Crime Scene Photos #3 ***WARNING - GRAPHIC DISCUSSION***

[FX Wiz]

Saw that. Was there a message from him along with it? It was hard to tell in the picture if there was. Thanks for the pics of the site.

Above his sig, it says "Rest in peace little baby"

 

[FX Wiz]

I see Jazz Baez. Or maybe that's his street name, LOL.

You're right, it does. Hmmm... I swear in person it looked more like Jose with a Z, now you got me doubting my own eyes!

 

[FX Wiz]

Did you see the pic of the "cross" that wasn't there in Jan. has JB's signature right on top?
http://www.creationwiz.com/misc/anthonycase.htm

My bad, I don't think it's JB's sig now.

 

[Unsolved]

Did anyone ever give it a name?

Snipped

Sorry I was so late seeing your question - oh yes, our kitteh is named after a great poster here on WS and is known as:

Hercat Purriot

 

[christee]

Hi guys, well I did it... I drove over to the "site" today. Snapped some pics. Saw a lot of pavers. Had to create a simple html file to upload em, so I added a couple old ones too.
Some interesting.
LINK
http://www.creationwiz.com/misc/anthonycase.htm

Thanks for the pics!
I think the "white pavers" with the "scalloped" edge may be landscape edging that is placed vertically in the ground, say, as a border around a flower bed.
This info has prob already been discussed but thought I'd post just in case!

 

[ZubenElSchemali]

I think this is too much material to be a degraded diaper. What could it be?

http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/1/lg/196770.htm


The link below shows what I believe to be a degraded diaper. As you will see, it thin and flat. Not fluffy or ruffely like the pic in the link above. You can clearly see the waistband and the material that would cover the stomach and crotch area.

http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/1/lg/196674.htm

The texture and size reminds me of a Handi Wipe or similar product. Usually they are colored. I can't remember what colors though, I don't use them.

 

[BondJamesBond]

While investigating a question from another WS yesterday about black plastic submitted for forensics testing I observed something, unrelated to the black plastic.

In a hyper-organized file on the evidence collected that JWG shared w/ me :highfive: I noted the following group of items that were recovered from 'Area A'. Recall that 'Area A' (see bumped graphic @ the bottom of this post FYI) is the area in which the disposal bags and skull were located

Area A

• One plastic brown bottle, capped
• One glass clear bottle, capped
• Two potting soil bags - 1 containing pots and bags inside
• One glass "SOBE" bottle, uncapped
• One broken red cup
• One broken plastic, red Dixie cup
• One broken pumpkin "PEZ" dispenser

Note that these aren't the only items recovered from 'Area A', only that these items were grouped together when collected as evidence. IMHO, this grouping may have something to do w/ how they were found (e.g. perhaps partially contained in/around a bag.

First - consider a proposition that IMHO non-human debris found in/near 'Area A' has a higher probability of being connected to the disposal than debris recovered from areas further away from the original disposal location. IOW...for whatever reason (e.g. partially captured in a bag) they were able to resist transport by water, predators, etc. over time.

Now...working in reverse order of immediate interest, let me call your attention to the following items:

SOBE bottle: http://www.sobeworld.com/teas_and_juices.php
SOBE drinks are generally fruity-flavored 'energy' drinks. Many flavors are akin to something like a fruit smoothie...something that would be colorful and sweet...a prime candidate for disguising something you might want a child to drink. Pure speculation/observation here. The SOBE bottles are large, glass and heavy. It follows that, esp. w/ the cap off as found, that this bottle wouldn't travel far if/when disposed near the remains. Not enough information on the capped brown plastic (my mind conjures up a prescription bottle, bottle of hydrogen peroxide, or even some pesticides I've purchased in the past) or capped glass bottles given. :waitasec:​

Two potting soil bags - 1 containing pots and bags inside:
This really has my attention. Although JWG has already pointed out to me the absence of anything on the December Hopespring search warrant that would appear to be connected to these potting soil bags, let me offer something for you to consider.

