CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #11

[MassGuy]

The Christmas trees are likely from Federal lands. A permit and modest payment is obtained and specific areas and types of trees are designated available for the public to cut. Some areas are specifically managed for such trees, other areas there is a goal such as thinning a plantation. The permitted Christmas trees come from designated areas where others are also cutting trees and that are loosely managed with occasional federal managers present. There are tens of thousands of acres of the federal forests (actually millions of acres) and Christmas trees cutting is permitted on relatively limited areas.

I was a forester with the US Forest Service for 16 years and currently live retired on a NF inholding. A fun item this time of year was "Christmas tree patrol". Staffing is low in Winter and it was fun to do a different job and also likely earn some OT and good cheer. I did this on two different Ranger Districts. We would go to the designated areas and park and check for Christmas tree permits (and be prepared to sell and issue permits on the spot). We had maps for the clueless and also counted vehicles going in and also coming out for public safety concerns. We would watch for commercial "Christmas tree poachers" and call LE if saw that instance rather than confront the sinners ourselves. If KB is disposed in the forests, more likely not in the Christmas tree areas.

I didn’t even know that “Christmas tree patrol” was a thing.

Clark Griswold sure got lucky!

 

[glamourkitty1922]

At this moment in time, the only sure fact we have is KB is missing. We don't know if she's living, dead, voluntarily missing, involuntarily missing. The only evidence is that her phone was in Idaho, a state where she has family. We should explore all possibilities. Having tunnel vision, especially in such a young case, is not good.

 

[nwmouse]

Agree. The resident girl crush, among others. Gay. Straight. Or Sammich.

Keen intelligence, insight and calm logic are attractive no matter to whom they belong. *usually.

Definite girl crush!
And you should listen to her input on Tricia's podcasts, (if you haven't already) gitana1's awesome.
(edited to clarify.)

 

[jillianelaine]

They might. To play devil's advocate. There have been a few cases where they send a text "I need some alone time."

But a couple of things are at play in such cases. One, they're usually found quickly and close to home. Two, there are often signs of deterioration, or mental health diagnoses. Three, there isn't zero trail and then suddenly a random trace a couple days later with nothing in between.

Usually these missing person suicides involve a sudden argument or bizarre behavior precipitating the disappearance. Like Linnea Lomax for the latter.

Some show no signs at all. Leanne Bearden comes to mind. Seemed happy. She was found a month later.

But note - LE wasn't focused on any suspect and no one close to her lawyered up and refused to talk.

Good points! I played devil advocate with myself too, realizing a depressed person might send the text prior to going one step further and deciding to take their life. Still, I don't think this applies here!

 

[MassGuy]

At this moment in time, the only sure fact we have is KB is missing. We don't know if she's living, dead, voluntarily missing, involuntarily missing. The only evidence is that her phone was in Idaho, a state where she has family. We should explore all possibilities. Having tunnel vision, especially in such a young case, is not good.

Tunnel vision is bad.

Ignoring evidence to push an unfounded theory, is worse.

 

[Hatfield]

I don't have a dog in the race either way other than the hopeful (but unlikely at this point) safe return of KB. Since my human nature is to play devil's advocate, what exactly hard proof do you have of PF being involved or committing a crime? I agree with the feeling that being a SO, he should face the most initial scrutiny until he is cleared, but his guilt is being based on a lack of a missing person's report being filed, he hired an attorney, and he hasn't taken part in press conferences or search parties (which there hasn't even been any search parties for him to partake in).

JMO
No proof of anything of course but there are certain "signs" in these kinds of cases that make a person lean a certain way.

One of those signs is watching LE actions and things they say or do not say. LE usually knows the most about a case and they keep things close to their vest but for those on the outside we can watch their actions carefully to pickup signs.

One not so small sign that stuck out to me was the gigantic hole that LE dug in his front yard the size of a bus.

 

[SandyQLS]

Press conference... “they were not living together, but they were engaged?” “Correct.”

You can believe that LE lied, perhaps. But you cannot say that they have not answered affirmatively that the two are engaged. They have.

I watched the section of the video for the 3rd time, and I would only repeat, let's agree to disagree.

 

[Wagtales10]

At this moment in time, the only sure fact we have is KB is missing. We don't know if she's living, dead, voluntarily missing, involuntarily missing. The only evidence is that her phone was in Idaho, a state where she has family. We should explore all possibilities. Having tunnel vision, especially in such a young case, is not good.

If we are making theories without requiring any kind of back up to them, then what if PF is secretly gay and had his BF murder KB? Theres nothing to back that up but if thats how some people want to come up with ideas.

See how ridiculous that is?

 

[bestill]

Old football/baseball number.... I am old and harmless..... Ain't that right MassCrushGuy ?

