Silver Alert CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 #15 *ARRESTS*

[bubby girl]

I think he’s going to run to Greece

i think he will go to turkey- seriously...

 

[afitzy]

FD had regular joint custody of the children for almost the entire time of the divorce action except the last 2 months .

I would have to go back to the documents to double check the exact timing of each of the various custody arrangements but my recollection is that in 2018 FD did not see his children at all except for 2 months of supervised visitation after Judge Heller ruled that he had engaged the children to lie on his behalf on various issues including MT and her daughter being at 4Jx.

FD was required to go to therapy as he didn't understand why his engaging the children to lie on his behalf was psychologically damaging to the children. It is unclear whether the therapy had any impact on FD or whether he understood the horrible position he was placing his children in by asking them to lie on his behalf.

If I were to put a tag on this period of time I would call it, "FD Knows Best"! FD wanted his children to be in one happy family with MT and her daughter at 4Jx EVEN THOUGH the Family Court said NO.

It was stunning to me that he disregarded the formal court orders on this issue of MT and her daughter. But the more I think about the situation I really wonder why MT and her daughter would choose to be at 4Jx when the Dulos children were there as it was a known violation of court orders?

I have to think that MT knew that she was not to have contact with the Dulos children, but she persisted. Why? MT could have easily left on the weekends when the children were visiting but that doesn't appear to be what happened.

The more I think about all the issues associated with this dynamic the more twisted it becomes! MT as a mother you would think would be sensitive to the issues of Dulos children interaction with her while the divorce battle was ongoing and the custody situation was evolving.

Did we see any sensitivity or caring about the mental well being of the Dulos children from MT? Nope. IMO this is about as unfeeling and uncaring as anything we have seen from FD. MT simply didn't care about the court orders and neither did FD. MT was front and center during the children's visits and Lady of 4JX when the Dulos children came to visit. How confusing and upsetting this must have been for children that had no way of understanding exactly what was happening.

It was only after this long period of time with no visits that the supervised visits were put in place.

I think in one of the prior threads someone summarized the various changes to the custody arrangements. There were more than a few changes to the arrangements over time but I don't recall a period of what I would consider the standard dropping off/picking up children at pre established times and with a standard schdule as FD was unable to follow any standard schedule. For a period of time FD was not allowed to speak to his children on the phone and then he had phone rights with the children but they had to be supervised. Then there was the issue of speaking Greek as supposedly this was used to circumvent the supervisors understanding what was being said. So then the court had to intervene to prohibit speaking any languages that the supervisor didn't understand.

We also saw the issue early in the divorce case where FD had weekend children's visit and instead took off to CA for some event/party and left the children with his sister (not court approved caretaker) without telling JD or the GAL. The sister took the children to the ski pond and one of them got lost for a period of time and JD only found out about the situation after the fact.

In short, the custody situation with FD truly sounded horrific as there seemed to be an inability of his part to follow instructions and rules and comply with basic scheduling protocols and the behavior of FD and MT during the divorce period was consistently defiant of any/all court orders.

 

[oceancalling]

Re: Jury's: I have personally recently postponed 2 jury requests. Why? Because I simply and legitamitely do not have the availability they need. I very much want to serve! I have made arrangement with my county to be available in September.
I do not live in CT.

Who knows if I will be/would have been selected.

It makes me wonder, who are those that are available to serve and is that fact that they are available in and of itself lending to a certain type of juror? (i.e. Casey Anthony jurors)

I mean no offense to those who have served. I just wonder if juror availability plays a role in what type of people will be more likely to be swayed by 'reasonable doubt'?

Just an interesting thought.

Casey Anthony had a death qualified jury and many people believe that was the State's first mistake. Jury selection is an art and often, the State does an absolutely miserable job of it (through no fault of its own). Defense counsel, on the other hand, spends lots and lots of time on this aspect of the trial. The jury selection experts in Anthony, and there were more than one, were truly some of the best in the country.

I am not worried about the forensics here and or the lack of a body. I believe that, from the beginning, LE knew it had a murder on its hands and acted accordingly. That belief leads me to the conclusion that this investigation has been tightly and professionally conducted.

