CO - The Stalking and Mysterious Death of Morgan Ingram #5

[Sonya610]

I have slacked off for the last day and don't have time to catch up on all the latest threads. Can anyone answer a quick couple of questions?

First -- the Radio show. I listened to the first half but not the whole thing. On the radio show did she say she had the trail cam photo and also a couple of other video clips of the stalker? Or did that come up in her blog a couple of days ago when she was responding to skepticism?

Secondly can someone post a link to the trail cam photo?

 

[nursebeeme]

I haven't read the entire thread but has the hemorragic corpus luteum been discussed? It could have been a painful ovarian cyst. Just wondering if Morgan could have thought it was a return of her old symptoms and possible porphyria despite her efforts at health and juicing. It also seems weird that she would have been on an antidepressant all thru most of her teen years for a possible illness not even confirmed. That may have set her up to turn to this same med any time illness or pain came up. What if she had cystic ovaries all along!

jmhoo but it just signifies ovulation. (that combined with the congestion)
(the corpus luteum is a mass of cells that is present in the ovarian follicle after ovulation)

 

[txsvicki]

I'm not jumping to a conclusion that someone didn't have a hand in Morgan's death just because there were wrong conclusions about there being a huge horse dose of ami. Morgan could very well have taken something to help with sleep and still been slipped something fatal by someone. Not an expert here, but by there being some ami. In her stomach, I'd think she may have gotten several doses over a period of an hour or so. If she took expectorant she was also probably drinking more fluids. Why take expectorant if planning to die.

 

[21merc7]

I have slacked off for the last day and don't have time to catch up on all the latest threads. Can anyone answer a quick couple of questions?

First -- the Radio show. I listened to the first half but not the whole thing. On the radio show did she say she had the trail cam photo and also a couple of other video clips of the stalker? Or did that come up in her blog a couple of days ago when she was responding to skepticism?

Secondly can someone post a link to the trail cam photo?

No video to link to yet, it has never been posted.

In this thread are the wildlife cam photos and some work others did with them:

The Stalking and Mysterious Death of Morgan Ingram: timeline, picture,media thread: - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

 

[21merc7]

jmhoo but it just signifies ovulation. (that combined with the congestion)
(the corpus luteum is a mass of cells that is present in the ovarian follicle after ovulation)

Thank you! (Would have never figured that out!) :blowkiss:

 

[txsvicki]

Hemorragic doesn't show a cyst?

 

[nursebeeme]

Hemorragic doesn't show a cyst?

it could be indicative of one but not necessarily. He did not mention one present so to me it just signifies ovulation.

It could mean a cyst as well, but the ovaries were otherwise unremarkable along with the rest of the genitourinary portion of the post.

:twocents:

 

[concernedmother]

I doubt there was any meaning whatsoever to the color except that she liked it. Girls (and guys!) wear all kinds of colors of polish now, sometimes even a bunch of different colors at the same time.

I get my nails done at Regal inside Walmart. I just stick to the french manicure look but that place is always swamped with people of all ages and I see alot of funky colors going on the toes and nails. Im not that bold but I did break down and let them put a flower design on my big toes. lol
(Just wanted to note that they arent even matching fingers and toes any more.)

 

[FrayedKnot]

If authorities had bothered to look though then they'd know the date on the bottle and could verify that they had been sitting there unused, or mostly so, for over a year and a half as TI claims. 18 pills isn't as many as was originally thought but still, if they'd been sitting there all this time and then, all of a sudden, she decides to take them. It would shed light on the situation to determine how many were left, etc.

Also it would give credence to what TI claims which is that M hadn't been filling that prescription for the last year and a half. The autopsy does assume a build up of the drug (is this stated right?) over an eight or nine year period. I'm confused now because it also says the dose would be worse for someone who isn't used to taking it. Either way, it was too much.

Wait, it was stated that the EMT's accounted for all the pills in the bottles? They were full, none taken? I don't know why that would be, seems kind of weird to fill the scripts and not even take a few, since you had been, before you quit taking them. Why pickup refills in the first place then?

