means, I just think it's possible.

To give one example, the drug Diazapam (valium) is known to sometimes make people with an aggression problem more aggressive. The Las Vegas mass shooter was prescribed this medication a couple of months before the attack. It could be coincidence. There are other such possible coincidences. I've long wondered if some psyche medications, and even an anti-acne medication (accutane) has been suspected in this, and has psychosis as one of the possible side effects listed in the prescribing information (another is suicidal thoughts, depression, etc). This is why I favor requiring the police to disclose the toxicology reports on mass killers; to determine if there is a statistical indication of a connection to one or more medications (or perhaps a combination).
 
Mr. Dyck's body was not found in Kam's burning truck.

"Their disappearance was first noted when the truck they'd been driving was found burning on the side of Highway 37. As Mounties searched the area, they uncovered the UBC lecturer's body two kilometres away."


UBC botany lecturer: What we know about the man found near teen murder suspects' truck
If you read my post, I wrote in, or near the burning vehicle.

In the scale of the territory of the killings, 2 klms isn't a long way. It took the RCMP some time to ascertain that (a) the body, which had suffered burning was in some way connected to the burnt out vehicle back a small ways along the road, and then to work out that (b) it wasn't the body of either of the two people reported to be travelling in that vehicle.

And then (c), it had to be assumed that the person who's dead body , burned, must have, at some stage , had some connection to the burning truck and must have got to this destination by some OTHER vehicle, now missing, and obviously, the persons who arrived in the burning vehicle , had taken the vehicle belonging to the burnt dead man , who, according to NSW POL had been shot, also.

Therefore, the persons now in the vehicle that once belonged to the burned dead man were absconders, from the scene of an accident, at the very least, and at the worst, were murderers, and thieves, to boot.

And as it turns out, Kam and Bry pretty much appear to be both murderers and thieves. Otherwise, why then burn the vehicle of Professor Dyck ? .. . if not to try and fool the RCMP into thinking they were dead as well..
 
The post mortem examinations on triple murder fugitives Bryer Schmegelsky and Kam McLeod have been completed with authorities expected to release more details on the case in the next 24 hours.

Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) have so far remained tight-lipped about what killed the teens and have refused to reveal the nature of a mystery object found near their bodies.

But there are reports this morning the British Columbia branch of the force is preparing to make an announcement about the case on Monday morning (tonight Australia time).

RCMP Manitoba spokesman Sergeant Paul Manaigre said police needed to complete formalities relating to the identification of the pair before releasing autopsy details.

“We’re just kind of waiting on those formalities to be done and then that information will be shared,” he told CBC.
New details coming on Canada highway murder spree
 
The mystery of what sparked teenagers Bryer Schmegelsky and Kam McLeod to go on their killing spree and what led to their own deaths in wilderness in Canada's remote north could soon be revealed.

The Royal Canadian Mounted Police will make an announcement on the case on Tuesday (AEST).

The RCMP has not revealed how Schmegelsky and McLeod, 19, died, what the item found in the vicinity was, or if Schmegelsky died before turning 19 on August 4.


The announcement follows the airing on Sunday of 60 Minutes' interview with Schmegelsky's father Alan, who apologised to the families of the victims.

Schmegelsky snr, however, was shown cheering and saying "kudos, boys" when told during the interview the teenagers had successfully passed through a police roadblock.
https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-...ada-could-soon-be-solved-20190812-p52g6g.html
 
How would their privacy be affected if the COD was known?

Normally, public domain information regarding a death is name, date of death, and general location of burial. Everything else is protected by the right to privacy.

However, anything published in the obit, on sm, or even comments in the eulogy becomes public domain. I'll look for a link for that. We were informed of this by the funeral director when my dad passed away.

In rare cases, the Coroner may over ride this right to privacy and release additional information.

ETA .. this link is the closest I can find http://www.servicealberta.gov.ab.ca/foip/documents/bulletin16.pdf
 
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When they found the bodies, I remember someone saying they were in very dense bush, the kind of place no one would see or try to venture to. Maybe they were found at the base of a steep slope (cliff), where there is dense growth. I thought the bodies were together, or in close proximity. The fact they were in close proximity, means they definitely helped each other to the end. Not being sentimental, just an observation. MOO.

The bugs could certainly drive them off a cliff. It's just hard to explain their possessions in the water if, in a mad frenzie, they jumped to their deaths into dense bush.
 
In that same Globe article I believe there was one photo of a RCMP boat near the shore of the river too.

The RCMP photo was taken at the boat launch. You can see the cement where a vehicle would drive the boat trailer down into the water, and you can see the breakwater of rocks. I'm not sure that we know exactly how far the bodies were from that spot.
 
I follow the Australian Institute of Criminology on twitter and apparently their research has found a strong correlation between the acts of making hoax calls and committing arson.
and a strong connection to making hoax calls about fires being lit!.. The arsonist at Gippsland was into that big time, call up and report a fire he thought someone might have deliberately lit. And they had, it was him. ..

I wonder, ooo, if that is a cultural thing, fire being the most terrifying thing in AU, and deliberately lit fire unspeakably so...?? I would be curious to know if that is a universal thing, or a particularly Au thing.

I finally broke my own embargo on watching AU 60 mins, since that ghastly attempt to retrieve that woman's children that the father had taken to Damascus, the ex emirates hostie., the failed child abduction shindig … but I didn't last long, it took a few goes to watch and listen to Allen completely immerse himself in the hard job of deflecting any accountability whatsoever, in the matter of his only child. Even his plaintive howl near the end ,. how his pain is the most awful, no one else could compare. .. terrible terrible.

Not a very enlightening episode. That clip of Bryer with the 'play ' gun, lining himself up to shoot at a parked car, perhaps a parked car with people in it, was so chilling I had to turn away.
 
It continues to nag at me , a baffling anomaly in this whole criminal enterprise.. They murder Mr Fowler and Ms Deese. Then, a couple of days elapse, and a distance of around 500klms. ( miles or klms in Canada? I forget ) .. those couple of days, and that distance did not in any sense diminish the rage it takes to murder another human being. It did not appear to retreat or extinguish, but somehow, the two of them as an operative pair of killers, managed to maintain their rage and fury after sleeping at least one night, maybe two, and then managed to ratchet it up to concert pitch to kill again. Together.

Decades ago, a pair of young soldiers, just escaping out of boot camp decided the world was hateful and they were just the pair to balance this out somewhat, and kill people as revenge for their feelings of being hard done by. Truman Capote wrote about them in his book 'In Cold Blood' , they wound up in the same prison ward ( the Death Row) as Dick and Perry, and were their rivals in the strata of status in Death Row at that prison. They could go days without killing then pitch themselves up to start up again, .. it is a very rare phenomenon.

There is no report of them being anywhere in those few days between the killing of Ms Deese and Mr Fowler, and then the killing of Prof Dyck. No report of them robbing, or attempting to kill anyone else, because it is difficult to have a strike rate of perfect success as K and B appeared to have, that is, no failure of trying to hold up someone who got away, or someone who saw them approaching in a menacing manner. Most killers don't have that kind of 100% success that K and B managed to attain.
 
In your opinion, at what age do leisure activities stop being play and become hobbies?
 
I dont think rage was the motivating factor behind any of these murders.

Imo, these two teens were spree killers with little or no emotion behind them.

Spree killers simply kill because that is what they want to do, and have set out to do it.

<modsnip>

Jmho
 
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