Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #26

Welcome to Websleuths!
Click to learn how to make a missing person's thread

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Status
Not open for further replies.
Its to do with the vile desecration of innocent children's corpses. It would be like someone throwing children's corpses into a swamp for the alligators to eat, or disposing of the bodies in some other foul way. They were not laid to rest with DIGNITY and that's why we're horrified.

But, the children were murdered, likely by their dad. To me that is what's horrifying. I would think most body disposals by the murderer are not dignified. It's all very disturbing, but the murder trumps the manner of disposal, IMO, as far as horror goes.
 
I believe it has been shown that the girls typically went to bed at 6:30 pm. If this is accurate, it has been a while since we had children at that age but does 6:30 pm seem early to anyone? Again, just wanting other's thoughts and not projecting here.
Mine (4 and 2 years of age) go to bed at that time if they haven't napped during the day, just because they are tired. If they nap, they go much later. But to your question, no it doesn't strike me as odd. I know a lot of parents that have early bed times, some are pretty strict about it, some aren't. And I also know quite a few parents with late bed times.

Edited to add: It also depends when kids get up in the morning. Mine are early risers, for example, and no matter when they sleep at night they will be awake at six. Right now. It always changes.
 
Last edited:
LE knows and has evidence proving he murdered them all. That’s why he is charged as he is charged.


Agreed, but people here aren't going to be happy because everybody wanted to know the cause of death and the prosecution is trying to seal that.
 

I reviewed the corporation’s articles of incorporation and articles of dissolution, and do not see her as an officer of shareholder of the company. However, I don’t have access to the annual reports that may have included her at some point.

Looks like the company was in business from 2006-2008.

North Carolina Secretary of State Business Registration Search
 
There is a name on the endorsed witness list other then LE, family, and NUA. It’s NK. I’ve never heard this name mentioned before. It looks like all the persons social media has been scrubbed. There is info out there about this person but it’s not fact that’s why I can’t post here but she or he is on the witness list.

Are any of the VI friends familiar with this person?

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/001/COMPLAINT AND INFORMATION.pdf
I don't believe any VI will confirm or deny knowing witnesses on the list as it could expose their identity.
 
That seems a little out there to me, but I'm sure weirder things have happened. It looks like it would be a lot easier to go to a hotel, the AP's house or even parking in the woods, but to each his own. I don't really know why that matters anyway, unless you think she was there during the murders. I find that highly unlikely, but that's all just my own opinion.
I don’t think she was there that night— just saying she may have been there on some other occassion. (posters were speculating she hadn’t been because neighbors would have seen her). If she was who knows what she may have left behind. Just one more thing we don’t know.
 
Sorry I misunderstood.

I don't believe there will be a shred of evidence of premeditation in the murders of the children. The love both parents expressed for the children in those videos was genuine. JMO
This is curious logic. Suppose the videos paint a completely accurate picture, and both were loving parents.

Someone killed those kids. Someone squeezed the life out of them. Someone dumped their bodies like trash.

If you can kill your family, and take the actions that C.W. took after the fact, premeditation doesn’t seem to be a stretch.

It takes a cold and calculating person to do those things, and premeditation is exactly that.

Looking at Facebook videos and reaching the determination that this wasn’t premeditated, doesn’t seem to be solid logic, or have any basis in fact.

Appearances can be deceiving, because appearances aren’t necessarily reflective of reality.

This may not have been premeditated, but we shouldn’t make a call either way, based on Facebook posts.
 
Agree but men having affairs don’t respect the family space. Women take it very personally but men don’t see it that way when they bring women into the family home or even their marital bed. Speaking from a lot of personal experience
Sorry you had that experience. It would not surprise me if SW is the one who provoked the discussion and ripped the sheets off the bed. Since LE found the bottom sheet, I assume it would be tested for DNA. JMO
 
Thank you for keeping us updated, @Layla123 :)

