Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #25

[moonlessnight]

He seems to be very concerned with what the "other woman" thinks. Are you saying he may have told the other woman that he and his wife had already split up weeks ago? This is what I am thinking was the main reason for closing his FB account, and when he closed it. I'm trying to get a sense of just how deceitful he is, and what his future plans may have been with her. I'm wondering if he was giving his wife the impression everything was ok, while telling the other woman he had already ended the relationship. I don't know how much longer he planned to keep that up. And what he told her right after she went " missing?" Jmo

and did he have another FB account?

 

[Mosaic]

Wondering, were SW and CW strong Catholics? For whom divorce would be especially problematic? TY.

Good point. Even if SW was a strong Catholic believer, I don't think it weighs too much; she was divorced once. JMO

 

[MyBelle]

@Trinket78 did

i can’t that link to work I would love to see that !
Shanann Watts

Shanann Watts
This is where I got it from . She has it in in the picture and also stated she was thriving through pregnancy a friend said she was told to stop SW said her midwife approved

SW had a midwife? In a high-risk pregnancy? Wow! A midwife isn't qualified to determine what is safe or not safe. Anyone who has ever been in a high-risk pregnancy knows that! They also want to deliver with a NICU nearby. JMO

 

[Tigerlily75]

As we are not allowed to link ingredients due to TOS if you google the ingredients for Lemon Meringue "T" bars it clearly states Allergens: Contains Milk, Soy, Tree Nuts (Coconut).
Shanann Watts

Only some people with tree nut allergies are allergic to Coconut. If SW was giving this to Cece, then it’s most likely Cece wasn’t one of them.

 

[Gardener1850]

He seems to be very concerned with what the "other woman" thinks. Are you saying he may have told the other woman that he and his wife had already split up weeks ago? This is what I am thinking was the main reason for closing his FB account, and when he closed it. I'm trying to get a sense of just how deceitful he is, and what his future plans may have been with her. I'm wondering if he was giving his wife the impression everything was ok, while telling the other woman he had already ended the relationship. I don't know how much longer he planned to keep that up. And what he told her right after she went " missing?" Jmo

BBM - This is my theory. I may be proven wrong later when electronic communications are released, but I don't think CW and SW ever talked about separation at all. I have found no evidence of it besides CW's word. SW had way too many friends. She told her friends everything and was in constant communication to the point where it was suspicious when she hadn't messaged her friend NAU to say good morning. IMHO if separation or divorce had come up SW would have confided in someone. She might have felt CW was distant recently but I'm not convinced she knew why. I don't know her, obviously, and I could be wrong but I don't see her keeping a conversation like that to herself. She might not post it on social media but as social and extroverted as SW was it would seem strange if did not confide in a friend. JMO.

On the other hand CW might have told a few people that he and SW were separating before he even told SW. Namely the AP to keep her believing the relationship was going somewhere but also anyone who wasn't particularly fond of SW or not close to SW. If someone who didn't know SW very well found out about CW's AP I can see CW "covering" by saying they were going to separate soon as a way to try to keep the AP secret a little longer. IMO, it would also endear him more to a person who never liked SW much if he told this kind of lie. MOO.

 

[moonlessnight]

MyBelle said: ↑
I wonder why SW thought it was necessary for a toddler to have a spine adjustment.



I am sure other's would disagree with me but I would not chose that treatment for a child with developing soft bones and muscles. JMO

there are plenty of chiros who will claim that spinal adjustments can help with childhood allergies. the theory is the nerves are aligned and functioning optimally, so the immune system will work better with fewer allergies.

 

[PommyMommy]

@Trinket78 did

i can’t that link to work I would love to see that !
Shanann Watts

Shanann Watts
This is where I got it from . She has it in in the picture and also stated she was thriving through pregnancy a friend said she was told to stop SW said her midwife approved

Not exactly. She said her midwife AND HER OB approved. And the link works for me. It is the Live from the San Diego trip.

 

[Johnny1181]

I absolutely believe she was in love with her family, but love is complicated. My mom still calls her ex-husband her "husband" . She "knows" they will get married again someday, even though he had a girlfriend before they were divorced and he is constantly seeking female companionship in local exchange sites. When you love someone with all of your heart and the sanctity of marriage is paramount to you, sometimes you turn a blind eye to things in order to preserve your own personal vision of your relationship.

