CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #48

[Psychic Sleuth]

If he was choked, suffocated, hit in the head (closed head injury) and many other possibilities there would be no evidence at the crime scene unfortunately.

 

[katydid23]

But even if they find Dylan in the lake, and he has some trauma to the body, MR can still say that Dylan must have gone fishing by himself and was accosted by a transient killer.

 

[KateNY]

what would be found AT the crime scene


traces of a drug..

traces of other bodily fluids (where not expected to be found)

recent dents on furniture, wall, etc

? wonder if they even cursory examined MR for any bruises, scratches -on day 1

:twocents:

 

[Seajay]

It always is, no matter how much I feel I am prepared for the reality of the worst it always hits me like a ton of bricks!

You are right, I remember when Autumn Pasquale's body was found and the circumstances surrounding her death. I cried for days. No matter how you try to distance emotionally, these cases still get to you.

I think for me, because I believe Dylan is still alive and haven't seriously enterained the idea he is not, it would be a particular shock to me.

With all this talk about the lake melting, I know they will be going back soon and I have to look at the possibility they will find something. :angish:

 

[KateNY]

If he was choked, suffocated, hit in the head (closed head injury) and many other possibilities there would be no evidence at the crime scene unfortunately.

could be trace body fluids tho

 

[mijamawi]

But even if they find Dylan in the lake, and he has some trauma to the body, MR can still say that Dylan must have gone fishing by himself and was accosted by a transient killer.

Yes, but if Dylan is found in the lake with said trauma AND MR is responsble, I would hope Dylan's body would be the final piece of the puzzle for LE.

If Dylan is found in the lake with trauma and MR is NOT responsble, I hope they have some evidence pointing to the killer.

I guess what I'm saying is I hope like H-E-double hockey sticks LE has something....

 

[Dee10]

Yes, of course, those would be signs of trauma. I'm wondering what would be found AT the crime scene if there's no blood? I'm sure there are things that would be found. Lincoln Rhyme would find them. lol What obvious signs would lead to a crime scene if there is no blood?

IF for example IMO, MR in a fit of rage strangled Dylan in the livingroom and removed him from the house fairly quickly, there wouldn't be evidence of a crime scene, even though it would be the crime scene. What could be found in that case?

 

[Bonnie Blue]

If he was choked, suffocated, hit in the head (closed head injury) and many other possibilities there would be no evidence at the crime scene unfortunately.

This is what I have been thinking about too. If Dylan is found in the lake, then what? The family can bury their son but what evidence is there besides the way MR acts? I think it will be a very long time before we have answers, if ever. JMO

 

[mijamawi]

what would be found AT the crime scene


traces of a drug..

traces of other bodily fluids (where not expected to be found)

recent dents on furniture, wall, etc

? wonder if they even cursory examined MR for any bruises, scratches -on day 1

:twocents:

But those aren't obvious. I'm honestly not trying to argue (honestly, I'm not.) but IF MR killed Dylan, let's say in the woods or around the lake somewhere before dumping him in the lake, then what kinds of evidence would say a random searcher (like a member of the public) find, if there's no blood?

I'm asking this because as the weather warms, I'm hoping there will be more searches (possibly like the public search last time) and if Dylan really was murdered, then I would hate for evidence to be tainted/contaminated by a good samaritan not realizing they're in the middle of a crime scene.

 

[katydid23]

But those aren't obvious. I'm honestly not trying to argue (honestly, I'm not.) but IF MR killed Dylan, let's say in the woods or around the lake somewhere before dumping him in the lake, then what kinds of evidence would say a random searcher (like a member of the public) find, if there's no blood?

I'm asking this because as the weather warms, I'm hoping there will be more searches (possibly like the public search last time) and if Dylan really was murdered, then I would hate for evidence to be tainted/contaminated by a good samaritan not realizing they're in the middle of a crime scene.

I don't think there will ever be a crime scene that is discovered. I don't think it was a long struggle, but was probably over very quickly. JMO

 

[KateNY]

Gotcha mijamawi, I was thinking things the fbi could get from the home

 

[mijamawi]

Gotcha mijamawi, I was thinking things the fbi could get from the home

Ooooh, ok. Sorry. IF MR did this at his home, I would hope they collected those things during their search. IF MR did it outside the home, I just picture a lot of dirt and leaves, and it would be like finding a needle in a haystack.

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

Hopefully if/when he is found an autopsy can at least determine COD. And hopefully IF MR did it they have something to link him to the crime.

 

[cluciano63]

Right now, several cases here are pending, (Jennifer, Elisa, Robin) due to not being able to determine COD, and the victims were found in far less than 4-5 months. I think it is very worrisome and quite possible that if Dylan is found, the same will hold true. Even Caylee's cause of death could not be determined, although manner was more obvious, not to mention where she was found, etc. but if Dylan is found deceased, yet fully dressed without signs of restraint, etc. it is all too likely that by now, COD will be impossible to determine.

I have not been posting, since there has not been any news in a very long time, but continuing to read all of the posts ( as well as rumors, etc. on FB) just in case. Also I have nothing optimistic to offer, as I truly feel that Dylan is not alive. Hoping, of course, to be wrong.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Yes, of course, those would be signs of trauma. I'm wondering what would be found AT the crime scene if there's no blood? I'm sure there are things that would be found. Lincoln Rhyme would find them. lol What obvious signs would lead to a crime scene if there is no blood?

