Documentary Claims Jesus Was Married

[accordn2me]

I am disappointed that Bill Dever didn't confront Jacobovici about breaking into the tomb. I expect to see Dever in a few weeks and I am definitely going to ask him about that.

Have you ever heard the saying, "It's easier to get forgiveness than it is to get permission."? It's the truth.

You said yourself he didn't have any proper training. Do you think they would have granted pemission had he asked for it?

As far as contamination or scientific reevaluation, it doesn't seem like scientists were the least bit interested in this tomb. I bet if they would have called Ted Koppel 27 years ago and told him what they found, they would have been on his show instead of Jacobovici. Just a guess....

 

[Dark Knight]

Have you ever heard the saying, "It's easier to get forgiveness than it is to get permission."? It's the truth.

That's an unwritten rule in radio, too, LOL! :crazy:

 

[tybee204]

I thought it was interesting and should be further investigated. I think it would be incredible if it could be proven to be Jesus and His family. I can understand how it would attack ego but not Faith.

 

[Cypros]

Have you ever heard the saying, "It's easier to get forgiveness than it is to get permission."? It's the truth.

You said yourself he didn't have any proper training. Do you think they would have granted pemission had he asked for it?

As far as contamination or scientific reevaluation, it doesn't seem like scientists were the least bit interested in this tomb. I bet if they would have called Ted Koppel 27 years ago and told him what they found, they would have been on his show instead of Jacobovici. Just a guess....

Of course the IAA would not have given him permission to open the tomb. He has no credentials. That he felt he could just break through a concrete seal because he was making a film demonstrates his arrogance and lack of respect for the law and the tomb itself.

As said many many times in this discussions. The Israelis haven't done anything about this tomb because it was nothing special. Archaeological discoveries are made every day in Israel and the museums are filled with millions of artifact, most of which are duplicates of each other. They viewed this tomb and its contents as just another 1st century tomb with ossuaries, some of which were engraved with common names. They properly documented the find, tended to the reburial of the bones and stored the boxes. The end.

As for the scientist's input in the panel discussion, I agree that they did not do much at all. However, it is difficult to make a complete argument when, just as you are getting into a topic and covering the background, Ted Koppel jumps in a changes the topic. I see this on virtually every TV show that involves interviews these days. All they want is sound bites. They don't want full discussions. I often wonder what is the point of arranging for experts if they are not allowed to say what they are there to say. I am sure that we will hear more complete observations from experts from all sides in the days to come (for those interested in spending more time on this). In the end, IMO, in comes down to what so many of us have been posting on here for the last week. It is possible, but improbable, and there is no way to prove it one way or the other. Nothing wrong with exploring the subject, but I do object to Jacobovici's methods and obvious goal to gain $$ and publicity for himself.

 

[Dark Knight]

I thought it was interesting and should be further investigated. I think it would be incredible if it could be proven to be Jesus and His family. I can understand how it would attack ego but not Faith.

Our faith is based on the resurrection, and this is an attempt to discredit that.

 

[Maybe So]

No, the topic is that Cameron claims that Jesus was never resurrected and is buried somewhere and that he has the coffin and everything, supposedly. Where he is going to get DNA to compare it to is beyond me, but Cameron's a nutcase to begin with. I wonder if Geraldo will be there with him? BAHAHAHAA!

I can just see a TV special with Geraldo and the opening of the tomb of Jesus.....and finding nothing in it....LOL

 

[LovelyPigeon]

I posted this article a few pages back, but adding it again, since there are questions of whether the producers of the documentary should or could be prosecuted for entering the tomb. I hope the tomb will be extensively explored, documented, filmed, etc

The film of the actual tomb was just fascinating! I think most Christians are only familiar with church literature that includes drawings of imaginary tombs, rather than what 1st century tombs in Jerusalem actually looked like and about the stone ossuaries that remains were put into after decomposing for a year or so.

