GUILTY Canada - Noelle Paquette, 27, Sarnia, Ont, 31 Dec 2012 - #3

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justthefact said:
These are profilers ..so you dont believe their work? hmmmmm..they have helped in many many cases that deal with the criminal mind..and each time of sick crime involved
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Ok. Show me the credentials of these "profilers". Please. If this is a fact than show me. Otherwise you may want to add IMO to your last statement.
 
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appleeye said:
I think that is a stretch. Just my opinion.

I would think she would meet up with siblings in town before she would do that. I know people are just musing about but there is nothing at all in me, knowing the city , the people and some of the players that would suggest that at 230 in the morning, she would high tail it out to BG, basically hitch hiking.

This girl was crazy tight with her siblings.

When you are angry and fighting with your boyfriend supposedly, you want to be with friends (which she did not want the help of at the time) or just at home.
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Could she have been trying to meet up with siblings? Perhaps that's who it's rumored that she was texting nonstop (assuming the cab info from reddog is correct). I wish we knew more about the basic timeline/facts, generalities, not details. Just enough info to end speculation. KWIM?
 
appleeye said:
I guess my thoughts are this... because they have been charged with premeditated murder - being murder 1 - I consider the part that they premediated a murder to be fact. Because the police say so at this time. This could change and evidence may not be enough to support this in court, however... until they are in court and proven not guilty, that will be the assumption even though I know that you are innocent until proven guilty.

Was it sick? Was it crazy? Was it an accident and just being kidnapped was the plan? Who knows?

This group is called websleuths. People are musing about for answers... hoping to find something. As said before, these boards have apparently been helpful in solving some cases. Without brainstorming and stretches of the mind, I don't think you can do that?


Do you see where I am going here?

I see you are local, so am I. Us locals tend to be a bit hot about this topic right now and rightfully so.

:twocents:
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I think perhaps people are getting idea that premeditation is required to lay a first degree charge. But, there are two reasons for first degree murder charges to be laid under the Canadian Criminal Code: 1) premeditated or 2) a homicide occurring in the commission of another crime as noted in the code:

From: http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-231.html

Classification of murder

231. (1) Murder is first degree murder or second degree murder.
Marginal note:planned and deliberate murder

(2) Murder is first degree murder when it is planned and deliberate.
Marginal note:Contracted murder

(3) Without limiting the generality of subsection (2), murder is planned and deliberate when it is committed pursuant to an arrangement under which money or anything of value passes or is intended to pass from one person to another, or is promised by one person to another, as consideration for that other’s causing or assisting in causing the death of anyone or counselling another person to do any act causing or assisting in causing that death.
Marginal note:Murder of peace officer, etc.

(4) Irrespective of whether a murder is planned and deliberate on the part of any person, murder is first degree murder when the victim is
(a) a police officer, police constable, constable, sheriff, deputy sheriff, sheriff’s officer or other person employed for the preservation and maintenance of the public peace, acting in the course of his duties;
(b) a warden, deputy warden, instructor, keeper, jailer, guard or other officer or a permanent employee of a prison, acting in the course of his duties; or
(c) a person working in a prison with the permission of the prison authorities and acting in the course of his work therein.
Marginal note:Hijacking, sexual assault or kidnapping

(5) Irrespective of whether a murder is planned and deliberate on the part of any person, murder is first degree murder in respect of a person when the death is caused by that person while committing or attempting to commit an offence under one of the following sections:
(a) section 76 (hijacking an aircraft);
(b) section 271 (sexual assault);
(c) section 272 (sexual assault with a weapon, threats to a third party or causing bodily harm);
(d) section 273 (aggravated sexual assault);
(e) section 279 (kidnapping and forcible confinement); or
(f) section 279.1 (hostage taking).

So it is possible it was premeditated, but more likely occurred in the commission of one of the crimes under (5). And before we speculate, it could simply be the kidnapping that led to the first degree charge. The full charges will tell the story more clearly. IMHO, with deference to friends and family of the victim.
 
