CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #34 *ARREST*

[InvSmith]

I know...I think Brad Cooper is due to get out in 2021? Ugh.

Question for veteran WSers: do you see this happen very much? (major (digital) evidence used to convict someone ultimately being called into question to the point of appeal for a second trial (w/change of plea) being granted?) Just knowing about this particular case, has me on edge for Kelsey's case, knowing how important digital evidence will be in PF's trial. I'm hoping what happened in the Brad Cooper case is more isolated, and that with Kelsey's case, LE is following protocol to a T, in terms of processing digital evidence. The murder of Nancy Cooper was my first WS case, and was local to me. I actually know someone tied to the case, but didn't realize it until certain news articles came out during the trial.

"Gessner, who also presided over the trial in 2011, allowed prosecutors to introduce evidence of a Google Maps search of the site where Nancy Cooper’s body had been found. Prosecutors argued that the map search and time stamps associated with it showed that Brad Cooper had searched for a site to dump his wife’s body.

The defense team at trial, however, raised questions about the validity of the time stamps on the laptop files.

Gessner ruled against the defense’s attempt to classify two witnesses as forensics experts to raise questions about the computer evidence.

The appeals court judges noted that the “sole physical evidence linking” Brad Cooper to the homicide was the Google Maps search. “Absent this evidence, the evidence connecting Defendant to this crime was primarily potential motive, opportunity, and testimony of suspicious behavior,” the ruling stated.

Further, the appeals court panel added that “whether the error was constitutional or not,” failure to let Brad Cooper use his experts was a key error that warranted a new trial."

Brad Cooper pleads guilty to second-degree murder; gets at least 12 years in prison

I know that this might seem OT, but I'm just referencing this case because of the fact that it also relied on digital (computer) evidence. I hope KB's, PF's and KK's phone providers were able to provide chalk full of data!!

The PF case, I see a little differently as most data will be cellular based. There may be some maps used such as Google but, IMO, most mapping and communications will be cellular and highly traceable. Also, everywhere you go, there is a camera. Traveling around Colorado to do whatever they did then KL driving to Idaho takes a lot of stops. It also sounds like KL shared her love life and the murder plot with co-workers and the mailman.

 

[GordianKnot]

JMO
That is my understanding too which seems unusual to me. Its almost like LE is hiding something from the public because if she really did carry KB's phone to Idaho then she would be directly involved in this case one way or another.

My guess only is some sort of formal deal has been made and she is staying somewhere where LE has agreed to until the trial. That is the only thing that makes any sense to me. The main reason I think this is that when LE was honing in on PF and did the secondary searches at KB's home and formal charges on PF came down so quickly, it appeared they had gotten some detailed information and my guess is someone gave LE that information.

RSABBMFF:

Hatfield, I agree this is a scenario that makes sense, and I wish to high heaven it didn't, because I really am disgusted at the prospect of KK skating.

The one glimmer of hope I have that KK is NOT the one cooperating with LE is the fact that she disclosed PF's solicitation to her BFF, so it's possible that the BFF is actually the one who contacted LE to give them the info and that BFF is the one in protective custody.

We may learn who provided LE with damning info re: PF murdering KB on the 19th at at the probable cause hearing.

If it's KK's BFF and not KK, I will be dancing a jig, because KK needs to held accountable for her actions r/t the cover-up and any other involvement she may have had in KB's murder.

All JMO.

 

[tmar]

.

Agree she's staying out of sight with a relative.

Perhaps KK is staying out of sight, as OK with LE.
Reading here and laughing at us because we have little idea, what is going on.
Guess she is reading many 'crime books' in the meantime.
MOO.

 

[Trudie]

as to looking for KK: if she is in a rural area, no reason she cannot be on a ranch and just not "go into town," and no one will see her. the press is probably looking, but in a rural area, if there is no one to question and no errands being run by her, she will just not be visible. her kids do have to go to school, but maybe their dad and relatives are taking care of that. her attorney may have agreed that she would not speak publicly before trial and maybe she is happy to not be torn apart by inquisitive reporters, IMO.

I think if you read a few threads back, you’ll find more info.
We can’t discuss her kids......ya know?
Yes she could be on a ranch, maybe willing to stay inside forv3-4 years. Yes, reporters are watching. I’ve emailed two. They’re very kind about responding. However, they both ask the same question, “do you know where she is.”

 

[InvSmith]

Trudie, I don't know, but if true, it's a really good thought! Thank you for offering the possibility that KK may be locked up even as we speak.

IMO, KK is due for a wardrobe update. I hear green striped patterns and orange jumpsuits in breathable fabrics are going to be de rigeur this spring.

PF being the fashion forward dude that he is already got in ahead of the upcoming season's styling trends.