I think this has been a question in many of our minds. Unless every pill originally dispensed is still in the bottle, then it is not safe to say they were all accounted for. And, as you point out, if she had not taken any of ONE prescription, why would she have had another bottle?

As an earlier poster, perhaps Gitana, pointed out; on an 18-month-old prescription, the expected amount of pills left would be ZERO. Any other remainder would be impossible to "account for".

Again, excepting two completely full bottles and then, why?

And agreed the amount found in M's system was too much for a therapeutic dose, and IIRC, appr. 2x the fatal dose. But contrary to earlier speculation on this thread, the amount was certainly ingestible and not necessarily indicative of foul play.

MOO

 

[mysterygirl]

I think this has been a question in many of our minds. Unless every pill originally dispensed is still in the bottle, then it is not safe to say they were all accounted for. And, as you point out, if she had not taken any of ONE prescription, why would she have had another bottle?

As an earlier poster, perhaps Gitana, pointed out; on an 18-month-old prescription, the expected amount of pills left would be ZERO. Any other remainder would be impossible to "account for".

Again, excepting two completely full bottles and then, why?

And agreed the amount found in M's system was too much for a therapeutic dose, and IIRC, appr. 2x the fatal dose. But contrary to earlier speculation on this thread, the amount was certainly ingestible and not necessarily indicative of foul play.

MOO

Could have been different mg.

 

[mysterygirl]

Promethazine (Phenergan)
Guafinesin (expectorant)
Cyclobenzaprine (Flexeril)
Amitriptyline (Elavil)
Flurazepam (Dalmane)
Conitine (Nicotine)

One point of agreement for both Kurtzman as well as Doberson is the amount of time from the point the drugs entered Morgans system to the point of death..
Kurtzman says minutes to an hour
Doberson says within 30 minutes

I am more unsettled than ever at this point unlike I know some others are feeling a level of resolve or somewhat closure in their opinions as far believing stronger and more certain than ever that this was in fact a suicide.. I unfortunately am not at all feeling that way and in fact feel more unsettled than ever at this point in it just does not add up for me at all..

Someone mentioned upthread the clothing is easily explained and was due to Morgans having been drinking and drugging and left her just passing out in her clothes..except for the fact Morgan was not drinking nary a drop of alcohol and imo the drugs that her system were overloaded with are just frankly not at all any of the typical prescription drugs of choice that young adults regularly use and abuse to get high, numb, or euphoric..while i understand some of thes drugs have been abused before and no one need argue that point because i do know that but nonetheless the drugs her body was overloaded with are not by any stretch of the imagination the "usual" go to pills when seeking to get high..

So, I am very much in disagreement with this being a case of an intoxicated, high girl who just died from "partying" on booze/pills.or in that state chose to kill herself..again alcohol is known for a fact to not even play a role at all at any time near or leading up to her death..

And if what we are being told is true then every instinct and intuition within my entire existence is screaming this is not suicide..again if everything we've been told is true such as:
-Morgan fine emotionally/physically at dr 36hrs prior
-Morgan upbeat and fine the entire day of Thurs 12/1 ate big breakfast helped dad and ex bf for better part of the earlier part of the day..around 2pm meeting up with D and at around 8:30pm after having left D she stops by a house where friends were and is happy/upbeat especially about D having told her how much her really liked her.
-and after 9pm at home in bedroom fine and texting with D...dad visits in her room says she was smiling and happy tho, feared it was possible she was coming down with a cough and worried about going and getting kids sick she was bbsitting for, but didnt wana cancel last minute on the mom who would be expecting her to keep the kids..ends the night telling dad how much she loves him.
-has breakfast plans to meet early next morning with D prior to her going to bbsit..

