Defense Conversation on the Net

[Ricki]

This is the forlorn look I mentioned earlier - this is when the next jury pool was already in the room and some people were thinking she was getting upset because the charges were about to be read out.

No Way! ICA was upset because Baez would not let her sit next to him when the swapped to the other side of the desk.

if the defense read here last night I would expect there to be even more distance between JB and KC because this does not look good at all. It is like a ( you don't love me anymore) look.
So sad to bad!

 

[~Lisa~]

For what it's worth...here's what I heard JB say: "You're acting like a CHILD."

I watched it with speakers up and fully expecting his mouth to match with what I had read ("you're acting like a 2-year old")...but IMO/interpretation... he def said CHILD.

Just wish we could have heard what she was saying at the moment the camera switched from HJBP to the DT table.

That's what I heard too. Child... not 2 yr. old
Think I'll go grab my son's headphones!

JMO

 

[LambChop]

The computer in front of CM, the one with the problems, is hooked up to the court reporter. CM can't hear well and he reads what has been said. I believe he had problems the other day with it and someone gave him instructions on how to reboot it and that is what KC was helping him with. He's technically challenged, which I too can relate to. jmo

 

[darnudes]

if the defense read here last night I would expect there to be even more distance between JB and KC because this does not look good at all. It is like a ( you don't love me anymore) look.
So sad to bad!

I know, I can't quite find the right word for it, it's sort of like she is willing him to look at her so she can make him see how much he has upset her - that one look she shot him just shook me, I just didn't expect ICA to ever be so obvious about Baez in front of the cameras.

 

[Jomo]

For those fascinated by the interplay between ICA and Baez (I know I am) I've come across another section that bears watching again. The reason I'm so interested in this is because
1. I think the relationship between ICA and Baez is deteriorating
2. ICA is not a client the defense is able to control for the length of the trial
3. ICA seems to be using the classic "divide and conquer" technique on her attorneys all for reasons which seem unfathomable but I can only surmise that this is ICA at her game playing best
4. I honestly believe that ICA believes that something special is going on between her and Baez
5. This will come back later to haunt Baez when/if he is accused of improper conduct with his client by his client.
6. I think Baez is fully aware that this scenario is coming and could by why his visits to ICA have dwindled down to virtually nothing, I don't think he visits her alone anymore either.

Okay, so we have seen yesterdays spat and then the carry on this morning, ICA was obviously unhappy with her seating arrangements and treatment by Baez, she complained to Mason and Finnell about Baez, Mason went to talk to Baez to smooth over troubled waters so then Baez approached ICA and ICA's response to Baez caused Sims to immediately tell ICA to stop what ever she was saying. The Judge entered the courtroom thus putting an end, for now, to what was happening.

Later in the day when the new jury pool was to be brought in everyone gets up to move their seats to the opposite side of the table. This is what I see next starting at the 2.49 mark:

1. ICA gets up to move her things, Finnell kind of interrupts and motions to Mason and Baez for ICA to sit up with them, Baez must put the kibosh on it and Mason just shrugs his shoulders, you can see ICA motioning to Mason to move down but he won't
2. Eventually Finnell comes back and tells her to sit next to her which she does but she looks very unhappy
3. As the Judge is asking if the state is ready and if the defense is ready, ICA shoots Baez a look that is so sad and forlorn it's quite startling. The look is at mark 4.18.

ICA is so unhappy by what I can only imagine is her feeling that Baez is ignoring her - she's so upset and she looks ready to cry and not because the charges are going to be read out again to another jury pool but by what is happening between her and Baez. Luckily for her, her attention is diverted by the dismissal of the jury pool.

How long before the relationship between Baez and ICA disintegrates entirely?

My guess is not long and this is due partly to them spending so much time together recently and ICA inability to understand where she is and why she is there.

http://www.wftv.com/video/27841998/index.html

I think your observations are bang on! The stress of the upcoming trial is getting to them and they are going to explode before long!

For me, this really is the BIG story this week.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

Please provide a link. Thanks

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QstxUZAk0nc[/ame]


@2:26..Baez says, Really..ICA really...Baez your acting like a 2 y/o...so that's why she refused to sit near him....LMAO Baez how you feeling now?


