Casey and Family Psych Profile #11

[Gma Kat]

i am not saying casey has or had MPD. i do believe she has something inside her that could let her function as if she did not have one care in world. no panic of wheres my baby, no freakin out of omg i killed my baby as far as we have seen on early 31 days behavior. i only said i really did see actual clients who really did have MPD and it is very real and chilling. i still do not know how casey was able to live day by day those 31 days and whatever you call it its just frickin unbelievable she did not crack up. or did she ? how did she even function?

I see your point. There is obviously some sort of serious personality issue with ICA. There is no doubt about that. Regardless of what truly happened to Caylee, ICA was able to function at a high level - perhaps a higher level than before Caylee's death. It sadly appears that WITH Caylee's death, ICA came to life.

I don't know a great deal about psychiatry or psychology so I really appreciate the expertise of so many of our members who study, work, suffer from such things.

BTW: Your former job sounds so interesting.

 

[littlemisslegal]

I see your point. There is obviously some sort of serious personality issue with ICA. There is no doubt about that. Regardless of what truly happened to Caylee, ICA was able to function at a high level - perhaps a higher level than before Caylee's death. It sadly appears that WITH Caylee's death, ICA came to life.

I don't know a great deal about psychiatry or psychology so I really appreciate the expertise of so many of our members who study, work, suffer from such things.

BTW: Your former job sounds so interesting.

the hardest thing i find puzzling is she was able to just block out the 31 days and as you say a high level- of deception perhaps. seems she was never alone so i can not even begin to think in the hours of solitude she screamed, cried, collapsed or just was in grief. some one would have saw behavior of such if she was with them. even if her child was stolen by aliens i would think she would be going beserk asking where the f- is my child !!!! tell someone! then if we go with, she herself, knew how her child was missing- did she not even have a moment of omg what have i done? can anyone really block out all that unless they can turn into someone else and function as someone else? i would just want a honest chat with her and say how did you really feel before the 31 days came into light? how can you have been a mom who in pics loks like you have a perfect family? why did you not just give caylee to cindy and say - shes all yours-? do you really hate your mom more than loved your own child. if i was a juror i would sit and listen to every word and then i would try and figure out how casey functioned -is she so strong she could be able to fool everyone 31 days? AND YES, MY FORMER JOB YEARS BACK WAS INCREDIBLE, the therapist died after i moved away but i will never forget all she taught me - she was incredible lady and yes we had famous clients.

 

[Searchfortruth]

Can you imagine if they put her on the stand to go through that! Oh Lord! I don't think she will take the stand, most high profile trials come and go with out the defendant taking the stand, and I expect that to be the case here, but I can imagine just what that would look like...

I just had a vision as a result of your post. In my vision, Casey takes the stand to demonstrate her affliction with MPD. The defense atty says that he'd like to talk to Zanny, Casey says, you're in luck, Zanny is here. The atty asks her to tell the court something about herself. Casey (AKA Zanny)replies, "well, I'm a filthy rich nanny that has an affinity for stealing other people's kids, while forcefully grabbing their wrists in broad day light. My sisters name is Samantha, my mom is named Gloria and my father goes by the name of Victor. I have no known address and make phone calls from a private number which are unable to be traced. I also like to live in abandoned apartments. On a scale of 1-10, I am a "10", I have straight white teeth and a perfect figure. By the way, I am much better looking than that other Zanny that was on TV."

I think I would pay to see this.

 

[Intermezzo]

Well, she didn't block it out did she! ICA spent every opportunity she could assuring her mother - on the phone or by texting - Caylee was just fine at the beach or here, there, or wherever. ICA also made a point of avoiding her mother, father and her brother because she knew she would have to produce Caylee if she saw them in person. That isn't dissociation, that's deliberate avoidance.

BBM
ITA...For 31 days Casey deliberately avoided her family and she deliberately came up with stories/lies about Caylee's whereabouts...TL said when Casey was talking on the phone (to Cindy iirc) she would always go talk outside...

 

[logicalgirl]

BBM
ITA...For 31 days Casey deliberately avoided her family and she deliberately came up with stories/lies about Caylee's whereabouts...TL said when Casey was talking on the phone (to Cindy iirc) she would always go talk outside...

I was speaking of seeing them in person - ICA knew she was a better liar or could more easily brush off Cindy's questions over the telephone than in person. She made a conscious effort not to meet either Cindy or George when she dropped into her parents home to pick up this and that.