Israel may open 'Jesus tomb' to public
By ETGAR LEFKOVITS AND DAVID HOROVITZ
Israeli authorities say they are prepared to consider opening to the public a 2,000-year-old burial tomb in Jerusalem's East Talpiot neighborhood which is said by the makers of a new documentary to have likely been the final resting place of Jesus of Nazareth, his mother, partner Mary Magdalene, son, and other members of his family.

The Israel Antiquities Authority (IAA), responsible for the tomb - which was first uncovered during construction of the neighborhood in 1980 - said it would be up to the Jerusalem Municipality to make such a decision. And municipality spokesman Gidi Schmerling told The Jerusalem Post on Monday night that if a request were made to open the site, it would be considered. --->>

But the Israeli archeologist responsible for the 1980 excavation, Prof. Amos Kloner, on Monday night intensified his criticism of this assertion, lambasting the documentary as "absolute nonsense."

At their press conference, Jacobovici said he now "dreamed" of the opportunity for the tomb to be more properly excavated. He and a colleague were able to enter the tomb, which lies sealed beneath a rectangular slab between rows of buildings in East Talpiot, only briefly during the filming of the documentary, with the permission of neighbors. They were asked to leave and reseal it by an IAA official who was called to the site.

"We rediscovered the tomb," Jacobovici noted, adding that many had believed erroneously it was destroyed during the 1980s' construction. "The tomb is there! There may be inscriptions in the tomb," he said, along with all kinds of other evidence including bones that might bolster, or shatter, the documentary's claims. "This is the beginning." --->>

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1171894526073&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

 

[Dark Knight]

I posted this article a few pages back, but adding it again, since there are questions of whether the producers of the documentary should or could be prosecuted for entering the tomb. I hope the tomb will be extensively explored, documented, filmed, etc

The film of the actual tomb was just fascinating! I think most Christians are only familiar with church literature that includes drawings of imaginary tombs, rather than what 1st century tombs in Jerusalem actually looked like and about the stone ossuaries that remains were put into after decomposing for a year or so.

Israel may open 'Jesus tomb' to public
By ETGAR LEFKOVITS AND DAVID HOROVITZ
Israeli authorities say they are prepared to consider opening to the public a 2,000-year-old burial tomb in Jerusalem's East Talpiot neighborhood which is said by the makers of a new documentary to have likely been the final resting place of Jesus of Nazareth, his mother, partner Mary Magdalene, son, and other members of his family.

The Israel Antiquities Authority (IAA), responsible for the tomb - which was first uncovered during construction of the neighborhood in 1980 - said it would be up to the Jerusalem Municipality to make such a decision. And municipality spokesman Gidi Schmerling told The Jerusalem Post on Monday night that if a request were made to open the site, it would be considered. --->>

But the Israeli archeologist responsible for the 1980 excavation, Prof. Amos Kloner, on Monday night intensified his criticism of this assertion, lambasting the documentary as "absolute nonsense."

At their press conference, Jacobovici said he now "dreamed" of the opportunity for the tomb to be more properly excavated. He and a colleague were able to enter the tomb, which lies sealed beneath a rectangular slab between rows of buildings in East Talpiot, only briefly during the filming of the documentary, with the permission of neighbors. They were asked to leave and reseal it by an IAA official who was called to the site.

"We rediscovered the tomb," Jacobovici noted, adding that many had believed erroneously it was destroyed during the 1980s' construction. "The tomb is there! There may be inscriptions in the tomb," he said, along with all kinds of other evidence including bones that might bolster, or shatter, the documentary's claims. "This is the beginning." --->>

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1171894526073&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

I have seen numerous pictures of 1st century tombs as both a Protestant and a Catholic. I don't recall many drawings. I have even seen pictures of the 2 tombs that claim to be Jesus' actual burial tomb. But yes, if anyone hasn't seen such pictures, or visited the Holy Land, they might find that aspect interesting.

 

[accordn2me]

Our faith is based on the resurrection, and this is an attempt to discredit that.

