CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #53 *ARREST*

[PommyMommy]

Thanks Pommy Mommy. So it sounds like there will be a trial and/or

1). Plea of not guilty,

2). Plea of not guilty and request for bond and release while trial is pending since no body was found,

3). Defense and DA have come to some sort of plea agreement and sentencing date will be set.

Either way, it’s sad that cameras are not allowed in courtroom but I suppose that is the Judge’s discretion.

Hope we can get tweets, if the reporters can even hear in that courtroom.

Guessing #1. No bond request, no plea agreement. MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Guessing #1. No bond request, no plea agreement. MOO

I hope they do ask for bond. I could use a good laugh.

 

[ilovechili]

yah it should be interesting, shes already said she would plead the fifth at the preliminary(Through her lawyers). It will be an interesting conundrum for her at trial, plead the fifth as to not incriminate herself or go to bat for PF. I'm not sure she can have it both ways.

It should be dramatic

I don't disagree with that either, I think it will be a hot seat if she has to testify. I even want to hear what she has to say about KK and KB, etc. I have my preconceived notions of how she felt about each but her testimony should tell us.

Her testimony could damage or help either side depending on how well she does and whether she is believable and the big one, just what she knows and or admits to knowing. However, clearly she would feel partial to PF but want to save her own arse as well by not perjuring herself... One would hope...

All jmo.

 

[ab01]

I don't disagree with that either, I think it will be a hot seat if she has to testify. I even want to hear what she has to say about KK and KB, etc. I have my preconceived notions of how she felt about each but her testimony should tell us.

Her testimony could damage or help either side depending on how well she does and whether she is believable and the big one, just what she knows and or admits to knowing. However, clearly she would feel partial to PF but want to save her own arse as well by not perjuring herself... One would hope...

All jmo.

I think a lot may be telling about how she answers questions the defense asks vs the ones the prosecution asks, sometimes more damage can be done by what a witness doesn't say vs what they do say and vise versa.......

ETA: And the same goes for KK as well or anybody really, But I think KK answers will be much more straight forward unless the defense can find some bombshell revelation that the prosecution has overlooked.....

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

I think a lot may be telling about how she answers questions the defense asks vs the ones the prosecution asks, sometimes more damage can be done by what a witness doesn't say vs what they do say and vise versa.......

JMO

I think she can only hurt him, the only question is how bad.

That fire thing alone, is pretty damning, and if she says she didn’t see it, then no one is going to buy that.

Burned plastic, scorched earth, and the presence of an accelerant already lend a hell of a lot of credibility to KK’s story.

I think we’re likely to hear a lot of “I don’t recall.”

 

[ilovechili]

I think a lot may be telling about how she answers questions the defense asks vs the ones the prosecution asks, sometimes more damage can be done by what a witness doesn't say vs what they do say and vise versa.......

JMO

I agree. How she reacts to each, how defensive, how she comes across, what she doesn't say or tries to resist answering even as you said. Her tone and more... I do not know if it will be asked because it may not be germane to the case entirely but even why they would not let the Berreths see the baby, etc...

It will be a long time until trial but hers is testimony I really want to hear and watch if possible...

 

[ab01]

I think she can only hurt him, the only question is how bad.

That fire thing alone, is pretty damning, and if she says she didn’t see it, then no one is going to buy that.

Burned plastic, scorched earth, and the presence of an accelerant already lend a hell of a lot of credibility to KK’s story.

I think we’re likely to hear a lot of “I don’t recall.”

Yah I think thats pretty spot on based on other similar cases I have followed, I wasn't aware of that or I can't recall the exact date etc.

And of course the prosecution will counter with you can't recall? This was thanksgiving weekend a rather significant holiday, you can't remember the things that happened around that time. Thinking back till the last time you saw your granddaughters mother etc. You have no recollection of those events?

pretty powerful stuff

 

[ilovechili]

It brings up another thought. Often the pros or defense prep a witness for testimony... We can probably assume KK will be prepped by the pros. Ma, not so sure.

I wonder if she will be become a "hostile witness..." Jk. Sort of... Ma I mean.

Edited to clarify who I meant.

 

[Hatfield]

yah it should be interesting, shes already said she would plead the fifth at the preliminary(Through her lawyers). It will be an interesting conundrum for her at trial, plead the fifth as to not incriminate herself or go to bat for PF. I'm not sure she can have it both ways.

It should be dramatic

JMO
I agree it should be dramatic one way or another.

I was disappointed in the initial judge's ruling where the judge did not let the DA get her on the stand.

I had never heard before where someone declares they will just be pleading the 5th to everything so there is no sense in getting on the stand, and somehow the judge agreed she was not needed.