 

[Melanie]

I've only heard her use the word ME and I, so I have a problem with the MPD defense. Even if the defense throws it on the table, if I was a juror, it wouldn't mean much. She still (allegedly) killed Caylee. Should be a historic trial full of twists and turns.

MOO

Mel

ETA: I think they're more likely to throw out the PTSD than MPD. Easier to explain if she was molested and abused as a child. We've already seen hints of that!

 

[seagull65]

The following article is a very interesting read albeit long. I wonder if this just might be where the defense is headed with Casey...does she suffer from MPD? Could she possibly be Zanny, Juliette, Zach, etc. all rolled up into one Casey brain? Or is she possibly faking MPD?
I'm curious to hear your opinions about this and the possibility that Casey could possibly be suffering from MPD or the possibility that she and the defense are going to fake it.

Multiple Personalities: Crime and Defense
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/criminal_mind/psychology/multiples/index.html

Haven't read the article yet, thanks for posting it. I always thought this was a possibility, seemed like quite a few people did early in the case, (I can't remember if maybe there was a designated thread on it?) I remember some of us mentioning it here and there (maybe you, too ) Thanks for opening the discussion again. It would definitely seem to fit in a lot of ways. I definitely always wondered about the possiblity of a "multiple personality" type problem, or just delusional or confused thinking about some of these characters she thinks exists in her stories.
Who knows, i.e was she all the characters, did she play all the roles? Does she have a personality where various facets of her identity/personality/awareness actually shut down at various times, and she goes into an altered personality state, for whatever medical/mental reason?
Or on the other hand does she just have delusional beliefs about non-existent people. Wish we knew more about her toxicology history, brain MRI, more medical and mental health testing etc.) Is it fallout from some traumatic event that was too much to comprehend? Is she trying to make sense of confused memories?
Was she drugged or had started using some drug and that's what caused these false/confused beliefs about non-existent people and events, etc. Does she have confusion or disorientation during times when she's having the seizures, or if she's sleep deprived, etc.
Wish we had a lot more info. Or what if more of her stories is true than we know, i.e. do any of these people exist! LOL At first we did find some little shreds that made us wonder like for example about the other JH.

re: faking
Seems like a very roundabout way to fake multiple personality disorder or any mental illness, I think a faker would fake it in a much simpler way if that was the goal. And if she were going to fake something, why even fake mental illness? Why not just fake that a stranger had taken Caylee. etc. But, who knows. I don't.

 

[USARDOG]

Haven't read the article yet, thanks for posting it. I always thought this was a possibility, seemed like quite a few people did early in the case, (I can't remember if maybe there was a designated thread on it?) I remember some of us mentioning it here and there (maybe you, too ) Thanks for opening the discussion again. It would definitely seem to fit in a lot of ways. I definitely always wondered about the possiblity of a "multiple personality" type problem, or just delusional or confused thinking about some of these characters she thinks exists in her stories.
Who knows, i.e was she all the characters, did she play all the roles? Does she have a personality where various facets of her identity/personality/awareness actually shut down at various times, and she goes into an altered personality state, for whatever medical/mental reason?
Or on the other hand does she just have delusional beliefs about non-existent people. Wish we knew more about her toxicology history, brain MRI, more medical and mental health testing etc.) Is it fallout from some traumatic event that was too much to comprehend? Is she trying to make sense of confused memories?
Was she drugged or had started using some drug and that's what caused these false/confused beliefs about non-existent people and events, etc. Does she have confusion or disorientation during times when she's having the seizures, or if she's sleep deprived, etc.
Wish we had a lot more info. Or what if more of her stories is true than we know, i.e. do any of these people exist! LOL At first we did find some little shreds that made us wonder like for example about the other JH.

re: faking
Seems like a very roundabout way to fake multiple personality disorder or any mental illness, I think a faker would fake it in a much simpler way if that was the goal. And if she were going to fake something, why even fake mental illness? Why not just fake that a stranger had taken Caylee. etc. But, who knows. I don't.

Or, NONE OF THE ABOVE! She's a sociopath, a liar, and a killer, IMO. Her parents always bought her lies rather than argue, and she thought the police would do the same. WRONG!

 

[logicalgirl]

Or, NONE OF THE ABOVE! She's a sociopath, a liar, and a killer, IMO. Her parents always bought her lies rather than argue, and she thought the police would do the same. WRONG!

Bingo! There we have it - ITA!

I keep wondering why posters think she "shut out" the 31 days. If she is a sociopath, as we suspect, she simply didn't care that she killed Caylee, who was no longer any use to her. The only shutting out she did was not to see her parents in person - until they "got over" Caylee being gone or ICA got out of town.

