Deborah Bradley & Jeremy Irwin - Dr. Phil Interview - 3 February 2012 #2

[melissasmom]

Yes, she is concerned about wild "accusations and theories."

Well here is another:
Two parents, with three kids, only one parent working, don't have money to pay their cell phone bill but Mom thinks it's okay to buy wine and feed her neighbor. Mom lived in the vicinity of a high publicity case, Fort Bragg, NC, where another mother faked/staged a kidnapping. Mom has said she followed other missing child cases.

The family is struggling financially...how to get more money...
fake a kidnapping? How can this be done? Have someone put up a reward....it will never have to be paid out because the family knows who "took" the baby. Have a known felon (who you only have to promise a little money...because he is a homeless/drifter or so you think) be seen several times walking around with a nearly naked baby. Wait four hours to report the "kidnapping" or until you have confirmation that the baby has been handed off. Tell a bunch of convoluted stories of what happened. Say that your three cell phones, one broken, were stolen. That way, people can believe that an intruder broke in, took your cellphones and nothing else except your baby.

Hire a high powered attorney, who tells you to stop talking so he can spin, wait three months to again speak publicly, sell new photos of you and the baby for upwards to 1/2 a mil...that's what that other lady got...plead for someone to drop her off at a fire station, a church, whatever "we don't want you we want her...there's $100,000 reward." Mom & Dad collect their talk show $$$. The Lawyer and the "PI" can get paid. The "benefactor" doesn't lose any money or she can be paid back for BS's time. The baby can now magically come home...and the "kidnapper/baby buyer" can just fade away into the night.

How's that for a wild theory?

This appears to be a young couple who may live paycheck to paycheck ( I do not KNOW this, I am just guessing) They have a tidy little house, at least one vehicle, their children appear to be decently dressed, they are well-fed. They may have problems budgeting, but where does the "desparate for money" thing come from?

As far as buying wine when they hadnt paid their cell phone bill? I guess some people may call this "shocking", but I'm just kind of like "eh, whatever". I would be a little more bothered if say, the children had nothing to eat and one of the parents spent the last of their money on a bag of weed. Right now my property taxes are overdue, but last night my family and I went out to eat and spent $35 on it. So I guess I'm a pretty shifty person and a lousy parent to boot.

But yes, in my opinon, that is one of the most outrageous theories yet. I think if they were going to sell a child, they would have planned and executed it a little better.

 

[Jacie Estes]

Yes, a witness to the fact that the lights were off at 11:30pm. . .an hour after DB claims she went to bed.

Perhaps from her lign of sight there were no lights on; the lights were on on hte other side of the house out of SB's view. IMHO

 

[Donjeta]

It doesn't matter, if you wake up and your spouse asks why the lights and window is open, your going to be alarmed especially if there is no details, just lights on and window open.

IDK about that, why not just say, sorry I must have forgotten the lights on again. It sounds like this was a frequently repeated conversation in their home, what with Jeremy being so frugal about the electricity bill and so mindful of the lights being an electrician. I can't imagine she jumped up in a fright every time JI brought up the lights that she'd left on.

I might be more alarmed if the lights that I left on and the windows that I left open had suddenly turned themselves off and closed themselves while everybody was sleeping.

 

[Just K]

This appears to be a young couple who may live paycheck to paycheck ( I do not KNOW this, I am just guessing) They have a tidy little house, at least one vehicle, their children appear to be decently dressed, they are well-fed. They may have problems budgeting, but where does the "desparate for money" thing come from?

As far as buying wine when they hadnt paid their cell phone bill? I guess some people may call this "shocking", but I'm just kind of like "eh, whatever". I would be a little more bothered if say, the children had nothing to eat and one of the parents spent the last of their money on a bag of weed. Right now my property taxes are overdue, but last night my family and I went out to eat and spent $35 on it. So I guess I'm a pretty shifty person and a lousy parent to boot.

But yes, in my opinon, that is one of the most outrageous theories yet. I think if they were going to sell a child, they would have planned and executed it a little better.

The theory is not about selling a child but about a fake kidnapping and being patient enough to wait a few months to reap the financial rewards for your "story."

It is another theory.

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

I thought she said she left the window open. Didn't she say on Dr, Phil that she left the window open and it would have been pretty easy for an intruder to come through?

I'm not sure she said "she" left it open, but that the window was open and someone could have come through it.

OT sort of, and just using your post as a jumping off point, but to show the lengths that some will go to to gain illegal entry...
A few years ago when I left my job to build furniture, I still did not have power in my shop so I had to run an extension cord under the shop door for power for a few weeks. The 50 ft entension cord ran from our lower pond to the shop door. Over time during the facelift on the shop, lumber, a lot of lumber ended up on top of the cord.
One morning I went out to the shop and the cord is gone. LE came to my door after I reported it stolen, and said they found it and wanted to show me where it was. Across the street is an apt complex. Someone had climbed a tree, tied off my cord to a large branch, snagged the other end between the gutter and the facia board, and shimmied across the cord hand over hand, and broke in through a 2nd story window to steal a stereo. :what:
I don't find it far fetched that someone wanting into their home, for whatever reson could not have easily done so.