During PF's trial I hope the judge allows her to be called as a witness because she has a lot of important information that only she would know.

Like who showed up to Thanksgiving dinner?, What were they wearing?
Any stains on anyone's clothing?
What time did they get there?
What time did they leave?
And other important questions about other things like
Where were you going the day LE arrived to arrest PF?
Do you know anything about a steel rod?
Do you know anything about leaving things down at the gate for KK?, etc.

She has a perogative to choose to plead the 5th on some questions but she needs to answer each and every question IMO because not all questions that answer would apply to.
Normally an attorney will ask the witness clarifying questions like their full name?, Where they lived at the time of the incident?, etc. for background information for the jury.

So is she going to plead the 5th if the attorney asks her name?

She needs to answer each and every question posed to her and if she pleads the 5th on 90% of them then that will be evidence in and of itself and that will still help the jury get a pretty good picture of what was going down around the time of KB's disappearance.

 

[ajaylee]

IIRC, there was something about PF and visitation/communication with Baby K. Because he's in jail, I don't know if that would be up to the trial judge or if it's a family court issue.

JMHO, but I think if it were me, personally, I would rather have a trial than a guilty plea - unless that guilty plea included a full and detailed confession. I think I'd find more closure with a trial than a guilty plea, even knowing that I might not learn much more at trial than the public already knows.

 

[ab01]

JMO
I agree it should be dramatic one way or another.

I was disappointed in the initial judge's ruling where the judge did not let the DA get her on the stand.

I had never heard before where someone declares they will just be pleading the 5th to everything so there is no sense in getting on the stand, and somehow the judge agreed she was not needed.

During PF's trial I hope the judge allows her to be called as a witness because she has a lot of important information that only she would know.

Like who showed up to Thanksgiving dinner?, What were they wearing?
Any stains on anyone's clothing?
What time did they get there?
What time did they leave?
And other important questions about other things like
Where were you going the day LE arrived to arrest PF?
Do you know anything about a steel rod?
Do you know anything about leaving things down at the gate for KK?, etc.

She has a perogative to choose to plead the 5th on some questions but she needs to answer each and every question IMO because not all questions that answer would apply to.
Normally an attorney will ask the witness clarifying questions like their full name?, Where they lived at the time of the incident?, etc. for background information for the jury.

So is she going to plead the 5th if the attorney asks her name?

She needs to answer each and every question posed to her and if she pleads the 5th on 90% of them then that will be evidence in and of itself and that will still help the jury get a pretty good picture of what was going down around the time of KB's disappearance.

Yah agreed and I think the context was at the preliminary that it just wasn’t necessary. The judge felt the prosecution could prove their point without Ma F. And in order to keep things moving along and not have a three ring circus.

The judge made the decision that listen I realize that her testimony is likely relevant, but let’s just save that for trial.

If she’s called she will have to answer certain questions no doubt about it.

 

[susiQ]

I don't disagree with that either, I think it will be a hot seat if she has to testify. I even want to hear what she has to say about KK and KB, etc. I have my preconceived notions of how she felt about each but her testimony should tell us.

Her testimony could damage or help either side depending on how well she does and whether she is believable and the big one, just what she knows and or admits to knowing. However, clearly she would feel partial to PF but want to save her own arse as well by not perjuring herself... One would hope...

All jmo.

I'm going to take a wild guess that absolutely nothing she has to say will work in favour of PF or herself JMO

 

[susiQ]

I'm just feeling tomorrow is going to be rather anti-climatic. That arrogant creep is going to plead "not guilty". BUT, if he doesn't, I'll eat my Easter bonnet. Oh, I forgot, I don't have one Maybe my grandkids Easter bunny. Well, I'll eat something if he pleads guilty

 

[Hatfield]

I hope nothing delays the arraignment and PF's plea.
The new date is set for May 24 at 8:30 a.m

JMO
If he tries to delay it anymore then it seems to point to guilt. What would evidence testing have anything to do with whether PF thinks he is innocent or guilty of the charges. He is either pleading not-guilty or guilty to the charges against him so if his defense claims they need more time to wait for some evidence then that kind of points to someone who is already guilty and they are just waiting to see if the DA has enough evidence to actually prove it or not.
Important to know, yes, but really has nothing to do with whether one is claiming they are innocent or not.