Robert Hare tells of a client of his. The client, a sociopath, was walking down the street and within ten feet from her, a child was struck and killed by a car. The child's mother was grief stricken, as were other passersby - the sociopath was focused on the blood that had gotten on her new shoes.
The dead child and the grief stricken mother had no effect on her.

 

[chefmom]

Hmmm! MPD as KC's defense. Interesting idea. Not sure it will work unless they can provide proof of those other personalities being seen or heard by others. Now, if they could, say, produce a number of, oh, I don't know, *advertiser censored* pics of KC, and state that this wasn't her but was actually Zanny the Naughty Nanny, then, yeah, it might help. :angel: And, if they could produce someone who could state they had seen KC acting like less than the Mother of the Year, like, maybe a store clerk who could say she allowed her child to struggle with the door at Wal-Mart, that might help. :innocent: Oh! They could play that clip of JG saying that the KC he knew would never harm a hair on Caylee's head, but he didn't know the evil, dark person sitting in jail now. That would lend credence. :angel: This might be the best chance the defense has at sparing her life because, IMO, they will never prove her innocence that they have claimed. JMO.

 

[chefmom]

Haven't read the article yet, thanks for posting it. I always thought this was a possibility, seemed like quite a few people did early in the case, (I can't remember if maybe there was a designated thread on it?) I remember some of us mentioning it here and there (maybe you, too ) Thanks for opening the discussion again. It would definitely seem to fit in a lot of ways. I definitely always wondered about the possiblity of a "multiple personality" type problem, or just delusional or confused thinking about some of these characters she thinks exists in her stories.
Who knows, i.e was she all the characters, did she play all the roles? Does she have a personality where various facets of her identity/personality/awareness actually shut down at various times, and she goes into an altered personality state, for whatever medical/mental reason?
Or on the other hand does she just have delusional beliefs about non-existent people. Wish we knew more about her toxicology history, brain MRI, more medical and mental health testing etc.) Is it fallout from some traumatic event that was too much to comprehend? Is she trying to make sense of confused memories?
Was she drugged or had started using some drug and that's what caused these false/confused beliefs about non-existent people and events, etc. Does she have confusion or disorientation during times when she's having the seizures, or if she's sleep deprived, etc.
Wish we had a lot more info. Or what if more of her stories is true than we know, i.e. do any of these people exist! LOL At first we did find some little shreds that made us wonder like for example about the other JH.

re: faking
Seems like a very roundabout way to fake multiple personality disorder or any mental illness, I think a faker would fake it in a much simpler way if that was the goal. And if she were going to fake something, why even fake mental illness? Why not just fake that a stranger had taken Caylee. etc. But, who knows. I don't.

BBM

The problem I have in believing that any of the "imaginary people" exist is that this has been a highly publicized case. Surely, at the least, someone who knew of any of these people, or could vouch for their existence would have come forward by now. Yet, we have not heard of one parent coming forth to say that their child was in kindergarten with Zachery Hopkins. Not one person has come forward to say that they had a neighbor named Gloria with 2 daughters named Zenaida and Samantha. No bosses, no friends, no angry ex-boyfriends or ex-girlfriends. Nothing. This solidifies for me that they never existed except in KC's imagination. JMO.

 

[seagull65]

What always caused me to suspect Casey's stories were delusions rather than deliberate lies was that the stories she told were not designed to benefit her in any way or help to free her, they would only discredit her. They also just seem delusional/confused. There's the shifting/juxtaposing of people/places/times etc. There's the confusion between current and past events (i.e. working at Universal, going to Sawgrass like she used to a lot in the past 2006/2007 etc). There's the apparent belief in imaginary phone calls, imaginary people, etc. The quality of her stories just seems so delusional. For example:

Caylee's "phone call" to Casey: When asked by police what Caylee said in the phone call, why not say, "She was crying and saying, 'Mommy, I want to come home. Zanny has me.'" or whatever a liar would want to get across. Why not claim the people with Caylee said on the phone, "don't involve the police or we'll kill the child." Or better yet, "Mommy, a man has me, I don't know him, I want to come home" or whatever. Not describe something like a dream version of the father's day video. What's the point of that? Why mention shoes also? And she also insisted that Caylee was not worried or upset at all. That seems like a self-comforting element inserted by her mind.

