kaykay543
Well-Known Member
Thanks! Yes that is a very odd spot for a light switch. I know for myself I would reach up trying to find one; but would never reach down to find a light switch
Did John Ramsey carry the body to contaminate the scene or not?
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Thanks! Yes that is a very odd spot for a light switch. I know for myself I would reach up trying to find one; but would never reach down to find a light switch
If only we knew with certainty that Fleet had flipped the light switch! It would be pretty damning if John flipped the same switch and the light worked this time. It would prove that he went into the wine cellar after 10am that morning and had 'discovered' JonBenet well before the 1pm search.
CoreyRocks
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hwow:
Does no one else see the significance of these photos Cottonstar posted? I've never seen them before Cottonstar shared them and they show what we've only speculated about before. Has anyone else seen a photo that clearly shows the wall outlet configuration in this room?
I think this proves that John Ramsey went into the WC after Fleet White had searched for JonBenet that morning. I don't know if Fleet White figured it out, but I think that's one of the things he was puzzled about enough to go back to this room after Arndt told him to guard the stairway.
Anyone else see it?
I see it. It took me awhile. Wow oh wow.
When Fleet White returned to the wine-cellar maybe he saw there were two power outlets? Could have he worked it out for himself?
Minimally I reckon Fleet White has always considered JR to be directly involved in the staging of JonBenet's body and possibly even her death.
His continued silence must mean he knows something, which if made public might subject him to litigation, something after the Krebs debacle he wishes to avoid.
He is likely happy just knowing who did it?
.
Minimally I reckon Fleet White has always considered JR to be directly involved in the staging of JonBenet's body and possibly even her death.
His continued silence must mean he knows something, which if made public might subject him to litigation, something after the Krebs debacle he wishes to avoid.
He is likely happy just knowing who did it?
.
Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
Word has it, JR used the switch on the right, close to the floor. Why didnt he use the switch just inside the door?
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ChuckMaureen
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Did FW wonder at the moment of discovery *why* JBR was *bound, gagged and deceased* in the basement of her own house?
Upon finding JBR's body, did JR wonder if the perp might still be in the house, hiding? Since FW did not notice the blanket nor JBR's body on his first go-around in the basement did FW wonder if a perp might be hiding in the house and that they should perform a more-thorough search just-in-case? Did either suggest that to the other at *any time* after discovering JBR's body?
If the perp was someone who stalks pageants we might expect there would have been other incidents either before or since JBR. Have there been any other beauty pageant children in the United States kidnapped and/or murdered since JBR?
If not, then that could eliminate that angle. That leaves neighborhood folk, family- or work- friends or acquaintances and family members on the potential suspects list.
Regarding the reference to "$130,000" in the 'ransom note'... was there paperwork in the house that revealed JR's 'bonus' deposit of the same/similar value? I'm wondering if the perp who wrote the note simply took advantage of information they may have happened to find in the house.
The Pineapple aspect. Weird. If JBR was not eating pineapple with a family member, what made her trust whomever it was who fed it to her? If it was a stranger would JBR not have had a gut-instinct that something was not right? Flashlight. Would use of that flashlight by the perp not have made JBR wonder what was happening?
Since it was *Christmas* what would be a best way to coerce a child from her bed to go downstairs and search for presents? I'm convinced the perp was wearing a Santa Clause outfit or at least sported a beard (either fake or real) ...or... it was a family member and 'coercion' was not necessary... but, why the flashlight?
Why would a perp have spent so much time in the house... awaken and coerce JBR to leave bed and go downstairs, make a pineapple meal in the kitchen, coerce or force JBR to the basement, locate an area/room to do the deed, do the deed and then escape? When was the note written... before or after the murder?
Foreign DNA? Unreliable find, since the crime scene and body et al were 'contaminated' from the start.
Upon finding JBR's body, did JR wonder if the perp might still be in the house, hiding? Since FW did not notice the blanket nor JBR's body on his first go-around in the basement did FW wonder if a perp might be hiding in the house and that they should perform a more-thorough search just-in-case? Did either suggest that to the other at *any time* after discovering JBR's body?
