DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #18

[katydid23]

I agree. They have searched his car and belongings from that day, and his cell phone records for at least the day of the crime (and if IIRC, a few days before and some time after- sorry if this is a mistake) and still nothing. I mean, anything is possible, but to me this is a sign that LE isn't too interested in him as a suspect at this point.

The fact that the defense in yesterday's hearing kept trying to cast doubt on him with the same old information makes me think that they don't have anything newer on him. Also, I don't know what is allowed or not allowed to be said in these hearings, or what the defense would know at this point, but it was stated that there was a 3rd person's DNA found. Wouldn't someone say if it was, or wasn't, JW's? Would the defense call him out for not submitting DNA?

I agree with your observations.

Also, the fact that the defense is going after JW makes it clear to me that JW is NOT under arrest secretly somewhere. JMO

 

[Bootsctr]

Ok ... if VF normally left at 3pm which we thought was her usual time .... why was she leaving around 6pm and didn't call her husband. She would have had time between 3 and roughly 6 pm before DW broke it. IMHO that time seems too late for the break-in.

I think it started earlier too. All these guessestimations have my timeline skewed up to the nth degree.

Of course 5:56 p.m. could have been when Mr. S arrived at the home and maybe something got slammed then that caused the system to detect glass being broken.

It just makes me sick to think what this family suffered and endured many hours and through the night.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

This article makes the first mention of items stolen from the home AFAIK:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...40c08c-2fc3-11e5-a879-213078d03dd3_story.html
Apparently there are missing samurai swords that haven't been found. Also the article describes more why they think multiple were involved.

 

[jjenny]

SS' DNA was also on the vest, but he wasn't driving the Porsche. There is a third unnamed person whose DNA was also on the vest. That person could be unknown or LE could be keeping that information to themselves at this point. If the DNA belongs to someone who could have come in contact with the vest in some legitimate way (used it for work or play, picked it up when s/he was in the garage, etc.) it would not necessarily indicate the person was involved in the crime, whether s/he was or not.

DW definitely could have been driving the Porsche, but someone else could have also driven it that day or the day before. If someone drove it that day who had a legitimate reason to drive it in the past, again that would not indicate that person was involved in the crime. When someone's DNA is found and there is no legitimate reason for it to be there, that's when it has forensic value. Otherwise, it might keep LE from ruling someone out, but it doesn't definitively rule them in. JMO

SS's DNA could be from blood.

 

[rkf]

Thanks! Isn't the drive from Chantilly to the house 45-60 mins? So assuming that JW was still in Chantilly when he heard about the fire just as soon as it was discovered (1:15 PM) he wouldn't have been able to make it back to the house until 2 PM at the very earliest.

One question I would have: Did that 11:54 AM call from SS's phone to JW summon him back to DC? Because that would have enabled enough time for JW to drive back and park in the zone before the tape went up.

Some reports say the pings from JW's phone at the time of the text to AS put him in VA (general), but at least one said it still put him in Chantilly (but I was thinking that might have been an assumption by the reporter based on the fact that we know he had been there until at least noon). Maybe he was actually well on his way back at that point.

Excellent points. I wish we knew. Has it been stated affirmatively how he received the news - in person at the dojo or by phone when he was elsewhere? I don't believe it's been stated where JW was after Lowe's, except that his phone pinged in VA around the time he learned of the fire. (Maybe that's a clue to how he heard about it? If so, where was he if not Lowe's or the dojo?) If the 11:54 call was SS asking him to come back to DC, and he received it and took off straight for DC after leaving Lowe's at noon, then I don't think he would have still been in Virginia at 1:15 or 1:30. He probably would have already been back at the house when the fire started. But it's my understanding that a reporter learned from a LE source that JW's phone pinged in Virginia around the time he learned about the fire. I haven't seen that info in any LE documents.