A sane liar would also know the phone call obviously would not show up on the phone record, so why invent this at all? And why stay in town vegging with Tony and his friends for a month and not report anything? Just report the disappearance immediately and say a stranger took Caylee. (Casey is not stupid, apparently she was quite bright, according to friends who discussed here, and we heard also that she was in AP Physics when in highschool. So she is not a dumb person, it's not due to stupidity.)

And the questions about her workplace, why not just say, "I actually don't work, I'm in a situation where we live with my parents and I take care of Caylee during the days, I've never admitted to my parents that I didn't return to work." or whatever, instead of "I work at Universal studios, my phones are from there" + lots of details which would be proved untrue immediately. Why not invent lies that would help her if she was going to tell lies?

But multiple personality or just delusional, or traumatized or confused due to some cause that we don't know, still seem very possible to me. Separate from the question of whether she was the one who harmed Caylee or not. I.e. she could be guilty whether she remembers it or doesn't.....or on the other hand she could be delusional or even have multiple personality disorder but not be the killer. Mentally ill people do sometimes become victims of crime.

Someone could also have slipped her acid or something and she may not even know it. She sounds a bit like that. Sometimes people (even if they know they took acid) will persist in believing in the unreal thoughts they had during their trip.

 

[tsitra01]

Or, NONE OF THE ABOVE! She's a sociopath, a liar, and a killer, IMO. Her parents always bought her lies rather than argue, and she thought the police would do the same. WRONG!

ITA I can't see giving her an excuse for killing Caylee. She killed her and
lied to everyone and she will continue to hide what she has done hoping
she gets away with it. Imagine what is going on in her evil head as her
boys are preparing for her trial.
This is my opinion and I'm sticking to it. :waitasec:

 

[seagull65]

that's right Chefmom, there are only those few weird shreds here and there.
Like there is a history of a ZCG (same name as person at Sawgrass) with relatives named Victor and Gloria on whitepages.com. And a few other similarities there that I won't get into. Plus all the various other weird shreds and similarities.
But exactly right about ZachH etc. Although there is the weird father's day duct tape video with the actor by that name. etc., made in Orlando. Just weird shreds, but none of the people can be identified and found as she had explained them, so appears to only be in her imagination.

 

[chefmom]

that's right Chefmom, there are only those few weird shreds here and there.
Like there is a history of a ZCG (same name as person at Sawgrass) with relatives named Victor and Gloria on whitepages.com. And a few other similarities there that I won't get into. Plus all the various other weird shreds and similarities.
But exactly right about ZachH etc. Although there is the weird father's day duct tape video with the actor by that name. etc., made in Orlando. Just weird shreds, but none of the people can be identified and found as she had explained them, so appears to only be in her imagination.

KC lies. This cannot be denied. Everyone knew she lied and just let it go. I think this gave her a sense of invincibility. No one wanted to call her out too much and get into a confrontation, it would seem, so they just ignored her lies. People around her knew that she was a thief. She had been stealing from many people, both family and friends, and those who stayed in her life, again, seemed to just let it go. She was a bad liar and a bad thief. My niece had a child with a young man who was a bad liar and a bad thief. I stepped in to take care of their little boy because he needed someone looking out for him. This young man would steal money from my nieces purse, and when she would walk in the room and catch him, he would look her square in the eye and say he didn't do it. She would make him pull off his shoe to reveal the $100 she had just caught him stealing, and he would say it was his. He stole from his family, friends, employers, anyone who was stupid enough to leave him alone in a room. He lied everytime he opened his mouth, badly I might add, and yet his family and my niece would just tiptoe around like they were afraid of the truth. The truth was that he was a heroin and opiate addict. They knew it but didn't want everyone else to know it. He has been in and out of rehab as often as I change my sheets, but it has done him no good. He spent 2 years in prison and only stayed clean as long as the probation officer was testing him for drugs. As soon as the testing stopped, he went right back to pain pills and heroin. I know that there has been no real evidense of KC doing drugs or anything, but I firmly believe that the A's know a lot of things about KC that they aren't coming clean about, possibly to save face, and by doing this, they are potentially holding back the info that could save her life. JMO.