 

[DeAnn]

If that were the case then why did DB assume something was wrong and they raced in to check on BL? If she just simply left some lights on and JI came in and confronted her with that, then you would think she would have said, "Woops, sorry, I must have left them on." But that wasn't the story we were initially told.

ETA- and I'm still confused as to why SB would say the lights were off at 11:30pm if they weren't.

Still talking lights eh?

Someone here (sorry I wish I could remember who cause it was quite cute and descriptive) talked about a son getting up in the middle of the night to tinkle and leaving lights on.

DB could have turned off lights and son when leaving her bed on way to his and presumably the bathroom (probably what got him up) turned some on and that would have been after SB went to bed. Hence lights on that she didn't leave on.

I wish Dr. Phil had asked....what was your sons and SB's daughter doing from 6:30 until 10:30 and if they went to bed with you at 10:30 and their normal bedtime is 8 p.m. (what she said) and it's a school night....were they up 2 1/2 hours past their bedtime or crashed out asleep on a living room couch or what?

Somehow Lisa left the house that night or early morning. How and when did that happen...still not seeing what lights were on or weren't has to tell us anything that answers those questions.

 

[Jacie Estes]

The lights have been discussed for a day. If someone objects to a discussion that strongly they should just notify a moderator. If there's a discussion that I'm not interested in or have had enough of, I read something else, I don't tell others they shouldn't be discussing it.

It's far from just semantics in other peoples opinions. She hasn't been called the devil incarnate and no one said it definitely proves anything. It's being discussed in the forum that is supposed to be about the case.

Which is why I put IMHO in my posts; it is my opinion. I'm not saying don't discuss it...have at it. Opinion is just that opinion. fwiw

 

[melissasmom]

The theory is not about selling a child but about a fake kidnapping and being patient enough to wait a few months to reap the financial rewards for your "story."

It is another theory.

Ooops, my bad. I think the fake kidnapping thing is outrageous too.

 

[Sparklin]

If she didn't want JI to know that the baby was dead, she had to take that chance. She couldn't just leave her in the house knowing that either JI or the cops would find her.

IDM thinks it unlikely she could have gotten close enough to the river, in the dark, to throw in a 30 pound baby, (sorry IDM if you've changed your mind about that - I remember seeing you say that on another thread). The police searched the area and didn't find anything. So, where did she hide her?

Then you have the men carrying around diapered babies in the night. I just don't what to make of this case.

I don't know either -- but I find it far more plausible that someone entered the house and took Lisa then that Deb, being even slightly tipsy, could pull this off. I don't think she 'hid' her or 'hurt' her at all.

 

[jjenny]

I'm not sure she said "she" left it open, but that the window was open and someone could have come through it.

OT sort of, and just using your post as a jumping off point, but to show the lengths that some will go to to gain illegal entry...
A few years ago when I left my job to build furniture, I still did not have power in my shop so I had to run an extension cord under the shop door for power for a few weeks. The 50 ft entension cord ran from our lower pond to the shop door. Over time during the facelift on the shop, lumber, a lot of lumber ended up on top of the cord.
One morning I went out to the shop and the cord is gone. LE came to my door after I reported it stolen, and said they found it and wanted to show me where it was. Across the street is an apt complex. Someone had climbed a tree, tied off my cord to a large branch, snagged the other end between the gutter and the facia board, and shimmied across the cord hand over hand, and broke in through a 2nd story window to steal a stereo. :what:
I don't find it far fetched that someone wanting into their home, for whatever reson could not have easily done so.

I am pretty sure in earlier interviews DB did say she left the window open.

 

[cityslick]

Why are you going to be alarmed if you left that window open and lights on?

Because we have no clue how that statement was presented to her. Was he concerned when he told her this? If she really was drunk, what's to say her first reaction isn't surprise, coming out if a sleep.

 

[Just K]

IMO, the Dr Phil interview did more harm to DB's image than good. Each and every time she opens her mouth the details change... and "the devil is in the details." IMO, she looks more guilty now than she did three months ago.

 

[hambirg]

Perhaps from her lign of sight there were no lights on; the lights were on on hte other side of the house out of SB's view. IMHO

I was under the impression that SB was still out in front of the house. Surely she would be able to see if there were lights on in the computer room and the kitchen. . .which are some of the ones that DB now claims she left on.

Again, why would SB lie? If she couldn't really see if the lights were all out, why say anything about them at all?

 

[Just K]

I wonder if anyone who thought she was innocent or was undecided has a different opinion today?

 

[cityslick]

I wonder if anyone who thought she was innocent or was undecided has a different opinion today?

I don't know if she's guilty or innocent. The only thing that gives me pause from yesterday is if in fact it's the truth that she didn't tell LE about the drinking. That's a problem for me.