Justice for Caylee

 

[Ricki]

I know, I can't quite find the right word for it, it's sort of like she is willing him to look at her so she can make him see how much he has upset her - that one look she shot him just shook me, I just didn't expect ICA to ever be so obvious about Baez in front of the cameras.

It certainly does not look like a look that is concerning her about jury selection or what jurors or viewers might think about her. It is a look that is all about JB and KC. Her focus is definitley not where you would expect it to be but we are talking about KC here.

 

[darnudes]

I think your observations are bang on! The stress of the upcoming trial is getting to them and they are going to explode before long!

For me, this really is the BIG story this week.

Cheers Jomo, I think it is too but only because it fascinates me so much. Can't wait for today.

 

[Jomo]

Never a boring day! I'm so happy we all get through it together!

 

[BD1]

It certainly does not look like a look that is concerning her about jury selection or what jurors or viewers might think about her. It is a look that is all about JB and KC. Her focus is definitley not where you would expect it to be but we are talking about KC here.

Right. The sense is that all the stuff happening this week (or even since the beginning!) is just happening *around* her, not to her. She is more concerned with her mini drama's within the legal team, primarily with Baez. The feeling of intimacy they have is more than a little disturbing, and I think what we are seeing as a distance between them could be intentionally constructed for court (since we know they read here and elsewhere.) Casey has been focusing her attention to Mason for several court dates now. I think she was instructed to, as their relationship might be seen as less inappropriate. Honestly, to do her defense any good, she needs to be between both female attorneys, who pay little intimate attention to her. But even then, Casey and Baez are drawn together like a magnet, and it is this relationship that distracts her from what she is doing in that courtroom.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

Youre reading my mind. In the years JB has defended this unusual person- Fatal Attraction never occurred to me-but for some reason- Ive been getting these vibes as of yesterday. I think Jose is, too. IMO, his face is redder-- and he appears to be more detached to her than usual.

It appears Baez is finally seeing the 'real' ICA!

When she gets convicted, he ain't felt/seen nothing yet!

I posted the vid where he tells her to stop acting like a 2 y/o...it appears that is what he said...not child...it also appears she loves the attention and that it's all on her, all about her....she can't help but let the real ICA show, it was bound to happen...now I wonder if he truly still feels this cold hearted young woman is innocent?

I so hope Baez has come to his senses and realizes what he's dealing with!

I also wonder if she is insisting on taking the stand in her own defense. She must believe she can get a jury to see it her way....:waitasec:
JMHO

Justice for Caylee

 

[Linda7NJ]

I'm starting to think she's brain damaged in some way. IMO She seems to live her life in the moment, she doesn't seem to have the ability to think ahead or see the big picture. Executive functioning is way off.

Watching her, especially during this exchange, she's oblivious to the reason she's there and how others percieve her.

 

[Laidbacksal]

All ICA is worried about is what's going on socially. She's not capable of thinking of anything else.

 

[faefrost]

For those fascinated by the interplay between ICA and Baez (I know I am) I've come across another section that bears watching again. The reason I'm so interested in this is because
1. I think the relationship between ICA and Baez is deteriorating
2. ICA is not a client the defense is able to control for the length of the trial
3. ICA seems to be using the classic "divide and conquer" technique on her attorneys all for reasons which seem unfathomable but I can only surmise that this is ICA at her game playing best
4. I honestly believe that ICA believes that something special is going on between her and Baez
5. This will come back later to haunt Baez when/if he is accused of improper conduct with his client by his client.
6. I think Baez is fully aware that this scenario is coming and could by why his visits to ICA have dwindled down to virtually nothing, I don't think he visits her alone anymore either.

Okay, so we have seen yesterdays spat and then the carry on this morning, ICA was obviously unhappy with her seating arrangements and treatment by Baez, she complained to Mason and Finnell about Baez, Mason went to talk to Baez to smooth over troubled waters so then Baez approached ICA and ICA's response to Baez caused Sims to immediately tell ICA to stop what ever she was saying. The Judge entered the courtroom thus putting an end, for now, to what was happening.

