Casey and Family Psych Profile #11

[chicklet]

Perhaps chicklet needs to state that it is his/her opinion regarding the questionable mental health issues/diagnoses, etc. of Casey Anthony and that would clear up any misconception regarding his/her posts. Most all of us on this forum include somewhere in our posts that it is IMO, JMHO, JMO, etc. Some include it in their signature line while others just type it in with their post.



~jmo~

I will be verified later tonight, so it won't be an issue.

 

[Ada]

I haven't obsessively followed this case, so maybe I'm coming at it from a slightly different place. Some of it could be that I've interacted with some extremely ill folks over the years and even people most would consider pure evil I still manage to find at least some redeeming qualities in. I've got a pretty deep Rogerian streak in me, too. I see love between both ICA and Caylee in the photos/videos I've seen. But even parents who have killed their children usually do love them and do the best the can with what they know and have been raised to learn.

BBM

chicklet, just wanted to point out that many of us have experience with extremely mentally ill people. Some with personal experience and some with professional experience, and, I imagine, some with both. Lots of folks found this site because of their ties with extremely mentally ill people, on whatever level.

Just saying. Didn't want you to think that we didn't know what we were talking about. :crazy:

 

[chicklet]

BBM

chicklet, just wanted to point out that many of us have experience with extremely mentally ill people. Some with personal experience and some with professional experience, and, I imagine, some with both. Lots of folks found this site because of their ties with extremely mentally ill people, on whatever level.

Just saying. Didn't want you to think that we didn't know what we were talking about. :crazy:

I know. I do believe, however, that some of the people who have been following this case very closely for the entire time might be more emotionally invested in it than someone who hasn't been following it all along. It's sort of like the way I have a difficult time being completely impartial and unbiased on the subject of domestic violence because I am a survivor and it is an issue very close to my heart even though my experiences ended almost two decades ago. I hope that explains what I meant a little better.

 

[Pensfan]

I understand what you are saying. That being said, we still come back to the DSM-IV-TR and the third diagnostic criteria...evidence of Conduct Disorder prior to age 15. There just isn't any evidence to suggest that ICA had Conduct Disorder as a child. Also, the videos and photos of ICA with Caylee depict a woman who has an emotional attachment. APD just doesn't fit. Many mental illnesses have very similar symptoms and traits and APD is very common in people in prison, especially men in prison. I think that's why "sociopath" gets kicked around so often. Sometimes it's something else, though and I really believe it is something else in this case.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/coldwar/images/sta_family.gif
http://www.russia-ic.com/img/news/news_6035_n.jpg
http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.town...0064a68-4a95-11df-9c1b-001cc4c03286.image.jpg
http://flatrock.org.nz/topics/history/assets/stalin_and_wife.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...oseph_Stalin_with_daughter_Svetlana,_1935.jpg

These are photos of the most murderous dictator in history, Joseph Stalin, and his family. Notice that he appears to be completely normal in such photos. Stalin was responsible for the deaths of 6X as many individuals as Hitler. This normal looking man was responsible for the deaths of over 20 million of HIS OWN PEOPLE.

Casey Anthony’s photos with her daughter are not evidence that she does not have ASPD/isn't a sociopath.

BTW, the correct acronym is ASPD and not APD. APD is the acronym for Auditory Processing Disorder.


signed,
Pensfan
verified psych nurse with 31 years of inpatient experience

 

[realdeal]

All evidence and testimony points to ICA having an appropriate emotional attachment to her daughter.

Strongly, strongly disagree. What emotionally attached mommy , with no job, looks for any and everyone (including an imaginanny) to care for her precious child just so she can flit about?

 

[Beatrice]

My beautiful, brilliant, bedazzling sister has the anti-social personality trait of
Sociopathic Behavior. Naturally, she cannot recogize her actions as such. She blames the WORLD for her anger, her addictions, her incarcerations.

To be around her is quite harmful physically & emotionally to me. Her lack of REMORSE & EMPATHY hurts the most.

(She started talking at about age 3 or 4.....Would this have been a clue?) TIA

 

[realdeal]

With all due respect, I don't see that. ICA looks at the camera and smiles. There is no interactin with her dd as she is very interested in smiling for the camera. It is not a real smile. It is a pose.

There were two videos put forth (that I saw). One of her wrestling w/Caylee and the other of casey holding Caylee and taunting her mother. Caylee was caught between them trying to get a lick of ice cream which she never got.

100% agree with your assessment.

 

[Beatrice]

All evidence and testimony points to ICA having an appropriate emotional attachment to her daughter.