We don't know what/if any plan Casey had to dispose of the body. How little or much thought she put into it, and when she made the decision to go w/ the Suburban Drive location. IOW...it could've been a general idea that turned into a spur of the moment :idea:...maybe more...maybe less. I hafta admit I'm predisposed now to think it was less vs. more. Many of us have been thinking Casey borrowed Brian's shovel to attempt to dig a grave in G&C's backyard. We've also been attracted to the 'depression' found near the pool. Finally, we've also noted the soil found in the trunk of the Pontiac and tried to put all of these pieces of the puzzle together. :waitasec:

Here's another option to consider.

In what to me would be almost a perfect fit for Casey's m.o....Casey may have simply taken the potting soil from G&C's w/ the intent to cover over the body @ the final disposal location vs. actually digging a grave. Perhaps hoping to take advantage of a naturally ocurring depression somewhere (Dunno if the 'sinkhole' search had anything to do w/ it, but, IIRC, that was done some time before 6/16 and if so, prolly unrelated). Since one of the potting soil bags contained some "pots & bags inside" it might've been already open @ G&C's and Casey decided she'd 'top it off'. To do this she ran next door to get Brian's shovel and scooped a few shovel fulls into the partially empty potting soil bag, leaving the depression. IIRC, the depression was in the area where the storage box may have been covering it...near/where George had moved the hibiscus from to make room for the box. Loose soil there...easy to dig.

This route would give us...

• Empty potting soil bags disposed w/ the body
• Shovel use w/o decomp
• Soil in the trunk of the Pontiac from an already-opened potting soil bag

Of course, over time, w/ the effects of rain and flooding from hurricane Faye the soil would wash away from the bags and leave them exposed as they were found. We're not talking about a tremendous amount of soil here...and I don't think we're talking about it being compacted. Just dumping the soil on top of the disposed remains bags and off Casey goes...proud of her clever no-muss-no-fuss burial idea.
​

FWIW, JWG already noted to me that these items don't appear to have been submitted to the FBI for further testing...at least as far as we know based on what has been released.

FWIW, bumping the topography view of the disposal site since it was something I knew was available and might help others understand the proximity of 'Area A', etc.

Rough view of how water would drain into and away from the disposal site based on the elevations in the topographical survey (for those not familiar w/ reading them).

 

[countzero]

See, you brought an optional view to our attention I didn't even think or consider until you posted it.

Why, oh why would anyone throw bags of potting soil, one filled with empty pots and such in a place such as where Caylee was found? The area isn't near a trash bin, it isn't near anything but woods and swampy areas.

One would normally, hate using this word since it doesn't apply to the A clan, place these items in their trash cans or recycle bins once they are used or discarded.

I think you are on to something here with your theory. It can work for me, I can believe it happened.

Thank you :clap::clap::clap:

 

[MADJGNLAW]

The texture and size reminds me of a Handi Wipe or similar product. Usually they are colored. I can't remember what colors though, I don't use them.

They look like arm and hammer dryer sheets to me. But I do agree they could possibly be wipes or similar products.

 

[MADJGNLAW]

If anyone recalls the physic had said to look for 3 white pavers. If you notice in this picture there are 3 white/peach-discolored pavers-stones. To me this was the landmark of were Caylee would be found and I feel that Casey some how got that message out there somehow. I really do not believe the physic.

Link to picture: http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/1/lg/196749.htm

 

[BondJamesBond]

See, you brought an optional view to our attention I didn't even think or consider until you posted it.

Why, oh why would anyone throw bags of potting soil, one filled with empty pots and such in a place such as where Caylee was found? The area isn't near a trash bin, it isn't near anything but woods and swampy areas.

*snipped*

Thanks, CountZero. Just noodlin'.

You hafta remember, though, this is also an area on the side of a road that is not travelled very often during the summer when school is out. Easy place for peeps to throw trash outta their vehicles. (I dunno why they do that :furious When you look @ the pics of items recovered it becomes clear, besides the potential for kids walking into the area to 'hang out' this area is prolly like so many side-of-the-road dumping grounds you see.

