CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #26 *ARREST*

[PommyMommy]

I don't think they were oblivious to the fact that PF was closely being watched at that point. I get doing a simple favor for a friend, but it seemed they were willing to help him hide possible evidence IMO. Did anyone confirm whose white truck PF was hiding in while they disposed of his "trash?" I know he owns a red truck, but uncertain if he was borrowing someone else's vehicle - especially if it was supposed to be a simple trip to the dump.

I have a question about the dump too. Do we know it was PF's trash that was being dumped? Apologies if my memory has failed me here, but couldn't he have just been along for the ride with two guys dumping their trash? Or maybe they all combined a trailer load of trash? How do we know whose trash it was?
MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Question:

Does PF have living quarters in his barn at the “ranchette”?
Where I live, most barns do have very nice apartments. It’s common for farm hands to live on site.

We haven’t heard anything to that effect.

He clearly wasn’t running a large scale operation, and there’s no indication that anyone other than PF and his mommy, lived on the same property.

 

[girlhasnoname]

That would not change the fact that she believed that she was engaged. She may have suspected that he was too close to another woman, but that doesn't mean that she was aware of the fact that he intended to murder rather than marry her. Isn't the wife/girlfriend the last to know when the husband/boyfriend strays?

@otto Absolutely, especially when she's holding down a full time job with a long commute and caring for an infant daughter as well.

 

[Jethro4WS]

There would be no reason for Kelsey’s body to have traveled in a completely opposite direction, all that matters is that she can’t be found.

What difference does it make where her body is?

In PF’s mind, no body, no murder charges.

I think it’s probable that he killed Kelsey himself, because no one was willing to do it for him.

If no one is willing to kill for you, then it’s likely that no one is willing to dump a body for you.

People are talking here, and I can’t imagine that if someone else knew where her body is, she wouldn’t have been found by now.

PF is probably the only one that knows, and as long as her body remains undiscovered, he can still claim ignorance.

It won’t work though.

Where her body is may affect jurisdiction. Unless the prosecution can absolutely prove Kelsey was killed in her home - not something circumstantial to let a jury weigh - it opens the door that Kelsey was killed elsewhere and if she is found outside of Colorado that would cause Colorado to have to drop the murder charges. If, for example, her body is found in Idaho, and a medical examiner can't conclude she was killed in Idaho then what state has jurisdiction - Wyoming, Utah, Idaho, or Colorado - since she could have been killed (or finally died) in any of those. One thing for certain is that double jeopardy attaches once a jury is impaneled so things can get complicated if the evidence of Kelsey being killed in her home is not solid and she turns up in another state.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

It may have been a coincidence.

Someone could have started talking, especially as they saw the pressure ramping up on PF.

Clearly, law enforcement was closing in.

It’s also possible that they received some lab results back at that point.

I think there is more yet to be revealed. I don't think it's a coincedence, just like I didn't believe the 'false ping' was a coincedence.
I think it's also why they didn't find anything on Mother's property.
It was hidden elsewhere.
MOO.

 

[girlhasnoname]

No, PF will have to hire a private attorney for the civil case.
MOO

Well that makes me happy, one less set of attorney's fees for the taxpayers to burden. I'm sure Momma F can kick in for baby boy.

 

[MassGuy]

Where her body is may affect jurisdiction. Unless the prosecution can absolutely prove Kelsey was killed in her home - not something circumstantial to let a jury weigh - it opens the door that Kelsey was killed elsewhere and if she is found outside of Colorado that would cause Colorado to have to drop the murder charges. If, for example, her body is found in Idaho, and a medical examiner can't conclude she was killed in Idaho then what state has jurisdiction - Wyoming, Utah, Idaho, or Colorado - since she could have been killed (or finally died) in any of those. One thing for certain is that double jeopardy attaches once a jury is impaneled so things can get complicated if the evidence of Kelsey being killed in her home is not solid and she turns up in another state.

I believe that they can prove that she was killed, and killed in her home.

Charging someone with murder is a big deal.

Charging someone with murder without a body, is a huge deal.

They would absolutely require compelling evidence to this effect, and the speed in which they charged PF in this, means that they almost certainly do.

 

[Trudie]

We haven’t heard anything to that effect.

He clearly wasn’t running a large scale operation, and there’s no indication that anyone other than PF and his mommy, lived on the same property.

Tysm. One barn pic looks like a Morton building. They are very pricey & a lot (not always) of times are designed with one or more apartments. Jmo

 

[KSinMT]

I agree that isn't the case in this situation about an amber alert my response was in regards to the poster who thought the 'robbery' might be of the baby.

I'm not familiar with custody issues, but does anyone know if an unmarried couple has a dispute as to whether the child will go with them who has the final say if there isn't some type of custody agreement?

I know in my state, it is whoever has physical possession of the child at the time, as long as both parents are listed on the birth certificate.

 

[cody22]

I believe that they can prove that she was killed, and killed in her home.

Charging someone with murder is a big deal.

Charging someone with murder without a body, is a huge deal.

They would absolutely require compelling evidence to this effect, and the speed in which they charged PF in this, means that they almost certainly do.