Later in the day when the new jury pool was to be brought in everyone gets up to move their seats to the opposite side of the table. This is what I see next starting at the 2.49 mark:

1. ICA gets up to move her things, Finnell kind of interrupts and motions to Mason and Baez for ICA to sit up with them, Baez must put the kibosh on it and Mason just shrugs his shoulders, you can see ICA motioning to Mason to move down but he won't
2. Eventually Finnell comes back and tells her to sit next to her which she does but she looks very unhappy
3. As the Judge is asking if the state is ready and if the defense is ready, ICA shoots Baez a look that is so sad and forlorn it's quite startling. The look is at mark 4.18.

ICA is so unhappy by what I can only imagine is her feeling that Baez is ignoring her - she's so upset and she looks ready to cry and not because the charges are going to be read out again to another jury pool but by what is happening between her and Baez. Luckily for her, her attention is diverted by the dismissal of the jury pool.

How long before the relationship between Baez and ICA disintegrates entirely?

My guess is not long and this is due partly to them spending so much time together recently and ICA inability to understand where she is and why she is there.

http://www.wftv.com/video/27841998/index.html

I think you are partly correct. But I think there is something more going on there. We talked about this years ago, that right at this point KC would suddenly start having issues with JB. It is so predictable just from watching her behaviors. Some were speculating that it is stress and she is finally getting "to the end of the hall". She isn't. Based on what we have seen with KC she is actually at the "just one more day Mom! I just need one more day!" point in her mental rotations. Up until this point it has been her lawyers seeking delays. But I think her frustration is that they, especially JB don't seem to be doing that to her satisfaction anymore. I mean "this thing is actually going to trial! That man up there is talking about her killing her daughter and you guys aren't stopping it!" So now we start to see KC beginning to move towards her own delays. She doesn't want the trial to start on Tuesday. Particularly telling was that feeling some had that she wants to talk to the judge. I guarantee that that conversation will not be to plea out. That will be an attempt to fire her lead attorney in order to get a few more weeks to come up with something better. When the initial firing fails as the judge sees right through her she will then attempt to pull out the sexual misconduct accusations. Anything she can to gum things up. She won't get to that "end of the hall" moment until she has chewed through and thrown everyone else under the bus. I hope I am wrong about this, but I just have a feeling there.

 

[ZsaZsa]

Nothing too unusual in her behavior. She is more concerned with interpersonal relationships ( to put it politely) with the men around her , than she is about the trial procedures,or anything related to her dead child.

 

[Kat]

I think you are partly correct. But I think there is something more going on there. We talked about this years ago, that right at this point KC would suddenly start having issues with JB. It is so predictable just from watching her behaviors. Some were speculating that it is stress and she is finally getting "to the end of the hall". She isn't. Based on what we have seen with KC she is actually at the "just one more day Mom! I just need one more day!" point in her mental rotations. Up until this point it has been her lawyers seeking delays. But I think her frustration is that they, especially JB don't seem to be doing that to her satisfaction anymore. I mean "this thing is actually going to trial! That man up there is talking about her killing her daughter and you guys aren't stopping it!" So now we start to see KC beginning to move towards her own delays. She doesn't want the trial to start on Tuesday. Particularly telling was that feeling some had that she wants to talk to the judge. I guarantee that that conversation will not be to plea out. That will be an attempt to fire her lead attorney in order to get a few more weeks to come up with something better. When the initial firing fails as the judge sees right through her she will then attempt to pull out the sexual misconduct accusations. Anything she can to gum things up. She won't get to that "end of the hall" moment until she has chewed through and thrown everyone else under the bus. I hope I am wrong about this, but I just have a feeling there.

I agree with you faefrost and with the poster you quoted and also with the other member that said that her behaviors are showing how deep her pathology is...JMHO.

IMHO what we are seeing is not affection, caring or love for Baez it's more of the first rumblings of a narcissistic rage.

Baez is not behaving in a way she thinks is appropriate perhaps. He's not feeding her ego anymore perhaps.

