CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #20

[Woe.be.gone]

Thanks. You are right that I was just posting my opinion in a general way based on the perps own alleged statements (if the news people got it right).

You also have a good question in your context, and that is still a good open question. I've often wondered it myself, especially since for me, I do believe in creation, so I wonder why are things "allowed" to be as they are. You are right that some things are unanswerable, and this is probably one of them.
The best answer I got from a preacher once, is related to the "free will" theory.

My dad told me a funny thought that I will never forget. It was in relation to some people who say "if their time has come, then their time has come". Well, my dad said....what if I am on an airplane, and it is the guy's next to me time to go. LOL Thoughts like this are probably unanswerable. LOL

We go to church and seek God, to be comforted and to worship what we know is good, teaches good ideas, instills good values and encourages faith in what's good. The greatest error is believing that our lives on earth are going to be all good and that, if we are good, we won't be touched by evil or tricked by it. When evil shows itself among church leaders, it's very destructive and a total abuse of power. That's why I believe in giving less power to any leader and more power to individuals seeking/relationship with God. People are just people no matter their title. When a kid can't trust his own father, we can tell him God our Heavenly Father is there for you and loves you, so turn to Him. If a kid experiences betrayal by the church leaders and shame based on knowing his own father is a scam artist in the church nonetheless, that may be too much for a kid to sort through and to overcome. Who knows what A has witnessed or even what's been done to him (no excuses, just saying).

Even though we learn about the devil and sin, usually it's only a small portion of what we learn about in religious studies and I'm not sure we realize how real the force of evil is and that it's an active force. Also I believe evil is different than sin. We all fight sins of one kind or another. They are personal and may hurt us alone or directly hurt other people if left unchecked for too long. Sin can manifest into evil. Alone sin is just sin. (I'm making up as I go along thinking about this). We need instruction early on to help hone our radar to help discern when evil could be encroaching upon us.

Or as Maya and Oprah have said, 'When someone shows you who they are, believe them.' That's a start anyway.

 

[Confusion]

Brain injury or damage is being increasingly linked to this sort of violence.

If AS's father was a drug user then it is possible that his DNA was damaged before he was even conceived.

We may be seeing an increase in violent children because of damaged genetic material inherited from drug using parents of either sex.

AS may be another Alyssa Bustamante - just wanted to find out how it felt.

The wiring is wrong, and has been wrong since they came out of the womb...perhaps before they were even concieved. They just don't think like normal people, and perhaps it's because they physically can't.

Who is to blame if damaged DNA this is the cause of their deficiencies?

We need more research into the potential generational effects of long term drug abuse.

I think there is a possibility of some form of brain damage. It doesn't even have to be drug related. TBIs to certain parts of the brain can cause a lot of things - loss of impulse control, excessive aggression, etc. Something could have happened during birth, when he was a younger child, or even in the past few years; especially when very young, it might not even have to seem like a serious blow because of the softer skull. Chemicals or drugs the mother was exposed to while pregnant could also cause problems, and so could some kind of genetic mutation that we don't even know about yet.

I agree that more research needs to be done on these and many other things that can produce this type of behavior. I don't think it'll be as simple as, "Now we know that anyone who has this marker on that gene will become a serial killer!" It could look at what underlying issue, or combination of issues, could result in the behavior with certain triggers, and possibly determine what some common triggers are. It would also be nice to have more research on common behaviors and other indicators that point to a possible psychopath, serial killer, sadist, whatever, so it will be possible to attempt to change the path early or catch the child before reaching the point of actual murder (or even animal abuse, if possible).

MOO

 

[LotusPawprint]

Does anyone know if AS was absent from classes that Friday JR was abducted? I'm assuming he maybe was but surprised he wasn't turned in as a tip earlier as LE was asking for people who were absent from work/noticeable changes/etc. I'm curious to how he was acting after the fact and if anyone at all picked up on "any changes" in his personality or if he was just always kind of "dark" and "weird" to everyone that no one noticed? How did he clean up his clothes? Throw them away or did his poor mother wash his laundry like normal? I wonder if deep down his mother suspected him but just couldn't sort it out. So awesome that she was able to call her own son into LE - very courageous of her.

I saw a couple other responses to your question saying he was absent on Friday but I had JVM on and I was pretty sure Jon Lieberman, the investigative reporter said that AS WAS in class later on Friday. I only half-listen to JVM though, but she seemed to make a point of that, saying "well that's brand new information". I'm open to being corrected here

 

[Madeleine74]

Oh I think both should have been considered adults, no doubt about that. But I do see some irony in naming 17-year olds (or even 20+ year- olds, as some have done in the case of some of the POI's in Lauren Spierer) as children, something I see here often.

