Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #3

[silver tongue]

just thought id mention this, CG was found 2ks from casuarina prison
which is a stone throw away in the west ,was he familiar with this area as a result of time spent incarcerated or was he visiting a friend doing time , with police admitting mistakes have been made regarding dna testing he could very well of been a guest at casuarina prison [

 

[Sutton]

Regarding the Leederville attack in 1996, this is also where Mark Dixie raped the Thai student. But I have never seen Dixie pictured with long hair.

The method used by the attacker was similar to something that Dixie would have done, except I don't think Dixie was ever reported to have transported his victims to a secondary scene for the actual rape.

I just wanted to mention Dixie was in Perth from 1993-1999, and offended in Leederville in 1998.

Hope this post makes sense--it's late here.

http://m.smh.com.au/national/wa-police-defend-role-in-dixie-probe-20080224-1uda.html

http://go.galegroup.com/ps/i.do?id=...PS&sw=w&asid=404736f5c4fca76880a3760b4b9d165c

Just to be extra clear, Dixie is not the CSK.

 

[Sutton]

Here is a link to an article about the Rohypnol assaults and attempted assaults that Paper mentioned:

Http://go.galegroup.com/ps/i.do?id=...PS&sw=w&asid=86f4ea2f835a809c8d3408b1d78ba8f0

(Someone let me know if you can't read the articles linked thru Gale and I'll find another way to post them.)

 

[papertrail]

just thought id mention this, CG was found 2ks from casuarina prison
which is a stone throw away in the west ,was he familiar with this area as a result of time spent incarcerated or was he visiting a friend doing time , with police admitting mistakes have been made regarding dna testing he could very well of been a guest at casuarina prison [

Think you may have had too much Christmas cheer Silver. It was JR that was found and her disposal site was 4.25 kms as the crow flies.

 

[Sutton]

why don't you start up a discussion on this 'missing tool'

Here are my thoughts on and understanding of the 'missing tool' J35 mentioned:

A tool was missing from LW's parent's house. It matched wounds on Jane's body.

• I have hundreds of tools around my house. The only way to determine if something was missing would be 1.) if it was a very specific tool that you only had one of, or 2.) it was part of a 'set' of some kind. I wonder how police knew the tool was missing?

• If the tool is missing, how could police match it to Jane's wounds? So what if Jane had a shovel-shaped wound and LW is missing a shovel (just an example)? That isn't a match, just a similarity. You'd have to have a very rare tool or be able compare the tool marks (from the die or from another object the tool was known to have left marks on).

• Jane was exposed for almost two months. The tool would have had to have left a print on her bone to get any detail (must likely, obviously I don't know the details).

What kind of tool would be missed and would leave discernible marks after two months?

(It is the nature of the forums to discuss victims and the last moments of their lives objectively. I do remember the girls and their families each time I post (as I'm sure most other posters do)).

 

[papertrail]

Regarding the Leederville attack in 1996, this is also where Mark Dixie raped the Thai student. But I have never seen Dixie pictured with long hair.

The method used by the attacker was similar to something that Dixie would have done, except I don't think Dixie was ever reported to have transported his victims to a secondary scene for the actual rape.

I just wanted to mention Dixie was in Perth from 1993-1999, and offended in Leederville in 1998.

Hope this post makes sense--it's late here.

http://m.smh.com.au/national/wa-police-defend-role-in-dixie-probe-20080224-1uda.html

http://go.galegroup.com/ps/i.do?id=...PS&sw=w&asid=404736f5c4fca76880a3760b4b9d165c

Just to be extra clear, Dixie is not the CSK.

I suppose it begs the question: what length of hair do people in general describe as 'long'. Would a man's description differ from a woman's description. Would the length of ones' own hair alter someone's perception and description of length ? Also when does 'brown' hair change to being described as 'blonde' and vice versa. I've heard people describe dark honey coloured hair as blonde or brown. It is also astounding the number of people in the general population that have significant degrees of colour blindness; and that would also need to be kept in mind when considering witness descriptions of colour. Degrees of colour blindness can vary enormously with some people unable to differentiate between actual colour and view the world in shades of grey, others have particular 'blindness' to various colours to various degrees.

A great example of this came out a couple of years ago http://www.independent.co.uk/news/s...er-you-see-says-a-lot-about-you-10074490.html

The dress was actually blue and black.

 

[papertrail]

I was pretty astounded to read recently that it was not until after 2008 that all States of Australia started submitting DNA data (obtained through police sources) into an Australia-wide database that could be accessed for cross-checking. Unbelievable. I will try and put my hands on the article and post here.

Police were also making statements in 1996 and 1997 and thereafter that they believed it was possible there were two people involved with the Claremont abductions and murders.

It is possible they already have a DNA match to one suspect, and attempting to match another connected person. McKechnie came out when he was chief WA State prosecutor that he was very concerned about the police leak of information regarding LW and how it would affect any future prosecution of the case. This could be one (of many possible) reasons the police have changed their (current) investigation techniques.

