Does Skyline school bear any responsibility?

[wondering1]

I say no. This is a school in an area where something like this, I assume, either hasn't happened in a long time or has never happened at that school. Yes, it stinks that the staff was easily tricked by a confusing appointment, but I would never blame them for what happened to Kyron. TH took advantage of that school and it's lax security practices to do what she did. I am not going to blame the school when it was played by a cunning and manipulative woman, or even if by a predator. There is no way they could have known that he was kidnapped. I am sure every staff member feels terrible about what happened, and I am sure the kids are traumatized. It would add insult to injury to then blame them for what happened.

So no, I don't put any responsibility on them. I am sure they have learned their lesson and something like this won't happen again. I am sure they have tightened security and no teacher is just going to rely on a parent ever again for an appointment. I am sure they have to sign and verify the day and time a kid won't be there and even sign the kid out on the day of on top of that.

The responsibility should be shouldered by the person who did this, whether it's TH or a predator, and not the school. I see the school as a victim in all of this. How does it do any good to blame them for what happened to Kyron? It doesn't, and they shouldn't be blamed for it.

ITA. And I think it's a shame that everything has to be double and triple checked and dozens of costly hoops need to be jumped through to avoid charges of negligence and the inevitable law suit. Humans are, well, human. And just because something awful has happened doesn't mean it must be someone's fault. jmoo

 

[Kat010]

Yes, they bear responsibility, regardless of whether or not Terri was involved. They should have had a sign out procedure in place, as well as a parent call-in procedure for children who are not coming to school at all.

There should have been a process in place whereby when the teacher's roll hit the office, somebody compared the ones marked 'absent' against the sign out sheet, and list of students whose parents had called them in sick.

Any student not accounted for should have immediately had a call home, and if the parents can't be reached, then a call to 911 to report the child missing unless/until they're accounted for.

It seems to me that's just common sense to protect the children for whom you are legally (I'll leave out morally) responsible.

This is just plain common sense.

Brilliant post!

 

[curiousgirl2010]

I'm a little confused that it was so easy for this kid to go missing from school and nobody seemed to notify the parents.

I went to private school and it was SO hard to leave school. We only had 1 door to leave school with security guards. In order to be able to leave the school from kindergarten to my senior year, we had to have a note signed by the school's principal.

If a mother or stepmother left the school with the kid, the security guards would have seen them. And the kid would only have been able to leave the school with the parent.

Are schools in Oregon open? That's very weird to me. My school was SUPER strict and there was basically ONE door to come in or out.

I had to jump the fence once to runaway from school when I was a freshman. And the security was SO tight that literally 10 minutes after I was gone my mom called me to ask where the heck I was because the principal had called her saying I was gone.

So yeah, even though I hate that security at that time, I'm thankful for it now.

 

[BeanE]

I am not going to blame the school when it was played by a cunning and manipulative woman, or even if by a predator.

BBM.

Speechless.

 

[curiousgirl2010]

WS is acting weird and it double posted! Sorry.

 

[Kat010]

With due respect, Wondering, things don't need to be triple-checked because of potential lawsuits.

They need to be checked in order to provide safety for children left in the school's care.

 

[BeanE]

ITA. And I think it's a shame that everything has to be double and triple checked and dozens of costly hoops need to be jumped through to avoid charges of negligence and the inevitable law suit. Humans are, well, human. And just because something awful has happened doesn't mean it must be someone's fault. jmoo

How about a few cheap hoops to avoid losing yet another child? They're human too.

 

[citigirl]

I'm going to weigh in here and say as a teacher and ex-administrator, I think the school does bear some responsibility. The check-out system sounds extremely lax to me. As does the crowd control for the science fair.

Schools really have to be vigilant about these things because, besides whatever may have happened to Kyron, there are common dangers to kids when procedures are not followed. For example, often a non-custodial parent will try to sign out a student against the permission of the custodial parent. Kids will sometimes try to play hooky by not arriving at school.

Schools need procedures in place to prevent these kinds of things. They need the names of adults who have permission to pick up students and IDs need to be checked. Parents need to be notified when a students does not arrive at school.

I am really having a hard time believing the story we have heard about the teacher is true. I just cannot imagine a teacher thinking a student is in the bathroom and then forgetting about him for the rest of the day. We track these little guys multiple times throughout the day. There has got to be another reason she crossed him off her mind's list. Maybe it was the doctor's appointment.

In any event, I believe there is a lot more that teachers and staff at the school know about that day's events. And you are right, Aedrys, there will certainly be some change in attendance policy at the school.

 

[Herding Cats]

BBM.

Speechless.

Echo-ed.

Sigh.

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[wondering1]

With due respect, Wondering, things don't need to be triple-checked because of potential lawsuits.

They need to be checked in order to provide safety for children left in the school's care.

With all due respect, that is a HUGE part of the reason why. Most of the rest of the reason is to obtain federal funding by making sure children are in attendance and avoiding truancy Children are, by and large, very safe at school (from abuctions at least) without any precautions whatsoever. Stranger abductions from an actual school building are beyond rare. jmeo

 

[cypress]

If it turns out Kyron was taken by a sexual predator, and Terri is absolutely innocent of any involvement in Kyron's disappearance or ultimate fate, will it change your minds about the responsibility of the school in this case?