We still don't know what time JW got back to the house or how large a circumference the crime tape encircled. If you look at the map of the S house, it's hard to figure out where JW could have parked a block away that would have been taped off. Maybe he parked within a block of the house? But in that case, how would he have done that unless he got there before the firetrucks and LE arrived? By the time the news camera got there, the surrounding streets were pretty packed with official vehicles. WE know NG made it back to the house from VA while the fire was still burning, because we can see her on the news footage. I didn't see JW or his car in the footage, but that doesn't mean he wasn't there. All the streets around there have 2 hour parking unless the car has a residential parking permit. I was leaning toward JW leaving his car when he dropped off the money and driving one of the S cars to Chantilly since he might have expected to drive SS later in the day. But he would have risked a ticket if he left his car on the street all day.

 

[rkf]

This is interesting. .. so he gets the 11:54 call while at Home Depot. Maybe a few minutes to finish shopping, have to go through checkout, then back to the dojo to drop off whatever. So he probably didn’t get back on the road until 12:15, maybe a bit later. I'm local, and I would be surprised if he could make the drive in under an hour... I think inbound on the 66 is always, always bad (outbound seems to have more of the normal rush hour patterns). If traffic was really bad, it could take him over an hour just to get to the beltway.

So he may have been on the road when he got the call about the fire, and starts trying to call/text SS and AS. He gets to the scene maybe around 1:30-1:45.

This could work.

Moo

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LE must know where in VA his phone pinged. Wish we did!

 

[pinkandgreenmom]

The part about VF usually leaving at 3 came from NG, right? I think it is possible that she doesn't know what she is talking about.

But assuming she does, and VF usually leaves at 3, I can see a few reasons why she would still be there at 6 on that particular day.
(1) she was somewhere else that AM and started a few hours late
(2) the house was a bit messier than usual and cleaning took longer (perhaps there had been a recent event at the house and thus extra clean up)
(3) there was some prep work/extra cleaning to do for an upcoming event (the dojo opening, the older daughter graduating from high school)
(4) extra work AS requested be done that day that didn't fall within the normal cleaning duties (cleaning the inside of a refrigerator, washing windows)

I'm just trying to throw out some reasons why VF may have been there at 6 instead of the timeline being off. But these are JMO based on things I have run into with my cleaning services in the past.

 

[rkf]

I could be wrong here because I'm new to sleuthing & just still teething. But IMO they had to have a plan. They - refers to the ring which I believe existed since these people had all been in the quick money business & were seasoned. But bank doesn't open until morning, so evening to get the calls out to prep the $$, then late in the dark of the night, slither & take valuables. Which leaves morning for the coup de gras Jackpot money drop. It's just planned too well for it to not have been methodically planned out. & I do find it odd that he has a girlfriend in Brooklyn NY so close to the violent neighborhood w all the violent activities. JMO

Kind of puts to bed the $40,000 already being expected if the gang planned to spend the night from the beginning. (Otherwise, why not just show up at the expected drop-off time?) I hadn't thought about how quickly SS called JW after arriving home (based on JW's text response) - ITA that makes it seem more likely this was the plan all along, not a botched burglary. You guys have made me change my mind on that. Thanks CrimeNeverPays and SpanishInquisition.

 

[rkf]

& this is why it is so difficult not believing JW was complicit in the crime. Because IMO JW is like the KEY to the lock. And there seem to be so many oddities when it comes to JW, actions, alibi, texts, etc etc....It all just doesn't compute without him.

And they just keep coming! Every time I think "it could be all coincidences", we learn something new that pushes me back toward "probably involved." I no longer think LE is just punishing JW for lying to them. I think the prosecution and the detective made it clear in court yesterday that they are still looking at JW.

 

[katydid23]

I could be wrong here because I'm new to sleuthing & just still teething. But IMO they had to have a plan. They - refers to the ring which I believe existed since these people had all been in the quick money business & were seasoned. But bank doesn't open until morning, so evening to get the calls out to prep the $$, then late in the dark of the night, slither & take valuables. Which leaves morning for the coup de gras Jackpot money drop. It's just planned too well for it to not have been methodically planned out. & I do find it odd that he has a girlfriend in Brooklyn NY so close to the violent neighborhood w all the violent activities. JMO

I just don't see it as all that methodical or well planned out. The cops knew who DW was and where he was within days. A methodical planner does not eat pizza and leave the crusts laying around. A planner would have used enough accelerant to totally burn all of the evidence in the home and the car. If it was truly an organized ring they would have taken some of those cars, filled them with expensive art and collectibles and they would have been in a warehouse or a barge out of the country before daylight.