Is it based on the resurrection? Or is it based on the immaculate conception? Or is it based on the miracles? Or is it based on Jesus' message?

Don't you think Christianity could win a lot more souls if it were more focused on the latter, and didn't tell people they are not "real" Christians unless they proclaim belief in the supernatural aspects? Some people cannot wrap their scientific minds around the unprovables. They get hostile and defensive when they are told that belief in these things is the only way into the Kingdom of Heaven. Then, they throw the baby (Jesus and the Word) out with the bathwater.

 

[tybee204]

Our faith is based on the resurrection, and this is an attempt to discredit that.

If these were proven to be the remains of Jesus and His family would you lose your Faith? Is this aspect of Christ's story more important then the Word or the message he put forth to mankind and sacrificed His life for?

If mans translations and interpretations of the Gospels are wrong it dosent eliminate the mission of Christ and the power of His Ministry. If they are the bones of Jesus it just means man screwed up. The power of His message has survived 2000 years. That speaks for itself. IMO of course

 

[Pepper]

The documentary was on the Discovery Channel last night. I watched some of it, but fell asleep before it was over. I'm sure it will be repeated numerous times. I thought it was fascinating, what I saw of it.

Even if this was proved beyond a doubt scientifically, I don't think it debunks Christianity (from my perspective). If you view religion, i.e. Christianity as a teaching or a philosophy, or a guideline for behavior, then none of this really matters. It's only when you get into the "history" of exactly what happened, when, why, and most importantly how, that scientific findings can mess with your beliefs - if you choose to let it.

From my perspective, it doesn't matter whether or not Jesus' remains rotted in a tomb, or evaporated on "Easter Sunday." Nor does it matter whether Jesus' remains carried the DNA of Mary AND Joseph, or MARY and some other dude, or MARY ALONE. It is the teachings that I find inspiring.

 

[tybee204]

Is it based on the resurrection? Or is it based on the immaculate conception? Or is it based on the miracles? Or is it based on Jesus' message?

Don't you think Christianity could win a lot more souls if it were more focused on the latter, and didn't tell people they are not "real" Christians unless they proclaim belief in the supernatural aspects? Some people cannot wrap their scientific minds around the unprovables. They get hostile and defensive when they are told that belief in these things is the only way into the Kingdom of Heaven. Then, they throw the baby (Jesus and the Word) out with the bathwater.

It is my opinion that the Resurrection and Imaculate Conception are interpretations promoted to show the Church as the one true religion above and beyond previous manifestations. To elevate Christ above past dispensations and Prophets. The greater the miracle the more powerful the Prophet.

 

[Dark Knight]

Is it based on the resurrection? Or is it based on the immaculate conception? Or is it based on the miracles? Or is it based on Jesus' message?

Don't you think Christianity could win a lot more souls if it were more focused on the latter, and didn't tell people they are not "real" Christians unless they proclaim belief in the supernatural aspects? Some people cannot wrap their scientific minds around the unprovables. They get hostile and defensive when they are told that belief in these things is the only way into the Kingdom of Heaven. Then, they throw the baby (Jesus and the Word) out with the bathwater.

According to Scripture itself, without the Resurrection, our faith is for nothing.

ETA: 1 Corinthians 15 to be more specific

 

[michelle]

. Seems this is making a lot of Christians anxious for some reason. Sounds like some of you would be all for "crucifying" these guys. Jesus would probably be glad some of you weren't around in his time.

I think Jesus would have loved to have me around in his time, I am alot of fun!

 

[Glow]

This is just a side note.....

probably most of you know, but since I did not I will post it for anyone else that doesn't. I always thought that the "Immaculate Conception" referred to Jesus. That is not so. That is the Catholic teaching that Mary was conceived without sin. The teaching about Jesus is called the "Virgin Birth"


I never quite thought about it this way but I think I have an affinity for Catholics. Two of my best friends through life, were both Catholic. One Patty(High School) was German, the other Theresa (current)is Italian married to an Orthodox Jew. I especially like Theresa's home because nearly every day is a feast day! They have taught me many thinigs about their very intricate faith.