My point exactly.... she obviously turned (or had) a blind eye if the man was able to carry on an affair per LE, and she didn't know, she obviously got annoyed at the things I get annoyed with and people get annoyed with me, she obviously loved her babies, and worked her butt off... perhaps just as obviously she truly loved her husband and her babies, came home from a weekend of work, dropped her shoes, suitcase and purse... and went upstairs to a nightmare that I cannot imagine.

Committed by the man she was truly in love with. Moo moo moo it's just horrific to me

 

[MyBelle]

No they won't. That's not automatic. The court has to find medical records relevant to a charge.

How could a judge NOT find medical records relevant if the defense is representing his client's wife murdered his children? That sounds incredibly unfair. JMO

 

[Lady Justice21]

That they don't align with, what... killing her daughters? Or that she doesn't practice what she preaches? If the latter, I'm not sure how that can be used as a basis for her capability of killing her own children. In fact I AM sure it can't. My feeling is that if there is a "dot" to connect, it would have been connected by now. Jmo

I don't disagree with you. I get the impression these nuggets are thrown to paint a picture. I was attempting to paint it. They're not my dots, which is why I mentioned I was taking a when lot of liberty and probably putting words in people's mouths.

But to clarify my own words I meant align in practicing what she preaches, which in different words is what I said. Apologies if that was unclear. How that mis-alignment plays in to the narrative then goes to the other things I said about exaggerating, mental health issues or family division.

 

[Colorado303]

I don’t find this odd at all. Her youngest hadn’t met anyone but grandparents so makes sense to take a long trip if she doesn’t have a job where she has to use vacation.

Plus, the girls were finally at an age where they could make memories with extended family members.

 

[Tigerlily75]

SW had a midwife? In a high-risk pregnancy? Wow! A midwife isn't qualified to determine what is safe or not safe. Anyone who has ever been in a high-risk pregnancy knows that! They also want to deliver with a NICU nearby. JMO

SW said they were approved by her doctor. She used the hashtag #DoctorApproved more than once

 

[SausagePizza]

Is it possible the co-worker did not have the baggage she had? Live on FB and not even knowing?

 

[MCDRAW]

“In voir dire lawyers for each side question the potential jurors about their biases and backgrounds, as well as any pre-existing knowledge they might have about the case. The attorneys can also ask questions designed to uncover characteristics or experiences that might cause potential jurors to favor either the prosecution or the defense.”

This is why we, the posters on WS, have differences of opinion. Our life experiences play a huge role in how we see things. From my life experiences, I see CW as a helpful husband, with chores and with the kids. I see SW as bossy and condescending. So much is said about how SW could have flown even greater heights if she’d had a better husband. I had a husband who didn’t change a single diaper, wash a single dish or even mow the grass. I not only worked but I did everything else. I look back and don’t know how I managed it all. He would just go to the basement and drink and think of ways to make my life even more hellish with his put downs, silent treatments, etc. I have been on the receiving end of snarky comments and those I got were private. I can’t imagine if he had talked to me that way publicly. None of what I did was appreciated. Let’s pretend for a moment that all my husband did was not appreciate me. That alone gave me a deep sadness. I did not feel valued. I was overworked and we (the children and I) walked on eggshells. I left for my sanity. I would have loved having a helpful husband. With the Watts, there are tons of videos that in my opinion show him as great with the kids and helping around the house. Heck, she would even take off on trips and leave the girls with him. For SW it seemed to me to be all about her, Thrive, her friends, having a certain lifestyle (not just projecting one) and Social Media. That’s a lot of fluff with no substance. And when somebody’s ego constantly gets trampled in public & they feel devalued, they are ripe for an affair. I know SW is a victim. Of course she’s a victim. The children are beyond innocent victims. But I would guess that living far beyond their means, another baby on the way they can’t afford, living a life for Social Media with every move filmed, and feeling belittled made this man a pressure cooker ready to explode. I’m going to take a note from @Tippy Lynn and state imo, jmo and moo!