I think it does no good to infanticize victims (I don't know any kid above the age of 3 who would want to be called "a baby," and I'm sure there are plenty of 3 year olds who would let people know in no uncertain terms they aren't a "baby" either.) By the age of 13/14 most girls and boys have gone through puberty; girls as young as 11 get their periods. In school, in church, in communities they are considered "young men" and "young ladies." By age 18 they are considered adults, they can vote, go to war, etc.

If victims are going to be infanticized, then it's only fair to infanticize perps who are of similar age.

 

[writer7]

I was wondering from the beginning if LE had interviewed/searched the house of the perp and ruled him out accidentally. Wow! I'm guessing they didn't bring search dogs...?

It really would be nice if cops all had good decomp-sniffing dogs to use when they canvass neighborhoods around possible murders, even just to sniff cars.

We have marijuana-sniffing dogs that get pulled out even if the person legally refuses a car search, and I wish we'd switch out those two budgets! I don't give a flying fig about pot compared to suspicious decomp, ya know?

 

[fred&edna]

I wonder if we will ever know the details of the "confession" to his mother. I keep trying to imagine how it took place. I mean... did she suspect him early on... was her clue simply the cross... did she question him first or did he just offer the information. Maybe it's been suggested earlier, but I keep remembering the movie "The Bad Seed" (an old but a very good b/w movie).

http://youtu.be/F1kOXfKJSM8

 

[mck16]

I hope not. Again, I do animal research. I might just be kidding myself but I have done everything in my power to make what I do as humane as possible, and every time I handle a rat I say a prayer to his spirit because in a way I do wonder what makes humans soooo special that it is ok to sacrifice so many animal lives for the sake of saving or improving human lives.

...sorry, o/t.

Can u tell I've thought about it a lot?

I think it is okay, but I appreciate your feelings. I believe they were put here for that purpose, just like we eat cows, chickens, fish. My son who is a doctor said the hardest thing he had to do was the testing on live animals who ultimately did die. He said he cried. As long as it is done for a purpose and with no cruelity I believe it is okay. But, not as apparently these people are doing it and I certainly don't think it is okay on a human being. This goes beyond a civilized reason and the person doing it is not a person in his right mind. jmo

 

[Camdenres]

I read earlier that he had some kind of mohawk or fancy hairdo so I thoughty there was footage. That is why I was asking. Thanks to those who responded.

I was beating my head on the wall because of the "juvenile" status not because of your question...:blushing:

 

[QueenD]

I'm not complaining about what's been posted here, but I was hoping for some clarification. TOS says you can't sleuth minors even if they are suspects, but does this mean that it's okay once they've been arrested? I was also wondering about sleuthing the family of suspects/perps; I've seen a lot of posts about the father and several about the mother and her financial problems etc. I guess what I'm asking is, at what point is it acceptable to sleuth these people? (I just like to know for future reference so I don't cross the line accidentally.)

TIA

All I can say if the things were not in MSM, a space ship would have already flown in or this nurse lady with a really big needle. JMOO

 

[FrayedKnot]

Oh I think both should have been considered adults, no doubt about that. But I do see some irony in naming 17-year olds (or even 20+ year- olds, as some have done in the case of some of the POI's in Lauren Spierer) as children, something I see here often.

I guess, at least in my mind, childhood=innocence. Once a "child" commits an act like murder(first degree, not second nor manslaughter) and dismemberment, rape, torture, etc. (not saying that is what happened in THIS case) , that "child" has to turn in their card.

Aberration is aberration and age is inconsequential. Some things are so far broken they cannot ever be fixed.

 

[Camdenres]

These are horrifying details about Jessica Ridgeway and her uterus etc. But when I search I only find the WS post in this thread. Is there any MSM coverage about this? I've seen no references to this in court coverage today.

omg..what?????

 

[absentia]

I think there is a possibility of some form of brain damage. It doesn't even have to be drug related. TBIs to certain parts of the brain can cause a lot of things - loss of impulse control, excessive aggression, etc. Something could have happened during birth, when he was a younger child, or even in the past few years; especially when very young, it might not even have to seem like a serious blow because of the softer skull. Chemicals or drugs the mother was exposed to while pregnant could also cause problems, and so could some kind of genetic mutation that we don't even know about yet.

I agree that more research needs to be done on these and many other things that can produce this type of behavior. I don't think it'll be as simple as, "Now we know that anyone who has this marker on that gene will become a serial killer!" It could look at what underlying issue, or combination of issues, could result in the behavior with certain triggers, and possibly determine what some common triggers are. It would also be nice to have more research on common behaviors and other indicators that point to a possible psychopath, serial killer, sadist, whatever, so it will be possible to attempt to change the path early or catch the child before reaching the point of actual murder (or even animal abuse, if possible).

MOO

well yes because not all babies are DNA tested. so they can see the marker, but only if they take DNA. there are markers for a million things that don't all come to be active unless given the right circumstances & environment.