Hmmm....
Cindy is going for counseling about "what to do with Casey's attitude"
The counselor suggests that Casey and Caylee need to bond.
George & Cindy are taking a vacation & expect things to change for the better when they get back.......
or else they will raise Caylee on their own.

 

[Beatrice]

Well, we do have an indication that Caylee was dumped at her old pet cemetery-- how many pets died, I wonder. :waitasec: I hope her neighborhood friend can tell us...

And, Kio Marie did tell us right from the beginning...Check the secret place "The Zone" for Caylee.

Even with all the water/flooding....certain psychics had very strong feelings about this place.

IJMO Where Caylee was conceived.

 

[Chiquita71]

http://www.wftv.com/video/18206395/index.html

Thank you to a fellow WS who posted this video in another thread.

This video amazes me. The intensity she shows when she speaks of how this should be "all about Caylee" but "it's not." She is speaking of a People Magazine article with Caylee on the cover...and other things she has seen that are "all about her." That intensity would almost make you believe she is upset about what she claims, or maybe she is but for different reasons? ( 15:42)

In the beginning of this video and for much of the time until you get to what I described above, George is speaking of Caylee: her third birthday party coming up, his experiences with people who help find missing children, how they played Spongebob Squarepants...

Casey really "loses" it when George tells her this about Spongebob she laugh/cries it seems, reminiscing. :sick: This crying is all "right under the eye swiping slash nose wiping" as we have seen so many other times. Wiping and wiping, wiping and wiping. I will admit she seems snotty enough, though. :yuck:

Her main focus is "I want to be home when Caylee comes home." And that she has no more information for anyone. :dunno:

I had to post this here, I am hoping to read what everyone's impressions are of this visit between George and Casey. Mostly, I am amazed at how much "emotion" (?) ICA is showing while George is speaking about Caylee.

I can see George a little more clearly now, (maybe?) as with stuff like "hey beautiful." Casey was/is a terror, a monster that must be placated to at all times by her family. It used to be George and Cindy, but I think they gave that responsibility up to Casey's defense team. I think of Casey having her fit on Saturday, seeing Cindy hug George and cry because Cindy did not look at her while she testified nor after...

of Casey complaining/crying to D. Simms who says, "you are right, I was wrong." All of that kiss butt stuff coming from George and Cindy, all of the covering up was just what some had said all along: for princess Casey.

Is there a word for this kind of enabling, co dependence? What is this behavior? Is it as many have said the only way to deal with a sociopath?

Right now into my mind comes the persons in my own family who I would describe as a person/persons who for which we all walk on egg shells.

I have to think about that deeply now and process that because I am having some kind of realization about that but I don't know exactly what that is... :waitasec: :crazy:

In my family it was my maternal grandfather that everyone did this for, performed to keep him "happy." While being aware this happened to her, my mom was big on saying we were lucky we didn't have to walk on egg shells for her-while of course we did have to with her. But then she walked on egg shells for my brother...but she manipulates him with guilt and obligation. And, the big one we all walked on egg shells for was my sister, she could get my mom to do that for her.

Lots and lots of egg shells. In my just now realization I just realized that a big part of how I live my life and why I do not have contact with the family I do not have contact with is: I refuse to walk on egg shells for anyone. Or more like I would like to learn how to not walk on egg shells for anyone but I do not feel strong enough to resist so I shall remove myself from your presence.

I could not be more interested in the idea that Casey thought Cindy was going to go along with the latest incarnation of the "truth", ICA style. I did waiver as to who came first, the chicken or the egg shells? With everything included as to all the horrible mistakes/wrong doings performed by Cindy since this began; I can find the human being in Cindy. If only because she did not kill anyone. Casey did.

I do not think Cindy's behavior has been even close to how a good person would react to a horrible situation. It is the throwing of the innocent people, people who came to help in front of the firing squad, that I have not forgotten-but unless she is so devious that she knew she could raise a daughter to be what Casey is and know what Casey was capable of and to have wanted all of this to happen: I have to say that it was Casey running this household as they all tried to live with a sociopath.

:twocents:

 

[Wholehearted]

http://www.wftv.com/video/18206395/index.html

Thank you to a fellow WS who posted this video in another thread.

This video amazes me. The intensity she shows when she speaks of how this should be "all about Caylee" but "it's not." She is speaking of a People Magazine article with Caylee on the cover...and other things she has seen that are "all about her." That intensity would almost make you believe she is upset about what she claims, or maybe she is but for different reasons? ( 15:42)

In the beginning of this video and for much of the time until you get to what I described above, George is speaking of Caylee: her third birthday party coming up, his experiences with people who help find missing children, how they played Spongebob Squarepants...