This stuff about the lights is semantics to me IMO.

 

[Donjeta]

Still talking lights eh?

Someone here (sorry I wish I could remember who cause it was quite cute and descriptive) talked about a son getting up in the middle of the night to tinkle and leaving lights on.

DB could have turned off lights and son when leaving her bed on way to his and presumably the bathroom (probably what got him up) turned some on and that would have been after SB went to bed. Hence lights on that she didn't leave on.

I wish Dr. Phil had asked....what was your sons and SB's daughter doing from 6:30 until 10:30 and if they went to bed with you at 10:30 and their normal bedtime is 8 p.m. (what she said) and it's a school night....were they up 2 1/2 hours past their bedtime or crashed out asleep on a living room couch or what?

Somehow Lisa left the house that night or early morning. How and when did that happen...still not seeing what lights were on or weren't has to tell us anything that answers those questions.

According to JI the lights that were on were:

a lamp in the front living room lamp, two kitchen lights, the accent lights, a pumpkin light in the computer room

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cm3_ttvrweg&feature=endscreen&NR=1"]Lisa Irwin Parents New Interview - My Body Language Analysis. MUST SEE. GMA. CJB - YouTube[/ame]
(it's a long video and there is annoying interruptions but it's in the first couple of minutes)

According to DB on the Dr. Phil show:

We had, um, track lighting on in the computer room, we had- I had a little tiny lamp that is literally no bigger than this, on in the living room. And then, we had a stove light, the above the stove light on, and the clock radio light on.

I guess it depends on the layout of the home but I find it hard to visualize any layout in which a child going to the bathroom finds it necessary to turn on several lights in so many different rooms, including a pumpkin light.

 

[hambirg]

Still talking lights eh?

Someone here (sorry I wish I could remember who cause it was quite cute and descriptive) talked about a son getting up in the middle of the night to tinkle and leaving lights on.

DB could have turned off lights and son when leaving her bed on way to his and presumably the bathroom (probably what got him up) turned some on and that would have been after SB went to bed. Hence lights on that she didn't leave on.

I wish Dr. Phil had asked....what was your sons and SB's daughter doing from 6:30 until 10:30 and if they went to bed with you at 10:30 and their normal bedtime is 8 p.m. (what she said) and it's a school night....were they up 2 1/2 hours past their bedtime or crashed out asleep on a living room couch or what?

Somehow Lisa left the house that night or early morning. How and when did that happen...still not seeing what lights were on or weren't has to tell us anything that answers those questions.

I would buy that if it was the bathroom light, hall light, his bedroom light. But we are being told it was kitchen, computer room, etc. Why would he go in there and leave those lights on? And if that was the case. . why wouldn't DB and JI tell us that. The boy got up and turned on the lights and left them on, not the intruder turned them on like we originally thought. That's NOT what they're saying. I would bet that they know that is not what the boy said in his interview. JMHO

 

[RANCH]

Still talking lights eh?

Someone here (sorry I wish I could remember who cause it was quite cute and descriptive) talked about a son getting up in the middle of the night to tinkle and leaving lights on.

DB could have turned off lights and son when leaving her bed on way to his and presumably the bathroom (probably what got him up) turned some on and that would have been after SB went to bed. Hence lights on that she didn't leave on.

I wish Dr. Phil had asked....what was your sons and SB's daughter doing from 6:30 until 10:30 and if they went to bed with you at 10:30 and their normal bedtime is 8 p.m. (what she said) and it's a school night....were they up 2 1/2 hours past their bedtime or crashed out asleep on a living room couch or what?

Somehow Lisa left the house that night or early morning. How and when did that happen...still not seeing what lights were on or weren't has to tell us anything that answers those questions.

BBM
Thanks DeAnn. I've been asking how the lights being on/off help prove or disprove any theories. Most people are stuck on the lying angle.

 

[Just K]

For me, it is all about her retelling the story time and time again and every time it is slightly different. In the immortal words of William Shakespeare, ..."the lady doth protest too much."

I don't know what the truth is but IMO Deborah hasn't been truthful about many things.

 

[vlpate]

It's on Ron Rugen's blog (a Kansas City PI)

http://kansascitypi.blogspot.com/2012/01/confident-he-saw-live-baby-was-it-lisa.html

Oh brother. For three months MT has miked and twisted this incident that, according to his first interviews, would have taken 10-15 seconds to transpire. Here's what he initially said on JVM 11/2/11:

After stopping approx. 30 FEET from the man -
"He turned around and looked at me, I looked at him, and I just went on."

The baby was wearing "diapers and a t-shirt".

"I went on down to my cousin's house."

Never mentions the baby was sitting up and alert, never said he "hollered" at the man or that the man acknowledged him with a nod. Ron needed to press MT on why he changed his story - or why he is embellishing his story to the point of being the size of a Casey Anthony fantasy fish!