 

[logicalgirl]

What always caused me to suspect Casey's stories were delusions rather than deliberate lies was that the stories she told were not designed to benefit her in any way or help to free her, they would only discredit her. They also just seem delusional/confused. There's the shifting/juxtaposing of people/places/times etc. There's the confusion between current and past events (i.e. working at Universal, going to Sawgrass like she used to a lot in the past 2006/2007 etc). There's the apparent belief in imaginary phone calls, imaginary people, etc. The quality of her stories just seems so delusional. For example:

Caylee's "phone call" to Casey: When asked by police what Caylee said in the phone call, why not say, "She was crying and saying, 'Mommy, I want to come home. Zanny has me.'" or whatever a liar would want to get across. Why not claim the people with Caylee said on the phone, "don't involve the police or we'll kill the child." Or better yet, "Mommy, a man has me, I don't know him, I want to come home" or whatever. Not describe something like a dream version of the father's day video. What's the point of that? Why mention shoes also? And she also insisted that Caylee was not worried or upset at all. That seems like a self-comforting element inserted by her mind.

A sane liar would also know the phone call obviously would not show up on the phone record, so why invent this at all? And why stay in town vegging with Tony and his friends for a month and not report anything? Just report the disappearance immediately and say a stranger took Caylee. (Casey is not stupid, apparently she was quite bright, according to friends who discussed here, and we heard also that she was in AP Physics when in highschool. So she is not a dumb person, it's not due to stupidity.)

And the questions about her workplace, why not just say, "I actually don't work, I'm in a situation where we live with my parents and I take care of Caylee during the days, I've never admitted to my parents that I didn't return to work." or whatever, instead of "I work at Universal studios, my phones are from there" + lots of details which would be proved untrue immediately. Why not invent lies that would help her if she was going to tell lies?

But multiple personality or just delusional, or traumatized or confused due to some cause that we don't know, still seem very possible to me. Separate from the question of whether she was the one who harmed Caylee or not. I.e. she could be guilty whether she remembers it or doesn't.....or on the other hand she could be delusional or even have multiple personality disorder but not be the killer. Mentally ill people do sometimes become victims of crime.

Someone could also have slipped her acid or something and she may not even know it. She sounds a bit like that. Sometimes people (even if they know they took acid) will persist in believing in the unreal thoughts they had during their trip.

I see the points you have made, but really the issue for me is that whenever ICA felt like lying to get out of a tight spot, she did. But this is the first time anyone has challenged her on her stories. Usually her family or friends either believe her or ignore what she has said, and there are no repercussions. I think ICA expected everyone to just believe what she said and leave it at that. She lied about the phone call from Caylee, because she wanted everyone to believe Caylee was fine and there was nothing to make a fuss about or certainly not to begin searching for.

I think she didn't invent lies to help herself because she has bravadoed her way through life and she expected to be believed - completely.

 

[chefmom]

I see the points you have made, but really the issue for me is that whenever ICA felt like lying to get out of a tight spot, she did. But this is the first time anyone has challenged her on her stories. Usually her family or friends either believe her or ignore what she has said, and there are no repercussions. I think ICA expected everyone to just believe what she said and leave it at that. She lied about the phone call from Caylee, because she wanted everyone to believe Caylee was fine and there was nothing to make a fuss about or certainly not to begin searching for.

I think she didn't invent lies to help herself because she has bravadoed her way through life and she expected to be believed - completely.

ITA! As crazy as it sounds, I honestly think she thought she could just tell LE whatever she wanted to and they were going to take her word for it and go away! And, when they started to question her, she just kept lying and lying and defying them the whole way. As GA put it, she will take something as far as she can take it. I think she plans on taking this charade right up to a trial.

 

[Jolynna]

Casey did benefit from her lies.

She told people she was an event planner and she got respect without putting forth ANY effort. It is the same thing Mark Hacking did when he pretended to be taking pre-med classes. Instead of really going to school, Mark Hacking spent his days playing video games at a convenience store. Instead of going to "work" ICA texted, instant messaged and collected icons for her social networking pages. Hacking bought books to fool his wife. ICA forged e-mails. And as a result they didn't get nagged or hassled about being lazy. Cindy babysat for Casey after working all day so that Casey could "work".

Scott Peterson didn't say he was "single" because one of his "other" personalities had "come out". He said he was single because he was afraid Amber wouldn't have anything to do with him if she knew he had a wife. Just like Cindy would not have watched Caylee for an "Anything but Clothes" party. Just it was less hassle for Casey to tell Cindy that she and Caylee were spending the night with Zanny instead of in Ricardo's bed.

I don't believe Casey thought she really had a job any more than the guy who inflates his resume really thinks he went to college. I think Casey made up co-workers and a nanny so people would believe she had a job just like somebody who fudges a college degree sometimes has to make up grade point averages. When Casey took money from her grandparents to buy Caylee's bithday cake, I don't think it was because Casey was deluded and thought she was cashing her own "work" check. I think Casey was very thoughtfully hoping that her aging grandmother (that was under immense pressure because of her sick husband) wouldn't notice.