I am not worried FP's expertise. He has made a LOT of stupid mistakes, like the way he has handled his own PR. Is she a Gone Girl? Has she somehow committed a "revenge suicide" and managed to remove (AND HIDE) her own body in the woods? Does he FD have an alibi or not? Is his client even worried that the mother of his children has been missing for two months? His narrative is a mess. His pleadings are competent, but not outstanding.

What does worry me is that FP will reach out to other experienced lawyers from the national legal community. This is precisely what happened in the Anthony case. Baez himself was no powerhouse-he did not even have the experience to try the case without co-counsel- but he was very shrewd. Behind the scenes, he solicited some of the best lawyers in the state, a PR team, multiple jury selection experts, mitigations specialists, psychologists and much, much, more. And all of them worked FOR FREE! The State was way outgunned.

As I watch NP, it appears to me that he is really, really loving the spotlight. He views this case as his opportunity to make a national name for himself. While NP may be known in the area, his reputation is regional. He is not going to let go of this claim to greater fame, and will be looking for help wherever he can get it. My concern is that others will come to his "rescue" and the fight will no longer be fair. McKenna is the best indication this may be happening.

Conventional wisdom is that the State has more resources than the accused; this is usually true. In high profile cases, though, the opposite is often the case. State prosecutors are often overworked, with a grueling caseload. Their offices also have limited budgets, as do the small LE agencies investigating this crime. If the feds could somehow be involved, it would set my mind at ease. They spend whatever amount of money is necessary to get the job done ,and their prosecutors/staff are the very best of the best.

Don't get me wrong- it sounds like this prosecutor is very respected and experienced. I hope he is able to spend whatever funds are necessary to see the guilty party is brought to justice. Perhaps the financial crimes will give the FBI the opportunity to provide critical resources to the investigation. Of course, the feds can also indict FD if federal financial crimes have occurred. I don't care how it happens, so long as the guilty party is held responsible for taking this mother from her children. I hope that all necessary resources are being expended in this investigation without regard to the financial burdens it imposes.

 

[andalso]

Casey Anthony had a death qualified jury and many people believe that was the State's first mistake. Jury selection is an art and often, the State does an absolutely miserable job of it (through no fault of its own). Defense counsel, on the other hand, spends lots and lots of time on this aspect of the trial. The jury selection experts in Anthony, and there were more than one, were truly some of the best in the country.

I am not worried about the forensics here and or the lack of a body. I believe that, from the beginning, LE knew it had a murder on its hands and acted accordingly. That belief leads me to the conclusion that this investigation has been tightly and professionally conducted.

I am not worried FP's expertise. He has made a LOT of stupid mistakes, like the way he has handled his own PR. Is she a Gone Girl? Has she somehow committed a "revenge suicide" and managed to remove (AND HIDE) her own body in the woods? Does he FD have an alibi or not? Is his client even worried that the mother of his children has been missing for two months? His narrative is a mess. His pleadings are competent, but not outstanding.

What does worry me is that FP will reach out to other experienced lawyers from the national legal community. This is precisely what happened in the Anthony case. Baez himself was no powerhouse-he did not even have the experience to try the case without co-counsel- but he was very shrewd. Behind the scenes, he solicited some of the best lawyers in the state, a PR team, multiple jury selection experts, mitigations specialists, psychologists and much, much, more. And all of them worked FOR FREE! The State was way outgunned.

As I watch NP, it appears to me that he is really, really loving the spotlight. He views this case as his opportunity to make a national name for himself. While NP may be known in the area, his reputation is regional. He is not going to let go of this claim to greater fame, and will be looking for help wherever he can get it. My concern is that others will come to his "rescue" and the fight will no longer be fair. McKenna is the best indication this may be happening.

Conventional wisdom is that the State has more resources than the accused; this is usually true. In high profile cases, though, the opposite is often the case. State prosecutors are often overworked, with a grueling caseload. Their offices also have limited budgets, as do the small LE agencies investigating this crime. If the feds could somehow be involved, it would set my mind at ease. They spend whatever amount of money is necessary to get the job done ,and their prosecutors/staff are the very best of the best.