Frasier said:
Ok. Show me the credentials of these "profilers". Please. If this is a fact than show me. Otherwise you may want to add IMO to your last statement.
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From the Lodon Free Press today

In some instances, acting out a fantasy with a paid or consenting partner, prior to committing a sexual crime with a stranger, can be a part of the evolutionary process between fantasy and violence,” said retired OPP criminal profiler Jim Van Allan, who now runs Behavioural Sciences Solutions Group Inc.
you can go read the rest of the article...Im sure a retired OPP profiler ..makes him worthy to comment?

http://www.lfpress.com/2013/01/07/teacher-case-exposes-internets-sinister-side
 
justthefact said:
These are profilers ..so you dont believe their work? hmmmmm..they have helped in many many cases that deal with the criminal mind..and each time of sick crime involved
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IMO you may be watching way too much television to even make this nonfactual, unsubstantiated statement. Just sayin...... Fact check before you make claims these "criminal mind" experts are aware of all the facts and can actually make any educated statement at all in this case. moo. No disrespect.
 
justthefact said:
From the Lodon Free Press today

In some instances, acting out a fantasy with a paid or consenting partner, prior to committing a sexual crime with a stranger, can be a part of the evolutionary process between fantasy and violence,” said retired OPP criminal profiler Jim Van Allan, who now runs Behavioural Sciences Solutions Group Inc.
you can go read the rest of the article...Im sure a retired OPP profiler ..makes him worthy to comment?
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Like I said earlier. Great free advertising for this guy. A private business person getting his name out there. Nice. JMO. Believe what you like.
 
Local-np2012 said:
she used to work there!!!!! tanya was let go a while ago. she mentioned " she cant believe i actually worked with this girl" ....quote from her fb
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Since it is difficult to narrow down where TB was working at the present time (pre-incident) .... I wonder if she may have been out of work completely...

that could explain her references to having been having a low point in her life recently?

Just some thoughts...
 
Hamtowner said:
what I don't understand is, if the wounds to both of them / or just MM were so bad, how'd they drive all the way to London before getting treatment, and also check into a motel first? I'm not doubting that is what happened I'm just thinking if they needed to call EMT from the motel, it must not have been easy to drive the 45min - 1hr drive plus motel stop. I'm just curious about that.


As far as the court thing goes, the fact that it was turned over to the OPP, would that make a difference as far as them holding court in London vs Sarnia? I don't know anything about the court system but if the Sarnia LE turned the disappearance over to OPP when she was found, maybe they then would have the court case where the accused were apprehended vs where the crime took place?
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Perhaps they called EMS in hopes that paramedics could treat them there in the hotel room versus them going driving to the local ER and obtaining treatment there and increases the odds that ER staff would report things to LE. EMS doesn't always transport to hospital, particularly if a patient signs a waiver refusing to be transported. Maybe they were just hoping for some quick easy treatment there at the hotel.
 
Frasier said:
Like I said earlier. Great free advertising for this guy. A private business person getting his name out there. Nice. JMO. Believe what you like.
Click to expand...

Jim Van Allen has many years of experience as a criminal profiler, including as former manager with the Ontario Provincial Police Criminal Profile Unit.

He assisted in the investigation of the Paul Bernardo cases, and the Holly Jones and Cecilia Zhang homicides, two young girls who were abducted and killed in 2003 and 2004

A much sought after expert, Van Allen now heads the Behavioural Science Solutions Group, a private firm in Langley, B.C., that specializes in threat assessments and violence reduction strategies. He spoke to CBC News by phone from Langley.


If you want the link Ill give it to you....but that should be proof enough
 
appleeye said:
I have also heard from a medical professional that the splints that he was seen with in court sound like they could have been frost bite splints also, splinted and formed to keep blood flowing to the finger tips. With the temperatures that night and where the body was found , this is a real possibility.
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How cold was it that night? How long would it take to get frostbite? Sorry not from the area
 
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