LOL, I think most of us are harmless!

 

[SandyQLS]

Are we allowed to post the information from Kelsey's neighbor obtained from Woodland Park Underground?

Probably not because WPU is an unapproved FB. When I read some smart idea that is not my own like in a newspaper comment section, I might post it here as a question. "What if ...?"

 

[GoJacks]

If we are making theories without requiring any kind of back up to them, then what if PF is secretly gay and had his BF murder KB? Theres nothing to back that up but if thats how some people want to come up with ideas.

See how ridiculous that is?

i think it was the livestock in the pasture with a hoof or 2

/s

 

[?mysterian?]

At this moment in time, the only sure fact we have is KB is missing. We don't know if she's living, dead, voluntarily missing, involuntarily missing. The only evidence is that her phone was in Idaho, a state where she has family. We should explore all possibilities. Having tunnel vision, especially in such a young case, is not good.

You forgot the search warrant and 2 searches at the property PF lives at, LE obtaining trash from a waste mgmt. facility that PF and 2 other people took there, and a search at KB's residence. All this was reported in MSM and is linked previously throughout the threads and in the MSM/timeline thread.

 

[gitana1]

I don't have a dog in the race either way other than the hopeful (but unlikely at this point) safe return of KB. Since my human nature is to play devil's advocate, what exactly hard proof do you have of PF being involved or committing a crime? I agree with the feeling that being a SO, he should face the most initial scrutiny until he is cleared, but his guilt is being based on a lack of a missing person's report being filed, he hired an attorney, and he hasn't taken part in press conferences or search parties (which there hasn't even been any search parties for him to partake in).

No. That's not all. His possible involvement is being supposed due to all of the following:

1. Last person known to have seen her.
2. Experience in missing women cases.
3. He hasn't searched.
4. He did not go to the presser that everyone knew about days before.
5. He has lawyered up.
6. Most importantly, he has refused to discuss with LE his whereabouts from 11-22 through when she was reported missing.
7. He has a baby with her but did not alert LE when she failed to show up or contact him for a week.
8. He has not enabled KB's mom to see her grandchild.
9. Some have described him as violent with animals.
10. LE has probable cause, as determined by a court, to extensively search his premises and vehicles.
11. There is no evidence of any mental health issues, instability, wandering, drug or alcohol dependency issues, suicidal ideation, bizarre behavior, sudden argument, etc., on the part of Kelsey.
12. Kelsey has been known to be a devoted and responsible parent yet has had no contact regarding her child since at least 11-25 but more likely, 11-22.
13. Kelsey is a professional pilot working for a reputable company and she did not call anyone at her work, request time off or go through authorized protocols to take time off. She supposedly simply sent a vague text that she was taking time off. That is out of character, apparently.
14. Despite or because of access to all electronic, internet and other evidence/data involving KB and PF, it is clear that the focus of the FBI and the CBI is in Colorado and on PF. Not on possible random abduction, some other dude did it, phantom rehab/mental institution, voluntary missing, endangered post-partum psychosis or depression missing, etc.

 

[Mountain Misst]

I do wish this case would break.....

 

[The Night Watchman]

There is "zero indication" that anyone actually knows much of anything about the people involved in this case or the way they lived their lives. I don't know if the two were engaged or even in a relationship. I don't know who actually has primary custody of the child. I don't know where the mother actually lives. The list things that I, without a doubt, are factual is really, really long. It keeps getting longer everyday that passes.

I also know nothing about KB and PF's relationship. The mother said they were engaged and has stated the relationship was good, but I don't believe that she really knew.

Having said that I don't want get to wrapped up in this relationship status that remains unknown. Their relationship could be anywhere from caustic to "good". On the caustic end is more motive, and on good side it can be more likely that a single event really pissed off someone and became a motive.

I personally can't say which of these relationship statuses is more or less likely to result in violence. So I won't dwell on it unless something becomes more clear.

 

[Plo_Koon]

JMO
No proof of anything of course but there are certain "signs" in these kinds of cases that make a person lean a certain way.

One of those signs is watching LE actions and things they say or do not say. LE usually knows the most about a case and they keep things close to their vest but for those on the outside we can watch their actions carefully to pickup signs.

One not so small sign that stuck out to me was the gigantic hole that LE dug in his front yard the size of a bus.

That is a completely understandable viewpoint, and as I said from the beginning, he should be completely eliminated. My main point was that I feel I want to know all the facts and not make an assumption either way based on innuendo and holes dug. A few posters here seem to take it really to heart if someone else doesn't immediately align themselves with their viewpoints.

 

[Lhughessk]

Folks move on from the 'mental health' and 'Autism/Asperger' discussion. There is nothing in MSM to substantiate going down these paths of discussion.

