Found Deceased CO - Joseph Keller, 18, Antonito, 23 July 2015 - #1

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
ceci said:
I am not able to link so i tell where it is posted at so people can go to the site and read for themselves. I have ask Treelights to link for me.

If its known, then why should i have to continue to say IMO, it should be obvious its my opinion. I get chastised for the Angelica Sandavol, that i had never heard of, statement.

If your not going to do your research, you should be glad someone is and posting accurate information. Otherwise, take it with a grain of salt and move on. If i had only commenyed once ,id agree but to say it in every post is repetitive.
Click to expand...

I have appreciated your comments and I think your scenario is the most plausible. I hope you continue to post the results of your research. An easy way to deal with this is to edit your settings and either change your "user title" under the "edit profile" or change your signature to reflect that your posts are IMO or something like that so readers that may have missed your earlier posts are not confused.
 
Facebook rumors are not evidence of factual information. And the names of innocent people who are leaving comments on public Facebook accounts are not ever brought over and used to support theories.

Please take the time to review Rules Etiquette & Information:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?65798-Etiquette-amp-Information

In particularly, this section:
Social Media/Social Networking Links, e.g., Facebook and Twitter

Approved Pages/Profiles

Individuals
Victim (missing or murdered person)
Suspect (as indicated by LE)

Links may be used to direct members to posts made by a victim or a suspect.
Copying and pasting, or taking screen caps, directly from these pages is not allowed.
Paraphrasing is okay.
Posts by friends and visitors are off limits.
Do not link to an individual’s (victim or suspect) social media page if you are not 100% certain it belongs to the correct individual.
If a social media page is set to private and you get in the back way, you may not post what you find. Private means private!


Public Pages
Mainstream Media (MSM)
Law Enforcement (LE)
Group support pages for victims, such as "Help Find..." and "Justice for...”
Legitimate non-profit organizations who provide assistance and support to victims and their families (e.g., Klass Kids, Texas Equusearch).

Links may be used to direct members to a post by the owner or an admin of an approved social media page/profile.
Posts by an owner or admin may be copied or quoted. This refers primarly to posts or tweets by MSM reporters, and announcements by law enforcement, the immediate family, or the admin of a group support page.
Paraphrasing is okay.
***NOTE: Comments and posts by readers/visitors of these pages are not allowed to be quoted, copied or referenced. Just don’t mention them.
Regarding group support pages, i.e., "Help Find..." and "Justice for...”: If at any time the WS staff determines a group support page to be inappropriate, a notice will be posted in the thread stating that the page is no longer approved.



Not Allowed

Social media pages that fall in the following categories are OFF LIMITS.

Family members of either a victim or a suspect
Friends of either a victim or a suspect
Most any other individual

Don't link to these pages, nor make reference to information you find on them. Any exception must first be approved by an administrator or a moderator.
Click to expand...

BBM.

Your cooperation with this is appreciated. Thanks.
 
tiredblondy said:
Oh my goodness, this makes me think of David Paulides books-Missing 411
Click to expand...

I just listened to David & his son on Mysterious Universe podcast. He mentions this case (& all the other ppl who disappeared in parks/forests).


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
blondehart said:
I just listened to David & his son on Mysterious Universe podcast. He mentions this case (& all the other ppl who disappeared in parks/forests).


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

We do have a thread to discuss his book and all those missing persons.
Missing 411/ People Vanishing in National Parks
The thread is located in the members only sections of the forum so logging in is required to view. I
 
I no longer believe that the run started and ended at the ranch, as claimed by some on the FJK page. It just wouldn't make any sense. On both FB and another forum (thus both considered rumor per TOS), Joe's half-brother describes Joe and CG's run exactly the same way: 1. About 1.5 miles into it, they split up because CG is a faster runner; 2. CG goes off the main road to look for a hiking path for later; 3. CG cannot find one; 4. CG gets back on the main road and continues to run in the same direction he and Joe had been running; 5. CG runs approximately 3 miles down the road; 6. At the 2.5 mile mark down the road, CG waves at a fisherman. So CG had to have been going in one direction, rather than to go in one direction and then turn around. All IMO, of course.
 
bakerlady said:
I think your assessment is very plausible. I do keep reminding myself that Joe was from a place that is 900ft above sea level and then siddenly he is jogging at 9000ft above sea level and it was said earlier somewhere, (i think by his mother) that he had asthma as a child. So it is quite possible that he got disoriented by the elevation. He could have collapsed, he could have become confused.
Click to expand...