Don't get me wrong- it sounds like this prosecutor is very respected and experienced. I hope he is able to spend whatever funds are necessary to see the guilty party is brought to justice. Perhaps the financial crimes will give the FBI the opportunity to provide critical resources to the investigation. Of course, the feds can also indict FD if federal financial crimes have occurred. I don't care how it happens, so long as the guilty party is held responsible for taking this mother from her children. I hope that all necessary resources are being expended in this investigation without regard to the financial burdens it imposes.

Thank you for this well thought out response! I had forgotten about the death qualified juried in the CA case. I have conveniently forgotten a lot about the CA case even though I followed it here very closely! I was so disgusted by the whole charade.
I feel that way again.
This is not what justice should look like.

Something in the system is very broken when a 'gone girl' defense can be put forward in the media and have traction.

5 children.

5 children that have to endure this drivel.

It is heartless.

Cruel.

And yet this type of tactic worked in the CA case.

I am going to hope/suggest LE has everything they need to convict FD.

 

[MollyDDD]

Deleted by me; I have no idea how I managed to combine so many quotes and posts in so many confusing ways!

Been there, done that.

 

[CuriousCat9]

I ran across this article, not sure if it’s already been posted.

Dulos case: attorneys spar over whether Michelle Troconis should give deposition

 

[afitzy]

I ran across this article, not sure if it’s already been posted.

Dulos case: attorneys spar over whether Michelle Troconis should give deposition

@CuriousCat9 Thank you for posting this very interesting information. It hasn't been posted yet. Looks like MT Atty Bowman doesn't want her called to testify in the GF Civil case! Mmmm. So, MT will take the 5th. Mmm. We saw how effective taking the 5th was for FD in Family Court so wonder what it will mean in the civil litigation?

Paging the no doubt very exhausted @gitana1! Would appreciate your read on these new documents in the civil case relating the MT being deposed for the civil litigation with GF.

Was this orchestrated by the State with the cooperation of GF atty's? Would love to be a fly on the wall for this deposition of MT!

Here is link to case documents from the above article:
Motion for Emergency Hearing

 

[Bulldogs2]

Totally agree.

But of all the comments on the 26 CDs, I am scratching my head as to him bringing up MT in Farmington at 10 am? Does he think that people are stupid enough to believe that just because MT was in Farmington at 10 am that some wacky inference can be drawn to say that FD was in Farmington at 10 am and that MT is well positioned to provide an alibi for FD?

These comments from Pattis are simply not worth spending time on IMO and I sincerely hope some Judge that has influence on this case can slap a gag on Pattis/all professionals associated with the case soon, as irresponsible statements such as these made to a public not closely following the case are in nobodys best interest for an eventual fair trial IMO.

At one time I thought MT was returning a purse left behind to a friend around that time . Now she’s at a store. Then later she’s on Albany ave. She sure gets around. I think he wants to confuse potential jury pool to cast doubt.

 

[Bulldogs2]

He demonstrated that he was unable to put the needs of his children above his own, he was alienating them and making them lie for him, which is emotional abuse, he was violating court orders issued to protect the kids, like not having them around his mistress and he lied to the court.

All of this likely allowed the judge to reexamine past allegations and provided more credibility to those allegations when they were just he said she said allegations at the outset.

Those included that he was abusive to the kids forcing them to practice in grueling trianing sessions that lasted 8-10 hours, in order to make them little stars, that his kids were scared of him, that he had one drive a car on the open highway, that he dictated to his wife where she would live and when with the kids post-separation and that she and the kids would have to share their home with MT and MT's daughter and that he could access her mother's home whenever he wanted and that he chased her and threatened to kill his wife, among others.

Earlier we had posts blaming the family law judge for not issuing harsh enough orders against FD, essentially allowing him to murder her.

Now it's that her orders were too harsh prompting him to lose it and kill his wife.

Poor judge can't win.

IMO the orders were appropriate and well reasoned under the circumstances and everything the judge has done has been centered on the best interests of the kids.