Imo if those above details are in fact true and do accurately describe her demeanor and seeming state of mind .. I find it highly unlikely this was a suicide.. If we were to learn that the above is not really an accurate account/description of Morgans last days/hours then I could quite honestly feel drastically different about suicide..but for now with what we know and how weve been told of those last days/hours I just for the life of me cannot correlate that with suicide..

Imo it would be rather simple to have confirmation of the majority of those issues if we even had one person speaking out about Morgan in those last days and was she really fine, actually happy about certain aspects(budding relationship), and more so in a content, stable state of mind.. I certainly wish we would have a friend or even close aquaintance that would grace us with their presence here at WS and offer another point of view about Morgan..that could really go a long way in helping many of us to have a better or more complete, fleshed out, all around multi faceted descriptin of just who Morgan was.

I feel the same way.

I also want a second opinion on the 18 pills and want to know why there wasn't one little fragment of pill in her stomach.

Something feels wrong about it to me, the whole thing.

 

[concernedmother]

I wont be able to listen Sunday night but I hope someone asks Toni about what meds were found in M med cab and what full and empty bottles. Its very important to get that info.

 

[rollinginit]

Oh, wow. New information.

M having her street clothes on.....wonder if she sneaked out of the house after parents went to bed?

 

[nursebeeme]

Oh, wow. New information.

M having her street clothes on.....wonder if she sneaked out of the house after parents went to bed?

it bothers me too ( a lot )

with all the mentions of "jammies" on both the blog and the radio interview I don't think the street clothes were a normal happenstance (re: that she regularly slept in her clothing).

 

[Marshmallow]

I dont suppose there is any way to get a report from paramedic or LE about the scene that night? Pill bottles in M bathroom etc?

(if anyone else has asked this, I apologize. I'm reading from last night and haven't hit today's posts yet)

is there a chance that in their grief the family may have tidied up a bit and removed things without thinking?

 

[concernedmother]

I certainly understand why M had to be home by 10. They both work and were getting very little sleep thru this whole ordeal anyway. I wonder what it was like before the stalking if she had a certain time then. If this was new to M that probably was hard for a 20 yr old that wanted to be with her friends and while others were hanging she had to tell them she had a curfew. It was probably somewhat embarrassing to her.

 

[Marshmallow]

I'm not convinced of suicide.

This report didn't change that much for me.

If I remember correctly she had 10mg and 25mg pills in her old bottles.

I find it hard to believe that petite girl popped at least 18 pills on an empty stomach and didn't throw it up.

That's just me.

one of the questions I asked early on was if the family may have cleaned up the scene in the time between finding her and calling for help. In their heartbreak they may havetidiedwithout thinking and that may explain the absence of vomit or pill bottles, etc.

 

[rollinginit]

I certainly understand why M had to be home by 10. They both work and were getting very little sleep thru this whole ordeal anyway. I wonder what it was like before the stalking if she had a certain time then. If this was new to M that probably was hard for a 20 yr old that wanted to be with her friends and while others were hanging she had to tell them she had a curfew. It was probably somewhat embarrassing to her.

I don't know, but some nights M didn't get home until 12.
Most nights my daughter is home by 12 (her curfew). Especially if she has school the next day.

 

[Confusion]

I certainly understand why M had to be home by 10. They both work and were getting very little sleep thru this whole ordeal anyway. I wonder what it was like before the stalking if she had a certain time then. If this was new to M that probably was hard for a 20 yr old that wanted to be with her friends and while others were hanging she had to tell them she had a curfew. It was probably somewhat embarrassing to her.

If she was never out alone, and she had caring friends, why couldn't someone have followed her home, walked her to the doo, rand waited for her to go in on nights she wanted to stay out later? TI said that M had her own pepper spray, and I'd think one of those guys (especially a bf) would be a better protector than mom; then again, there is that mama bear syndrome!

 

[Confusion]

I don't know, but some nights M didn't get home until 12.
Most nights my daughter is home by 12 (her curfew). Especially if she has school the next day.

Is your daughter over 20? I think I'm going up and down even more after seeing the results than I did before.