Evidence revealed during the course of the Wrongful Death action

[Mollyandme]

This is in response to lash, for some
Reason my phone is acting up
And I can't quote so I apologize!

No I had no clue what LHK was until
I read your post and googled it with RZs last name and found what you are referring too. And yes, that is not right to publically harass others. I had no idea many of you were targeted that way and as a human being it bothers and upsets me to see fellow posters publicly mocked on a clearly agenda driven forum. It certainly explains some of the tension and after browsing around for ten mins to see the posts you referred to I now need a shower.

this is the only place I research or discuss this case aside from looking up California civil procedures and previously federal procedures. I hope I do not engage in baiting bc it's disrespectful and I have been a member here long enough to know the rules. If it appears that way it's not my intent and please tell a mod so they can let me know. Websleuths is the only place I discuss true crime due to the rules and the ability to agree to disagree respectfully. I don't see the point of a discussion when every single person has the same opinion, even if it's a small detail where there's a difference of opinion, everyone has brought good points to this forum at some point IMO.

I know many don't agree with my personal opinion on this specific case but I have tried and will try to remain respectful. This is the first case I have followed where my opinion is in the "minority" but I really just want the truth to come out regardless of what it ultimately is for all parties involved. I should have added a "jmo" about feeling ganged up on and not stated it as fact and for that I will apologize, but I won't apologize for my unpopular opinion on RZ's death. I don't think it's victim blaming to agree with the manner of death as suicide and to point to the investigation as evidence and past behaviors that were explored during the initial investigation. likewise, the plaintiffs will be doing the same investigations on the defendants and Dinas past has been discussed as well which is to be expected in a WDS where she is listed as a defendant

I have learned a lot from reading the different view points and even if no one agrees with mine, maybe at least it's helpful in some way to see what others with a different opinion think and why. If not, I totally understand and respect the good old "scroll and roll."

Thank you for your thoughtful post Lash. Have a happy new year

 

[Mollyandme]

This is in response to screechers recent post about Dina, for some reason I can't copy and paste..

I have not seen any links to back up these facts, just general comments in the past in regards to your comments about Dina but I will go read further back for more info.

In using that same list you wrote, wouldn't that also make the plaintiffs filled with displaced hate and rage towards the defendants by filing a WDS against them after an investigation ruled their sisters death a suicide? I am not being snarky I seriously don't understand how one standard applies to one party but not the other.

In terms of a media blitz, the same logic could be used that the Zahau family had displaced hate and rage towards the investigators, medical examiner, etc as evidenced by the dr. Phil show which is just one example.

how is Dina wanting answers about her sons death any different than the Zahaus? Imo, both sides probably have some displaced anger and I'm not going to judge either one for it. They have the right to feel how they feel.

Hopefully during discovery, depositions, etc, facts and admissible evidence as to what happened will be presented to the judge who can determine whether there's enough for a jury to reasonably find In the plaintiffs favor.

 

[Mollyandme]

Now, could we please get back to discussing the Evidence revealed during this WDS?

Do the Zahau have any evidence at all to prove that anyone other than Rebecca was in the courtyard or her office that morning?

Or is it, as I maintain, a case made up out of lies, half-truths, manufactured information, and the intentional avoidance of truthful information about Rebecca's suicide?

The judge noted that the plaintiffs case is circumstantial and will rely mainly on expert witnesses so until any of that is disclosed I doubt we will see any evidence to support the theory and specific facts the plaintiffs claim in the WDS. IMO, if they make it past summary judgement, the plaintiffs will have a hard time meeting their burden of proof for any jury to find in their favor. How do you get past the initial ruling of suicide and many of the investigative details that confirmed that ruling for investigators which the public is still
Not aware of, and then find that the three defendants are responsible in the ways laid out in the WDS when they were cleared by investigators and at least one has an airtight alibi. I just think it's too big of a leap for a jury to make. IMO

Also, IMO, they don't have any evidence against the defendants than the initial investigators haven't already explored and ruled out and are relying on paid exert witnesses to find ways to support their theory.

That's jmo from what we have seen so far from various motions and depositions

 

[Imp]

Here's hoping 2017 brings justice for Rebecca and the Zahau family.