Potting soil bags, and some pots, and even what looks like landscape edging in the pics, could've also come from workers doing landscape on a yard or at the school, etc. So...anything's possible. It just caught my eye that these potting soil bags were in 'Area A' and I thought I'd offer the possibility.

 

[ibyoungr]

After analyzing JW's interview, and BB's interview and reading BJB's insightful post.

I think that she DID use the potting soil and the extra dirt from the yard. JWray states she did not see anything in that location PRIOR to the flooding. If the bags were covered with potting soil she WOULD NOT HAVE seen anything.

However, Ray Kronk sees stuff as early as August 11th? This is still before the floods?
Could the body have completely decomposed to the point RK saw a skull in August?

 

[countzero]

*snipped*

Thanks, CountZero. Just noodlin'.

You hafta remember, though, this is also an area on the side of a road that is not travelled very often during the summer when school is out. Easy place for peeps to throw trash outta their vehicles. (I dunno why they do that :furious When you look @ the pics of items recovered it becomes clear, besides the potential for kids walking into the area to 'hang out' this area is prolly like so many side-of-the-road dumping grounds you see.

Potting soil bags, and some pots, and even what looks like landscape edging in the pics, could've also come from workers doing landscape on a yard or at the school, etc. So...anything's possible. It just caught my eye that these potting soil bags were in 'Area A' and I thought I'd offer the possibility.

Tossing trash out the window is one thing, but to physically park a vehicle, physically walk through who knows what else is in that tall grass hiding (think snakes and whatnots), physically move branches (think spiders) then backtrack is another. All for dumping potting bags doesn't compute for me.

Just dawned on me; apparently this wasn't a regular spot the local kids used or Caylee would have been found immediately. KC may have known this.

I will have to go and look at the before photos again just to familiarize myself with the area we are discussing.

Again, much thanks for your heavy thinking. It helps me.

 

[JWG]

FWIW, the crime scene photos were taken in more or less the order that items were discovered and cataloged. Also, the photos are numbered by 3's (3, 6, 9, ... etc. and not 1, 2, 3, ...). I don't know the reason for that, but it is what it is.

There should be 18 photos in the range 197376.jpg to 197433.jpg. I picked this range because it is the one that includes the Pez dispenser listed by Bond:



Only one other photo was released in this range, one I believe is the "One glass clear bottle, capped":



The photos came from the Myfoxorlando site. Not sure if the others were released by LE and MFO did not feel like uploading everything, or if the photos of the other items were not released to the media. It could be that LE did not release the images of the other items because bones showed up in the images as well. Bones recovered from Area A were:

• One ulnar bone
• One radius bone
• Eight small miscellaneous bones
• One small miscellaneous bone
• Two small miscellaneous bones
• Two teeth
• One small miscellaneous bone
• Seven small miscellaneous bones
• One epiphysis

 

[BondJamesBond]

Tossing trash out the window is one thing, but to physically park a vehicle, physically walk through who knows what else is in that tall grass hiding (think snakes and whatnots), physically move branches (think spiders) then backtrack is another. All for dumping potting bags doesn't compute for me.

Just dawned on me; apparently this wasn't a regular spot the local kids used or Caylee would have been found immediately. KC may have known this.

I will have to go and look at the before photos again just to familiarize myself with the area we are discussing.

Again, much thanks for your heavy thinking. It helps me.

Certainly not trying to dissuade you from the potting soil being integrally involved, countzero. Just trying to be fair and point out...

a) Other landscaping-type debris was recovered from the general disposal location area
b) As a result of the flooding you can think of the place like one big stew...things floated everywhere...so where thing were found isn't necessarily where they were placed/tossed.​

Maybe I'm just confusing things. I just try to point out this isn't a clear-cut black & white thing. Esp. for folks that haven't had time to look @ some the details you might just read "potting soil bags found with the body" and think, well...DUH :doh: Kinda the NG-effect, IYKWIM.

