Ebola outbreak - general thread #9

[jjenny]

That 's really harsh, IMO.

I actually find it quite shocking myself. How could the doctors in Africa not realize that first test for Ebola can be inconclusive/negative?
It was widely reported here. Sounds like after first test came back negative everybody (and their mama) were hugging this doctor. Which isn't good. Now they are all under quarantine. And he was send home after first test came back negative. So the delay in treatment really hurt his chances of survival.

 

[SStarr33]

That 's really harsh, IMO.

It is, but I think it is true. Brantley for one had a negative first test.

 

[SteveS]

It was widely reported here. Sounds like after first test came back negative everybody (and their mama) were hugging this doctor. Which isn't good. Now they are all under quarantine. And he was send home after first test came back negative.

If he had such a light viral load that they couldn't even detect it in a test, I bet he couldn't infect them with a hug either. But it will be interesting to see how it plays out, and whether the quarantines are more of those "over-abundance of caution" moves we've seen being made.

 

[jjenny]

If he had such a light viral load that they couldn't even detect it in a test, I bet he couldn't infect them with a hug either. But it will be interesting to see how it plays out, and whether the quarantines are more of those "over-abundance of caution" moves we've seen being made.

But he was already symptomatic and his symptoms got worse while he was not in quarantine. Since he was send home after the test came back negative. Presumably he was infectious during this time.

 

[faw720]

I still hold out hope that they can learn something from every new case they treat here. That may be foolish, but hope costs nothing.

 

[jjenny]

So now I see his wife says he had two negative tests before a positive one. So maybe that's why doctors assumed he was negative.
It was after the second test came back negative? Were the first two negative tests done several days apart? Makes me question how well was the testing done. Apparently it was by some new lab? Or did his viral load stay undetectable for days at first?

"At first, Salia thought he had malaria or typhoid. His wife says he had two negative tests for Ebola before the third came back positive."

http://www.kens5.com/story/news/201...cted-ebola-in-sierra-leone-has-died/19162035/

 

[SteveS]

But he was already symptomatic and his symptoms got worse while he was not in quarantine. Since he was send home after the test came back negative. Presumably he was infectious during this time.

I would question that presumption, that he was infectious during the duration of that period.

The medical point that's been oft-repeated is that a person is "not infectious" prior to showing symptoms. Accepting that as fact, that still doesn't mean that they are then automatically infectious one second after the first symptom occurs, like an off-on event. It may still be a "while" before there's any actual infectiousness.

In fact, from the pattern we've seen in the US cases, the disease is being transmitted by contact that occurs DAYS later - after not only symptoms occur, but then after several MORE days, which I'm guessing has given time to allow the viral load to strengthen to a level that will infect someone. That sort of anecdotal pattern further suggests to me that when the CDC says to start quarantine with the first symptoms, they've erred with a super-abundance of caution, and that at that point there's still a cushion of several days before anyone can possibly catch anything.

It will be interesting to me if this case confirms that thinking, or shows it to be false.

 

[SteveS]

I made a misstatement above. Mr. Duncan began feeling symptoms 2 days before he went to the ER, and 2 days after that was admitted. That's 4 days after feeling the first symptoms, not 8 as I said earlier.

He was pretty sick, however, when he was finally admitted and treatment began.

Re Salia, for comparison

OMAHA, Neb. (AP) - A surgeon who contracted Ebola in his native Sierra Leone did not receive aggressive treatment until nearly two weeks after he first started showing symptoms - a delay that doctors said probably made it impossible for anyone to save his life.

Dr. Martin Salia was in the 13th day of his illness when he reached Omaha on Saturday. He had waited three days to be formally diagnosed after an initial test for Ebola came back negative. He then waited five more days to be flown to the United States.

 

[Yoda]

The special representative of the UN secretary-general for Ebola emergency response has been found dead.
Marcel Kanyankore Rudasingwa, a Rwandan, was found dead in his hotel room in the Guinean capital of Conakry. He had recently been appointed by UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon to coordinate anti-Ebola efforts in Guinea.

Rudasingwa is the second international personality who died mysteriously in Guinea. The head of the Cuban medical delegation, Graseciliano Jazbatolo, also died in similar circumstances.

http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/892359.shtml

 

[Yoda]

The head of the U.N. Ebola Emergency Response Mission (UNMEER) in Guinea, one of the countries at the epicenter of the outbreak, died suddenly on Monday of natural causes, the U.N. mission and authorities in Guinea said.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/17/us-health-ebola-guinea-idUSKCN0J11UT20141117

 

[Yoda]

NEW DELHI: Officials have quarantined a man who was cured of Ebola in Liberia.

The ministry said in a statement that the Indian national had been shown to be negative for Ebola in tests conforming to World Health Organisation (WHO) guidelines, but had been quarantined as a precautionary measure when he arrived at New Delhi airport on November 10. Later, tests of his semen detected traces of the virus.

:silenced:


http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ed-at-Delhi-airport/articleshow/45194610.cms?

 

[Yoda]

Weird.