As botched as the "death investigation" was, with its immediate rush to conclude suicide and make all evidence fit that conclusion, I'm truly grateful the case against the defendants will finally be heard within the next several months. Whatever the outcome, and I do think the "death investigation" was sufficiently corrupted and compromised that the defendants may walk, I hope the Zahaus can find peace knowing they did everything they could under impossible circumstances to seek justice for Rebecca.

I also hope her murderers and those who colluded with them never get a good night's sleep again in their lives.

 

[LuckyLucy2]

^ I have a feeling the Defendants are and will be sleeping just fine knowing that the Zahaus' salacious and fabricated charges will not hold up to the light of day and this ridiculous case will soon be over!

Happy 2017 everyone! :newyear:

 

[Betty P]

Justice for Rebecca Zahau! Best wishes for a Happy 2017!

:fireworks: :toastred: artyguy:

 

[*Lash*]

Happy New Year! I hope 2017 is good one!

:fireworks: :fireworks: :fireworks:



Justice for Rebecca!​

 

[Mollyandme]

Here's hoping 2017 brings justice for Rebecca and the Zahau family.

As botched as the "death investigation" was, with its immediate rush to conclude suicide and make all evidence fit that conclusion, I'm truly grateful the case against the defendants will finally be heard within the next several months. Whatever the outcome, and I do think the "death investigation" was sufficiently corrupted and compromised that the defendants may walk, I hope the Zahaus can find peace knowing they did everything they could under impossible circumstances to seek justice for Rebecca.

I also hope her murderers and those who colluded with them never get a good night's sleep again in their lives.

I don't see how the death investigation was "botched" "corrupted" or "compromised." There was not an immediate rush to conclude suicide. IIRC, one of the investigators that initially suspected this was a homicide quickly changed his mind after seeing her journal, but that didn't stop investigators from continuing the investigation for seven weeks to investigate the possibility of foul play, which there is proof they did investigate. Based on the totality of evidence uncovered during the investigation, including the autopsy report, RZ's death was ruled a suicide. It is not the fault of law enforcement that the evidence supported suicide as the manner of death. The public is not aware of all evidence LE has, as they have only made public some of their findings that excluded all other manners of death. There are certain pieces of evidence that weren't released out of respect for the family, like specific journal entries as an example.

There has been no proof presented that this death investigation was botched and that the investigation wasn't thorough. Of course if someone disagrees with the outcome of an investigation they will think it was botched, corrupted, compromised, or whatever term they choose to express their unhappiness. Just because Mary Zahau went on dr. Phil with her attorney and two paid experts to accuse Sheriff Gore and the department of "badly mishandling" the investigation doesn't make it a fact. Gore's response to these allegations pointed out that the "facts" they presented on dr. Phil were misrepresented, and that many pertinent details of the case were not discussed.

Because it is not uncommon for families who have had a loved ones death ruled suicide to raise allegations of a mishandled death investigation, or to fight the manner of death for numerous reasons, medical examiners are trained to make sure that a thorough and competent investigation of the death has been completed that uncovers evidence of suicidal intent before making a final ruling of suicide. To think that RZ's death wasn't thoroughly investigated and the manner of death was ruled suicide based on any reason other than strong and convincing evidence of suicide and the elimination of all other MOD's makes no sense.

If the Zahau's have actual compelling evidence to prove or suggest otherwise then I hope it is taken seriously, but I see nothing to support a botched investigation and rush to judgement in this case.



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[Simply Caustic]

I don't post very often on this thread - the rampant vitriol against Rebecca, calling her a liar, maligning her character as money-grubbing, saying she's full of hate, etc., would make me lose my almost decade long WS run without a timeout. So I just check in periodically. So glad that many of you (from the "likes" I see, a solid dozen supporters of Rebecca post and like with frequency) have stayed on. You're outstanding to stay, so dedicated to Justice and the perversion thereof that took place, here.
Much love to you all. Even those who incessantly rag on Rebecca and her family as "out for a ton of money" when they really just want answers.

I wish you ALL peace and a wonderful 2017.