Yep...... I think they have a lot of small evidence and at least one big old snitch broke this case open....MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

I really hope MSM doesn’t report stories misrepresenting another person/pictures of homes, etc of someone with the same name. Those facts should be checked and doubled checked way before reporting! Birthdates being the first thing to check....I had a very common first/middle/maiden name..... when I married, my last name became very unique..... crazy as it is, my husbands brother had married a girl with the same name as me..... so there were 2 of us with the same name, prior and after marriage (bizarre as it sounds).... we all went to the same Dr’s, etc...it got so confusing we had to change and go to separate Drs, dentists, etc. MSM really needs to double cross check!

I agree, especially in a criminal situation. It's highly irresponsible, unprofessional as heck and could even be dangerous IMO

 

[K9Enzo]

IMO, PF had many good qualities or women would not have found him attractive, he would have few friends, etc.
I think if he were an ugly, hideous ****, KB would not have been remotely interested in him. Nor would a rodeo queen. Jmo

Good point.

KB strikes me as a very intelligent, independent, career focused woman. If he displayed traits that she found undesirable, they would have probably fizzled out after a few dates, phone conversations, whatever. She would have moved on. People do this all the time in the dating world. But that didn't happen. If they did in fact break up (who knows), she certainly trusted him enough to care for, alone, their very small child. I believe he spent a significant amount of time with the child. Then there's the possibility she was totally still in love with him. We just don't know.

Threads ago, members were even speculating, because he was so hideous (in their opinion), she must have only been intimate with him one time, resulting in the child, but never again. Yeah, that made me shake my head. I give her more credit than that.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I think that is the furthest thing from the their minds. They have so much to deal with right now. They just need justice, and answers. Their hand I'd being forced at every turn.
MOO

THIS

 

[MsBetsy]

This is not true. An attorney can weigh in here for CO but if he is not declared on the birth certificate and if their is not a formal custody agreement she is informally being a nice mother. She has all the legal rights. He has rights but has to go to court for them. Right, now I am seeing the child is a "B".

Yes, that's true. But I believe his name is on the birth certificate. That's the point I made before. If it had not been, I don't see how he could legally prevent the maternal grandparent from seeing the child. There had to have been some kind of formal document. What I meant was that if there was no formal custody agreement there is usually equal access to the child. One parent can't deny the other visitation. It may not be that way in Colorado, but if not I don't see why LE could not have stepped in and allowed visitation with the grand parents. Imo

 

[girlhasnoname]

I know in my state, it is whoever has physical possession of the child at the time, as long as both parents are listed on the birth certificate.

Thank you for answering I truly have no idea how it operates

 

[KSinMT]

I agree, especially in a criminal situation. It's highly irresponsible, unprofessional as heck and could even be dangerous IMO

Absolutely! In this case I strongly believe KRDO reported the wrong info on the wrong person with the same first and last name but they have yet to correct it

 

[mrstfs]

Good point.

KB strikes me as a very intelligent, independent, career focused woman. If he displayed traits that she found undesirable, they would have probably fizzled out after a few dates, phone conversations, whatever. She would have moved on. People do this all the time in the dating world. But that didn't happen. If they did in fact break up (who knows), she certainly trusted him enough to care for, alone, their very small child. I believe he spent a significant amount of time with the child. Then there's the possibility she was totally still in love with him. We just don't know.

Threads ago, members were even speculating, because he was so hideous (in their opinion), she must have only been intimate with him one time, resulting in the child, but never again. Yeah, that made me shake my head. I give her more credit than that.

I think a lot of put together, smart, career focused women get involved with people who have undesirable traits. (I’ve done this in my younger years.) the Julia Jacobson case is an example of this. JMO

 

[riolove77]

The amount of time that has elapsed at this point really leads me to believe only PF is involved in the day-of actions of the crime. There is just no way another principle to the murder has yet to be arrested.

We have solicitees talking and we have KK, who, if reports are accurate, can expect an accessory charge.

PF knows where she is. If any one of these people did, her location would’ve been revealed by now. Perhaps they’re narrowing down through the witnesses and their conversations with PF.

 

[Seattle1]

IMO, PF had many good qualities or women would not have found him attractive, he would have few friends, etc.
I think if he were an ugly, hideous ****, KB would not have been remotely interested in him. Nor would a rodeo queen. Jmo

Please beware of the packaging and flying monkeys!
Ted Bundy also had many friends, handsome, and charming. Narcs/sociopaths count on others being naive and unaware to begin grooming their targets. Most recently, everybody thought CW a great guy and model employee.

 

[The Saint]

Here is a set of farrier tools.

If KB was murdered by PF or another farrier, wouldn't it be likely they would use a farrier hammer to bludgeon her to death? Or would they be too afraid of the blood splatter and having a medical examiner determine that a farrier tool was used, thus pointing to the killer being a farrier?

Farrier Tools,Hammers ,Nippers,Pullers,Knife ,Rasps - SHANDONG TONGLI S&T DEV. CO.,LTD

If KB were incapacitated or killed by a horse drug, wouldn't it take time
for the drug to take effect? Or does it work immediately?