If the perp was someone who stalks pageants we might expect there would have been other incidents either before or since JBR. Have there been any other beauty pageant children in the United States kidnapped and/or murdered since JBR?
If not, then that could eliminate that angle. That leaves neighborhood folk, family- or work- friends or acquaintances and family members on the potential suspects list.
Regarding the reference to "$130,000" in the 'ransom note'... was there paperwork in the house that revealed JR's 'bonus' deposit of the same/similar value? I'm wondering if the perp who wrote the note simply took advantage of information they may have happened to find in the house.
The Pineapple aspect. Weird. If JBR was not eating pineapple with a family member, what made her trust whomever it was who fed it to her? If it was a stranger would JBR not have had a gut-instinct that something was not right? Flashlight. Would use of that flashlight by the perp not have made JBR wonder what was happening?
Since it was *Christmas* what would be a best way to coerce a child from her bed to go downstairs and search for presents? I'm convinced the perp was wearing a Santa Clause outfit or at least sported a beard (either fake or real) ...or... it was a family member and 'coercion' was not necessary... but, why the flashlight?
Why would a perp have spent so much time in the house... awaken and coerce JBR to leave bed and go downstairs, make a pineapple meal in the kitchen, coerce or force JBR to the basement, locate an area/room to do the deed, do the deed and then escape? When was the note written... before or after the murder?
Foreign DNA? Unreliable find, since the crime scene and body et al were 'contaminated' from the start.
otg
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Hey, Tad. I don't know what that little box is, but I'm not convinced it's the ballast for a fluorescent light. I looked online and was unable to find anything like it but a socket cover. The ballast should be between the electrical supply wire and the fluorescent bulbs to make sure the voltage is regulated. If the ballast isn't wired into the fixture, the fixture could be plugged directly into a regular socket with no ballast (not good).
BoldBear
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I haven't seen a ballast installed in an electrical box. I just thought this was the cover for a fuse. I have no idea what it would be used for. I have old HVAC rooms that still use these fuses with this type of configuration.
okay so he now comments,
That "he has seen similar devices on 'older' industrial equipement
but never in residential application."
He now says, "Otg, ya, most likely it's not a ballast as they are
usually found within the fixture."
BB - "It looks simlar to the posted photo except no small switch visible at bottom,
may be due to the angle of photo.
99 percent, it's a type of fuse."
That "he has seen similar devices on 'older' industrial equipement
but never in residential application."
He now says, "Otg, ya, most likely it's not a ballast as they are
usually found within the fixture."
BB - "It looks simlar to the posted photo except no small switch visible at bottom,
may be due to the angle of photo.
99 percent, it's a type of fuse."
BoldBear
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I saw the photos. At some point there had to be a device with a motor on it (probably a freezer) in that room. The photo I provided was a switch with a screw-in fuse off of Google. I selected it to show what was probably under the box. I honestly thought it was self evident that it wasn't the same box. Those fuses keep you from burning-up your motors if something goes wrong.
I cringe to see exposed wires like that. Whenever I saw the photos of the closet in the train room with the wire hanging down and the note of which circuit breaker it went to, I want to scream at the owners. They have kids and it's easy to turn on a fuse in the fuse box without realizing it leads to a disconnected wire. A note in a fuse box can easily be overlooked.
I also don't want to get into the details of industrial vs residential, what the codes are and the history and regulations behind household wiring. Do you really want to have a discussion about how old the home was and whether or not the succession of owners wired to code? Simply put, some owner of the home decided to put something like a freezer in that room. The fact that the light switch is next to the fuse tells me that the light switch was wired before the fuse so the circuit could be shut-off if anyone needed to replace the fuse or cut power to whatever device it was wired to. If I was doing the wiring, the two plugs to the side wouldn't have anything to do with the light switch and the fuse. That would leave power for tools or extra lights if someone was working on whatever equipment was in that room.