 

[absentia]

omg..what?????

RUMOR ONLY.

no indications this is the case.

 

[SmoothOperator]

..Sick-of-sickos!!
What a perfectly appropriate username you chose..

 

[matou]

I think he wanted to put her in the abandoned mine shaft to "visit her" and was unable to do this because of other people spotting them from the road. So what did he take from her? Hands, head? I wonder if he was familiar with the abandoned buildings of the area (with the graffiti) and hung out there.

 

[scadder21]

I wonder if this Austin person even realizes his actions were wrong/evil/cruel/abnormal. I suspect he was curious and seeking to conduct his own experiments (I don't think he harbored any particular anger or hatred toward JR per se). Does he realize his "hobby" is an aberration? Or is he missing that part of his brain/wiring that would allow him to sense right from wrong?

I think psychopath and sociopaths are smart enough to realize that it's wrong but not feel regret or remorse about it. They could care less what others feel.

 

[DylansMom34]

Statement of Rob Sigg, defendant's father:

http://denver.cbslocal.com/2012/10/25/murder-suspects-father-releases-statement/

 

[otto]

... we've had snow and my 17 year old son is rowing a quad in 22F at this moment ...

His computer has to be used at the dining table, and can sometimes be used in front of the TV ... no way would he be allowed to hole up with his computer for hours in his room unless he should be sleeping, and if he's not sleeping he's still getting up on time in the morning. How does a 15 year old end up with so little supervision that he's become *advertiser censored* obsessed? What the heck is that about? How many people need to hole up in their private spaces with electronics for so many hours that they can become obsessed with *advertiser censored* ... certainly not normal people. He was rather chubby in his photo at the racetrack. I wonder if he was a difficult child and if anyone in his family was afraid for themselves after realizing what he did.

There's his cross ...

 

[gitana1]

I agree Pearl. Jillycat's comment would make a very good closing statement for the prosecution, except imo, this case will never make it to trial. Imo, based on Sigg's confession, his age, and recent prosecution strategies in other high profile homicide/serial killer cases. Life without the possibility of parole; plea agreements, have been the norm.
There are many reasons for this strategy, which I will save for another day.

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/10/25/ju...ect/index.html
Those who know him say Sigg was into forensics.
He won awards in student crime scene investigation competitions.
His father, on the other hand, had a history of committing them.

'Siggs, seemed to be the classic 'cat and mouse' narcissistic malignant psychopathic predator living out his deviant fantasies in tragic reality'... Sadly he is not the first, last, or the only..

Since he's not eligible for the death penalty, why would LWOP be a plea deal for him?

All Kids should learn a little self defense.
they should be teaching Karate in schools at least let these kids have a chance to fight back.

If your kids have to walk alone ever let them carry a pencil they can stab someone with it
and maybe get away with that moments distraction. A pencil!


I used t take my kids down to the beach and let them scream LOUD!

Hold on to your bike if your on one they cant get u and the bike in the car!

go limp and lie on the ground let them drag you if they have to. and scream!

Have any of you shown your kids how to get out of a trunk of a car?
Where the release latch is!

How to knock out a tail light?

LOve this!!!! EXCELLENT ADVICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Because he can still get up in front of the court and plead not guilty.

I hate that. Imo, if you confess, that should be it. No backing out, no trial. Straight to sentencing and then to prison. The perp has more rights in this country than the victim.

Well, to play devil's advocate, there are lots of cases of false confessions.

As a 17-year-old, Sigg can be tried and, if convicted, punished as an adult in the case. But, after U.S. Supreme Court rulings in other cases, he would not be eligible for the death penalty or a mandatory life term without parole.

Read more: DA: DNA of Austin Sigg, suspect in Jessica Ridgeway murder, ties him to case - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/breakingn...geway-murder-due-court#comments#ixzz2AKfDmDIf
Read The Denver Post's Terms of Use of its content: http://www.denverpost.com/termsofuse ​

Yes, but all that means is that a law which calls for a mandatory life sentence, giving the judge no leeway with regards to sentencing, is unconstitutional. It does NOT mean that LWOP for a minor is unconstitutional.

I think that's exactly what this evil kid is going to get. The DA would never agree to less in such a horrific case. And I'm pretty sure the jerk is going to fight and claim he's ill, etc.

 

[Confusion]

All I can say if the things were not in MSM, a space ship would have already flown in or this nurse lady with a really big needle. JMOO

I guess that's where I get confused. I didn't see anything in MSM about the cost of the father's home, how many bedrooms it had, when the mother's bankruptcy was filed or discharged, and all that good stuff (I know his home and criminal record were mentioned and so was the fact that she had filed, but I've missed anything about the details). I'm just a bit paranoid at times. I'm such a stickler for following rules, that I can't even bring myself to cheat at solitaire! Thanks to all who answered.