And he would have been found! JMO
 
I'm confused - can we say something about a comment on the fb page, as long as we refer to it as "rumor'? Thank you.

Also - how much time do we have after posting something to edit it? TIA
 
Scout12 said:
I'm confused - can we say something about a comment on the fb page, as long as we refer to it as "rumor'? Thank you.

Also - how much time do we have after posting something to edit it? TIA
Click to expand...
No, Scout. This is how the rule reads:

***NOTE: Comments and posts by readers/visitors of these pages are not allowed to be quoted, copied or referenced. Just don’t mention them.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2279603

In response to your second question, at the moment I can't recall the precise window. It's a few hours, but I'll have to double check to get the correct number.
 
inmyhumbleopinion said:
I no longer believe that the run started and ended at the ranch, as claimed by some on the FJK page. It just wouldn't make any sense. On both FB and another forum (thus both considered rumor per TOS), Joe's half-brother describes Joe and CG's run exactly the same way: 1. About 1.5 miles into it, they split up because CG is a faster runner; 2. CG goes off the main road to look for a hiking path for later; 3. CG cannot find one; 4. CG gets back on the main road and continues to run in the same direction he and Joe had been running; 5. CG runs approximately 3 miles down the road; 6. At the 2.5 mile mark down the road, CG waves at a fisherman. So CG had to have been going in one direction, rather than to go in one direction and then turn around. All IMO, of course.
Click to expand...

I don't at all follow why everyone thinks this would mean he had to be running point to point without a turn-around? If you have a mile race time that CG has then an easy run for him would be around 7 mins per mile, and most of his easy paced runs are probably that speed. That means an hour run for him would cover around 9 miles, he'd get be able to at least 4 miles out before turning around. Even if he ran for 1/2 mile off the road looking for a trail he'd still be able to make it down the road another few miles before heading back, and that's even assuming he was planning on running *only* 60 minutes and not a second longer (which, if you are out for a run by time can sometimes mean actually running for 70-75 minutes by the time you get back to where you started if you are exploring)

Can someone explain to me what I am missing here?
 
marble said:
I don't at all follow why everyone thinks this would mean he had to be running point to point without a turn-around? If you have a mile race time that CG has then an easy run for him would be around 7 mins per mile, and most of his easy paced runs are probably that speed. That means an hour run for him would cover around 9 miles, he'd get be able to at least 4 miles out before turning around. Even if he ran for 1/2 mile off the road looking for a trail he'd still be able to make it down the road another few miles before heading back, and that's even assuming he was planning on running *only* 60 minutes and not a second longer (which, if you are out for a run by time can sometimes mean actually running for 70-75 minutes by the time you get back to where you started if you are exploring)

Can someone explain to me what I am missing here?
Click to expand...

You make a very good point! What you described is completely plausible.

I would love to have access to a map of the route CG ran (including the portion/first 1.5 miles that CG and Joe ran together). Also a complete timeline. Of course, no one is obligated to provide such information to the public, so ....
 
I agree there! A map of the route and timeline would help clear up so many things and help people brainstorm what may have happened. Not to mention, I think the most plausible explanation is he became injured/lost/ill and succumbed someplace in the woods. Looking at a verified map and timeline might help with figuring out where he could have wandered to within the given time frame if he'd become lost.

Sadly I don't think he'll be recovered for quite some time if that's so since he wasn't located during the initial search and rescue efforts.
 