I would "assume" when the local police and FBI were ask to become involved that was an immediate request to place her under arrest or be brought in for questioning and search her home, car, work space, and property for evidence was undertaken. This was probably an attempt to secure evidence. She could have allowed this voluntarily except the work space if they took it that far and I would have. If she admitted to destroying the phone or having the phone (and I think she would of had an attorney) she could have been arrested and released on bond. Depending on her level of involvement, she may be a witness. If the prosecutor is going for burglary, then she may be a part of that charge unless something else has been stolen. Either way, she traveled with a deceased woman's phone for 700 miles (est.). This tells you all you need to know.

 

[Trudie]

Thanks, InvSmith!

Understood that the warrant would come out of CO and that KK would be charged back in CO, if she's arrested.

I think I worded my question poorly...what I'm really wanting to know is whether the arresting agency would be Twin Falls and whether KK would be arrested and booked into the local ID jail until CO came to extradite her back to CO, or whether CO would come out and execute the arrest warrant themselves.

Here, in KY, it’s like this: KY wants Jane Doe, she lives in Ohio. When KY is ready to pick Jane up, they will have LE in Jane’s jurisdiction accompany them. This of course is after the warrant is signed.
Now, if Jane’s warrant was in the data base & OH stopped her for a traffic violation, they would arrest & detain her, notifying KY, then there’d be extradition hearings, etc. The warrant is a court order, it doesn’t matter where it’s from, imo.

 

[GordianKnot]

I would "assume" when the local police and FBI were ask to become involved that was an immediate request to place her under arrest or be brought in for questioning and search her home, car, work space, and property for evidence was undertaken. This was probably an attempt to secure evidence. She could have allowed this voluntarily except the work space if they took it that far and I would have. If she admitted to destroying the phone or having the phone (and I think she would of had an attorney) she could have been arrested and released on bond. Depending on her level of involvement, she may be a witness. If the prosecutor is going for burglary, then she may be a part of that charge unless something else has been stolen. Either way, she traveled with a deceased woman's phone for 700 miles (est.). This tells you all you need to know.

Thanks so much for your reply! So, if I'm interpreting correctly, you think it's possible she's already been placed under arrest and bonded out...which is good news, as it means she's facing charges.

ITA that her transporting the phone and sending the texts tells me all I need to know about the<modsnipped> . I could tell you with great specificity what my exact opinion of KK is but then I would get banned forever, so there's that.

 

[Trudie]

Thanks so much for your reply! So, if I'm interpreting correctly, you think it's possible she's already been placed under arrest and bonded out...which is good news, as it means she's facing charges.

ITA that her transporting the phone and sending the texts tells me all I need to know about the Stampede Queen. I could tell you with great specificity what my exact opinion of KK is but then I would get banned forever, so there's that.

No, no I don’t. I was just pondering some recent posts, yesterday. Iirc, I was thinking about CO concealing arrests, trying to find the post explaining it. I certainly don’t think she needs “protection”, I think she’s capable of handling herself.
Maybe she got some type of deferred judgement, we would need to ask Rio or Mercedes.
Maybe she’s not guilty, maybe it’s all a big mix up. Idk.
Maybe her friend lied to the R’s.

 

[GordianKnot]

The PF case, I see a little differently as most data will be cellular based. There may be some maps used such as Google but, IMO, most mapping and communications will be cellular and highly traceable. Also, everywhere you go, there is a camera. Traveling around Colorado to do whatever they did then KL driving to Idaho takes a lot of stops. It also sounds like KL shared her love life and the murder plot with co-workers and the mailman.

BBM: Pretty sure that KK/KL spends much of her time glued to the Lifetime Channel and/or with her head buried in a Silhouette Romance novel. Daytime soap operas would also be her speed, IMO...she seems to like the idea of being cast in a starring role within the incredibly asinine plot conceived by her "Woody-from-Toy-Story-meets-Herman-Munster" cowboy.

Look how much her man loves her! Why, he would kill to be with her!!
Stupid, stupid, stupid woman. PF couldn't care less about KK.

Hey, maybe her mailman is the one who turned her and PF in to LE!

JMO, of course.

 

[Trudie]

I don't think KK was involved in any way in the actual murder of KB, other than being solicitated, if she was involved she would be in jail and facing charges, she isn't, so common sense says she had nothing to do with the murder. PF could have tossed the phone in her car and when she got him he could have called her and told it was KB's phone and now she was involved and an accomplice. Maybe she turned it on to see whose phone it was. She may have panicked and tossed it in the trash in Hansen, since that is where the FBI was looking all over town, according to one eyewitness. The mama's boy did this with a Colorado accomplice, who I am sure will be arrested too. Speaking of mama, SF, I passed her on the way to WP this morning, I am 99% it was her, funny thing is she was driving with her fog lights and her parking lights on, so four lights, very strange! All IMO only.

We all have our thought on her involvement.

 

[susiQ]

I think if you read a few threads back, you’ll find more info.
We can’t discuss her kids......ya know?
Yes she could be on a ranch, maybe willing to stay inside forv3-4 years. Yes, reporters are watching. I’ve emailed two. They’re very kind about responding. However, they both ask the same question, “do you know where she is.”

