Casey and Family Psych Profile #11

[RR0004]

Thanks button insufficient for this one, marspiter. Excellent post!

Yes indeed!

To all my fellow posters...what a great discussion!!

 

[logicalgirl]

There, you see - while I blither on and on in post after post, Marspiter swans in and succinctly posts what I have been trying multiple times to say, except clearly and concisely and with documented backup.:doh:

What took you so long Marspiter? LOL I was dying on the vine here!

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I don't think KC suffers from MPD but along the same lines as logicalgirl's post above, I think KC might live in a world of 'shoulds'. Somewhere along the line she lost herself, her own essence. She may have been shamed or scolded too many times or who knows why. But we have seen CA's expectation for perfection and have gotten glimpses of how she lives with blinders on. KC was inventing herself to live up to her mother's expectations. KC watched how GA, her father, operated and took notes.

KC got into the habit of telling people what she thought made her look like a whole functioning person, the one her mother wanted her to be. No one really questioned her and she liked the elevated status her lies gave her even though deep down she knew she was a fraud. No one apparently questioned her so as time passed her make believe world was working for her and became her reality in a way. :waitasec:

I sense GA put forth much of the same posing but to a lesser degree. People looked past his bs too except his daughter knew the truth.

 

[chefmom]

I don't think KC suffers from MPD but along the same lines as logicalgirl's post above, I think KC might live in a world of 'shoulds'. Somewhere along the line she lost herself, her own essence. She may have been shamed or scolded too many times or who knows why. But we have seen CA's expectation for perfection and have gotten glimpses of how she lives with blinders on. KC was inventing herself to live up to her mother's expectations. KC watched how GA, her father, operated and took notes.

KC got into the habit of telling people what she thought made her look like a whole functioning person, the one her mother wanted her to be. No one really questioned her and she liked the elevated status her lies gave her even though deep down she knew she was a fraud. No one apparently questioned her so as time passed her make believe world was working for her and became her reality in a way. :waitasec:

I sense GA put forth much of the same posing but to a lesser degree. People looked past his bs too except his daughter knew the truth.

BBM.

Neither do I. I am willing to acknowledge it as a possible defense tactic, but nothing more. I simply think KC is a liar and a thief. Nothing special or out of the ordinary. Just a person who has low morals and bad character. A person who cares only for herself and is only interested in others to the capacity that they serve a purpose to enhance or help her. I think KC liked having Caylee as a baby because she received a lot of attention as a young mother. Lots of ooohing and ahhhing that goes with new babies. But when the newness wore off, ICA realized she had been strapped with a lifetime committment that was going to be a lot of work and self-sacrifice, and ICA does not like to do either work or sacrifice. That's what other's do, not her. She made a decision to get rid of Caylee and she did it. Nothing special or remarkable about it. She is just another murderer. JMO

 

[Gaia713]

I've only heard her use the word ME and I, so I have a problem with the MPD defense. Even if the defense throws it on the table, if I was a juror, it wouldn't mean much. She still (allegedly) killed Caylee. Should be a historic trial full of twists and turns.

MOO

Mel

ETA: I think they're more likely to throw out the PTSD than MPD. Easier to explain if she was molested and abused as a child. We've already seen hints of that!

I can see her now. Given her history of lying about everything, the jury will want to know why they should believe her when she claims childhood molestation. Her teachers can be called to say she showed no manifestation of it. It'll be a "he said, she said" and there's plenty of evidence of how she lies. So they're gonna believe the other person before they believe a word of our her lying (or her lying) attorney's mouths.

So her lying will backfire on her doubly. No one is going to believe ANYTHING she claims based on her history.

 

[Gaia713]

ITA! As crazy as it sounds, I honestly think she thought she could just tell LE whatever she wanted to and they were going to take her word for it and go away! And, when they started to question her, she just kept lying and lying and defying them the whole way. As GA put it, she will take something as far as she can take it. I think she plans on taking this charade right up to a trial.

And through said trial too. She's so confident that she will expect a jury to believe her lies, too

 

[tlcya]

There, you see - while I blither on and on in post after post, Marspiter swans in and succinctly posts what I have been trying multiple times to say, except clearly and concisely and with documented backup.:doh:

What took you so long Marspiter? LOL I was dying on the vine here!

lmbo, don't feel bad, Marspiter gets me like that too. I spend endless posts trying to get my point across and then I return to find Marspiter has it all wrapped up with a nice little bow in one post. Thank goodness for Marspiter!