He made so many silly errors and miscalculations that I cannot agree it was methodically planned out. He is on video exiting the stolen Porsche. :doh:

I don't think it was DW that 'planned' the ransom drop. I think it was SS's idea. He was trying to buy his way out of danger by negotiating with this idiotic monster. I think DW was expecting to find loads of cash and jewels in the safe. And I don't think there was that much in there. I think they were an active, modern family that spent their money on private schools, their jet, their ranch, their family vacations, their businesses. And NOT on diamonds or Rolexes. I think DW was very disappointed and SS needed to calm his and make a plan to bring in some ransom money.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I think it started earlier too. All these guessestimations have my timeline skewed up to the nth degree.

Of course 5:56 p.m. could have been when Mr. S arrived at the home and maybe something got slammed then that caused the system to detect glass being broken.

It just makes me sick to think what this family suffered and endured many hours and through the night.

I take serious issue with the 6 PM time as I can't imagine why AS on her own volition would call SS to come home and babysit and throw a monkey-wrench in the already down-to-the-wire preparations for the grand opening so that she can go about town (which seems to be how it's described)...and why SS would agree to that. I could see a ruse used under duress like what we already heard about going to the hospital as that would be justification for SS to stop what he's doing and come home, but other than due to some real or faked emergency I can't see why AS would have called SS to come home early when he only had that evening and the next day left to prepare. I could for instance see a ruse of AS saying she needed to drive VF or someone else to the hospital as a reason for SS to come home early and babysit, but not so that AS could do something like go shopping.

 

[Peliman]

This article makes the first mention of items stolen from the home AFAIK:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...40c08c-2fc3-11e5-a879-213078d03dd3_story.html
Apparently there are missing samurai swords that haven't been found. Also the article describes more why they think multiple were involved.

Here's an important point in this article IMO

DNA testing on numerous pieces of physical evidence inside the home, including duct tape and a baseball bat, has not been completed, Owens said.

Now don't everyone fuss at me cause it's not processed, I warned ya.

 

[atthelake]

Of course, he could have gone up to the toll road... might be faster...

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Can you imagine if he did toll road without paying and his picture and car and plate was captured :floorlaugh:

Hey ..a gal can dream lol

 

[Bootsctr]

The part about VF usually leaving at 3 came from NG, right? I think it is possible that she doesn't know what she is talking about.

But assuming she does, and VF usually leaves at 3, I can see a few reasons why she would still be there at 6 on that particular day.
(1) she was somewhere else that AM and started a few hours late
(2) the house was a bit messier than usual and cleaning took longer (perhaps there had been a recent event at the house and thus extra clean up)
(3) there was some prep work/extra cleaning to do for an upcoming event (the dojo opening, the older daughter graduating from high school)
(4) extra work AS requested be done that day that didn't fall within the normal cleaning duties (cleaning the inside of a refrigerator, washing windows)

I'm just trying to throw out some reasons why VF may have been there at 6 instead of the timeline being off. But these are JMO based on things I have run into with my cleaning services in the past.

Thank you! I must consider the source, NG. She certainly added a lot of unnecessary information to the entire mix. Amy told NG to take Vera Wednesday if she needed her for the dojo opening, but NG said Vera wanted to work at the house. Unfortunately, Vera is not alive to hear her version of events.

It is interesting that LE is saying both Savvas and Vera were strangled to death. Death by strangulation is even more personal than stabbing IMO. It takes a loooooonggg time to strangle someone. Maybe LE thinks that is why more than Wint was involved in holding the family hostage? Two strangled, two stabbed/blunt force trauma = 2 different killers.