IIRC, the body was something in the neighborhood of 20-30' off the curb. Easy toss from small objects like beer bottles, etc. If there'd been a roadsign nearby I coulda hit it w/ a Little Kings bottle @ 35MPH when I was a little more in-practice

Very interesting point about how current this area would be used by kids, hence, body eventually being discovered. Maybe Kio gave details 'bout the timing of when their group would've hung out there. I'm thinking that's pre-16-driver's-license-kinda stuff, hence, minimum 6+ years ago for Casey. With Wii, etc, etc. I'm guessing this area has probably seen alot less traffic with kids as a hangout in that time.

One other comment I can't resist:

* Its not the spiders & snakes...its the 'whatnots' you hafta watch out for, esp. in Florida

 

[Noddy]

If anyone recalls the physic had said to look for 3 white pavers. If you notice in this picture there are 3 white/peach-discolored pavers-stones. To me this was the landmark of were Caylee would be found and I feel that Casey some how got that message out there somehow. I really do not believe the physic.

Link to picture: http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/1/lg/196749.htm

I was wondering if KC (with or without help) would be able to lift the sewer cover with that shovel or other tool and if so, where would that sewer system lead to? The following picture, from your above source (thanks MADJGNLAW) shows a manhole at the Caylee site.

http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/1/lg/196443.htm

Perhaps the rising water in August allowed the bag to escape through a faulty piping system and that is why KC was in so much shock when it was found. She just wasn't expecting that to happen.

Just a crazy theory perhaps.

 

[BondJamesBond]

FWIW, the crime scene photos were taken in more or less the order that items were discovered and cataloged. Also, the photos are numbered by 3's (3, 6, 9, ... etc. and not 1, 2, 3, ...). I don't know the reason for that, but it is what it is.

There should be 18 photos in the range 197376.jpg to 197433.jpg. I picked this range because it is the one that includes the Pez dispenser listed by Bond:
View attachment 4112
Only one other photo was released in this range, one I believe is the "One glass clear bottle, capped":
View attachment 4111

*snipped*

Thanks, JWG.

1) Pez dispenser looks like its laying on enough grass (vs. mud) that makes me think it was nearer the road. I always kinda thought it was just left/dropped by a trick-or-treater.

2) OK...I can see mixing vodka w/ SOBE. Hmmm...:waitasec: that sounds pretty good actually :martini:

 

[BondJamesBond]

I was wondering if KC (with or without help) would be able to lift the sewer cover with that shovel or other tool and if so, where would that sewer system lead to? The following picture, from your above source (thanks MADJGNLAW) shows a manhole at the Caylee site.

http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/1/lg/196443.htm

Perhaps the rising water in August allowed the bag to escape through a faulty piping system and that is why KC was in so much shock when it was found. She just wasn't expecting that to happen.

Just a crazy theory perhaps.

No crazier than anything else, Noddy.

FWIW...found this general ref. to manhole cover weighing 'bout 100 lbs. (45kgs). [ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhole_cover[/ame]

As far as we know Casey returned the shovel to Brian w/o leaving G&C's...not impossible, just AFAIK.

 

[cloud9]

I was wondering if KC (with or without help) would be able to lift the sewer cover with that shovel or other tool and if so, where would that sewer system lead to? The following picture, from your above source (thanks MADJGNLAW) shows a manhole at the Caylee site.

http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/021809remainsfoundOCSOpictures_set4/1/lg/196443.htm

Perhaps the rising water in August allowed the bag to escape through a faulty piping system and that is why KC was in so much shock when it was found. She just wasn't expecting that to happen.

Just a crazy theory perhaps.

EXCELLENT thought! My God! What if she did this??? And you're right. It sure would explain her "episode" the day the remains were found!

Thanks!

 

[OneLostGrl]

Snipped

Sorry I was so late seeing your question - oh yes, our kitteh is named after a great poster here on WS and is known as:

Hercat Purriot

omg! My cat is named after a poster here too! Kagey Karen.