 

[Phumi]

Casey did benefit from her lies.

She told people she was an event planner and she got respect without putting forth ANY effort. It is the same thing Mark Hacking did when he pretended to be taking pre-med classes. Instead of really going to school, Mark Hacking spent his days playing video games at a convenience store. Instead of going to "work" ICA texted, instant messaged and collected icons for her social networking pages. Hacking bought books to fool his wife. ICA forged e-mails. And as a result they didn't get nagged or hassled about being lazy. Cindy babysat for Casey after working all day so that Casey could "work".

Scott Peterson didn't say he was "single" because one of his "other" personalities had "come out". He said he was single because he was afraid Amber wouldn't have anything to do with him if she knew he had a wife. Just like Cindy would not have watched Caylee for an "Anything but Clothes" party. Just it was less hassle for Casey to tell Cindy that she and Caylee were spending the night with Zanny instead of in Ricardo's bed.

I don't believe Casey thought she really had a job any more than the guy who inflates his resume really thinks he went to college. I think Casey made up co-workers and a nanny so people would believe she had a job just like somebody who fudges a college degree sometimes has to make up grade point averages. When Casey took money from her grandparents to buy Caylee's bithday cake, I don't think it was because Casey was deluded and thought she was cashing her own "work" check. I think Casey was very thoughtfully hoping that her aging grandmother (that was under immense pressure because of her sick husband) wouldn't notice.

Anyone who doubts how deliberately manipulative ICA is needs to reread ICA's jailhouse letters to her new BFF Robyn. That instant intimacy and sugary sweetness is pure con, imo.

Spot on. Thank you.

 

[Leila]

Or, NONE OF THE ABOVE! She's a sociopath, a liar, and a killer, IMO. Her parents always bought her lies rather than argue, and she thought the police would do the same. WRONG!

ITA! There's been no indication of other personalities. The only personality we've seen is a very narcissistic liar, and I have no doubt she's a sociopath. There's been no indication she has the capacity to care about anyone other than herself.

I think Casey is very adept at lying, but really isn't a good liar because her lies are easily exposed. But she's had a lifetime of her parents not confronting her lies and making her take responsibility for her actions, so she thought the lie about the nanny kidnapping Caylee would be accepted by LE, no questions asked. She was not prepared to have her lies dissected and exposed.

We've heard the audio tape of Casey being questioned by detectives at Universal. Casey didn't act dazed, confused, or disoriented, and I don't think anyone has ever suggested any sort of impairment. She acted defiant. When she walked into the courtroom before the judge in the light blue hoodie she bought with the money she stole from Amy, her chin was jutted out in defiance. I think she was angry that someone wouldn't believe her lies and had arrested her. This was probably the first time in her life that Casey didn't get away with lying.

 

[Leila]

Bingo! There we have it - ITA!

I keep wondering why posters think she "shut out" the 31 days. If she is a sociopath, as we suspect, she simply didn't care that she killed Caylee, who was no longer any use to her. The only shutting out she did was not to see her parents in person - until they "got over" Caylee being gone or ICA got out of town.

Robert Hare tells of a client of his. The client, a sociopath, was walking down the street and within ten feet from her, a child was struck and killed by a car. The child's mother was grief stricken, as were other passersby - the sociopath was focused on the blood that had gotten on her new shoes.
The dead child and the grief stricken mother had no effect on her.

During those 31 days, Casey lived as she wanted to live.........living with the boyfriend of the month and partying like there was no tomorrow. She was enjoying every minute of her new found freedom out from under her mother's thumb and not having to care for her child. Only a sociopath could kill her child and then go forward without remorse.

 

[noonie]

She knew 100% of what she was doing. She isn't kidding me or anyone else with doubts. So my answer is no , No defects for this murderer!