Bravo Trudie! Their response is a bit humorous

 

[Dave F.]

The exact words of the December 21, 2018 prosecution motion to rescind Unsealing of the arrest affidavit were:
"The People object to unsealing of the arrest warrant prior to filing of charges
in this case. There is a serious risk that disclosure of this information may jeopardize substantial, ongoing investigative efforts in this case.
Further, the People believe that disclosure of this information at this juncture may seriously jeopardize the physical safety of potential witnesses in this investigation."
There are very limited reasons that can be given for sealing under Colorado law, and this cites two of them exactly as they are published. It was written an filed the afternoon of PF's arrest, 4 days after the FBI talked to KK.
My thought is..........it doesn't pay to second guess why they chose those two reasons from a very short list, and until the next hearing actually happens, it's still in the investigative phase. IMO
Colorado Judicial Branch - Teller - Cases of Interest - The People of the State of Colorado v. Patrick Frazee

 

[InvSmith]

OT, but how is this constitutional? We don't have secret courts in this country!

We even have secret Grand Juries.

 

[skycountry]

More locals will be arrested in this case, is why LE is sitting on the info they have. I am thinking more will be charged, and maybe more implicated. How he thought he would not be connected to KB murder boggles the mind. PF was not smart enough to carry this out on his own, is why he asked a mother of two to murder his baby momma. I hope he loses all contact with baby K, he doesn't deserve to be in her life after killing her mother. JMO

 

[Concernedmamaof3]

More locals will be arrested in this case, is why LE is sitting on the info they have. I am thinking more will be charged, and maybe more implicated. How he thought he would not be connected to KB murder boggles the mind. PF was not smart enough to carry this out on his own, is why he asked a mother of two to murder his baby momma. I hope he loses all contact with baby K, he doesn't deserve to be in her life after killing her mother. JMO

I hope you are right and all involved are prosecuted, but with each day that passes I do worry about the likelihood. It just seems to me they either have the evidence or not. I have a hard time believing more tips will be coming in as there is less and less press on this case. MOO

 

[GordianKnot]

More locals will be arrested in this case, is why LE is sitting on the info they have. I am thinking more will be charged, and maybe more implicated. How he thought he would not be connected to KB murder boggles the mind. PF was not smart enough to carry this out on his own, is why he asked a mother of two to murder his baby momma. I hope he loses all contact with baby K, he doesn't deserve to be in her life after killing her mother. JMO

BBM:

Boggles, and How!

If it weren't for Kelsey's death being so heartbreakingly tragic, it would be howlingly funny how totally imbecilic PF manages to be at every. single. juncture.
And just think: we haven't even heard any of the real evidence against him yet. What we hear at the probable cause hearing is going to be mind-blowing, IMO.

My current fantasy: PF insisting on taking the stand in his own defense.
IMO, he would prove himself to be an absolute master at lassoing the noose around his own neck....please, oh, please, let him take the stand, Mr. Public Defender.

C'mon, PF. Do it! Raise your right hand and do solemnly swear.....

 

[Steelhead]

You are right, I was too focused on thinking of a reason why you'd haul a load to the dump and not help unload or at least get out of the truck. He was baiting LE.

Maybe he was helping his friends (providing truck and trailer) so they could dispose of their stuff?

 

[MassGuy]

Maybe he was helping his friends (providing truck and trailer) so they could dispose of their stuff?

It’s certainly possible, but in light of who this guy is, and what this guy has done, I think most of us are treating every action with suspicion.

It very well may be unrelated to this crime, but who knows.

 

[susiQ]

Just trying to understand what will take place on Feb 19th provided there is no postponement. Article link below and excerpt:

"Preliminary hearings" in Colorado felony cases

"3. What Happens During a Preliminary Hearing?

A preliminary hearing is held before a judge of the Colorado County Court where the felony complaint has been filed. During the preliminary hearing, the prosecutor has to show probable cause to continue with the legal proceedings against the defendant.

The rules of evidence may be more relaxed at a preliminary hearing. During the preliminary hearing, the prosecutor may present evidence, including hearsay evidence, which may not be admissible later on at trial. The prosecutor may also present evidence such as witness or victim testimony. Evidence is viewed in a light favorable to the prosecution.

The defendant and his criminal defense attorney are present at the preliminary hearing. However, the Colorado DA cannot call the defendant to testify. The defendant may have access to limited discovery evidence before the preliminary hearing, to prepare their case. The defendant also has the right to cross-examine the witnesses called, and introduce evidence on behalf of the defense."

BBM

 

[GordianKnot]

It’s certainly possible, but in light of who this guy is, and what this guy has done, I think most of us are treating every action with suspicion.

It very well may be unrelated to this crime, but who knows.

He's baaaaack.....hey, Massy!

And thank you. I agree with this.