DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #15

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I've thought for a while that the theories implicating JW involved too many leaps of faith. I understand why they took a good look at him initially but its time to move on.

This was a freaky, weird situation for everyone involved. There's no way to assume how a person would typically act because there's nothing typical about it. Why was the employee stuffing money in his pockets? Everything gets put under a microscope but its a mistake to make assumptions.

ITA with your whole post. I will eat my hat if JW is involved but every one of the theories I've seen posted about his involvement has just struck me as a bit over the top/reaching/not very likely. I know everyone's just hoping to figure this thing out so I of course wouldn't blame anyone for theorizing every possibility but all the suspicion of JW really seems unfounded at this point.

It was a really tragic and unexpected thing that happened. I feel strongly that one can never predict how one reacts in strange, horrible situations and it's much easier to look at a situation that already happened and say 'well, that was weird' or 'why'd he do that?' when in the moment you wouldn't think twice about something, everything even remotely related to the tragic event becomes suspicious when the outcome is as grisly as this was.
 
It's a little messed up to imply that the people thinking JW was involved were reaching or being over the top. When you lie, you lose credibility. You become suspicious. Maybe I am just an honest person but if I know someone lies alot, I don't trust them. You don't get the benefit of the doubt, IMO. IMO , this is just my opinion.
 
I've seen just a few comments here about the CNN report last night. I plan to watch it tonight. Anything particularly interesting to listen out for? Did they mention SS's voicemails?
 
It's a little messed up to imply that the people thinking JW was involved were reaching or being over the top. When you lie, you lose credibility. You become suspicious. Maybe I am just an honest person but if I know someone lies alot, I don't trust them. You don't get the benefit of the doubt, IMO. IMO , this is just my opinion.

I believe IMHO that some folks thought all the JW angles proposed may have been
O/T. When you are given 5 pieces of a puzzle to a 35 piece total puzzle- some played those pieces overtime. It's no reflection on anyone- just a collective momentum that I noticed.
JMO


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It's a little messed up to imply that the people thinking JW was involved were reaching or being over the top. When you lie, you lose credibility. You become suspicious. Maybe I am just an honest person but if I know someone lies alot, I don't trust them. You don't get the benefit of the doubt, IMO. IMO , this is just my opinion.

i'm sorry...i suppose my post didn't come across the way I meant it too. I just want to explain that I really don't think that the thoughts of people putting forth theories about JW are 'reaching' or 'over the top.' In fact, I think that it made a lot of sense in the beginning of this case to suspect JW because of his lying and because of his close connection to the case. I simply meant that since it has been what 6 weeks since this crime and we have heard nothing further to indicate that LE believes JW was involved, the theories put forth earlier about JW only now seem (to me, anyway) 'reaching or over the top.'

I was always only talking about the theories themselves when looking at the case now on June 24 with no solid information implicating JW, not the people theorizing those things based on the very little info we have. I can certainly see why people are suspicious and trying to put forth any reasonable theory to try to figure this case out and I really appreciate the thoughtful discussion here and all of the theories that everyone here has contributed have provided good angles for looking at the case. I'm sorry to have implied otherwise.
 
I've seen just a few comments here about the CNN report last night. I plan to watch it tonight. Anything particularly interesting to listen out for? Did they mention SS's voicemails?

Yes, they mentioned the voicemail. They actually played it. IMO, the report didn't go into much more than we already know.
 
I've thought for a while that the theories implicating JW involved too many leaps of faith. I understand why they took a good look at him initially but its time to move on.

This was a freaky, weird situation for everyone involved. There's no way to assume how a person would typically act because there's nothing typical about it. Why was the employee stuffing money in his pockets? Everything gets put under a microscope but its a mistake to make assumptions.
And having said that, we can't assume he is innocent.
 
Considering how much incorrect information that CNN has reported about this case, might someone explain to me why we should suddenly find information reported about this case by CNN to be credible?

Didn't the LE positivity ID DW as the perp running from the Porsche? In last nights CNN special it was speculated that it could have been one of DW's co-conspirators.
 