 

[curiousgirl2010]

Can someone answer me if Kyron's school was open? Students could just wander off? There isn't a door in which all students go into?

 

[Kat010]

With all due respect, that is a HUGE part of the reason why. Most of the rest of the reason is to obtain federal funding by making sure children are in attendance and avoiding truancy Children are, by and large, very safe at school (from abuctions at least) without any precautions whatsoever. Stranger abductions from an actual school building are beyond rare. jmeo

Again, with due respect, Dr. Phil would disagree with you that such cases are "beyond rare."

C'mon over--we're looking at cases about abductions and schools.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111299"]Abductions or Attempted Abductions Involving Schools - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

And if only 1 out of 1,000 children is snatched from school, that's one too many for those left behind. I know we can't make the world a totally safe place, but common sense and good policies and procedures are minimum requirements, IMHO.

 

[wondering1]

How about a few cheap hoops to avoid losing yet another child? They're human too.

we'll just have to agree to disagree on this. School budgets for actual teaching are cut and cut and cut. Stranger abductions from inside a school rarely happen. And yes, I believe there is some risk/benefit analysis that has to go into these decisions. And I have children in elementary school. I don't worry about them being abducted. If it happens, it will be a fluke and the fault of the perp. Not of me or the school. And I don't want the budget for my kids' actual education cut anymore so that video cameras can be installed to prevent the remote possibility that one of them will be abducted by a stranger from inside the school. Needless to say, I'm not a worrier jmoo

 

[mydailyopinions]

The only way I would NOT blame this school is if someone can prove to me that Kyron never even stepped foot on the school grounds that morning.

I agree with BeanE 100% on the procedures for signing kids out. And also believe that no matter who you are, parent, friend, you should be made to sign into the school at any visit, and sign out on your way out the door. Might I add that an administrator needs to be right there all day long as witness to people coming and going, signing children in and out of school, if in fact cameras are not available.

In this day and time, there are no excuses.:twocents:

 

[Haeve]

I honestly can't say at this point as I don't think we have the whole story. So much hinges on those first couple hours of school, which is why I think LE is keeping info about those critical hours close to their chests.

Unfortunately I do agree that if the school/SD feels it is responsible in any way they would definitely be doing a lot of CY[Their]A. This is a large school district and at the very least there is too much at stake (money, public image, etc.) to have a general panic on their hands. But PPS (Portland Public Schools) is likely just as confused as we are. The fallout, if it is eventually proved the school was negligent, is going to have repercussions for a lot of people. It's sad they have to worry about stuff like that vs. simply worrying about what happened to Kyron. JMHO, I have no idea how PPS is approaching this.

 

[BeanE]

At least, thank God, the school immediately acknowledged their responsbility, and put new procedures in place to start better protecting all the children there.

 

[wondering1]

Again, with due respect, Dr. Phil would disagree with you that such cases are "beyond rare."

C'mon over--we're looking at cases about abductions and schools.

Abductions or Attempted Abductions Involving Schools - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

And if only 1 out of 1,000 children is snatched from school, that's one too many for those left behind. I know we can't make the world a totally safe place, but common sense and good policies and procedures are minimum requirements, IMHO.

I went over there and I'm seeing links to a few abductions. Most, if not all of which are from outside the school, like the bus stop. The only one I saw from in the school, sorta, was a lure outside to a car in the parking lot. Not changing my opinion that they are beyond rare just yet.

btw, the etan paitz case was recently reopened. I grew up in the tri-state area and remember that case very clearly But he was between home and the bus stop in NYC when it happened. Hardly comparable, imo and jmoo

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/05/26/new.york.1979.missing.child/index.html?hpt=C2

eta: I like dr. phil, but he's not my go to guy for responsible reporting or advocacy. jmoo, also

 

[cluciano63]

I have been saying all along, wait and see, as far as whether the school is partly responsible, until we know more about the so-called appointment. But I think it is fair to say that this little school considered itself to be a little country haven of sorts, for the kids, and that perhaps the parents liked the fact that it was less militarized than larger schools as far as rules, sign-ins, etc...whether right or wrong. I think if the parents objected to the way the school was run, it would have been an issue before this happened and we have not heard that it was "an accident waiting to happen" from any of the parents, to my knowledge.

Still, I think it TP did in fact ask where Kyron was, and received the answer he said he did, then yes, something clearly was not working in this school as a child of seven should not be permitted free-range wanderings to bathrooms, etc. without asking permission. I understand that a child could slip away for a moment from a busy teacher, but not the lack of concern in the the response we have heard, per TP.

Institutions are blamed all the time for things that happen within their premises; I for one am against the law suit craze, but finding some fault with the school, if the above is true, would be far less ridiculous than many other suits that have been won in the courts.

 

[Kat010]

Security cameras are cheap.

If I'm recalling correctly, aren't there 3 doors to the outside in the area of the gym and classrooms?

Security cameras could easily be put on all 3 doors for less than $1,000.

And darned well worth it.