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[LuckyLucy2]

^ If the Zahaus really wante "just answers" they would have read the investigative files (they claim they have not), and not filed a sham lawsuit for 17.1 million dollars accusing innocent people of murder.

 

[Mollyandme]

^ If the Zahaus really wante "just answers" they would have read the investigative files (they claim they have not), and not filed a sham lawsuit for 17.1 million dollars accusing innocent people of murder.

Wait, they haven't read the investigative files? Or at least claim they have not? I was not aware of that. I think it could be accurate that most family members didn't read the files, I can definitely understand it being too upsetting to read everything, especially for her parents.

I know investigators flew to Missouri and sat down with the family and discussed what led them to their conclusion that RZ committed suicide. I think it's possible that meeting was all her parents could handle hearing, and understandably so.

Regardless, I find it unlikely that at the very least Mary Zahau and her husband didn't read the investigative files, especially if they just wanted answers and weren't satisfied with the explanation given, the investigative files would have been the perfect place to start looking for discrepancies or errors on the part of the investigators before filing a WDS.

I hate to be the poster asking for a link but if you have one that confirms their claims of not reading the investigative file could you post it just so I can see the context. Thank you!



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[LuckyLucy2]

Hi Mollyandme, no problem and you should never hesitate to ask me for a link. It is from an excerpt from Mary Zahau's deposition and on page 168 of this court document:

37-2013-00075418-CU-PO-CTL_ROA-408_08-23 16_Ex_Parte_Application _By_Defendant_Dina_Shacknai

 

[Imp]

I don't see how the death investigation was "botched" "corrupted" or "compromised."

<snipped to address>

We simply disagree, Mollyandme, and that's absolutely okay.

This many years after Rebecca's brutal murder, I'm not inclined to dig through the archives to provide you with all the dozens of ways the death investigation was indeed, botched ... corrupted ... and compromised. I suspect if I was inclined to do that, we would still disagree! In any event, I'm very confident in my interpretation of the "death investigation" and have no need to defend it. I'm confident I know who killed Rebecca, as well as who stumbled and bumbled along in the role of accomplice. I'm also confident I know at least a dozen names involved in the subsequent coverup.

I haven't followed many crime cases, but of the few I've kept track of, I've not seen such a hot mess as RZ's "death investigators" made of her case, either due to incompetence, or for other even less savory reasons. It has been an abominable miscarriage of justice up to this point.

Again, I'm sure you don't agree, and that's fine.

 

[Mollyandme]

Hi Mollyandme, no problem and you should never hesitate to ask me for a link. It is from an excerpt from Mary Zahau's deposition and on page 168 of this court document:
]

Thank you so much. So during her deposition she claims that her opinions were based on the same Info that was released to the public and found on the internet, she never reviewed any of the reports from the different agencies that investigated her sisters death if I'm understanding all of that correctly.

Personally, and this is JMO, I don't believe her when she states that she never reviewed any of the reports asked about in the depositions you posted for many reasons. I think she claimed during her deposition that she didn't review them because if she did admit to reviewing any documents, even if it was not in preparation for her deposition or to refresh her memory for the deposition, it still could open the door to a slippery legal slope where those documents could be discoverable, and the defense could then review them regardless of whether or not it was considered a privileged document. By claiming that her opinions were only made from information that was also available to the general public, she confirms that she has seen the autopsy report, comments made by investigators to the media, and pretty much all the information we have. IMO The actual investigative files contain a lot more information that supported the ruling of suicide and ruled out homicide so any admission of reviewing that would have been potential fair game for the defendants to review. MZ obviously knew this as well.

That's JMO and my take on it.



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[Mollyandme]

<snipped to address>

We simply disagree, Mollyandme, and that's absolutely okay.

This many years after Rebecca's brutal murder, I'm not inclined to dig through the archives to provide you with all the dozens of ways the death investigation was indeed, botched ... corrupted ... and compromised. I suspect if I was inclined to do that, we would still disagree! In any event, I'm very confident in my interpretation of the "death investigation" and have no need to defend it. I'm confident I know who killed Rebecca, as well as who stumbled and bumbled along in the role of accomplice. I'm also confident I know at least a dozen names involved in the subsequent coverup.