I'll play. At the lake: If no one else has been there, you might see signs of a foot slipping in the mud, or shoe prints (assumes accident at the lake where Mark got angry and pushed Dylan and he fell in the water-water was so cold, Dylan could not swim to get out, Mark did not jump in to get him or assumes Mark intentionally threw Dylan in the water). You might see signs of a scuffle (broken branches, rocks moved). You might see scratch marks on rock where a fishing pole (if there was one) scraped on the way into the lake. You might find a piece of a fishing pole, line, or reel.

Anywhere: You might find a phone, something from the backpack, the backpack, a piece of fabric, a shoe or other piece of clothing. You might find a beer or soda bottle or cup with dna. (How about a McDonald's cup?) You might find something special Dylan (or whomever got him) carried, like a special trading card, necklace, token. I have so many things you might find, if you knew what you were looking for, or if you had enough people to really look at everything.

 

[Redhead72]

Awhile back I speculated that I thought MR might want to keep Dylan close to home, so to speak, where he could have him near. This would make the lake a prime target to search. Also have read that narcissists very frequently think they are the smartest people in the room. That would fit with thinking they have outsmarted law enforcement. My thoughts on the fishing pole are that he may have planted it at the lake to lead LE there to make a quick discovery of Dylan and claim it all an accident. Your thoughts are intriguing! I also think the backpack was used to weight down a body in the lake. It sells the accident theory a bit more and MR still gets to know exactly where everything is. I'm going to think about a pole and a backpack and a phone being discovered out there in the wilderness though....can't rule it out and would welcome the discovery as evidence.

I actually agree with all of your speculation above, and that is my "prime theory" so to speak. (I don't know if the backpack would be used as a weight though because anything added to it with enough weight to hold down a body would look suspicious, imo.)

I'm just branching out a bit in thinking about the miscellaneous things... MR also made mention of DR and a bridge "he was known to hang out at" - and ER was shaking her head at that comment... Perhaps he dropped items there thinking it would all wash into the reservoir? Or that if he dropped items there it would look as if DR fell into the river and it took him into the reservoir/lake?

Again, this is all speculation, and nothing more... And it's not my "prime theory" so to speak, but alternative theories I'm thinking over. I just want there to be some kind of evidence found in case the possible recovery of DR (if he is in the Reservoir/lake) turns out to be inconclusive for whatever reason...

As always, all of the above is MOO! :cow:

 

[Redhead72]

Yes, of course, those would be signs of trauma. I'm wondering what would be found AT the crime scene if there's no blood? I'm sure there are things that would be found. Lincoln Rhyme would find them. lol What obvious signs would lead to a crime scene if there is no blood?

A crime scene doesn't necessarily have to be where the primary or initial crime took place, either.

If, for instance, MR buried the backpack somewhere, it is possible that his clothing caught on some brush, or that he dropped something with or near the backpack - in which case that would become a crime scene and evidence tying MR to DR's disappearance as well.

Therefore, there wouldn't even need to be evidence that DR was at a specific location in order for it to be considered a crime scene involved with the disappearance.

 

[Redhead72]

However, if he accidentally killed Dylan in a fit of rage, then I would think there would be some trauma on his body (Dylan's) and then I would wonder why MR would try to lead LE to the lake with the fishing pole story. Also, IF he killed him before putting him in the lake, it will be determined that he did not drown, right?

Snipped only to focus...

BBM

No, actually determining if someone drowned is usually a matter of ruling out all other possible causes of death. It is actually quite difficult to definitively rule someone's death a drowning, unless all other factors have been ruled out, or someone actually witnessed the person in the water.

If there was perhaps trauma to the head discovered on DR's body (like a skull fracture) it could be suggested that he "fell and hit his head" for instance.

Dependent upon the time a body is immersed in the water, and all of the other factors discussed (temp., pressure, rate of decomp., etc...), an autopsy might actually be inconclusive. At which point circumstantial evidence would become a key factor again.

You can refer back to my previous posts where I linked up info. about forensics in regard to bodies immersed in water, and it will give more detailed info..

The only thing working in favor of evidence on the body if DR is found in the lake are the cold temperatures, and the pressure which would slow down the rate of decomp quite considerably, to the point that there could be a great deal intact which the coroner could then determine a COD from.

Note: Even if someone is already deceased before they are placed in a body of water, the lungs will fill with water.

 

[Ghostwheel]

I have always thought that IF Dylan was found in the lake, the perp expected him to be found right away. The perp may not have realized the cold would keep a body from surfacing right away. They wanted it to look like Dylan fell in and accidentally drowned. This would not really work if Dylan was already deceased, but would work if he were unconscious or thrown in and knocked unconscious or could not get back to the bank. This is a just a thought, not reality.

 

[Psychic Sleuth]

I have always thought that IF Dylan was found in the lake, the perp expected him to be found right away. The perp may not have realized the cold would keep a body from surfacing right away. They wanted it to look like Dylan fell in and accidentally drowned. This would not really work if Dylan was already deceased, but would work if he were unconscious or thrown in and knocked unconscious or could not get back to the bank. This is a just a thought, not reality.

I agree with this and a perp may not be too bright or understand forensics too well.