Casey really "loses" it when George tells her this about Spongebob she laugh/cries it seems, reminiscing. :sick: This crying is all "right under the eye swiping slash nose wiping" as we have seen so many other times. Wiping and wiping, wiping and wiping. I will admit she seems snotty enough, though. :yuck:

Her main focus is "I want to be home when Caylee comes home." And that she has no more information for anyone. :dunno:

I had to post this here, I am hoping to read what everyone's impressions are of this visit between George and Casey. Mostly, I am amazed at how much "emotion" (?) ICA is showing while George is speaking about Caylee.

I can see George a little more clearly now, (maybe?) as with stuff like "hey beautiful." Casey was/is a terror, a monster that must be placated to at all times by her family. It used to be George and Cindy, but I think they gave that responsibility up to Casey's defense team. I think of Casey having her fit on Saturday, seeing Cindy hug George and cry because Cindy did not look at her while she testified nor after...

of Casey complaining/crying to D. Simms who says, "you are right, I was wrong." All of that kiss butt stuff coming from George and Cindy, all of the covering up was just what some had said all along: for princess Casey.

Is there a word for this kind of enabling, co dependence? What is this behavior? Is it as many have said the only way to deal with a sociopath?

Right now into my mind comes the persons in my own family who I would describe as a person/persons who for which we all walk on egg shells.

I have to think about that deeply now and process that because I am having some kind of realization about that but I don't know exactly what that is... :waitasec: :crazy:

In my family it was my maternal grandfather that everyone did this for, performed to keep him "happy." While being aware this happened to her, my mom was big on saying we were lucky we didn't have to walk on egg shells for her-while of course we did have to with her. But then she walked on egg shells for my brother...but she manipulates him with guilt and obligation. And, the big one we all walked on egg shells for was my sister, she could get my mom to do that for her.

Lots and lots of egg shells. In my just now realization I just realized that a big part of how I live my life and why I do not have contact with the family I do not have contact with is: I refuse to walk on egg shells for anyone. Or more like I would like to learn how to not walk on egg shells for anyone but I do not feel strong enough to resist so I shall remove myself from your presence.

I could not be more interested in the idea that Casey thought Cindy was going to go along with the latest incarnation of the "truth", ICA style. I did waiver as to who came first, the chicken or the egg shells? With everything included as to all the horrible mistakes/wrong doings performed by Cindy since this began; I can find the human being in Cindy. If only because she did not kill anyone. Casey did.

I do not think Cindy's behavior has been even close to how a good person would react to a horrible situation. It is the throwing of the innocent people, people who came to help in front of the firing squad, that I have not forgotten-but unless she is so devious that she knew she could raise a daughter to be what Casey is and know what Casey was capable of and to have wanted all of this to happen: I have to say that it was Casey running this household as they all tried to live with a sociopath.

:twocents:

I agree with your assessment of this video of the jail visit. I just wanted to add, I've watched it a couple times, and I'm still just blown away every time I watch it by how Casey keeps trying to manipulate George into bailing her out. He spends the first 3 mins. or so flattering her and trying to keep her happy. In the first 7-8 mins., over and over, she tells him in different ways that if she's out of jail, there's a better chance of Caylee returning home. It finally gets to the point where he tells her straight out, Mom & I have done everything we can financially.

If the SA doesn't get to show these videos to the jurors, it will be a big loss.

 

[ZsaZsa]

All evidence and testimony points to ICA having an appropriate emotional attachment to her daughter.

That is not what her Mother said and she was living with her daily. According to ICA's own words, CA had told her she was an unfit mother, more than once.
For someone to say those words to their daughter,particularly CA who denies, overlooks and enables, the faults ICA displayed must have been tremendously neglectful.
In one of the first interviews with CA she said that at first she wasn't too concerned that ICA had gone away with Caylee, saying that she (ICA) had taken some time off to "bond with her child".
If that is not a bizarre statement then I don't know what is..... what mother of a 2 year old needs to go away to form a bond with their child? What had she been doing for the 2 years since her birth? The maternal bond all along was with CA and ICA was just another child in the house, with no responsibilities and only a Photo Opportunity superficial attachment to Caylee.

 

[ZsaZsa]

Strongly, strongly disagree. What emotionally attached mommy , with no job, looks for any and everyone (including an imaginanny) to care for her precious child just so she can flit about?

The nerve of this selfish girl is breathtaking. She fooled RG into babysitting for her while he was trying to do real work from home, so that she could go to her fictitious job.
She gets her best friend to babysit (without pay) every day so she can go to work - and then goes off to laze around all day/text/Facebook.
The devoted mother couldn't wait to get rid of the child each day, ever since she was born..