 

[txsvicki]

Casey is still the master at fooling people, even the public. So many blame Cindy for all of Casey's problems just like Jesse and his Dad blamed Cindy due to Casey's lies about her family. It's almost unbelieveable that one person's manipulations could reach so many people through the media. Cindy made it plain in her myspace statements that Casey had changed after having Caylee, and many friends and family also verified this. A kid in elementary, middle, and high school might lie and get away with some things but there's no way they could be on the level that Casey is now without being institutionalized by the State or juvenile division and the public would have heard many more stories about Casey. I have a feeling that Casey (due to her oddness) wasn't very popular and didn't even know that many other kids growing up to cause trouble or get into much. Cindy had finally discovered that Casey is a sociopath and was going to take steps, a big rejection and an end to some manipulations. Why is Casey given more leeway than the male psychopaths who go ape when faced with final rejection. Casey didn't hate Cindy more than anyone else. Casey wants everyone to blame her mother, and now George and Lee. She hates everyone. If this stuff with blaming Cindy goes on during the trial and jurors fall for it, Casey will never be properly punished and it won't be Cindy's fault then.

 

[noonie]

She suffers from "mistruths" and "halftruths" as described by her very own mother Cindy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is all I have to say.

 

[drip~drop]

None of these A people have fooled me one bit.
I'll say this though, they are THE MOST...ummm.. interesting and unusual people I have ever witnessed in my life. I 'm sure none of us has ever seen anything quite like this before.

They have single handedly turned the death of Caylee into a side show of oddities.

IMO JMO :cow: & all of it.

and PLEASE for THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING S T O P refering to the defense as a "dream team".
A dream team? Is this a dream to anyone? More like the nightmare team.
MOO again.

~whew....better~~

 

[OneLostGrl]

Casey is still the master at fooling people, even the public. So many blame Cindy for all of Casey's problems just like Jesse and his Dad blamed Cindy due to Casey's lies about her family. It's almost unbelieveable that one person's manipulations could reach so many people through the media. Cindy made it plain in her myspace statements that Casey had changed after having Caylee, and many friends and family also verified this. A kid in elementary, middle, and high school might lie and get away with some things but there's no way they could be on the level that Casey is now without being institutionalized by the State or juvenile division and the public would have heard many more stories about Casey. I have a feeling that Casey (due to her oddness) wasn't very popular and didn't even know that many other kids growing up to cause trouble or get into much. Cindy had finally discovered that Casey is a sociopath and was going to take steps, a big rejection and an end to some manipulations. Why is Casey given more leeway than the male psychopaths who go ape when faced with final rejection. Casey didn't hate Cindy more than anyone else. Casey wants everyone to blame her mother, and now George and Lee. She hates everyone. If this stuff with blaming Cindy goes on during the trial and jurors fall for it, Casey will never be properly punished and it won't be Cindy's fault then.

It won't? Well with Cindy lying for her and covering up for her it sure will be part her fault as it has always been her fault for lying for and covering up for her. If a person is never held accountable how are they to ever learn?! It must begin at home- period!

 

[OneLostGrl]

She suffers from "mistruths" and "halftruths" as described by her very own mother Cindy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is all I have to say.

Yeah, the same woman who says she's her "best friend". :crazy:

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

BBM.

Neither do I. I am willing to acknowledge it as a possible defense tactic, but nothing more. I simply think KC is a liar and a thief. Nothing special or out of the ordinary. Just a person who has low morals and bad character. A person who cares only for herself and is only interested in others to the capacity that they serve a purpose to enhance or help her. I think KC liked having Caylee as a baby because she received a lot of attention as a young mother. Lots of ooohing and ahhhing that goes with new babies. But when the newness wore off, ICA realized she had been strapped with a lifetime committment that was going to be a lot of work and self-sacrifice, and ICA does not like to do either work or sacrifice. That's what other's do, not her. She made a decision to get rid of Caylee and she did it. Nothing special or remarkable about it. She is just another murderer. JMO

I totally agree...there is nothing special about ICA and I'm sure once the jurors get to hear about her, they will get Caylee's justice.

Ususally, jurors like to hear from their own mouths what went down, ICA will never take the stand. I was actually surprised when on the fraud charges she changed her plea to guilty. I was sure she would take this as far as she could and not admit to any wrong doing...then to say, I wish I'd been a better friend! What? She's never been a friend to anyone since all she does is lie to them. When you lie to others, you lie to yourself...maybe this is how she's been able to get through her years, she's lied to herself so much that she's convinced herself of whatever scenario she finds herself in...just like being the accused murderess of her own child...JMHO

Justice for Caylee

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

BBM.