 

[katydid23]

Kind of puts to bed the $40,000 already being expected if the gang planned to spend the night from the beginning. (Otherwise, why not just show up at the expected drop-off time?) I hadn't thought about how quickly SS called JW after arriving home (based on JW's text response) - ITA that makes it seem more likely this was the plan all along, not a botched burglary. You guys have made me change my mind on that. Thanks CrimeNeverPays and SpanishInquisition.

Maybe. But it does not have to mean it was a plan all along. It is possible that DW forced AS to open the safes and he was very frustrated that there was very little cash or valuables inside. And he was raging. SS walks into the nightmare and needs to calm the raging monster down immediately. SS says he can get cash when the bank opens and he immediately begins making the calls to show DW that money was coming. JMO

 

[rkf]

I believe he would have been arrested if anything was found to incriminate him. He was put under a microscope in the beginning (before they found the damning evidence from DW).


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The problem with JW vs DW is that any forensic evidence found in the house, cars, on the vest, etc., can be explained away because JW had access to the home, garage and cars through his job. Unless his DNA was found on the pizza or something else that was only present during the crime, JW's fingerprints would be expected in the crime scenes. As long as JW could say "Oh, yeah, AS asked me to go up to PS' room to bring down a box from his closet. I stopped and used his bathroom" LE can't use any forensic evidence to prove JW was involved in the crime. If DW isn't talking, LE would have to build an air-tight circumstantial case against JW. If JW participated in the crime but didn't touch the murder weapons or the pizza, what evidence would put him at the scene? If he never entered the main house during the crime, it would be even harder to prove he was working with DW. LE would have to prove that JW and DW had the opportunity and the means to collude, by phone records, SM and/or witness testimony.

I don't believe that because no one else has been arrested, no one else is suspected of involvement by LE. They made it clear yesterday that they think DW didn't commit this crime alone. They didn't tell us directly who they might suspect, but calling JW "something of a mystery man", and bringing him up repeatedly, etc., would be strange if they had cleared him long ago. When Owens tried to say something about DW's brother, the judge stopped it, so we don't know what else they're thinking about him, other than he seemed to be directing the money laundering.

JMO

 

[katydid23]

If they swabbed the car, they couldn't identify the DNA as his for sure unless he either agreed to, or was compelled to, contribute a known DNA sample, so I don't think the swabs and fingerprints they were looking for were JW's. I think they wanted to know who else might have been in his car. JMO.

I think they can ID His. I bet they have his fathers DNA on file from his LE career. If they match a primary DNA recovered from his car, they can compare it to his fathers and rule it in or out. IF they needed to. But I think they got a warrant for it or it was already given voluntarily. JMO

 

[rkf]

I think it started earlier too. All these guessestimations have my timeline skewed up to the nth degree.

Of course 5:56 p.m. could have been when Mr. S arrived at the home and maybe something got slammed then that caused the system to detect glass being broken.

It just makes me sick to think what this family suffered and endured many hours and through the night.

Since the affidavit is only for SS' murder, when they say "offense" it might only refer to when the offense against SS began, not when the home invasion began. IDK

 

[Bootsctr]

I take serious issue with the 6 PM time as I can't imagine why AS on her own volition would call SS to come home and babysit and throw a monkey-wrench in the already down-to-the-wire preparations for the grand opening so that she can go about town (which seems to be how it's described)...and why SS would agree to that. I could see a ruse used under duress like what we already heard about going to the hospital as that would be justification for SS to stop what he's doing and come home, but other than due to some real or faked emergency I can't see why AS would have called SS to come home early when he only had that evening and the next day left to prepare. I could for instance see a ruse of AS saying she needed to drive VF or someone else to the hospital as a reason for SS to come home early and babysit, but not so that AS could do something like go shopping.

:yeahthat: Weird scenario thrown into the mix. I was thinking he almost made it seem like a girls night out or something at first.

And the delivery of the $40K from VA to the home in DC when it was going to be taken back to VA on Friday...

 

[atthelake]

Ok ... if VF normally left at 3pm which we thought was her usual time .... why was she leaving around 6pm and didn't call her husband. She would have had time between 3 and roughly 6 pm before DW broke it. IMHO that time seems too late for the break-in.

:thinking: :thinking: :thinking: