DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #18

[rkf]

If JW is involved, he and DW would have had to communicate before, during, and after the crime. LE certainly has all the applicable cell phone records, social media accounts, etc. If they found any communications, between JW and DW, or any of DW's close circle, I believe they would have arrested JW.

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LE knows DW had contact before and after the crime with someone who we can't discuss here, even handing off the loot, but that person hasn't been arrested, as far as we know. Do you think LE has investigated that other person and found him to be uninvolved in the crime, despite being caught with $20,000 of the ransom money?

At the end of the report linked below, McGinty says "Now the lead detective did testify that police have not offered Jordan Wallace any sort of a deal to avoid prosecution.” Assuming the defense asked the question, why would DW's attorneys want to know that? If JW is not involved in the case, why would LE offer him a deal and what would JW have to say that could implicate DW?

As much as I like to make assumptions, I don't think we can assume we know what LE knows. Since they stated again yesterday that they don't believe DW acted alone, they must have information that points to that conclusion that we don't have. If they have someone in mind, they haven't named that person as a suspect. If they think someone is involved who they haven't investigated yet, they haven't told us that either. The only way we know DW was involved in the crime is because of DNA. That's virtually worthless for fingering someone who had reason to be at the crime scenes. It would take a lot longer to build a case without forensic evidence.

There are plenty of cases where LE suspects someone, but doesn't arrest them until months or years after the crime. The Lyons sisters case just made an arrest after 40 years! I hope we don't have to wait that long for justice in this case.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...31d64c-2cc4-11e5-a5ea-cf74396e59ec_story.html

 

[facundo]

I agree. They have searched his car and belongings from that day, and his cell phone records for at least the day of the crime (and if IIRC, a few days before and some time after- sorry if this is a mistake) and still nothing. I mean, anything is possible, but to me this is a sign that LE isn't too interested in him as a suspect at this point.

The fact that the defense in yesterday's hearing kept trying to cast doubt on him with the same old information makes me think that they don't have anything newer on him. Also, I don't know what is allowed or not allowed to be said in these hearings, or what the defense would know at this point, but it was stated that there was a 3rd person's DNA found. Wouldn't someone say if it was, or wasn't, JW's? Would the defense call him out for not submitting DNA?

This was a preliminary hearing for only Darron Wint. There was nothing to be gained for the prosecutor to confuse the charges against Wint by discussing details of investigations of other persons. The absence of mentioning other persons, JW included, does not clear their names nor does it exclude them from future charges.

 

[BellaVita]

Thank you! I must consider the source, NG. She certainly added a lot of unnecessary information to the entire mix. Amy told NG to take Vera Wednesday if she needed her for the dojo opening, but NG said Vera wanted to work at the house. Unfortunately, Vera is not alive to hear her version of events.

It is interesting that LE is saying both Savvas and Vera were strangled to death. Death by strangulation is even more personal than stabbing IMO. It takes a loooooonggg time to strangle someone. Maybe LE thinks that is why more than Wint was involved in holding the family hostage? Two strangled, two stabbed/blunt force trauma = 2 different killers.

I've been saying this for weeks. I feel there was a pact between 2 or more killers and each used their own favorite way of killing/inflicting harm. If both/and/or/three of them participated in the bodily harm, it would be more unlikely they'd rat each other out. JMO>

 

[Skigirl]

I hate to point back at my own posts...but did anyone else notice the guy in the foreground of the "burning car" video that we saw a much longer clip of yesterday than had been previously released? Do you think the earlier part was released by accident? Or on purpose?

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I don't think there was a 'mastermind' or a boss and he was the one who messed it up. Why did he still have 30kplus when he was arrested? Why wouldn't the mastermind have had a way to get DW out of the neighborhood already? Or a way for DW to leave the crime scene besides the method that left a torched vehicle yards from his home?

We don't know the circumstances surrounding the car. The car was torched hours after the fire rather than the fire being something aligned with the start of the fire and fleeing the scene. Where the car was in those hours after the fire is one the mysteries of the case. The original plan may have been to steal the car to sell it, which I do for the circumstances surrounding the car strange that it was taken but not torched immediately. I do hope there are answers as to why that happened.

 

[katydid23]

I hate to point back at my own posts...but did anyone else notice the guy in the foreground of the "burning car" video that we saw a much longer clip of yesterday than had been previously released? Do you think the earlier part was released by accident? Or on purpose?

Is he wearing a suit? Could he just be a guy walking home and coming upon a burning vehicle and trying not to get involved?

 

[rkf]

I think DW 'planned' to barge into the 'rich ' people's house and come away with diamonds and gold and loads of cash. I am not sure if he planned to kill them, but I would guess probably so, since he was not wearing a mask, AFAIK.

The torture would have seemed unusual, if I had not already heard the vile death threats he made against his 8 yr old sister and against an INFANT. He threatened to stab an infant and bragged about how good he is with knives! And we know he stabbed a man in the neck previously, so he backs up his talk.

I think he needed people in the home so he could access the safes and turn off the alarm system. If no one was home he could not do either of those things.

I don't think there was a 'mastermind' or a boss and he was the one who messed it up. Why did he still have 30kplus when he was arrested? Why wouldn't the mastermind have had a way to get DW out of the neighborhood already? Or a way for DW to leave the crime scene besides the method that left a torched vehicle yards from his home?

I think he ordered pizza because he was hungry. Simple as that. He planned to burn the house down so he thought it wouldn't matter. Idiot.

I think "mastermind" isn't a very accurate description of whoever planned this crime. I don't think DW wore a mask, either, because I think he came in through the front door. I would assume the S family had a security system, but I wouldn't have assumed they had a safe. I don't think it's terribly common for people to have one of those giant safes at their house, unless they run a cash heavy business like a restaurant, where they might have to take home receipts before the bank opens. How do you think DW would know there was a safe? Or just a lucky guess on his part? Pretty insane that the safe would have been visible from the street if the garage door was open - especially if it's true that they left the garage doors open all the time. But, consider the source... I might have just answered my own question.

If DW hadn't set the house on fire, driving the Porsche away from the crime was a fine exit plan. The only reason LE was looking for the car is because someone noticed it was missing because of the fire. Whoever planned this crime, ahead of time or on the fly, obviously didn't think about how one aspect could affect another. Setting the house on fire to eliminate evidence - good idea. Doing it right before you take off in a stolen car - bad idea.

I know I'll get yelled at, and DW is a violent psychopath, but when I read about DW making those threats against children, I thought of it as posturing meant to scare the adults because nothing is more frightening than one's child being threatened. He may have meant it, but it's not necessary for him to have been really thinking about murdering children to make those kinds of threats in a rage. The people who got orders of protection all later let DW live with them, so it's hard to know how seriously they even took the threats. It's only because of what DW did to PS that I know he has the capacity and will to carry out that kind of violence against a child. Before that, I would have thought it was just more of his psycho-angry raging.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I am not sure how that would work. If JW brought that money to the home, KNOWING there was a crime in progress, any crime at all, even car theft, he would be an accessory to the ensuing murders. JMO

I don't think it would work but it could be what they consider their best shot. I think what they're really going for (or at least Hanover was) is a plea bargain.

 

[CrimeNeverPays]

Excellent points. I wish we knew. Has it been stated affirmatively how he received the news - in person at the dojo or by phone when he was elsewhere? I don't believe it's been stated where JW was after Lowe's, except that his phone pinged in VA around the time he learned of the fire. (Maybe that's a clue to how he heard about it? If so, where was he if not Lowe's or the dojo?) If the 11:54 call was SS asking him to come back to DC, and he received it and took off straight for DC after leaving Lowe's at noon, then I don't think he would have still been in Virginia at 1:15 or 1:30. He probably would have already been back at the house when the fire started. But it's my understanding that a reporter learned from a LE source that JW's phone pinged in Virginia around the time he learned about the fire. I haven't seen that info in any LE documents.

We still don't know what time JW got back to the house or how large a circumference the crime tape encircled. If you look at the map of the S house, it's hard to figure out where JW could have parked a block away that would have been taped off. Maybe he parked within a block of the house? But in that case, how would he have done that unless he got there before the firetrucks and LE arrived? By the time the news camera got there, the surrounding streets were pretty packed with official vehicles. WE know NG made it back to the house from VA while the fire was still burning, because we can see her on the news footage. I didn't see JW or his car in the footage, but that doesn't mean he wasn't there. All the streets around there have 2 hour parking unless the car has a residential parking permit. I was leaning toward JW leaving his car when he dropped off the money and driving one of the S cars to Chantilly since he might have expected to drive SS later in the day. But he would have risked a ticket if he left his car on the street all day.
View attachment 78504

That picture is too close, doesn't show enough to be able to figure. Can you get a picture that is not so close ??-- & where on that picture was the crime tape? That would help a lot.

 

[BellaVita]

I think they can ID His. I bet they have his fathers DNA on file from his LE career. If they match a primary DNA recovered from his car, they can compare it to his fathers and rule it in or out. IF they needed to. But I think they got a warrant for it or it was already given voluntarily. JMO

IDK. I'd be surprised if that was the case. What database would that be in?

 

[katydid23]

We don't know the circumstances surrounding the car. The car was torched hours after the fire rather than the fire being something aligned with the start of the fire and fleeing the scene. Where the car was in those hours after the fire is one the mysteries of the case. The original plan may have been to steal the car to sell it, which I do for the circumstances surrounding the car strange that it was taken but not torched immediately. I do hope there are answers as to why that happened.

I have a possible scenario in mind... lol

I think DW drove it to the church lot and went home to 'chill.' He was anxious. Then he saw or heard on the news, the cops were looking for the stolen Porsche. So he runs out and torches it, hoping to burn up the evidence. ?

 

[Skigirl]

Is he wearing a suit? Could he just be a guy walking home and coming upon a burning vehicle and trying not to get involved?

It doesn't look like a suit to me, it looks like a dark sweatshirt to me, IDK. Could be a bystander, I guess...but why wasn't he in the video that LE released previously?

 

[katydid23]

IDK. I'd be surprised if that was the case. What database would that be in?

In California, ALL law enforcement officers have their DNA in a statewide data base. They use it to rule out DNA at crime scenes or to nail 'criminals' wearing the uniform.

ETA
State has DNA databases from cradle to jail

:

http://www.modbee.com/news/article12561632.html

 

[katydid23]

It doesn't look like a suit to me, it looks like a dark sweatshirt to me, IDK. Could be a bystander, I guess...but why wasn't he in the video that LE released previously?

IDK. Maybe they have ruled him out so they did not release his picture previously.

 

[rkf]

I think it is a way of tainting the jury pool. No way do they want the jury to think that this brutal crime was DW's idea. They want him to be a 'dumb' worker bee. They want the good looking, middle class, racer wannabe to become the villain here.

Even if they convince the jury that it was someone else's idea, when the judge explains what is required to find DW guilty of felony murder, the defense will have helped the prosecution make their case. If DW just held the duct tape roll for JW while he tied everyone up and then killed them, DW would still be guilty. Since the evidence seems to indicate that DW had a greater role than holding the roll, how does conceding that DW took part in the crime at all, even as "just the muscle", help DW? The only way I see to avoid a guilty verdict is if the defense could make the case that JW (or someone else) committed the crime instead of DW.

 

[rkf]

IMO, YES. My reference is Jon Benet Ramsay case.

??? Was there DNA from a factory worker?

 

[i.b.nora]

It doesn't look like a suit to me, it looks like a dark sweatshirt to me, IDK. Could be a bystander, I guess...but why wasn't he in the video that LE released previously?

This is just a guess, but maybe the video they used for that news was shot off a giant screen that the guy walked in front of as the video was being re-videoed. Maybe it was at a press conference early on.

 

[rkf]

Theoretically DW could admit to conspiring to a crime that isn't one of the ones that covered under the DC felony murder statute (what felonies qualify varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, which I believe the requirement for DC is that they're 'dangerous' felonies). I think for instance DW could say that he signed up for something like car theft but it became something he didn't sign up for and he didn't kill anyone, so he can't be found guilty of felony murder. They could be going for a combination Ficker/Hanover in challenging the evidence while saying he was just a pawn to something lesser while JW or whoever was the mastermind directing others. I think DW's best hope would be a plea bargain and it could be that what's really going on is they're angling for that.

From the DC code:

§ 22–2101. Murder in the first degree - Purposeful killing; killing while perpetrating certain crimes.

Whoever, being of sound memory and discretion, kills another purposely, either of deliberate and premeditated malice or by means of poison, or in perpetrating or attempting to perpetrate an offense punishable by imprisonment in the penitentiary, or without purpose to do so kills another in perpetrating or in attempting to perpetrate any arson, as defined in § 22‑301 or § 22‑302, first degree sexual abuse, first degree child sexual abuse, first degree cruelty to children, mayhem, robbery, or kidnaping, or in perpetrating or attempting to perpetrate any housebreaking while armed with or using a dangerous weapon, or in perpetrating or attempting to perpetrate a felony involving a controlled substance, is guilty of murder in the first degree. For purposes of imprisonment following revocation of release authorized by § 24‑403.01(b)(7), murder in the first degree is a Class A felony.
BBM

http://dccode.org/simple/sections/22-2101.html

 

[rkf]

I hate to point back at my own posts...but did anyone else notice the guy in the foreground of the "burning car" video that we saw a much longer clip of yesterday than had been previously released? Do you think the earlier part was released by accident? Or on purpose?

I think it was a firefighter because I think the footage was made by a firetruck's dash cam. JMO

ETA: found this at 1:15. Very fast, so hard to catch in a screen shot.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I have a possible scenario in mind... lol

I think DW drove it to the church lot and went home to 'chill.' He was anxious. Then he saw or heard on the news, the cops were looking for the stolen Porsche. So he runs out and torches it, hoping to burn up the evidence. ?

AFAIK the chain of events was that LE was looking for where the car had been previously after they found the car on fire and tied it back to the S family:

Police are asking that anyone who saw a blue 2008 Porsche with D.C. tags DK2418 after 10:30 a.m. and 5:30 p.m. Thursday to contact them. The vehicle has been recovered, but police are attempting to account for its whereabouts prior to it being found.

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/local/dc/2015/05/14/dc-fire-ems-woodland-drive/27312461/
I think it was at least a day after a fire that it publicly went from being 'suspicious' to publicly being a murder/arson investigation.