In my opinion, I'm thinking that SW would have loved having a husband that didn't kill her. Of course, this is just a guess on my part. I'm not even sure why I bother coming on here anymore. I have never seen a killer be given so many excuses as to why he killed his victim. If being bossy, is now a good reason to kill, there are a lot of first born children that need to get ready to pass. JMO I can't remember another killer that has been praised about what a wonderful husband he was, after confessing to killing his wife.

 

[Deleted member 230544]

Where are we getting this info? That she "always" had to lean on several doctors because everyone misdiagnoses her kids.

Have any of you who feel she was making her kids sick read anything about the syndrome or factitious disorders in general?

There have been a few cases featured here and many books about such people.

How many times did SW mention her kids' illness in the last two years of social media? Out of how many posts? Does someone care to count?

People with this condition, that's virtually all they talk about in this internet age, online. That and other horrible crises in their lives.

They have blogs and pages just devoted to their children's "journeys" and to constant, minute by minute updates as to every terrible procedure and turn for the worse and emergency their children endured:

"After Bella went through her last round of chemo we had high hopes. We are devastated to report she is back in the ER with a high fever and signs of a major infection. The doctors say she may not make it. Keep us in your prayers."

This is the stuff you see in such cases. Constant escalation of illnesses leading to near death, then miraculously the kid "pulls through", only to be found with another issue or to have another crises within often just days. And other crises that they post in an effort to get pity like fires, or robberies or rapes, or whatever. It's a constant bid for sympathy.

These people can't stay off the internet with their constant tales of woe.

You know there are people with multiple illnesses in the world. And those illnesses can have periods where a person is doing better and then not. And their kids can actually end up with health problems as well, without having a factious disorder.

We have plenty of examples of posters with just these issues.

To try to diagnose a murdered woman with a condition like that and accuse her of killing her kids based on such fiction seems terrible and not like the websleuths I've been used to for almost 15 years.

I feel sad about this.

@gitana1 To answer your question in post: BBM
For a chronological order of medical appointments posted on SW facebook page you can go to "More" drop down menu on SW face book page ~ Check Ins ~ Places ~ Recent.

 

[Medstudies]

SW had a midwife? In a high-risk pregnancy? Wow! A midwife isn't qualified to determine what is safe or not safe. Anyone who has ever been in a high-risk pregnancy knows that! They also want to deliver with a NICU nearby. JMO

CW was okay with this? That is equally shocking.

 

[MsBetsy]

The prosecution has to prove each element of the crime beyond a reasonable doubt - Body disposal is not an element of first degree murder - it pertains to a separate charge (he admitted to). First degree murder is that the defendant, in the state of Colorado, after deliberation, with intent to cause the death, actually caused the death, and conduct was not authorized (jury instructions are a great resource but I can’t figure out how to link to them). So the evidence - circumstantial or direct - would need to prove facts pertaining to those elements.

And regarding circumstantial evidence - I’m not sure how it’s treated in Colorado, but in many jurisdictions, if the circumstantial evidence can fit two or more reasonable conclusions - at least one of which supports the defendant’s innocence - then that’s the one the jury has to go with.

In your opinion, how much weight do you give the porch interview, and how might the defense explain it, if they have to at all? How do you think a jury will perceive it, assuming a pattern of deception is clearly shown? ( by other things such as lying to friends, the friend that came to the house, etc)

 

[SausagePizza]

He seems to be a quite type of guy/personality?

 

[Seattle1]

@MyBelle said: ↑
If CW's defense goes with the strategy that SW killed the children, those medical records and histories will become evidence. JMO
@Seattle1 said: ↑
And why do you think the children's medical records and presumably health histories will become evidence? The children didn't kill anybody.

Because one of their parents killed them and the one taking them to multiple doctors and flying off the handle because MIL gave a child an ice cream treat is the one CW has accused of killing them. Pretty simple logic, really. JMO

The horrific loss of 3 lives is not a fantasy, and requires not your "simple logic" but the application of means, motive, and opportunity. There's nothing simple about it whatsoever.

 

[borndem]

I think that that was when he was pretending that they were just missing, wasn't it?

oops, clicked Reply button instead of Like button.

 

[Silver~Bell]

Nite all, looking forward to reading all your thoughts tomorrow on this fast-moving discussion...and wishing that the reason for the thread had never happened...RIP SW, BW, CCW, and BN