Frazee arraignment pushed to later date in murder case

 

[MassGuy]

I hope nothing delays the arraignment and PF's plea.
The new date is set for May 24 at 8:30 a.m

JMO
If he tries to delay it anymore then it seems to point to guilt. What would evidence testing have anything to do with whether PF thinks he is innocent or guilty of the charges. He is either pleading not-guilty or guilty to the charges against him so if his defense claims they need more time to wait for some evidence then that kind of points to someone who is already guilty and they are just waiting to see if the DA has enough evidence to actually prove it or not.
Important to know, yes, but really has nothing to do with whether one is claiming they are innocent or not.

Frazee arraignment pushed to later date in murder case

Ultimately it is his choice, but he will likely defer to the judgment of his defense attorneys.

Pushing for a delay is likely their idea, and not his.

There is literally nothing he could do that would change my mind as to his guilt anyways.

The evidence speaks for itself.

 

[sun16]

So, would the prosecution try to force PF’s mother to testify, by subpoena? If they have enough on PF that they don’t need her testimony, do they still care about it, or seeing if mother committed a crime herself?

 

[MsBetsy]

I hope nothing delays the arraignment and PF's plea.
The new date is set for May 24 at 8:30 a.m

JMO
If he tries to delay it anymore then it seems to point to guilt. What would evidence testing have anything to do with whether PF thinks he is innocent or guilty of the charges. He is either pleading not-guilty or guilty to the charges against him so if his defense claims they need more time to wait for some evidence then that kind of points to someone who is already guilty and they are just waiting to see if the DA has enough evidence to actually prove it or not.
Important to know, yes, but really has nothing to do with whether one is claiming they are innocent or not.

Frazee arraignment pushed to later date in murder case

I think if they were waiting on any evidence, it would have been finding the body in the landfill.
Unless, of course, PF knew all along it would not be found there. Jmo

 

[GordianKnot]

So, would the prosecution try to force PF’s mother to testify, by subpoena? If they have enough on PF that they don’t need her testimony, do they still care about it, or seeing if mother committed a crime herself?

Accomplice: Kelsey Berreth was blindfolded, beaten, burned by fiance

SABBM:
Krystal Kenney told Slater that Frazee burned Berreth's body while it was in a tote bag. He used gasoline and wood to start the fire.

Kenney says the tote was stored at Nash Ranch before being moved back to Frazee's property, where the fire was started. Kenney said Frazee's mother went outside on the porch to see what was going on.
_________________________________________

KK is going to testify to the fact that SF came outside during the bonfire at the ranch.

SF is absolutely, positively, going to be called up to that stand by the prosecutor.

They may have to drag her up there kicking and screaming, but she will be taking that stand.

She is a witness who can corroborate KK's account of the burn that took place at the ranch.

I would be not at all surprised if DA May ends up having to request that the judge declare her to be a hostile witness.

The woman is clearly not what you'd call cooperative.
She had to hire her own attorney.
'Nuff said.

Regardless of whether she needs to be declared one legally or not, SF will no doubt prove herself to be a (very) hostile witness for the prosecution.

JMO.

 

[Hatfield]

I think if they were waiting on any evidence, it would have been finding the body in the landfill.
Unless, of course, PF knew all along it would not be found there. Jmo

Good point.
Both the defense and prosecution are glad to have that out of the way for now.

I have always wondered what that other strange evidence was that was talked about where the evidence could be destroyed or something by testing it. Or something along those lines. Not sure what that evidence was or what ended up with all that.

And then there was some evidence where Idaho was having to make special arrangements with Colorado about transfer or something about the evidence. That was a little bizarre as well. May or may not have been related.

I guess we just need to be patient till Friday and we will at least know if he finally pleads or not.

 

[GordianKnot]

I think if they were waiting on any evidence, it would have been finding the body in the landfill.
Unless, of course, PF knew all along it would not be found there. Jmo

BBM:

I think part of the delay tactic employed by the defense was to see if the search was successful in locating KB's remains at the landfill. Unfortunately, it looks like they couldn't pinpoint the correct search location based on the fact that they never found any trash r/t the Frazee ranch at the landfill.

The other thing they've been waiting on, though, is for the testing of the forensic evidence to be completed. That was the stated reason for the request for the continuance at the April hearing.

We should find out Friday whether or not that evidence testing has been completed.
If it has been, hopefully there's no reason to request another continuance.

Well, aside from a desire to delay the inevitable result, i.e., a conviction, of course.

PF can go on ahead and deliver his, "Not Guilty, Your Honor," line in his most sincere, and by sincere, I mean completely spurious and unconvincing, manner.

I'm guessing it's not going to be an Oscar-worthy performance on his part.
Dude doesn't strike me as being a very convincing actor.

I mean, I already don't believe a word that's come out of of his mouth....
And he hasn't even opened it yet.
So there's that.

JMO.