BoldBear,
Do you think one of those outlets controls the voltage to the light switch, that's the question here?
Days before Fleet White opened the wine-cellar door LHP and her daughter fetched items from the wine-cellar for Patsy, they reported no issues with the light switch, i.e. they found it.
Also with the way the door opens how could Fleet White miss the light switch with ambient light behind him, i.e. he has to open the door pretty far to look in.
Conventional theory has it Fleet White not only missed the light switch he missed JonBenet too.
I can buy all that if JonBenet had been wrapped in a dark blanket, but it was white and the gown was pink, I reckon they would have been visible to anyone who looked in the wine-cellar possibly not recognizable but definitely something to investigate?
Could Fleet White have been thwarted in his search for JonBenet by someone swithching off the power to the light switch, or does the wiring preclude this?
.
Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
This is from the A&E Doc in 2000, when Bill Kurtis enters the wine cellar and uses the switch to the left to turn on the light. This is from the same scene, notice the switch on the right is in the up position.
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UK Isn't / wasn't that the supposition
we are examining?
there's just one flat wire running to the 3 boxes
so I thought the overhead lights weren't hard wired?
need schematics lol
Tadpole12,
Right, I got that wrong then, sorry. Not certain what hard wired means in this context?
The history of this room suggests its makeshift, i.e. DIY Job, hence the flat wire, so I doubt if it is hard wired, i.e. shielded in tubes etc?
I'm still not 100% on whether Fleet White could have been denied access to the light switch via one of the other boxes being switched off?
IMO its smoking gun since if Fleet White says he flipped the switch and nothing happened then JR comes along and flipping the switch works for him well how does that work is it magic or ... ?
.
BoldBear
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Nope.
The idea being here that bottles of wine were stored in that room. But if you look at the question in the interrogation, it's about as vague as you can get. Fleet may have gone into the basement to get some red wine. Things were taken into the basement and just dumped. No one's really supposed to know where that room is and no one's giving specific instructions on how to get there.
I got an idea. How about for the party, the wine was dropped somewhere in the basement near the bottom of the stairs. That way someone goes into the basement without entering that room and finds the wine on one of the counter tops.
Of course, you're not going to let it stand there because we need to tie this into as many knots as we can. If someone thinks Fleet may have gone into that room for some undetermined party when they ran out of red wine, then he went into that room. It couldn't be that the wine was left anywhere else.
Conventional theory is that the police already searched the house so a thorough search wasn't necessary. JB didn't enter that room and lock the door behind her and no one was thinking murder at the time.
And again the police had searched the home. The thought doesn't jump out at me that they didn't do a good job so I need recheck their work. No one was going through the bags Patsy had left at the bottom of the spiral staircase because something may have been missed.
You really think they put a light switch near the door and a 2nd one further in the room and near the floor for the same light? You're not going to take me there. The light switch for the fuse was for whatever device they were running in that room. My best guess is a freezer. Older devices didn't have fuses built in. If the bearings started to freeze-up, a fuse would stop an electrical fire.
The outlets were installed for a purpose.
kaykay543
Well-Known Member
This is all too far fetched for me. Never does FW say he tried to turn the light on and it didn't work.
Experiments done at the house at the same time of day; showed the room was totally dark/black and you could not see into it. When John entered later in the day there would have been a lot more ambient light.
Experiments done at the house at the same time of day; showed the room was totally dark/black and you could not see into it. When John entered later in the day there would have been a lot more ambient light.
Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
Put on a blindfold and go to any room with a door in your house. 9/10 you are going to instinctively find the switch easily, because thats where the switch is supposed to be. In the wine cellar, contrary to the popular belief that there wasnt a light switch where it was supposed to be, there was, just inside the door where you would expect it to be. My question is, if FW did flip the switch, then why didnt the light illuminate? Did someone monkey with the other light switch on the right?
Youre right about there being more ambient light in the afternoon, especially coming from the window in the boiler room.
Did JR switch on the hallway light as well?
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