CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #19 *ARREST*

[Mercedes]

Here's an interesting article by LA Times regarding whether or
not Defense Atty's are bound by rules of truthfullness.

Defense Lawyers and Truth: Just Where Do They Meet?

Ethically, lawyers cannot perpetrate a fraud upon the court.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I think it’s merely because the info we want can’t yet be released. As I stated earlier, it might be due to verifying the solicited person/s story. A timely task, IMO.

What I don't get is, it sounds like they have placed the charges without being ready....

 

[Ccging]

There was an article I posted earlier in another thread that said there was a "possible clue in a baked good". Tooth? Fingernail? Chunk of hair pulled out? Blood?

Do we know for sure the rolls were not eaten at all? Maybe PF started eating one and put it back down in the pan and his DNA is on it?

 

[Mercedes]

So is experience, IMO.

 

[The Farm]

I think the problem might be that PF has been charged with solicitation to commit murder. If evidence relates to testimony from a witness, the prosecution has good reason to worry that PF may attempt to have that witness murdered. Ultimately, PF will have access to all the evidence, full disclosure, but at this time full disclosure may result in endangering someone.

Than I believe they should put that witness in protective custody for the short while needed.

There could be others that would want the witness for other reasons as they have known a little.
So if said witness/witnesses is out there could be issues with others. I would think prosecution would not want to lose a witness.

 

[Mercedes]

Do we know for sure the rolls were not eaten at all? Maybe PF started eating one and put it back down in the pan and his DNA is on it?

True, but he told LE that he was at her house TG day.

 

[Warwick7]

BREAKING: New details in Patrick Frazee charges released for suspected murder of Kelsey Berreth

So it wasn't just Sept 1st.or Sept 2nd...It was anywhere between 9/1/18 and 11/1/18.

 

[BingoBongo]

What I don't get is, it sounds like they have placed the charges without being ready....

I think they are "ready" as far as PF, but maybe trying to tie up lose ends with any accomplices?

 

[Warwick7]

There was an article I posted earlier in another thread that said there was a "possible clue in a baked good". Tooth? Fingernail? Chunk of hair pulled out? Blood?

Steelylady, are you serious or joking?

 

[Teche]

Kelsey Berreth’s fiancé Patrick Frazee formally charged with murder
The charges indicate that authorities believe Frazee conspired with at least one other person to kill Berreth. The multiple solicitation charges suggest he engaged someone or multiple people to kill Berreth on three occasions.

Woodland Park Police Chief Miles De Young has said investigators recovered enough evidence at Berreth’s home to convince them that is where she was killed.

Court records indicate she was killed on Thanksgiving Day, but the arrest affidavit is sealed and few details are available about the evidence pointing to murder.

Although Berreth’s cellular phone was discovered in southern Idaho, authorities have indicated someone other than her took it out of state.

The murder solicitation charge means that someone else was involved in the crime but so far Frazee has been the only one who has been charged. To be charged with solicitation, the suspect did more than just ask someone to commit a murder on their behalf, Fourth Judicial District Attorney Dan May has said.

Is the actual cell phone in the Hans of LE?

 

[LietKynes]

Omg, you honestly think Mrs. F would want K murdered?
I can’t even wrap my head around this.
I have a paralyzed friend, confined to a wheelchair or bed, she’s raising three kids. Just sayin’.
MOO
Break time

SABBM

Re. the bolded section : ^^^ No, I never said that.

We don't know that at all , but it's a possibility; as the charges read 'solicitation' --which means PF asked or revealed his murderous plans to someone.

We know that SF and PF were leaving the property in two vehicles the day he was arrested , and neither of them would divulge where they were going and why they were fleeing.
We know that SF walked with difficulty, whether from rage about her son being arrested or actual frailty -- that is not known.
There are no wheelchair ramps going from the house.

Of the most interest is the solicitation charge at this time.
My first guess would be an employee at PF's ranch , or one of his besties.
Someone who is afraid to talk as they could be the next 'disappearance'.
I doubt it'd be mommy dearest as she seems like more of a string puller.

 

[Trudie]

Would Kelsey’s parents have a better chance at permanent custody since they’re married unlike Patrick’s single mom?

The court can’t discrimate based on marital status, disability, etc.
Mrs. F, IMO will be awarded visitation.
But, in the Crystal Rogers case, a higher court over ruled the grandmothers visitation, claiming she has no right. Her daughter went missing and the child is living with his dad, the number one suspect. Three year old case. No body, presumed dead.

 

[PommyMommy]

Sorry, a little behind now, but this is making it sound like this "attempted robbery" thing is just a theory or example that some reporter came up with, not necessarily the State saying this is what they think happened. I know that we have very limited court documents available, as does the defense, so I'm just trying not to focus on this without some sort of verification.

Yes, we really need the probable cause affidavit to piece it all together.
MOO

 

[mustloveco]

It also sounds as if there was more than just Patrick in the house when she arrived home from Safeway. And that the planning of this started back in September is just so sad.

Maybe he asked her to make the rolls so he knew she'd be gone

 

[Deleted member 102539]

He's right up there with Dellen Millard in my books.

What, if KB had evidence of a severe crime done by PF, because of that wanted separation and wanted also little K taken away from him? Maybe PF tried to rob her of the evidence (in which form ever it existed) with the help of someone other? - My thoughts only.
Would make sense as investigations are underway (maybe re the first crime), not completed and even so important, that the prosecutor wants the affidavit sealed for at least 10 days.

 

[Mercedes]

Several of you have commented upon the DA’s use of the word theory vs. legal theory, so I have tried to shed some light on the difference. Hope this helps.


Legal Theory Law and Legal Definition | USLegal, Inc.

Legal theory is a principle that a litigant (or DA in this case) bases its claims in a case. It can also be the law under which the DA proceeds.

That is different than a plain old theory that is used to justify a condition or event. Such as a scientific theory.

 

[Ultra Violet]

DA Dan May answers a question about the timeframe mentioned on the charges. It is just a broad date range selected to cover their bases. The solicitation could have happened at any time during that range.

He explains it much better than I can here at 12:08 in this video posted by KOAA 5:

 

[PommyMommy]

Is the actual cell phone in the Hans of LE?

Could be, but we don't know.
MOO

 

[tmar]

Hearing today's announcement, this Creep, for months had a plan.
Kelsey was unaware of his evil mind, and was living her life, sharing her daughter with PF.
Her poor family.
Hope justice comes swiftly with everything exposed.
We are finding, these evil minds live amongst unsuspecting families.
Hope PF's life is torn apart, thread by thread.
MOO.

 

[gliving]

Yes, we really need the probable cause affidavit to piece it all together.
MOO

So would PF's attorney. lol