Anyone who doubts how deliberately manipulative ICA is needs to reread ICA's jailhouse letters to her new BFF Robyn. That instant intimacy and sugary sweetness is pure con, imo.

 

[marspiter]

I would say based on the DSM ICA is your basic run of the mill ASPD. The when you add in the Hare checklist she fits very well into the psychopathic category. The APA however does not officially recognize psychopathy in its current DSM-IV. However DSM-V is being revised and may include "psychopathic type". ICA in my humble layman's opinion does not have multiple personality disorder. I don't believe she is confused or disoriented as some have mentioned. I also don't believe something tragic happened and she disassociated from that tragedy (Caylee had an accident).

ICA isn't some big mystery of psychological disorders. She is an immature mother who got tired of her responsibilities (what little there were) and decided she would do away with the problem. I also think there were issues with her and Cindy as well that exacerbated this event. Like SP said she hated Cindy more then she loved Caylee. The wheels were in motion for this tragedy and it was her ASPD that allowed her to go through with it and then move on with her life because of her lack of empathy.

ICA is legally competent for trial. If she wasn't the defense would have already pursued that route. Yes I know the first DP lawyer on this case suggested it but that advice was summarily turned down too.

ICA has shown a precedent of lying in her past and present. Her mother has commented on her lying and the first judge in this case has commented on her lying. People lie all the time to avoid consequences. Just because the lies aren't particularly well thought out doesn't mean the person has a mental disorder or is confused. For example a man lying to his wife about an affair when he is caught red handed. It's particularly common and not all that mysterious even when the lie doesn't hold water. They're doing it because hey a 1% chance of someone buying the lie is better then a 100% chance of getting caught to some.

In my work I get people all the time that are caught red handed on drug screens. Eventually most admit to using after attempting several lies. People lie all the time despite the lie being relatively easy to disprove. It's not some big mystery or conspiracy, and doesn't require one to have an exotic mental disorder imho.

If the defense does go down that route I wish them lots of luck in finding an expert who is willing to back up that claim and undergo the scrutiny of the DA's office and it's experts. Also for ICA has to my knowledge not been previously diagnosed with a mental disorder and her lying to cover her activities kinda shoots any insanity defense out the window quick fast and in a hurry imho.

 

[ynotdivein]

I would say based on the DSM ICA is your basic run of the mill ASPD. The when you add in the Hare checklist she fits very well into the psychopathic category. The APA however does not officially recognize psychopathy in its current DSM-IV. However DSM-V is being revised and may include "psychopathic type". ICA in my humble layman's opinion does not have multiple personality disorder. I don't believe she is confused or disoriented as some have mentioned. I also don't believe something tragic happened and she disassociated from that tragedy (Caylee had an accident).

ICA isn't some big mystery of psychological disorders. She is an immature mother who got tired of her responsibilities (what little there were) and decided she would do away with the problem. I also think there were issues with her and Cindy as well that exacerbated this event. Like SP said she hated Cindy more then she loved Caylee. The wheels were in motion for this tragedy and it was her ASPD that allowed her to go through with it and then move on with her life because of her lack of empathy.

ICA is legally competent for trial. If she wasn't the defense would have already pursued that route. Yes I know the first DP lawyer on this case suggested it but that advice was summarily turned down too.

ICA has shown a precedent of lying in her past and present. Her mother has commented on her lying and the first judge in this case has commented on her lying. People lie all the time to avoid consequences. Just because the lies aren't particularly well thought out doesn't mean the person has a mental disorder or is confused. For example a man lying to his wife about an affair when he is caught red handed. It's particularly common and not all that mysterious even when the lie doesn't hold water. They're doing it because hey a 1% chance of someone buying the lie is better then a 100% chance of getting caught to some.

In my work I get people all the time that are caught red handed on drug screens. Eventually most admit to using after attempting several lies. People lie all the time despite the lie being relatively easy to disprove. It's not some big mystery or conspiracy, and doesn't require one to have an exotic mental disorder imho.

If the defense does go down that route I wish them lots of luck in finding an expert who is willing to back up that claim and undergo the scrutiny of the DA's office and it's experts. Also for ICA has to my knowledge not been previously diagnosed with a mental disorder and her lying to cover her activities kinda shoots any insanity defense out the window quick fast and in a hurry imho.

Thanks button insufficient for this one, marspiter. Excellent post!