A woman who dropped dead at Amy Professional Hair Braidig had blood 'coming from her face, nose and mouth' said an eyewitness
The woman had recently traveled from Guinea three weeks ago, and was being monitored for Ebola said a worker at the salon
She was at the salon visiting the owner and was said to have died of a heart attack said the same worker

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ood-coming-face-nose-mouth.html#ixzz3JTmiUMZv
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-drops-dead-blood-coming-face-nose-mouth.html

 

[jjenny]

Weird.



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ood-coming-face-nose-mouth.html#ixzz3JTmiUMZv
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook[/FONT][/COLOR]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-drops-dead-blood-coming-face-nose-mouth.html

Bleeding from face, nose and mouth? That's not a symptom of a heart attack.

 

[Yoda]

Bleeding from face, nose and mouth? That's not a symptom of a heart attack.

I'm trying to figure out how they determined heart attack so quickly.

 

[Yoda]

T

he special representative of the UN secretary-general for Ebola emergency response has been found dead.

Marcel Kanyankore Rudasingwa, a Rwandan, was found dead in his hotel room in the Guinean capital of Conakry. He had recently been appointed by UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon to coordinate anti-Ebola efforts in Guinea.

Rudasingwa is the second international personality who died mysteriously in Guinea. The head of the Cuban medical delegation, Graseciliano Jazbatolo, also died in similar circumstances.

Quoting myself. I wonder if the brooklyn heartattack could be similar to these two officials that died in Guinea? Is this a different disease? A different ebola strain? Or a weird coincidence.

 

[CarmelEyesD]

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/nyc-de...death-woman-monitored-ebola/story?id=27011543

A New York City official briefed on the woman's death told ABC News, "Earlier today, an individual who came to the U.S. from one of the three Ebola-impacted nations in West Africa within last three weeks died of an apparent non-Ebola condition. This individual at no time showed any symptoms of Ebola.

 

[jjenny]

T



Quoting myself. I wonder if the brooklyn heartattack could be similar to these two officials that died in Guinea? Is this a different disease? A different ebola strain? Or a weird coincidence.

Ebola could cause a heart attack. So them dying out of heart attack wouldn't rule out Ebola as the cause of a heart attack.

"There are also short term post-viral effects, Lea said. Some with Ebola might experience acute renal failure, which usually is reversible, but not always. Others could have brain bleeds leading to stroke or bleeds leading to heart attacks."

Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/news/local/article3952318.html#storylink=cpy
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/article3952318.html

 

[jjenny]

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/nyc-de...death-woman-monitored-ebola/story?id=27011543

A New York City official briefed on the woman's death told ABC News, "Earlier today, an individual who came to the U.S. from one of the three Ebola-impacted nations in West Africa within last three weeks died of an apparent non-Ebola condition. This individual at no time showed any symptoms of Ebola.

I dunno. Bleeding from the mouse and nose could be a symptom of Ebola. So how can they say individual at no time showed any symptoms of Ebola?

 

[Yoda]

Ebola could cause a heart attack. So them dying out of heart attack wouldn't rule out Ebola as the cause of a heart attack.

"There are also short term post-viral effects, Lea said. Some with Ebola might experience acute renal failure, which usually is reversible, but not always. Others could have brain bleeds leading to stroke or bleeds leading to heart attacks."

Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/news/local/article3952318.html#storylink=cpy
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/article3952318.html

So you are saying it is possible, that these officials who died of heart attacks, could have had ebola which caused the heart attacks?
How do they determine someone died from a heart attack? Are they doing autopsies over there right now? Could the virus Attack their heart, and if they had a preexisting condition like mitral valve prolapse, could the virus do damage quickly without typical symptoms?
Thanks in advance if you have any answers!

 

[SteveS]

Marcel Kanyankore Rudasingwa, a Rwandan, was found dead in his hotel room in the Guinean capital of Conakry. He had recently been appointed by UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon to coordinate anti-Ebola efforts in Guinea.

Rudasingwa is the second international personality who died mysteriously in Guinea. The head of the Cuban medical delegation, Graseciliano Jazbatolo, also died in similar circumstances.

Quoting myself. I wonder if the brooklyn heartattack could be similar to these two officials that died in Guinea? Is this a different disease? A different ebola strain? Or a weird coincidence.

The "two officials" story is apparently an attempt to make a big deal out of nothing.

The story uses the words "died mysteriously" as if something was amiss and there's some sort of pattern to investigate. But the "rest of the story" is that he died of natural causes at age 59. I suspect the other death was just as benign, except for the reporter's attempt to make a big deal out of two random deaths.

"The United Nations Mission for Ebola Emergency Response today (yesterday) mourns the passing of Marcel Rudasingwa, Assistant Secretary-General and the Mission's Emergency Crisis Manager in Guinea. A Rwandan national, Rudasingwa passed on suddenly from natural causes," Farhan Haq, the Deputy Spokesman for the UN Secretary-General, told journalists at the UN Headquarters in New York yesterday.

Now we're trying to link an unrelated death in a different country to those two random otherwise-insignificant deaths in Guinea? Sheesh.