This Rowe Park guy could well have had male company. I doubt that during the abduction of this victim he would have placed her in the front seat area; she would have been bundled into the rear of the vehicle. Therefore it is possible an accomplice was the driver and unseen by the victim; if not the driver a passenger and unseen by the victim.

There were 2 main models of panel van; one manufactured by Holden https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Holden_vehicles_by_series and the other by Ford.

The Ford XG Longreach 'was a commercial range manufactured between 1993 and 1996'. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Falcon_%28XG%29.

 

[papertrail]

Here are my thoughts on and understanding of the 'missing tool' J35 mentioned:

A tool was missing from LW's parent's house. It matched wounds on Jane's body.

• I have hundreds of tools around my house. The only way to determine if something was missing would be 1.) if it was a very specific tool that you only had one of, or 2.) it was part of a 'set' of some kind. I wonder how police knew the tool was missing?

• If the tool is missing, how could police match it to Jane's wounds? So what if Jane had a shovel-shaped wound and LW is missing a shovel (just an example)? That isn't a match, just a similarity. You'd have to have a very rare tool or be able compare the tool marks (from the die or from another object the tool was known to have left marks on).

• Jane was exposed for almost two months. The tool would have had to have left a print on her bone to get any detail (must likely, obviously I don't know the details).

What kind of tool would be missed and would leave discernible marks after two months?

(It is the nature of the forums to discuss victims and the last moments of their lives objectively. I do remember the girls and their families each time I post (as I'm sure most other posters do)).

I firstly would like to know where the information regarding the 'missing tool' was obtained. I have read nothing about this in any newspaper report or anywhere else for that matter.

The Andrew Mallard stitch up is an interesting case. The government's pathologist in that case made some assumptions that proved to be totally incorrect or even false in the first place.

A 'tool' could be anything, literally and the 'tool' may not be related to marks on a body, but on foliage at both disposal sites.

Neither JR nor CG were buried either partially or fully; they both were covered by cut foliage which possibly may have preserved evidence given that many Australian native plants shed water from their leaves. The leaves have what appears to be a wax-type coating.

Is the 'missing' tool a garden implement ? I also read recently that JR was found face down; could this tell us that the upholstery evidence found in the 55 tape strips was from her back area or possibly under her fingernails or hair.

Re the upholstery evidence being linked to a VS Commodore Series 1. Given the detail published by Bret that the particular upholstery fibres matched upholstery that was only used in the Series 1 model, could the vehicle have been an upmarket vehicle and branded as a Calais or Berlina (documents online detail both these 'brands' as being Holden Commodore VS Series 1 models). All the information out there about the VS Series 1 states this model mainly upgraded mechanical components so to me it would be highly unusual for Holden to put money into special upholstery unless it was to be used in an upmarket model of the same model and series marketed under a different brand name.

Police were also stating in 2008 that there were witness sightings of CG after the sighting of her talking to someone in the station wagon. Could the station wagon driver have offered the lift, then CG said she was ok, kept walking and another driver has stopped; and he was driving a Calais or Berlina ?

 

[papertrail]

I missed this December 12, 2015 Post article so I'll post it here in case others missed it as well.

[...]

Screen shots from article at below link.

Is this a vital piece of evidence? - By BRET CHRISTIAN - POST, December 12, 2015 – Page 5 - Continued – Page 105
Read more: http://postnewspapers.com.au/editions/20151212/pdf/paper.pdf

Given the close proximity to Graylands Psychiatric facility located on Brockway Avenue and many patients free to roam in the community on day release, it doesn't surprise me to read this information. There was a massive upheaval of psychiatric services in Western Australia in very early 1990s and the subsequent response was that many psychiatric hostels and hospitals released (permanently) patients into the community to fend for themselves. Many of these people subsequently ended up in homeless shelters, youth hostels and the like. One such facility is called Romily House located at 10 Shenton Road; which is on the northern side of the railway line in Claremont and easy access to the Claremont Railway overbridge, and almost directly opposite the Conti and a hop and skip to Rowe Park.

Very interested to read that Bret is currently communicating with Napper; he could well be the source of leaked information coming out. He has, in the past, had access to police investigation files. And he has what could only be described as an acrimonious relationship with WA police.

 

[papertrail]

Here is a link to an article about the Rohypnol assaults and attempted assaults that Paper mentioned:

Http://go.galegroup.com/ps/i.do?id=...PS&sw=w&asid=86f4ea2f835a809c8d3408b1d78ba8f0

(Someone let me know if you can't read the articles linked thru Gale and I'll find another way to post them.)

Link works perfectly, thankyou.

There is another article written on an earlier date that details occurrences in Victoria where the male responsible was offering laced chocolate drinks to women whilst he was 'driving them home'. That article mentioned the male drove 3 x different makes of vehicle and one was a white commodore. For the life of me I can't find my way back to the article !

the 'chocolate' drink mention made me think of LW as he used to purchase a chocolate drink from HJ's every night at the same time. I wonder if he had visited Victoria at any time; possibly a work related trip ?