To me it's clear this man murdered his wife. He's a murderer. And it was calculated, cold and evilly planned well in advance, IMO. He had no legitimate reason to be at her house the day she disappeared. I don't think they were even supposed to communicate directly.

The only ones to blame for this are the ones who murdered Jennifer and any accomplices. Not the family court.

With you gitana.

 

[Bulldogs2]

You know I guess some people do believe that nonsense. It doesn't make sense to me. It always reminds me of Saddam Hussein delusionally and arrogantly standing there proclaiming that the streets would run red with the blood of Americans, as his nation was bombed to smithereens by American planes.

But I guess some people buy the bluster?

Unfortunately some do...and NP hopes they will be in the jury pool

 

[Bulldogs2]

"Pattis Patter". I like that!

Lol! Verbal diarrhea

 

[Bulldogs2]

I am pretty sure she lives with the PI. Yes the same one who is now investigating for FD.

Now THAT is gross.

 

[Bulldogs2]

I would have to go back to the documents to double check the exact timing of each of the various custody arrangements but my recollection is that in 2018 FD did not see his children at all except for 2 months of supervised visitation after Judge Heller ruled that he had engaged the children to lie on his behalf on various issues including MT and her daughter being at 4Jx.

FD was required to go to therapy as he didn't understand why his engaging the children to lie on his behalf was psychologically damaging to the children. It is unclear whether the therapy had any impact on FD or whether he understood the horrible position he was placing his children in by asking them to lie on his behalf.

If I were to put a tag on this period of time I would call it, "FD Knows Best"! FD wanted his children to be in one happy family with MT and her daughter at 4Jx EVEN THOUGH the Family Court said NO.

It was stunning to me that he disregarded the formal court orders on this issue of MT and her daughter. But the more I think about the situation I really wonder why MT and her daughter would choose to be at 4Jx when the Dulos children were there as it was a known violation of court orders?

I have to think that MT knew that she was not to have contact with the Dulos children, but she persisted. Why? MT could have easily left on the weekends when the children were visiting but that doesn't appear to be what happened.

The more I think about all the issues associated with this dynamic the more twisted it becomes! MT as a mother you would think would be sensitive to the issues of Dulos children interaction with her while the divorce battle was ongoing and the custody situation was evolving.

Did we see any sensitivity or caring about the mental well being of the Dulos children from MT? Nope. IMO this is about as unfeeling and uncaring as anything we have seen from FD. MT simply didn't care about the court orders and neither did FD. MT was front and center during the children's visits and Lady of 4JX when the Dulos children came to visit. How confusing and upsetting this must have been for children that had no way of understanding exactly what was happening.

It was only after this long period of time with no visits that the supervised visits were put in place.

I think in one of the prior threads someone summarized the various changes to the custody arrangements. There were more than a few changes to the arrangements over time but I don't recall a period of what I would consider the standard dropping off/picking up children at pre established times and with a standard schdule as FD was unable to follow any standard schedule. For a period of time FD was not allowed to speak to his children on the phone and then he had phone rights with the children but they had to be supervised. Then there was the issue of speaking Greek as supposedly this was used to circumvent the supervisors understanding what was being said. So then the court had to intervene to prohibit speaking any languages that the supervisor didn't understand.

We also saw the issue early in the divorce case where FD had weekend children's visit and instead took off to CA for some event/party and left the children with his sister (not court approved caretaker) without telling JD or the GAL. The sister took the children to the ski pond and one of them got lost for a period of time and JD only found out about the situation after the fact.

In short, the custody situation with FD truly sounded horrific as there seemed to be an inability of his part to follow instructions and rules and comply with basic scheduling protocols and the behavior of FD and MT during the divorce period was consistently defiant of any/all court orders.

Thanks for clearing the custody stuff up. I guess the bottom line is that judge Heller really thinks something is wrong with FD and that e everything pointed to her supervising action. It takes a long time to sort the custody stuff out. I have a feeling he won’t walk though. People up this end in the Farmington valley are all talking about this too and have nothing but contempt for him. I think it could be possible that FD never told MT that the court stipulated that she not be there. And MT being who she is just moved in and took over without a care in the world.