I don't expect to hear MPD make an announcement clearing JW. They just don't comment much on their cases, typically. In a way, imo, it was a statement with the release of the SW info. They could have kept that sealed.

LE also released SWs on the Chevy Cruze and Ameritech truck. I think the defense filed a motion to release some docs. I noticed the SWs were released at the same time as the motion was withdrawn. Could be coincidence. I can't predict anything based on LE's actions. I'm sure it's a calculated plan, but I give up on figuring it out! Patience is not one of my virtues.
 
I've thought for a while that the theories implicating JW involved too many leaps of faith. I understand why they took a good look at him initially but its time to move on.

This was a freaky, weird situation for everyone involved. There's no way to assume how a person would typically act because there's nothing typical about it. Why was the employee stuffing money in his pockets? Everything gets put under a microscope but its a mistake to make assumptions.


I think one of the main problems is that JW's lies didn't make sense. So we are left trying to figure out why someone would lie in this situation, what was he trying to hide that was more important than the torture-murders of four people, and what did he say that was actually true? I still have a hard time believing the accountant stuffed 4 bundles of cash in his pocket, then pulled them out and put them in JW's bag. But that was the last story, so we're led to believe, the most accurate? IDK.

Also, those of us who spent a fair amount of time on JW's and DW's SM pages (and their friends) before they were taken down, probably have a different perspective than those who didn't. It's impossible to explain the sheer narcissism he exhibited over the last several years. Coupled with the lies he told before this investigation (during interviews at Autobahn, to Skip Barber racing, and even on his websites) he comes off as someone who values style over substance; enjoys the excitement of starting things, but can't stick with them; and is lacking in any objective understanding of his place in the "racing world" and his chances of ever moving beyond hobbyist. It's sad really. Except that his lack of perspective contributed to his lack of professionalism, which he then broadcast for anyone to see - he exposed the S family, who was helping him out by giving him a job - to prying eyes. The S family lived well, but rather privately. It should have been their decision how much of their stuff and lives was made public. He objectified them by not considering how they would feel about having photos of the interiors of their cars and business transactions shared with anyone that JW's SM and text messages could reach. That is not the behavior of someone who really cares about people.

If JW is completely uninvolved in this crime, then he made a serious miscalculation. He could have sold his exclusive story to an outlet like another player, and funded his racing for years to come. But that would mean exposing all his previous lies, the ones he told to construct his Racer_Jordan persona. We know he's not shy. We know he has no problem using his proximity to others to raise his own profile. So why the radio silence?

He missed his chance to get his "story" out there to an international audience - something he has been trying to do for the last several years with Race Haus, J.T. Wallace Racing, #RacerGit, broke Racers Club, etc... Instead, the only information out there makes him look bad. Forget racing - who would even hire him to run errands for them now?

I'm on the fence about his involvement in the crime. Crazier things have happened. But I do know he's a liar and a petit thief, whose Maryland traffic violation is the only "crime" I know he's incurred. If you go back to DW's record, you'll see his criminal career started out exactly the same way, although he got there a couple of years earlier. If JW is not involved, this could be the best thing that ever happened to him - his trajectory was going nowhere fast. His brush with real criminals might scare him out of his fantasy world, so he can grow up, acquire some ethics and skills and build a productive life.
JMO
 
I've seen just a few comments here about the CNN report last night. I plan to watch it tonight. Anything particularly interesting to listen out for? Did they mention SS's voicemails?

Time is better spent here IMO. Regurgitated info from earlier reports, some of it inaccurate. I've learned way more here at WS and doing my own research than any MSM, including the 20/20 reports.
 
i'm sorry...i suppose my post didn't come across the way I meant it too. I just want to explain that I really don't think that the thoughts of people putting forth theories about JW are 'reaching' or 'over the top.' In fact, I think that it made a lot of sense in the beginning of this case to suspect JW because of his lying and because of his close connection to the case. I simply meant that since it has been what 6 weeks since this crime and we have heard nothing further to indicate that LE believes JW was involved, the theories put forth earlier about JW only now seem (to me, anyway) 'reaching or over the top.'