Could the Claremont perp have offered the girls a laced drink during the evening and that would have been a way of controlling them.

Also we need to keep in mind that when entering a car into the front passenger side, you do so by twisting to face the direction you are entering from, and many people do so with their back momentarily facing the driver; this may also give the perp (as the driver) the opportunity to perform a blitz attack on an unsuspecting victim.

 

[J35]

Paper trail, do you have links regarding cut branches?

This reminds me of a CSA episode I watched 6-8 weeks ago on foxtel. A serial killer, maybe in Victoria, would cover his victims in cut branches. Similar blitz attack and opportunistic motive. I wonder if all episodes of CsA are on youtube? It had Steve liebman (I think Lisa mclune from blue heelers did the early series (or another Aussie crime show))

95% certain they caught him

Bit vague on details as it was late at night and was falling asleep, but I remember watching and thinking it was CSK like- if I had know about the cut branches at the time I would have posted about it

 

[papertrail]

Paper trail, do you have links regarding cut branches?

This reminds me of a CSA episode I watched 6-8 weeks ago on foxtel. A serial killer, maybe in Victoria, would cover his victims in cut branches. Similar blitz attack and opportunistic motive. I wonder if all episodes of CsA are on youtube? It had Steve liebman (I think Lisa mclune from blue heelers did the early series (or another Aussie crime show))

95% certain they caught him

Bit vague on details as it was late at night and was falling asleep, but I remember watching and thinking it was CSK like- if I had know about the cut branches at the time I would have posted about it

I am now searching for the articles for you; I know that articles at the time of both JR and Cg discoveries mentioned their bodies were covered in foliage, branches etc. But I am absolutely certain there is a reference that stated 'cut'. It could have been in one of the Sunday Night programme interviews with Ferguson.

 

[papertrail]

J35 were does this 'missing tool' information come from ? Do you have a link to the article if there is one ?

 

[elastic]

J35 were does this 'missing tool' information come from ? Do you have a link to the article if there is one ?

There never was or is a reference to the tool, the posters just say that you have to 'trust' them on that...

Its a bit like the reference to the cut throats, whenever anyone asks for proof the poster says he is in the know and needs to be trusted on this. With all the misinformation I wouldn't take it (the Tool reference) too seriously

 

[elastic]

Here is a link to an article about the Rohypnol assaults and attempted assaults that Paper mentioned:

Http://go.galegroup.com/ps/i.do?id=...PS&sw=w&asid=86f4ea2f835a809c8d3408b1d78ba8f0

(Someone let me know if you can't read the articles linked thru Gale and I'll find another way to post them.)

How would this link in with the Claremost Rapist? Would he use this drug at the club where the girls are having their night out, does this bring (MM) back into the equation?

Or does he use his blitz attack to get control over them (Probably from being bound and tied up from washing line or rope) and subdue them before forcing the victims to take the drug so he could carry out his attack again later on in the night?

 

[elastic]

He used the screen name Quickstraw on BigFooty.

He uses the screen name Bartholemeus on Websleuths.

This isn't odd. Many posters use different screen names on other forums.

makes perfect sense, the way it was originally suggested is that he changed pseudonyms on this forum, which again could be for any reason eg. being banned and coming back with a new alias before being discovered at a later date.

 

[elastic]

Also this doctor from Debbie Marshals book that some here talk about, when people suggest he may be on the documentary, are they refering to the sexual predator? or the Matrial Arts Expert from a wealthy English Family? It doesn't sound like either, but we have very little / vague detail on the sexual predator.

 

[Sutton]

makes perfect sense, the way it was originally suggested is that he changed pseudonyms on this forum, which again could be for any reason eg. being banned and coming back with a new alias before being discovered at a later date.

Where was it suggested that way?

I don't think Billywhizz's post was misleading. The second sentence (which is actually part of another poster's comment) of his post indicates Quickstraw posted on BF. The final sentence just says they are the same person.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12252426

 

[Sutton]

Also this doctor from Debbie Marshals book that some here talk about, when people suggest he may be on the documentary, are they refering to the sexual predator? or the Matrial Arts Expert from a wealthy English Family? It doesn't sound like either, but we have very little / vague detail on the sexual predator.

Mel1303 mentioned the doctor practiced karate. I asked how old the doctor was, wondering if he could be the "martial arts expert from a wealthy English family" that was mentioned in the docu. Mel responded that he was too old to be that person.

I've heard nothing suggesting the doctor is a known sexual predator.

 

[Sutton]

How would this link in with the Claremost Rapist? Would he use this drug at the club where the girls are having their night out, does this bring (MM) back into the equation?

Or does he use his blitz attack to get control over them (Probably from being bound and tied up from washing line or rope) and subdue them before forcing the victims to take the drug so he could carry out his attack again later on in the night?

I don't know Paper's theory. I just posted the link in case others were curious.