 

[afitzy]

Thanks for clearing the custody stuff up. I guess the bottom line is that judge Heller really thinks something is wrong with FD and that e everything pointed to her supervising action. It takes a long time to sort the custody stuff out. I have a feeling he won’t walk though. People up this end in the Farmington valley are all talking about this too and have nothing but contempt for him. I think it could be possible that FD never told MT that the court stipulated that she not be there. And MT being who she is just moved in and took over without a care in the world.

I'd like to believe that MT didn't know about the court order for no contact. But I find it hard to believe this was the case. Can you imagine living with a character like FD, emotional, probably delusional at times and no doubt in raging horrible moods after court and MT not knowing that the court said she was to have no contact with the children? Its an interesting question for @gitana1 about whether MT herself might have received formal notification from the court that she and her daughter were not to have contact with the Dulos children? IDK the answer to this question.

I also think that one of the main reasons FD interjected MT into the entire situation was to enrage and humilate JD. MT was the perfect tool to torment and torture JD and what is so completely pathetic is that MT wasn't smart enough to see it even after nearly 3 years. So much for the value of her degree in psychology and the fact that her mother was previously a psychologist before losing her licence. Oh the power of love....probably not!

But I very much believe that the same way MT was reported by the local press to be making zero attempt to hide the adulterous affair with FD from JD, she made zero attempt to comply with the court order because it was a way to show loyalty to FD and to also hurt JD---a kind of emotional quick jab to the heart of JD with a knife daily double!

In all the articles I've read so far about MT, I get the sense that MT doesn't care about anyone else other than herself or where her next rush of adrenaline is going to come from. I also certainly think she demonstrated zero care for the mental health and well being of her daughter by subjecting her to living in a house with a volatile person like FD who just happened to be going through a very dificult divorce. MT certainly gave zero care to the mental health and well being on the 5 Dulos children and IMO this was despicable/uncaring/inhuman along with many other words that probably aren't permitted on WS!

Seeing what MT put her daughter through in the days following the arrest with all the media speculation I truly wonder if the daughters baby daddy were aware of the situation that a young girl was being placed in? Wouldn't it be ironic if MT lost custody of her own daughter due to her lack of care during the period surrounding the arrest? I just hope the baby daddy stays on top of the litigation situation and is well equipped to take legal action to protect his daughter as given what we know about the Arrezza/Troconis clan (Medicare fraud and lost licence in FL by MT mother) its unlikely that they would be well placed to take adequate care of the daughter by any court.

The other symbolic move made by MT and probably orchestrated by FD was her moving into 4JX almost immediately after JD left with the children. You have to wonder what self respecting female would move herself and her child into a house 1/2 owned and almost completely paid for using the Farber money? The entire situation was a farce IMO but it shows us so much of who MT is as a human being and what her values/priorities/morals might be. When we read the story of the entire Troconis clan coming to Farmington for Easter (described in the Family Court documents) all I could think about is why would the family support the relationship for 3 years to someone that it turns out was a deadbeat dad and business fraud IMO? Didn't they want better for their daughter? Guess not.

Just writing about all the issues surrounding MT has me scratching my head and thinking that in many respects she sounds as emotionally and morally bankrupt and fundamentally despicable as FD, and that is saying something!
MOO

 

[gitana1]

I'd like to believe that MT didn't know about the court order for no contact. But I find it hard to believe this was the case. Can you imagine living with a character like FD, emotional, probably delusional at times and no doubt in raging horrible moods after court and MT not knowing that the court said she was to have no contact with the children? Its an interesting question for @gitana1 about whether MT herself might have received formal notification from the court that she and her daughter were not to have contact with the Dulos children? IDK the answer to this question.

I also think that one of the main reasons FD interjected MT into the entire situation was to enrage and humilate JD. MT was the perfect tool to torment and torture JD and what is so completely pathetic is that MT wasn't smart enough to see it even after nearly 3 years. So much for the value of her degree in psychology and the fact that her mother was previously a psychologist before losing her licence. Oh the power of love....probably not!