I was always only talking about the theories themselves when looking at the case now on June 24 with no solid information implicating JW, not the people theorizing those things based on the very little info we have. I can certainly see why people are suspicious and trying to put forth any reasonable theory to try to figure this case out and I really appreciate the thoughtful discussion here and all of the theories that everyone here has contributed have provided good angles for looking at the case. I'm sorry to have implied otherwise.

I understood what you meant and didn't take offense. I'm an early-adopter of JW's involvement. The Mosler registration sealed it for me. Having said that, I keep an open mind and can see how everything we've learned could be coincidence.

I think we should be careful about assuming that because no other info has been released, or an arrest hasn't been made, that a WSIP (Web Sleuths-Interesting Person -- just made that up) has been cleared. LE has never backed away from their claim that someone else was involved. They haven't arrested anyone besides DW. I believe they still have someone in their sites, they are still building their case and they are watching their POIs day and night.

Perhaps LE floated JW out there (with his cooperation?) to take the heat off their real suspects. IDK. I agree with Observation. We have 5 pieces of the puzzle, so we can't even tell what the picture is or do the border! But I can't help fiddling with the pieces, hoping some of them will fit together.

Now I'm really going to go clean my house and reward myself with more WS later. :)
 
This is my first post here. I had trouble finding the latest place to post ie most recent. I am not sure where to post this or if this specifically been addressed. I just joined this excellent group. The Daily Mail UK last week released Savvas' voicemail to Gutierrez the long time housekeeper. In this voicemail he states Vera decided to stay ...

Anyway my 2 cents on this is Wint started this before 3pm when Vera was scheduled to go home. Vera and Phillip were probably alone so more easily overtaken. I remember some article stating Amy was called home quickly cause Phillip was sick, (the rouse to get Amy home)... hence the Porsche parked on the street.

I read in another place that Amy called Savvas at the martial arts studio stating she was going out and he needed to come home and watch Phillip. So that is how Wint got Savvas home.

This could all be possible even with Wint acting alone. He ate the pizza in the room that held Savvas, Amy and Vera.

We know Phillip was held in his room, alone, which I believe was the room next to wear the adults were held.

Go listen to this second recording just released.*Close*youreyes*and listen carefully to Phillip in the background (probably alone in his room cause he is not stopped from shouting out) ...

I think Wint is holding the phone to Savvas mouth as he leaves the voicemail for Gutierrez. Listen as Savvas states "Amy is in bed ...." Phillip screaming "No she isn't".

This breaks my heart that this voicemail message was listened to too late and not acted on. I can't stop weeping about what horror this boy*

This is haunting me.

I posted my concerns on a different site to no avail. Forgive me if this is not how to get involved on Websleuths.

Thank you.



I am reposting this. I tried to go back through the first 13 threads on this. I wasn't sure if anyone else heard these words. I clearly hear PS say No she isn't ... when SS is leaving voicemail to say AS is sick in bed. Anyone else hear this?

I will attempt to link. Thanks again.
 
This is my first post here. I had trouble finding the latest place to post ie most recent. I am not sure where to post this or if this specifically been addressed. I just joined this excellent group. The Daily Mail UK last week released Savvas' voicemail to Gutierrez the long time housekeeper. In this voicemail he states Vera decided to stay ...

Anyway my 2 cents on this is Wint started this before 3pm when Vera was scheduled to go home. Vera and Phillip were probably alone so more easily overtaken. I remember some article stating Amy was called home quickly cause Phillip was sick, (the rouse to get Amy home)... hence the Porsche parked on the street.

I read in another place that Amy called Savvas at the martial arts studio stating she was going out and he needed to come home and watch Phillip. So that is how Wint got Savvas home.

This could all be possible even with Wint acting alone. He ate the pizza in the room that held Savvas, Amy and Vera.