AB 9/18/18
1. Prosecution asked for Autopsy Report stay sealed. Why? Prosecution believes info about results is so critical to getting a conviction, they don’t want to take any chances. Information in autopsy could taint potential witnesses who have not yet been interviewed and jury pool.
2. Defense filed motion not to have to supply DNA, fingerprints, and palm prints because it is unreasonable search and seizure. It is routine for Prosecution to get this evidence, Defense is objecting just for the purpose of objecting.
3. Judged denied Defense request to investigate leaks, and today the Courts released a handful more documents. Defense filed an appeal asking judge to reconsider,
4. CW has access to newspapers.
5. Defense not happy about leaked information People Magazine printed and actually quoted them in motion. Motion cited that C.W. “showed no emotion when he was being booked,” “no evidence SW killed kids” “CW had been thinking about this for quite some time,” “evidence found in CW’struck.” “Evidence found in bedding, clothes, computers, phones, text messages, and search histories” Defense is not happy about this info getting out there.
6. Interesting that C.W. did not complain about information revealed about multiple affairs with male and female partners.
7. Has Defense been given discovery? As of two weeks ago, they haven’t been given a single page of discovery. Not unusual, CW hasn’t been arraigned, yet.
8. Defense could present a motion to dismiss the case if they can prove that State was selectively leaking pieces of information to taint the jury.
9. Richard Hodges, CW’s former roommate is guest on show. They attended classes together at the NASCAR Technical Institute. What kind of person is C.W.? CW was straight as an arrow. Very dedicated to school, very dedicated to his work, most likely to succeed. Wasn’t the kind of guy who went out and partied, a lot of guys did, but not C.W. He was more like, this is school, this is my future, and this is what I’m going to do. Worked hard, graduated with honors. Very strange to see someone like him being transformed into what we see today. A lot of old classmates have started talking and all on the same page, no one gets it. No one knows what to make of it. Hodges did not stay in touch over the years. After school they worked at the same dealership, but after that Hodges chose different career and moved. Lost touch. Hasn’t talked to him since 2005. None of school friends stayed in touch. CW was quiet and reserved, but not in negative fashion. Very rarely went out with friends. He was hard on himself, he wanted to get good grades and do well.
10. Hodges’ mom saved graduation program from 2004. Shows C.W. ‘s accolades. CW was most outstanding in class.
11. He worked out and was physically fit during school.
12. Does not remember C.W. dating anyone. Never brought anyone home. Didn’t seem odd. He was a perfectionist, very focused on grades. Reserved personality prevented him from meeting people. CW wasn’t a fan of large groups.
13. Any recollection of C.W. acting impulsively? No, he kept to his routine wasn’t impulsive. His attitude was he’d get down on himself once in a while if he didn’t think he was doing well. He pushed himself to do well in school. Never mad, very mellow. How he was,”emotionless” in his interview, that’s how he was back then.
14. Hodges biggest lesson from this whole situation is, “You think you know someone but you really don’t. There’s always gonna be people who have skeletons in their closets that they hide very well.”
15. Will Hodges reach out to him now? No. No need or desire to do so. Has not been contacted by either Prosecution or Defense.
16. What clues could be in Watts family trash? Why wasn’t it a crime scene starting Monday night? Trash day was a Tuesday, CW may have had 48 hours to clean up crime scene and get rid of it. LE didn’t have enough information or probable cause until second day.

Viewer Questions
1. Is C.W. being honest with his legal team? It’s actually a real problem. Not so sure of this image of C.W. being a loving family man is real. There’s something inside C.W. we’re not hearing about. Where are his current friends? Where is his family? How come nobody is speaking up for him? How come he was working in the Oil Industry and not for NASCAR that he had training for and loved so much? More silent than most other cases.

17. Got Hodges back on phone to discuss porch interviews. Hodges says the guy on the porch was typical C.W. The nervous rocking back and forth was him. Arms crossed, he was a shy guy. He’d do that. The part that seemed strange was the laugh, that was creepish, and never knew him to lie.
 
People here are not going to be happy...

"The deceased victims in the instant case, Shanann Watts, Bella Watts and Celeste Watts were murdered and their bodies moved from the initial crime scene. There is a great deal of interest surrounding this case and at this time, the cause of the deaths has not been made public. Consequently, the observations and findings contained in the coroner’s autopsy re-port will be critical evidence at trial. The disclosure of this information to the public prior to trial could result in tainting witnesses that have not yet been interviewed and impacting future jurors. "
Although I would like to know COD, I trust this prosecutor. If they have concerns that releasing the results could be damaging to the case, I get that. I can wait.
 
Before the previous thread closed last night, I was in the process of responding to a post written by @cailleach , who wrote "Just wanted to say 'Hello' to a fellow Coloradoan!". @cailleach was responding to @KathrynL I don't post often so I don't know how to bring that post over to this thread or it that's even possible. Below is my response to cailleach. Please pardon the length.