I haven't followed many crime cases, but of the few I've kept track of, I've not seen such a hot mess as RZ's "death investigators" made of her case, either due to incompetence, or for other even less savory reasons. It has been an abominable miscarriage of justice up to this point.

Again, I'm sure you don't agree, and that's fine.

I totally understand and respect your opinion. There have been cases where I have felt LE botched something badly (usually local stuff on the news) and explaining my reasons repeatedly to someone who disagreed would get tiring and accomplish nothing. So I get where you are coming from.

We may have a different opinion, which is fine, and I appreciate your kind post addressing it.


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[BBL]

^ Link?

Is this enough of a link / proof for you?
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...-San-Diego-for-Sale-Again-2017-409709075.html

I would not call this positive advertising for someone trying to sell a house. Still negative connotation surrounding the mansion. IMO it is suspicious that is it on the market again right before a potential trial. The quick renovations already wiped out so much potential evidence. I wonder if part of the discovery was digging into the initial (fake) sale and renovation?

 

[kittychi]

Is this enough of a link / proof for you?
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...-San-Diego-for-Sale-Again-2017-409709075.html

I would not call this positive advertising for someone trying to sell a house. Still negative connotation surrounding the mansion. IMO it is suspicious that is it on the market again right before a potential trial. The quick renovations already wiped out so much potential evidence. I wonder if part of the discovery was digging into the initial (fake) sale and renovation?

This brings to my mind that, IMHO, Jonah Shacknai knows everything and has all of the power in this...to tell the truth or to hide the truth. He is the elephant in the room. From Day 1 of the murder, the investigation, the cover-up, the fake sale of the home, the renovation of the home and everything else involved including any previous injuries that Max had. IMHO, JS has the answers to ALL questions that have ever been asked in this forum and chooses to let the immensely complex acrobatics and expense of this trial go forward without saying a word when he could have put an end to it years ago. It is mind boggling. I don't know what it is, but I think there is a very deep reason that he will never ever, EVER talk.

 

[1&2&3]

Just checking in and see the same ole' stuff going on!

Bless your hearts for sticking with it, pushing forward. I am talking to all RZ supporters.

Kittychi, every word in your above post ^^^^ is so true!! IMHO. JS will take the answers to his grave, for if he were to talk, I feel he would be charged with the charges of hiding facts and helping after the murder. JMO.

This case still ires me that due to his wealth, a certain person was able to pull favors and the investigation was blotched so badly!

Wonder what is up his sleeve this time to put the mansion on the market?

 

[K_Z]

Is this enough of a link / proof for you?
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...-San-Diego-for-Sale-Again-2017-409709075.html

I would not call this positive advertising for someone trying to sell a house. Still negative connotation surrounding the mansion. IMO it is suspicious that is it on the market again right before a potential trial. The quick renovations already wiped out so much potential evidence. I wonder if part of the discovery was digging into the initial (fake) sale and renovation?

There is no doubt Spreckels is a "stigmatized property."

How Homicide Affects Home Values
A violent crime in your neighborhood could kill your home's sale price

.

http://realestate.usnews.com/real-estate/articles/how-homicide-affects-home-values/

http://www.moneytalksnews.com/the-murder-factor-what-homicide-does-home-values/

https://www.thestreet.com/story/134...on-home-values-may-not-be-what-you-think.html

 

[thesetup85]

^ The only witch in this case is Rebeccca Zahau, since a book on witchcraft was found in her office - complete with instructions on knot tying, how to bind yourself, and the use of a red rope.

Dina is and was a Psy.D.

The tax rolls? Do you have a link for said "tax rolls?" If not, just another rumor.

If you did not mean to be nasty about Jonah Shacknai in your post, my apologies. But IMO, it seemed rather mean-spirited about a man who lost his grilfriend and child within days of each other and is not accused of anything by the Zahaus. You wrote:



I went back to re-read it, and it still reads that way, iMO. But I will take your word that you did not mean it the way it read to me.

Hello - Would you be kind enough to share a link to the book of witchcraft being found in RZ office? I am revisiting this form after a while and haven't kept up with the developments.

Thanks in advance.