But I very much believe that the same way MT was reported by the local press to be making zero attempt to hide the adulterous affair with FD from JD, she made zero attempt to comply with the court order because it was a way to show loyalty to FD and to also hurt JD---a kind of emotional quick jab to the heart of JD with a knife daily double!

In all the articles I've read so far about MT, I get the sense that MT doesn't care about anyone else other than herself or where her next rush of adrenaline is going to come from. I also certainly think she demonstrated zero care for the mental health and well being of her daughter by subjecting her to living in a house with a volatile person like FD who just happened to be going through a very dificult divorce. MT certainly gave zero care to the mental health and well being on the 5 Dulos children and IMO this was despicable/uncaring/inhuman along with many other words that probably aren't permitted on WS!

Seeing what MT put her daughter through in the days following the arrest with all the media speculation I truly wonder if the daughters baby daddy were aware of the situation that a young girl was being placed in? Wouldn't it be ironic if MT lost custody of her own daughter due to her lack of care during the period surrounding the arrest? I just hope the baby daddy stays on top of the litigation situation and is well equipped to take legal action to protect his daughter as given what we know about the Arrezza/Troconis clan (Medicare fraud and lost licence in FL by MT mother) its unlikely that they would be well placed to take adequate care of the daughter by any court.

The other symbolic move made by MT and probably orchestrated by FD was her moving into 4JX almost immediately after JD left with the children. You have to wonder what self respecting female would move herself and her child into a house 1/2 owned and almost completely paid for using the Farber money? The entire situation was a farce IMO but it shows us so much of who MT is as a human being and what her values/priorities/morals might be. When we read the story of the entire Troconis clan coming to Farmington for Easter (described in the Family Court documents) all I could think about is why would the family support the relationship for 3 years to someone that it turns out was a deadbeat dad and business fraud IMO? Didn't they want better for their daughter? Guess not.

Just writing about all the issues surrounding MT has me scratching my head and thinking that in many respects she sounds as emotionally and morally bankrupt and fundamentally despicable as FD, and that is saying something!
MOO

The court doesn't have jurisdiction over her so she would not be formally notified. I'm sure he told her though.

And I agree with your assessment of her.

 

[Tink56]

I ran across this article, not sure if it’s already been posted.

Dulos case: attorneys spar over whether Michelle Troconis should give deposition

Don't believe this has been posted before...Thank you finding and posting it!

Between the criminal, civil, and family aspects of this legal web, the logistics are staggering. It seems logical that MT could sit for the deposition and invoke her 5th Amendment rights if necessary, but I'm suspect the criminal case against her might prevent her from responding to many of the questions. However, simple questions related to how many homes FD sold while she was employed by FoRe Group shouldn't impact her criminal charges, right??????

It will be interesting to see if there is a hearing on the deposition.

 

[HopeForTheBest]

The court doesn't have jurisdiction over her so she would not be formally notified. I'm sure he told her though.

And I agree with your assessment of her.

I bet JD made it known to her through lawyers or by telling FD about it in the hearing of MT. Or, the guardian saying it, or kids being kids, one of them saying something about it like, “But, Dad, she’s not supposed to be here”—and then worrying and feeling terrible for being stuck in such a hard situation by FD knowingly disregarding the rules.

 

[Tink56]

I bet JD made it known to her through lawyers or by telling FD about it in the hearing of MT. Or, the guardian saying it, or kids being kids, one of them saying something about it like, “But, Dad, she’s not supposed to be here”—and then worrying and feeling terrible for being stuck in such a hard situation by FD knowingly disregarding the rules.

Didn't JD hire a PI to verify that MT (and her daughter?) were present when the Dulos children were with FD? I think I read that somewhere...perhaps before the court records were sealed.

 

[sds71]

185.00 07/26/2019 P MOTION FOR ORDER

OF EMERGENGY HEARING REGARDING TROCONIS DEPOSITION
http://civilinquiry.jud.ct.gov/DocumentInquiry/DocumentInquiry.aspx?DocumentNo=17425945

 

[Bulldogs2]

Yes I believe she did