We know Phillip was held in his room, alone, which I believe was the room next to wear the adults were held.

Go listen to this second recording just released.*Close*youreyes*and listen carefully to Phillip in the background (probably alone in his room cause he is not stopped from shouting out) ...

I think Wint is holding the phone to Savvas mouth as he leaves the voicemail for Gutierrez. Listen as Savvas states "Amy is in bed ...." Phillip screaming "No she isn't".

This breaks my heart that this voicemail message was listened to too late and not acted on. I can't stop weeping about what horror this boy*

This is haunting me.

I posted my concerns on a different site to no avail. Forgive me if this is not how to get involved on Websleuths.

Thank you.



I am reposting this. I tried to go back through the first 13 threads on this. I wasn't sure if anyone else heard these words. I clearly hear PS say No she isn't ... when SS is leaving voicemail to say AS is sick in bed. Anyone else hear this?

I will attempt to link. Thanks again.

I listened to the voicemail again with the volume on my phone turned up all the way. I just can't make it out. It sounds like one syllable. If it is PS, it makes me think he wasn't in his room at that point. I imagine he was silenced and then moved to his room to keep from yelling out again.

What about the other voicemail where SS refers to PS being sick? Is that still out there?

I think DW had a helper with him in the house. I have a strong feeling there were at least two of them to hold all four overnight.
 
Amy wasn't called home. It was SS who was called home, presumably by Amy, because Amy had to go out.
 
Didn't the LE positivity ID DW as the perp running from the Porsche? In last nights CNN special it was speculated that it could have been one of DW's co-conspirators.

Yes, Chief Lanier positively stated that it was Darron Wint in the video. Also CNN was correct that, it could have been his brother. In the arrest photos they have a facial likeness to one another. DW is described as 5' 7" and his brother as 6' 2". Also his brother has short hair as described by W3 in the SWs. It is difficult to assess height in the running video but in the arrest pictures, his brother's tall stature is obvious.
 
I understood what you meant and didn't take offense. I'm an early-adopter of JW's involvement. The Mosler registration sealed it for me. Having said that, I keep an open mind and can see how everything we've learned could be coincidence.

I think we should be careful about assuming that because no other info has been released, or an arrest hasn't been made, that a WSIP (Web Sleuths-Interesting Person -- just made that up) has been cleared. LE has never backed away from their claim that someone else was involved. They haven't arrested anyone besides DW. I believe they still have someone in their sites, they are still building their case and they are watching their POIs day and night.

Perhaps LE floated JW out there (with his cooperation?) to take the heat off their real suspects. IDK. I agree with Observation. We have 5 pieces of the puzzle, so we can't even tell what the picture is or do the border! But I can't help fiddling with the pieces, hoping some of them will fit together.

Now I'm really going to go clean my house and reward myself with more WS later. :)

Who is going to agree to be floated out there as a potential suspect in quadruple murder?
So if LE floated JW's name out there, I certainly don't think it was with his cooperation. I think they suspected him from the beginning, but their suspicion was false.
I don't think they can find any connection between JW and DW.
I also don't think they should have floated his name out there.
 
Amy wasn't called home. It was SS who was called home, presumably by Amy, because Amy had to go out.

It is pretty well confirmed that AS called SS and asked him to come home. However, and it IS speculation, it is thought that AS MAY have been called home on Wednesday afternoon in the 3pm time frame. The reason for this thought is that the Porsche was seen speeding/driving erratically through the neighborhood.
 
DW's brother (at least the one who was with DW when DW was arrested) is much taller than DW. The person who is running doesn't seem tall. LE could determine how tall the person was from that video. But I don't think it can be his brother based on height alone. They can also see how far the seat in the Porsche was to determine how tall the person who drove it was.

BBM: one of the biggest misnomers ever. I am quite short and not very wide. Every time I get out of the car, I take the seat back all the way. I always joke that if LE thinks I committed a crime and then they check the car seat, I will be cleared immediately by that line of thinking.
 
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