For anyone that hasn't seen someone with pathological narcissistic tendencies it looks pretty much like the relationship between Baez and his client thus far IMHO.

JMHO but she nailed exactly what it was she needed to do to manipulate him probably within a few minutes or a few hours at most from meeting him. She mirrored him, she pushed the buttons that make him tick and respond in a protective and caring way (does he have knight in shining armor issues? does he have an issue with needing to be considered attractive? who knows?) she manipulated him obviously because his behaviors at the beginning of her case illustrate that he was more than likely flattered with her attention and perhaps felt a certain way towards her...but it's clear she let her mask slip in front of him because he has been trying to distance himself-somewhat-for a bit not. Becoming more and more firm with her up until yesterday when he told her she was acting like a child (2 yr old).

The picture upthread where she is looking down the table at Baez. I don't see forlorn as in she wishes that Baez would give her the attention she needs---rather I see a look that says...oh excuse me MFer you think you
re going to treat me like that....(wheels churning) I'm gonna get your arse.

We will see all JMHO and thoughts and speculations.

 

[darnudes]

I think you are partly correct. But I think there is something more going on there. We talked about this years ago, that right at this point KC would suddenly start having issues with JB. It is so predictable just from watching her behaviors. Some were speculating that it is stress and she is finally getting "to the end of the hall". She isn't. Based on what we have seen with KC she is actually at the "just one more day Mom! I just need one more day!" point in her mental rotations. Up until this point it has been her lawyers seeking delays. But I think her frustration is that they, especially JB don't seem to be doing that to her satisfaction anymore. I mean "this thing is actually going to trial! That man up there is talking about her killing her daughter and you guys aren't stopping it!" So now we start to see KC beginning to move towards her own delays. She doesn't want the trial to start on Tuesday. Particularly telling was that feeling some had that she wants to talk to the judge. I guarantee that that conversation will not be to plea out. That will be an attempt to fire her lead attorney in order to get a few more weeks to come up with something better. When the initial firing fails as the judge sees right through her she will then attempt to pull out the sexual misconduct accusations. Anything she can to gum things up. She won't get to that "end of the hall" moment until she has chewed through and thrown everyone else under the bus. I hope I am wrong about this, but I just have a feeling there.

I can understand the issues with ICA wanting Baez to "make it stop" and I fully agree with you that she does not believe she is at the end of hall. What makes you think she is wanting to talk to the Judge? Was it something in particular that stood out to you?

Personally I think she is testing Baez to see how far she can go and what strings she can pull to make him dance. I just see this as her power play with him and I do feel now, after watching things the last few days, that there is an unhealthy relationship, on her part, between them. I can't imagine her firing him, not now and not yet. I don't see the same sort of angst displayed towards Mason as there is towards Baez - I'm seeing her destroy her relationship with Baez and her focus seems to be solely on him.

I wonder if Baez is having trouble explaining to her why all the evidence is coming in?

 

[Boots-OK]

Man....I didn't hear what so many heard in the little exchange. I've listened with every device I have - with all volumes as high as they will go - and, I still do not hear one single intelligible word. I've listened to every link, etc.

Maybe it's time to have a hearing check done - I really wanted to hear this, too!!

 

[SeaNymph]

Man....I didn't hear what so many heard in the little exchange. I've listened with every device I have - with all volumes as high as they will go - and, I still do not hear one single intelligible word. I've listened to every link, etc.

Maybe it's time to have a hearing check done - I really wanted to hear this, too!!

I had trouble hearing it through all my devices yesterday too but when NG played it last night they had some kind of amp boost on it and you could hear it...prior to that I was trying to figure out the 'youre acting like a ________' to hard to even hear the "REALLY? x3" exchange between them, but that was there, and quite amusing I might add.

 

[Boots-OK]

I had trouble hearing it through all my devices yesterday too but when NG played it last night they had some kind of amp boost on it and you could hear it...prior to that I was trying to figure out the 'youre acting like a ________' to hard to even hear the "REALLY? x3" exchange between them, but that was there, and quite amusing I might add.

Thanks...I also listened to it via NG last night. Yep...need to work in a hearing check up for sure. Can't do it for 8 weeks, though.