Connecticut school district on lockdown after shooting report at a Newtown elemen #11

[bourne]

Uhhh....any adult that willfully supplies high capacity semi-automatic rifles to their obviously mentally disturbed children SHOULD be charged.

Seriously? The kid in her own house communicated only through email for months? The obviously "not right" in the head kid? And she buys him rifles and allows him access to her gun safe???

Yes. I am sure a law on the books would cover this situation, and if there is not a law on the books there should be. Covering and excusing severe mental illness while providing ready access to firearms and actually PAYING for them to purchase firearms is messed up to an extreme. I can't believe anyone would even argue the point (though I can guess why a person might get offended and argue the point).

BBM. Where are you getting this from? Cite the law that states the above.

 

[Sonya610]

Guns, computers, video games appear to have been his interests. I definitely don't approve of the shared interest in guns in AL's case, but in the mind of his mother, as others have mentioned, it may have been one of the only ways she found to bond with him and try to get him in a social situation. Since he showed no signs of violence, it obviously wasn't a concern to her, or anyone else for that matter, that he would ever do anything like this.

He was obviously more than a bit mentally off, he covered the windows, he would not talk to his mother even though he lived in the same house, so buying him rifles seems like a good idea as a bonding thing?

No. Bonding is not in any way an excuse. The kid was deranged and obviously getting worse, supplying firearms and writing checks to buy him more is just as crazy as he was.

 

[Sonya610]

BBM. Where are you getting this from? Cite the law that states the above.

As I said, if there is not a law there should be. It is called common sense.

 

[LambChop]

NL had been dealing with AL's condition all his life. There is nothing to suggest that he ever showed any outward violent tendencies. His other behavior characteristics, that might point to signs in another child, were normal for his condition.

http://www.webmd.com/brain/autism/tc/aspergers-syndrome-topic-overview

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/7288381/#.UptxrMRDulI

Snipped.....

I read that there were packed boxes in the house so it appears NL was getting prepared to move. That could have very well been the trigger to him that set him off since he may not have wanted to move.

Thanks for posting that information. Very helpful.

 

[bourne]

Not purchase a whole bunch of weapons and not train her mentally ill son how to use them, for a start.

First of all, you have no proof that she was aware or even considered him "mentally ill". A diagnosis of Asperger's does NOT equal "mentally ill".

Second, just because she purchased guns doesn't mean she knew AL would use said guns to KILL other people.

Third, she did not coerce him to use guns or instruct him to use guns on other people.

Fourth, if an ADULT chooses to use guns in criminal manners, their PARENTS are NOT responsible for the ADULT'S actions.

 

[Sonya610]

First of all, you have no proof that she was aware or even considered him "mentally ill".

Uhhh....yeah. Okay then.

 

[jjenny]

He didn't exhibit any violence personally, but it certainly looks like he was obsessed with violence from an early age.
Seems quite a few mass shooters are this way.
They might not act out prior to shootings in violent ways, but they usually seem to be very interested in mass shootings, like to play violent video games, write violent stories, etc.

 

[iSleuth]

Wow! That was going to be her X-mas present to AL?

It sounds like either she was in complete denial of the gravity of the situation OR NL was doing whatever it took to keep some form of interest/communication going with him.

AL sounds like he had control over her in a passive/aggressive way. In a covert type of way.....

Yep she couldn't have a Christmas tree but he could get her to get his next gun for his present. I think he exerted more and more control and manipulation of her around the home as time went on. as things progressed towards the plan to move out of Newtown, and his planned date for the massacre.

What if she sometimes used guns as bribes to mistakenly gain his compliance? IMO NL didn't know what was coming. But I for one disagree with her every thing ( handling of almost everything) enabling of him and his life style in her own home . " doing laundry but couldn't go in his room? " which had all that going on ?

She perpetuated his estrangement with his father and reality. And she paid dearly for it - his first assassination - but I do believe since she did attempt to bring him to danbury hospital she knew things were getting out of hand . This must have been why she was seeking to find a place for him ( where was it they were going? Washington state ??)

If I can share my opinion, maybe his motive for the elementary school was that it was a place he 1. knew well,
2. A place where in his own mind he was happy, had a chance, friends, support and normality in his life ,
3 . The first place he received a therapeutic diagnosis and services . ( it's why they chose the system )

Awful


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[BeginnersLuck]

I was not approving of her actions with the gun activity. I was simply offering a possible explanation for what "she" may have been thinking. It's not what I would have done and my reason for listing the importance of keeping firearms locked up.

I listed the information above, to illustrate how aspergers could easily mask symptoms that we may see as red flags in others. This was a life long condition for him and NL would be looking at his behavior and relating it to his condition.

He was an adult and displayed no behavior such as violence or drug use, that would may result in a parent invading his space. In fact they tell you not to do things that make those with aspergers anxious.

So as far as what could/should have been done, the only thing I see is what is firearm related. Of course it can be argued that he could have gone out and bought firearms on his own, by either getting money from his mother or saving money to do so. The question is, would he have done what he did, if he hadn't been exposed to the firearms or they were not so easy for him to have access to? Hard to tell.

 

[iSleuth]

I was not approving of her actions with the gun activity. I was simply offering a possible explanation for what "she" may have been thinking. It's not what I would have done and my reason for listing the importance of keeping firearms locked up.

I listed the information above, to illustrate how aspergers could easily mask symptoms that we may see as red flags in others. This was a life long condition for him and NL would be looking at his behavior and relating it to his condition.