Hi @cailleach (and everyone),

I'm fairly new to posting on this particular thread. This is only my second post. However, I'm not new to WS. The Missy Bevers case initially brought me to the site a few years ago. @cailleach , hello to a fellow Coloradoan! .

I live about an hour and twenty minutes away from where this tragedy occurred and there really aren't any words to describe how saddened and heartbroken I am for SW, her daughters, and her unborn baby boy. My heart goes out to all family members and friends who were unwillingly thrust into this case and are attempting to make sense out of something that does not make sense at all. This case has captured my attention for several reasons.

Like SW and many of you, I have lupus (SLE), fibromyalgia, and a few other health issues. Lupus can go into remission and thankfully mine finally did about 2 years ago. However, not before I went through a lot of treatments, including bi-weekly infusion treatments that I could only receive at a cancer center, at that time. The side effects were very unpleasant. I still have a scar on my chest from where I eventually had to have a port placed because my veins were "overused". While the lupus is currently in remission, fibromyalgia and my other health issues remain a challenge. Some days are good, some days...meh. Throughout the years, I've had a few surgeries. Not fun. At various times in my life, I've had a few folks say to me, "But you don't look sick", or "Are you sure you have lupus because...?" I found these comments extremely offensive. They did not understand how much pain I was in and how I was trying to mask it. The majority of the time, I did not feel well but I figured people did not care to hear that all of the time. And at one point in my life I was a divorced mom with 4 children so I had to keep working (despite how I felt physically) to take care of my family. Ex-husband was bitter from the divorce and refused to pay child support (although he was ordered to do so by the court. He simply refused to help support our children - financially or otherwise). I couldn't lose my house, my children needed to eat, etc...so I put one foot in front of the other, prayed and just kept going. My mom would fly out to stay with us when things got really, really bad, i.e., when I was hospitalized, when I would have surgery, etc. No one (outside of my home) saw the real ugly parts. I learned to put myself together and fake a smile like you wouldn't believe. I just did what needed to be done. A lot of people who live with chronic, debilitating illnesses do that. I lived in AZ for about 19 years. Left there last year and moved to Colorado. I'm originally from the East Coast and I got tired of roasting in the extreme Phoenix heat. The weather is nice here in Colorado and the cost of living is reasonable.

Anyhow, I've been hearing about this case on my local news since it happened and perhaps it's bothering me even more than it should. I have more than enough to keep me busy, but I think about SW and her babies everyday. Lots of people in the community in which I live have been discussing the case. I did not know anyone involved in this case. But I simply cannot fathom how a person can be so cold-blooded and evil.

I am compelled to say it does not matter to me if SW was bossy or not, made too many work videos or personal home videos, posted too many photos to her SM, did not "look sick enough", said her daughters were "sick too much" for some folks' liking. And on and on and on. She's dead and gone. And so are her precious babies. And SW's husband and father is still above ground. Spewing his lies. I'll tread lightly here because I don't want to violate any TOS (I don't post very often, so I'm not too familiar with them although I have read them and do my best to stay on top of any updates). To that end, I do feel we all are entitled to our own opinions and we should communicate with each other in a respectable manner.

I was raised to always use my "common sense". My education (a bachelor of science in criminology and criminal justice and a master's degree in criminal justice) as well as my professional work experience implores me to not only use my common sense, but also logic and critical thinking skills. And naturally, I am going to utilize whatever ability I have left over to think in both a rational and reasonable manner. Therefore, common sense, logic and critical thinking, coupled with thinking rationally and reasonably tell me I do not need to expend a lot of energy entertaining CW's lies about SW. No loving father/husband can do what he did. (That's my opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own. That's what makes us all different. And that adds to the beauty of the world.) If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. It won't be the first time. And that's okay. Only time will tell. Until then, my condolences to the VI who personally knew SW and her children (@Colorado303), anyone else on here who knew SW and her children or the Watts family, and also to all of those on here who have shared their experiences regarding loved ones they have lost. I'm truly sorry.

RIP SW, BW, CCW, and baby N.

IMO, JMO, and MOO
Hi @NotAtAll!! I'm glad you're enjoying our beautiful state! I agree with all you've stated. If I could "love" your post I would!

You have excellent, educated, knowledge of the topics at hand here, and the personal experience of an often "invisible" chronic disease. I share the latter with you as I suffer from a handful of autoimmune diseases that belong to the "But you don't look sick" category. One of them is a rare disease that only a few thousand people worldwide suffer from and we discuss in our forums the frustrations of people not understanding you can be very ill without it showing.