I don't understand why there has been so much conflicting information.
Was the quarter mile reference an error in reporting?
Was the 1.5 miles an error?
Why is it so difficult to have a map and timeline and precise as best as it can be?
No wonder the case is baffling.
IMOO.
 
marble said:
I agree there! A map of the route and timeline would help clear up so many things and help people brainstorm what may have happened. Not to mention, I think the most plausible explanation is he became injured/lost/ill and succumbed someplace in the woods. Looking at a verified map and timeline might help with figuring out where he could have wandered to within the given time frame if he'd become lost.

Sadly I don't think he'll be recovered for quite some time if that's so since he wasn't located during the initial search and rescue efforts.
Click to expand...

For Ksenia Quiros, Colorado Springs, they found her vehicle in Stratton Open Space. She walked about 3 miles to the Point Sublime area. She was found deceased in a ravine. There were also a couple of vehicles there that most likely drove off Gold Camp Rd.

There was so much ground to cover while searching for Ksenia, because although dogs alerted to her scent, her scent was all over Stratton Open Space. And who knows how far (in the beginning when she wasn't found yet) she could have walked.

This is an excellent article about Ksenia and this is interesting to note:

"While there were no apparent missteps that can be directly linked to the failure to find Ksenia Quiros alive, a deeper look behind the scenes of the search could serve to underscore possible weaknesses in a response system that is most effective when agencies closely collaborate in saving human lives."

http://www.csindy.com/coloradosprin...allenged-springs-agencies/Content?oid=3153623

So when I read on the Conejos County Sheriff's Office Facebook, that there was going to be a SAR meeting, this article came to my mind about Ksenia.

One BIG clue for Ksenia, she was said to have been suicidal.

But yet, a Colorado Springs mom initiated the search efforts that I was on.

There were issues about the search as well:

from the link:

"a disagreement between agencies emerged over a request for federal aviation resources."

Plus, it Snowed the morning that we were searching for Ksenia.

Anyway...
getting back to Joe.

I know LE said they can't rule out foul play.

But maybe he became injured, fell, etc, and they haven't found him yet.

Just getting Ksenia out of that ravine took some time. It was not close to a hiking path.
In fact here is a map of Point Sublime:

http://mapcarta.com/23215534

Thread for Ksenia Quiros:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...enia-Quiros-44-Colorado-Springs-15-April-2015


Maybe Joe is not that far away from where he ran, and maybe he fell and is hidden somewhere where he can't be easily seen or easily reached.

IMOO.
 
inmyhumbleopinion said:
I no longer believe that the run started and ended at the ranch, as claimed by some on the FJK page. It just wouldn't make any sense. On both FB and another forum (thus both considered rumor per TOS), Joe's half-brother describes Joe and CG's run exactly the same way: 1. About 1.5 miles into it, they split up because CG is a faster runner; 2. CG goes off the main road to look for a hiking path for later; 3. CG cannot find one; 4. CG gets back on the main road and continues to run in the same direction he and Joe had been running; 5. CG runs approximately 3 miles down the road; 6. At the 2.5 mile mark down the road, CG waves at a fisherman. So CG had to have been going in one direction, rather than to go in one direction and then turn around. All IMO, of course.
Click to expand...

Sorry for posting in reply to my own post. I just wanted to say that I can no longer find the "1.5 miles" reference. Please let me know if anyone remembers.
 
Eileen730 said:
And he would have been found! JMO
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. As I stated, if he was still on the move when the search started, especially through the night, he could have traveled into areas already "cleared" by the search team. Also, cliffs, caves, ravines, etc. could provide enough cover to keep him from being seen, especially if he had sought shelter. If hypothermia kicked in and maybe even a terminal burrowing response - he could have effectively hidden himself from searchers. If we're talking about a search area of 10 square miles (6400 acres), that's a lot of ground to cover - even for 100-200 searchers. Not to mention the fact that not all of the searchers were trained in SAR. Some were volunteers and may have missed something.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is DeKalb County John Doe (2022)?

Members online

... and 82 more.
Total: 4,910 (members: 83, guests: 4,827)

Online statistics

Members online
83
Guests online
4,827
Total visitors
4,910
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
602,859
Messages
18,147,892
Members
231,556
Latest member
softhunterstech
Back
Top