Neither do I. I am willing to acknowledge it as a possible defense tactic, but nothing more. I simply think KC is a liar and a thief. Nothing special or out of the ordinary. Just a person who has low morals and bad character. A person who cares only for herself and is only interested in others to the capacity that they serve a purpose to enhance or help her. I think KC liked having Caylee as a baby because she received a lot of attention as a young mother. Lots of ooohing and ahhhing that goes with new babies. But when the newness wore off, ICA realized she had been strapped with a lifetime committment that was going to be a lot of work and self-sacrifice, and ICA does not like to do either work or sacrifice. That's what other's do, not her. She made a decision to get rid of Caylee and she did it. Nothing special or remarkable about it. She is just another murderer. JMO

RBBM, chefmom, brings out a point with which I've been struggling. I've been trying to determine at what point character and psych diagnoses intersect. Are "personality disorders" only a descriptor of "character" flaws or are they a valid cause to give a person some tolerance. Do these diagnoses carry with them any form of acceptability of what, in the olden days, I used to call poor moral character?

I have a huge bag of decisions and actions that I would be happy to put away in a box with a nice neat label on it if that would dissolve (or even lessen) my responsibility in those matters I regret.

I'm not being confrontational and hope it doesn't sound that way. I am really curious about how to reconcile the opposing thoughts I keep having in my own head!

 

[Knot4u2no]

RBBM, chefmom, brings out a point with which I've been struggling. I've been trying to determine at what point character and psych diagnoses intersect. Are "personality disorders" only a descriptor of "character" flaws or are they a valid cause to give a person some tolerance. Do these diagnoses carry with them any form of acceptability of what, in the olden days, I used to call poor moral character?

I have a huge bag of decisions and actions that I would be happy to put away in a box with a nice neat label on it if that would dissolve (or even lessen) my responsibility in those matters I regret.

I'm not being confrontational and hope it doesn't sound that way. I am really curious about how to reconcile the opposing thoughts I keep having in my own head!

The BRACE Character Profile can be used to correlate basic human nature (character) with personality disorders. There are free downloads available through my website ... and a link to Casey’s online BRACE Character Profile.

Russell

 

[USARDOG]

Caylee's "phone call" to Casey: When asked by police what Caylee said in the phone call, why not say, "She was crying and saying, 'Mommy, I want to come home. Zanny has me.'" or whatever a liar would want to get across. Why not claim the people with Caylee said on the phone, "don't involve the police or we'll kill the child." Or better yet, "Mommy, a man has me, I don't know him, I want to come home" or whatever. Not describe something like a dream version of the father's day video. What's the point of that? Why mention shoes also? And she also insisted that Caylee was not worried or upset at all. That seems like a self-comforting element inserted by her mind.

A sane liar would also know the phone call obviously would not show up on the phone record, so why invent this at all? And why stay in town vegging with Tony and his friends for a month and not report anything? Just report the disappearance immediately and say a stranger took Caylee. (Casey is not stupid, apparently she was quite bright, according to friends who discussed here, and we heard also that she was in AP Physics when in highschool. So she is not a dumb person, it's not due to stupidity.)

And the questions about her workplace, why not just say, "I actually don't work, I'm in a situation where we live with my parents and I take care of Caylee during the days, I've never admitted to my parents that I didn't return to work." or whatever, instead of "I work at Universal studios, my phones are from there" + lots of details which would be proved untrue immediately. Why not invent lies that would help her if she was going to tell lies?

But multiple personality or just delusional, or traumatized or confused due to some cause that we don't know, still seem very possible to me.

Your post edited for brevity.

As to the phone call, your scenario would not have fit with the lies she had already told. Remember, she had already lied and said Zany had taken care of Caylee for years. Had a complete wardrobe for her, took her to the beach and Disney World, and were did ICA ever take her?? No, ICA made it out that Caylee loved her invisananny and was very happy with her so to Caylee, an extended stay with Zanny would just be less time she had to spend with her controlling, angry mother.

As to ICA and the phone records, remember, ICA lives in 10 min blocks, she never had to think further ahead because her parents never called her on her lies, so she is a prolific liar, but a poor liar because he never had to improve her lies to have them tolerated by her parents.

Work place... She had been lying to her parents so long about work, she sort'a believed it herself, and I don't think she ever though the police would actually check up on her lies. No one had ever done that to her before.

No, DID is just a gimmick the defense hopes to pull out when they need it, IMO. I don't for a second think ICA really has it, she's just a bad liar and someone who killed her own child, and I think in the end we will find that the "Baez smirk", was just something he doesn't know how to wipe off his face.