I do so understand the putting of one foot in front of the other and doing what needs to be done with a smile on your face. In fact, I spend part of the commute every morning smiling just to release endorphins and put myself in the frame of mind to face the day as positively as possible.

Regarding this case, I joined WS to participate in it specifially. I live about 45 minutes from the Watts' home. I have known we'd never see her and those sweet girls alive again since his first interview. Gut instinct and little knowledge of the criminal mind were all that were needed. My career has been largely in the criminal justice system so I'm also experienced. I've seen some hellacious cases but this one grabbed my attention.

I hope you're having a good experience here. I'm going to follow you so I can catch more of your posts. Stay well!
 
What an unfortunate thing to know from experience... I guess I always thought of those kinda guys hiding out in hotels and keeping it from home.

That leads me to think he maybe felt he had a hotel of sorts in the home with Shanann away in NC. And if he was leading his affair to believe he was separated, he would almost have had to have her in "his" house to perpetuate his narrative. IMO

Cheating men with families aren’t paying for hotel rooms - that’s a real rarity but I’m glad you don’t know that. ;)

I’m sure he was very proud of his home. His family was away for a month and he could show her that he was a great provider & give her reason to sympathize with him & resent the ungrateful wife.

It’s possible he actually felt that way.
 
Last edited:
There is never any justification for the murder of children. And there is no justification for verbal abusing anyone whether it be spouse, child, neighbor.

Verbally poke at someone repeatedly and you might get an unexpected reaction. Unfortunately, horrific tragedies can result. JMO

Are you saying you think Shanann's murder was justified?
 
Although I would like to know COD, I trust this prosecutor. If they have concerns that releasing the results could be damaging to the case, I get that. I can wait.

It will be interesting if the defense New Motion actually pushes the hand of the prosecutor to release some of the cause of death to justify the warrant that Watt is resisting, as in his his motion, he is stating that the prosecution hasn't stated the cause for the body warrant?
 
The prosecution has asked to have the autopsy sealed. Does that mean they’ve seen it? If they’ve seen it and then asked for palm prints, etc I’m encouraged there may be forensic evidence on the bodies even after the oil dumping.


See, one of my theories is CW smothered the girls with pillows, and with Shanann, put her in a choke hold then strangled her.

Strangling is likely to leave evidence beneath the skin, generally, if I'm remembering correctly, so with that, I think there's a great chance at still having evidence despite any outer skin loss or whatever may have occurred with (I'm sorry this is gross) Shanann's corpse, element and animal wise, in the 4 (?) days in a grave I'm imagining shallow enough to be exposed to the aforementioned gross stuff.

But if the girls were smothered with pillows, what kind of evidence would show that, like lung stuff, petechial hemorrhages around the eyes which could be seen in deeper tissue layers?

Anyone medical have any insight into how smothering may present differently in these particular settings/elements/situation?
 
No, I wouldn’t.

If I were THAT worried, I’d call the police.

I inferred from that FB post: “I can’t wait to hug my husband and kids” and NOT “Gee, I hope my husband didn’t strangle my kids”.

Fact is, we have seen this in repeated cases. Wife confides in one or two people that of something happens, the husband did it, or if they don;t show up, something is wrong. But to most they paint a picture that all is okay and they don't actually act on their concerns.

I doubt she truly thought the kids were harmed. But she may have had a gut warning that caused her to speak out to her friend. We shall see at trial what was said.
 
The defense attorneys first goal is to protect his Constitutional rights, they know the goal of any evidence collection by the prosecution is so it to be used against him at trial. The prosecution certainly isn't working tirelessly to prove his innocence. The defense would rather have exculpatory evidence themselves to present than allow the prosecution to have it first and find a way to explain it.

I am certain they will lose and a judge will issue a search warrant though.

They also cited conflict with a state statute that they asked the Judge to rule on. Maybe one of the VI attorneys can elaborate on what it all means.
 
In your opinion, do you think anything you saw on SM could be used as evidence against either of them, to show intent, or anything at all?
As I’ve said before, I’m not a big FB user. Though I did see one that doesn’t seem to be there anymore, I’m basing my comment on statements from other friends who were a lot more plugged in to her social media than me. The one I remember was completely innocuous, at least to my untrained eye and without benefit of hindsight.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
131
Guests online
516
Total visitors
647

Forum statistics

Threads
605,491
Messages
18,187,729
Members
233,391
Latest member
datalord
Back
Top