 

[Wagtales10]

No. That's not all. His possible involvement is being supposed due to all of the following:

1. Last person known to have seen her.
2. Experience in missing women cases.
3. He hasn't searched.
4. He did not go to the presser that everyone knew about days before.
5. He has lawyered up.
6. Most importantly, he has refused to discuss with LE his whereabouts from 11-22 through when she was reported missing.
7. He has a baby with her but did not alert LE when she failed to show up or contact him for a week.
8. He has not enabled KB's mom to see her grandchild.
9. Some have described him as violent with animals.
10. LE has probable cause, as determined by a court, to extensively search his premises and vehicles.
11. There is no evidence of any mental health issues, instability, wandering, drug or alcohol dependency issues, suicidal ideation, bizarre behavior, sudden argument, etc., on the part of Kelsey.
12. Kelsey has been known to be a devoted and responsible parent yet has had no contact regarding her child since at least 11-25 but more likely, 11-22.
13. Kelsey is a professional pilot working for a reputable company and she did not call anyone at her work, request time off or go through authorized protocols to take time off. She supposedly simply sent a vague text that she was taking time off. That is out of character, apparently.
14. Despite or because of access to all electronic, internet and other evidence/data involving KB and PF, it is clear that the focus of the FBI and the CBI is in Colorado and on PF. Not on possible random abduction, some other dude did it, phantom rehab/mental institution, voluntary missing, endangered post-partum psychosis or depression missing, etc.

Just reposting for truth

 

[?mysterian?]

From post 4 of this thread:

"ADMIN NOTE: Welcome to our new members.
If you haven't done so yet, please take a little time to review the Etiquette & Information forum, and the Rules Social Media - Facebook, Twitter, etc.

In the meantime, I'll give you the run down on a few important ones.

• Rumors and gossip are NOT allowed on WS. If you read it on Facebook, leave it on Facebook.
• WS holds to a "victim friendly" policy, so this applies even more strongly to family members, particularly parents and spouses, who in most cases are innocent, and suffering terribly when their loved one is missing or murdered. The last thing we want to do is add to their pain. Therefore, they always are granted the benefit of the doubt.
• Brainstorming theories is encouraged, but must be based on fact. For our purposes, "fact" refers to information published in the mainstream media (MSM) or other acceptable sources, such as academic and professional publications.
• When you state something as "fact", you must back it up with a link to an approved source.
• If you can't link it, you can't post it.
• Social media is a nightmare in terms of rumors. You can summarize information from an original post on a LE or MSM FB page. No copy and paste, no screenshots, and you must include link.
• Comments and posts by the general public are considered rumor, and therefore, off limits. Again, leave them where you find them.
• If you are stating a theory, based on your opinion, be sure to qualify it in your post (ex. IMO, hypothetically, I think)

Harmony 2, Sunday at 10:01 AMReport
#4Unlike+ QuoteReply"

 

[Wagtales10]

That is a completely understandable viewpoint, and as I said from the beginning, he should be completely eliminated. My main point was that I feel I want to know all the facts and not make an assumption either way based on innuendo and holes dug. A few posters here seem to take it really to heart if someone else doesn't immediately align themselves with their viewpoints.

Ill quote Gitana1

"No. That's not all. His possible involvement is being supposed due to all of the following:

1. Last person known to have seen her.
2. Experience in missing women cases.
3. He hasn't searched.
4. He did not go to the presser that everyone knew about days before.
5. He has lawyered up.
6. Most importantly, he has refused to discuss with LE his whereabouts from 11-22 through when she was reported missing.
7. He has a baby with her but did not alert LE when she failed to show up or contact him for a week.
8. He has not enabled KB's mom to see her grandchild.
9. Some have described him as violent with animals.
10. LE has probable cause, as determined by a court, to extensively search his premises and vehicles.
11. There is no evidence of any mental health issues, instability, wandering, drug or alcohol dependency issues, suicidal ideation, bizarre behavior, sudden argument, etc., on the part of Kelsey.
12. Kelsey has been known to be a devoted and responsible parent yet has had no contact regarding her child since at least 11-25 but more likely, 11-22.
13. Kelsey is a professional pilot working for a reputable company and she did not call anyone at her work, request time off or go through authorized protocols to take time off. She supposedly simply sent a vague text that she was taking time off. That is out of character, apparently.
14. Despite or because of access to all electronic, internet and other evidence/data involving KB and PF, it is clear that the focus of the FBI and the CBI is in Colorado and on PF. Not on possible random abduction, some other dude did it, phantom rehab/mental institution, voluntary missing, endangered post-partum psychosis or depression missing, etc."

but keep misrepresenting what we're saying if it makes you feel better