 

[Nova]

This is just a side note.....

probably most of you know, but since I did not I will post it for anyone else that doesn't. I always thought that the "Immaculate Conception" referred to Jesus. That is not so. That is the Catholic teaching that Mary was conceived without sin. The teaching about Jesus is called the "Virgin Birth."

Bears repeating, Glow. Though I know differently now, I think most Protestants assume the "Immaculate Conception" refers to the conception of Christ.

 

[Nova]

According to Scripture itself, without the Resurrection, our faith is for nothing.

ETA: 1 Corinthians 15 to be more specific

DK, if it could be proven that the ossuary in question did indeed hold the bones of Jesus, I would still have faith that He was resurrected in spirit.

 

[LovelyPigeon]

I have seen numerous pictures of 1st century tombs as both a Protestant and a Catholic. I don't recall many drawings. I have even seen pictures of the 2 tombs that claim to be Jesus' actual burial tomb. But yes, if anyone hasn't seen such pictures, or visited the Holy Land, they might find that aspect interesting.

It's interesting, at the least, that Jerusalem already has 2 locations that claim to be the tomb of Jesus. One is the Garden Tomb, thought to have been on the property belonging to Joseph of Arimaethea, and the other is the Holy Sepulchre, which the mother of Constantine claimed to find (along with the crosses of Jesus and the 2 thieves crucified on each side of him) about 300 years after Jesus died.

The previous tombs of Jesus weren't found by archeologists but by individual believers hundreds to thousands of years later, based on what they believed the NT said compared to what they saw in the landscape and heard from legends around Jerusalem.

The tomb located in 1980 in the southern Jerusalem sector is at least the 3rd location with claims as a possible site of the tomb of Jesus. The Holy Sepulchre location is in the northwest sector of Jerusalem. The Garden Tomb is also in the northwestern sector. Does anyone know the distance apart the locations are?

(Jerusalem also has a tomb that is claimed to belong to Mary, the mother of Jesus, near the Mount of Olives. Other locations, like Ephesus, make similar claims.)

 

[LovelyPigeon]

According to Scripture itself, without the Resurrection, our faith is for nothing.

ETA: 1 Corinthians 15 to be more specific

1 Cor 15 also says that there is a body that is "corruptible" (human, flesh, bones, etc that isn't permanent but returns to dust) and a body that is spiritual (everlasting, eternal), and that "flesh and blood" don't go to heaven (v50).

It seems very unlikely that anyone who dies and then goes to heaven (or otherwise) will go in the skin/bones condition of a living human body. And the NT describes a "new" body which lasts eternally that isn't like the human body on earth.

Although it isn't described that way in the NT, it seems possible that a person (Jesus included) who comes alive after death and then goes into heaven (a spiritual 'nother dimension whose existence that isn't seen by human eyes) might just leave their bones and other body parts behind when they enter a purely spiritual existence

 

[accordn2me]

This is just a side note.....

probably most of you know, but since I did not I will post it for anyone else that doesn't. I always thought that the "Immaculate Conception" referred to Jesus. That is not so. That is the Catholic teaching that Mary was conceived without sin. The teaching about Jesus is called the "Virgin Birth"


I never quite thought about it this way but I think I have an affinity for Catholics. Two of my best friends through life, were both Catholic. One Patty(High School) was German, the other Theresa (current)is Italian married to an Orthodox Jew. I especially like Theresa's home because nearly every day is a feast day! They have taught me many thinigs about their very intricate faith.

I did not know this. Thank you for posting it. My boyfriend who is Catholic did not know it either. When I asked him what it was,:laugh: he said, "In Sports? Montana to Clark (holding hands over head as if catching a football)." When I specified the field was religion and the word was conception he stated that was how Jesus was conceived. So I learned something, taught it to someone else, and got a good laugh today. Hope your day is great too! Thanks again.