 

[coloradoteacher]

I was married to what I believe now to be a sociopath/narcissist- a great read is "The Sociopath Next Door". I HIGHLY recommend it. My ex was never violent in a law enforcement type of way but would have rages, much like we have seen from ICA. He would kick our dog (who he loved outwardly- he volunteered at the humane society!!), break chairs and threaten to go kill people when he would lose a video game- it was the game creator's fault. He would get mad at the world when he would have to wait at a red light because he "is better than everyone else". I will not be surprised one day when I get the call that he has done something seriously wrong. Our marriage luckily ended when he started to have affairs. I am the lucky one.
I think ICA shows many qualities of a sociopath- she reminds me of a more evil Scott Peterson or perhaps just a less intelligent sociopath than him.
They both had an outward sense of normalcy (as my ex did) but they just could not care less about anyone else and thought what they wanted they should get.
She is now throwing everyone under her bus to get what she wants after doing the same to her beautiful child and obviously didn't think twice about it.
I would love to see the psych eval that Lippman refers to her as very sick in. She, at the very least, has no empathy. She might not have shown violence yet because she has gotten her way. Children have that effect- it can't be all about you anymore. That could have been her snap.
She scares me very much.

 

[Pink Panther]

When sociopaths expose themselves the people around them are left in awe. They can't believe it! What? He/she did/said that? Unbelievable! That's the norm. Even when there is obvious proof that the sociopath has been lying, those around them are left scratching their head. The lie is so BIG that it's impossible to comprehend. Sociopaths have no gauge whatsoever as to how far they can go. They are great observers and if no one tips them off (because of they're outlandish behaviors and lies) they will keep going and going and going like the ENERGIZER Bunny. (Thanks WOO). No one ever tipped this woman off (challenged her). Until last week. Oh and by the way, her hissy-fit; she knew exactly what she was doing. Manipulating, as usual.

There is no end to the depths that these people will go and that is why there is always some sucker that will try to justify what they do! It's too incredulous for "normal" poeple to comprehend.

moo

BTW - I think that there is more than one sociopath in this family. Ehem. Let the games begin!

 

[Wise Old Owl]

When sociopaths expose themselves the people around them are left in awe. They can't believe it! What? He/she did/said that? Unbelievable! That's the norm. Even when there is obvious proof that the sociopath has been lying, those around them are left scratching their head. The lie is so BIG that it's impossible to comprehend. Sociopaths have no gauge whatsoever as to how far they can go. They are great observers and if no one tips them off (because of they're outlandish behaviors and lies) they will keep going and going and going like the Everyready Bunny. No one ever tipped this woman off (challenged her). Until last week. Oh and by the way, her hissy-fit; she knew exactly what she was doing. Manipulating, as usual.

There is no end to the depths that these people will go and that is why there is always some sucker that will try to justify what they do! It's too incredulous for "normal" poeple to comprehend.

moo

BTW - I think that there is more than one sociopath in this family. Ehem. Let the games begin!

ITA - but to avoid copyright problems, for the record its the ENERGIZER BUNNY! :floorlaugh:

 

[Pink Panther]

ITA - but to avoid copyright problems, for the record its the ENERGIZER BUNNY! :floorlaugh:

Corrected, as noted. HOOT HOOT!

:crazy:

 

[Oakley]

IIRC Cindy told Ryan P that Casey was a Sociopath. No one knows Casey better than Cindy, IMO.

ITA with Cindy's Dx. For what it is worth, I've studied psychology extensively for many years (I am in my 50's,) earned a BA degree with a major in psychology, and an MA in Educational Leadership (with a concentration in counseling.) Have also had first-hand experience with sociopaths.

Oh, and I've read a lot about them on Wikipedia. That right there would qualify me as an 'expert' according to Casey's DT. :crazy:

 

[countzero]

Hmmm....
Cindy is going for counseling about "what to do with Casey's attitude"
The counselor suggests that Casey and Caylee need to bond.
George & Cindy are taking a vacation & expect things to change for the better when they get back.......
or else they will raise Caylee on their own.

Where did you get this info from?

 

[LCoastMom]

All evidence and testimony points to ICA having an appropriate emotional attachment to her daughter.

I don't see it - maybe in the infant photos, after that I see ICA putting on a big, fake smile and a stressed Caylee trying her hardest to look happy with mommy.

The friends who have testified had very limited exposure to ICA with Caylee and IMO young males have a very limited experience of what "good mothering" actually is.

Notice the first young female we heard from - Kissh, wasn't at all impressed with ICA's mothering skills and she only met Caylee once!