He was an adult and displayed no behavior such as violence or drug use, that would may result in a parent invading his space. In fact they tell you not to do things that make those with aspergers anxious.

So as far as what could/should have been done, the only thing I see is what is firearm related. Of course it can be argued that he could have gone out and bought firearms on his own, by either getting money from his mother or saving money to do so. The question is, would he have done what he did, if he hadn't been exposed to the firearms or they were not so easy for him to have access to? Hard to tell.

No I don't think he could have done what he did if he didn't have access etc .
Although he probably could have procured a gun, he could not go buy a gun. By gun laws in the state of CT he was not old enough to buy a gun and have it registered in his name.

I think he could and did go buy ammunition though. ?


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[Brightbird]

No I don't think he could have done what he did if he didn't have access etc .
Although he probably could have procured a gun, he could not go buy a gun. By gun laws in the state of CT he was not old enough to buy a gun and have it registered in his name.

I think he could and did go buy ammunition though. ?


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He tried to buy a gun but was turned away because he didn't want to wait for the 14-day background check.

I'm really surprised that there isn't laws against permit holders allowing people without permits to access their guns so easily. I would have thought that would be a requirement of holding a permit, but I guess not.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/de...nman-tried-to-buy-rifile-days-before-20121215

 

[bourne]

This guy was an officially diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic. I wouldn't call him "normal" at all, either. He had very strange ideas and behaviors, would refuse to speak to some staff or other residents for weeks at a time if he was offended by something.

I see in some posts above you are becoming very upset about people implying AL was mentally ill.

They are not lumping Asperger's into mental illness. Asperger's is a neurological issue.

But you cannot possibly believe he was fine and then "snapped". He was bizarre and quite obviously an undiagnosed mentally ill person.

Cite reference to AL being diagnosed with schizophrenia of any form.

No, sigh. No, I'm not upset with whatever he was diagnosed with or not.

I did not say he was "fine". I clearly said he had mental issues and I believe he was NOT properly diagnosed prior to his going off on his mom and began shooting up the school. That is why I do NOT believe his mom is to be blamed. She was as naive as the next person as to how ill he was.

 

[jjenny]

He tried to buy a gun but was turned away because he didn't want to wait for the 14-day background check.

I'm really surprised that there isn't laws against permit holders allowing people without permits to access their guns so easily. I would have thought that would be a requirement of holding a permit, but I guess not.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/de...nman-tried-to-buy-rifile-days-before-20121215

That's old information which turned out to be bogus. He didn't try to buy his own gun. Why would he? Mom bought him plenty.

 

[iSleuth]

He tried to buy a gun but was turned away because he didn't want to wait for the 14-day background check.

I'm really surprised that there isn't laws against permit holders allowing people without permits to access their guns so easily. I would have thought that would be a requirement of holding a permit, but I guess not.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/de...nman-tried-to-buy-rifile-days-before-20121215

This is one of the first laws Ct and Gov. Malloy made early in 2013 gun licenses and mental health . That was my first hint .


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[iSleuth]

http://www.ct.gov/despp/cwp/view.asp?a=4213&q=494616.

Right ty someone said about legal age 18 to buy a gun . Actually she broke laws buy transferring her registered guns to him under 21- but here is something I found interesting too.

3. Other persons prohibited from possessing a firearm include anyone convicted as delinquent for the commission of a serious juvenile offense; or has been discharged from custody within the preceding twenty years after having been found not guilty of a crime by reason of mental disease or defect; or has been confined in a hospital for persons with psychiatric disabilities (as defined in section 17a-495) within the preceding twelve months by order of a probate court; or is subject to a firearms seizure order issued pursuant to subsection (d) of section 29-38c after notice and hearing; is prohibited from shipping, transporting, possessing or receiving a firearm pursuant to 18 USC 922(g)(4); or is an alien illegally or unlawfully in the United States.

Scary he was doing that all in my neighborhood. ::; shudder ::::

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Paranoid schizophrenics or severe drug addicts will do this too.
I've seen it with both types, it's rather unnerving. Most people will buy nice blackout drapes.

I still wonder if Adam didn't have undiagnosed PS .. the severe isolation, his body type, I just have a suspicion that as he left his teens and entered into his 20's that the issues he's had growing up developed into a severe mental illness, but because he was so entrenched in the house he remained undiagnosed.

 

[Brightbird]

That's old information which turned out to be bogus. He didn't try to buy his own gun. Why would he? Mom bought him plenty.

Oh, thanks. I didn't know it wasn't true that he tried to purchase a gun. Guess you can't believe everything in the news, lol.

 

[jjenny]

I still wonder if Adam didn't have undiagnosed PS .. the severe isolation, his body type, I just have a suspicion that as he left his teens and entered into his 20's that the issues he's had growing up developed into a severe mental illness, but because he was so entrenched in the house he remained undiagnosed.

From the report just released, he had OCD, anxiety and was diagnosed with Asperger's.
No info that he heard voices.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Although you can't purchase a hand gun prior to the age of 21 in Connecticut, you can still purchase a long gun once you turn 18 and apply for the certificate. He would have turned 21 in April.

http://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state-laws/connecticut.aspx

As far as I know, he was never hospitalized for mental illness. How are they going to prevent people with mental illnesses from purchasing guns. How will they track this?

There are many untreated, undocumented people with mental impairment or illness in our country.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

I think if he had walked into a shop to try and buy a gun that he would have had a hard time, he looks frightening. Or would they have been unable to stop him do you think?