Evidence

[abel]

Yeah, or nothing at all, I guess. I'm just curious to see if they did further testing on all these various fibers to see if they were common amongst all items, and then with anything else (say Anthony home carpet, etc.)

I would assume they already know if these fibers match anything and I guess we just haven't seen the results. I would assume if fibers are found on evidence they immediately start comparisons. I still can't believe the various vaccum contents weren't examined, unless I'm mistaken.

 

[abel]

Maybe it would just be an even wash. If nothing matched to Casey the prosecution wouldn't bring it up; if the defense did then SA would just be able to say that the dump site environment had washed any connection to Anthonys away. All other fibers present could then have come from the dump site. My uneducated moo.

I think they need to bring it up.
I'm pretty uneducated at this myself, except for watching Forensic Files and shows like that on a daily basis but I would think with those FBI reports in evidence and it saying there's fibers the defence has a right to know if those fibers were consistent with anything A and if they're not they would jump all over the opportunity to say "Here's more evidence that disconnects KC from the crime".
I don't think environmental effects would make that type of evidence useless (speculation on my part) and I think now that that statement is in evidence it has to be addressed. Who knows, maybe they already have a solid "match" and we're just not privy of it yet.

 

[Hot Dogs]

It's true that only two paper towels were found in that trash bag, right? You can't clean up much fluid with only two towels. You certainly wouldn't try to tackle a basketball or child sized fluid spill with only two towels. If those towels were actually used to sop up any kind of fluid in the trunk, then they ought to have trunk liner fibers and/or the same dirt residue that was found embedded in the liner.

If those towels are devoid of any trunk fibers or dirt, then they probably were not used on the trunk liner at all. Those towels were inside of a trash bag containing household refuse that came out of the boyfriend's house. Those towels could have been placed into the trash bag when it was still inside the house and not yet ready to take out.

Were any foreign fibers, hair, dirt or other solid materials recovered from the towels?

 

[BondJamesBond]

It's true that only two paper towels were found in that trash bag, right? You can't clean up much fluid with only two towels. You certainly wouldn't try to tackle a basketball or child sized fluid spill with only two towels. If those towels were actually used to sop up any kind of fluid in the trunk, then they ought to have trunk liner fibers and/or the same dirt residue that was found embedded in the liner.

If those towels are devoid of any trunk fibers or dirt, then they probably were not used on the trunk liner at all. Those towels were inside of a trash bag containing household refuse that came out of the boyfriend's house. Those towels could have been placed into the trash bag when it was still inside the house and not yet ready to take out.

Were any foreign fibers, hair, dirt or other solid materials recovered from the towels?

Perhaps more likely used to clean off some shoes/boots/pants one might've been wearing whence stained...or simply that came into contact w/ the body in the trunk, eh?

 

[3doglady]

Maggots were attached to the paper towels. Hoping for maggots in the next doc dump.

 

[RainyGirl]

Maggots were attached to the paper towels. Hoping for maggots in the next doc dump.

AMEN to that! I have always believed that the "bug evidence" (in layman-speak) is critical to this case. Been waiting anxiously for testing to be completed and reports to be drawn up. There is solid, time-tested (and trial-tested) support to back up forensic entomology data. Bring it on! Bugs don't have an agenda and they are very, very consistent in how they operate. I am a supporter of the fine researchers at the U of Tenn. Body Farm!!!!

JMO....

 

[Jolynna]

Dr.Haskell, the A-Rod of bug guys, checked out the"garbage" and went over KC's trunk, the wheel well and the tire cover on December 17. I'm interested in his theories of how and when Caylee was disposed of.

 

[treeseeker]

It's true that only two paper towels were found in that trash bag, right? You can't clean up much fluid with only two towels. You certainly wouldn't try to tackle a basketball or child sized fluid spill with only two towels. If those towels were actually used to sop up any kind of fluid in the trunk, then they ought to have trunk liner fibers and/or the same dirt residue that was found embedded in the liner.

If those towels are devoid of any trunk fibers or dirt, then they probably were not used on the trunk liner at all. Those towels were inside of a trash bag containing household refuse that came out of the boyfriend's house. Those towels could have been placed into the trash bag when it was still inside the house and not yet ready to take out.

Were any foreign fibers, hair, dirt or other solid materials recovered from the towels?

There was only one VFA, Butyric Acid, found in the trunk carpet, and indicates early decomp:
http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0619/19801995.pdf (pg 12/41)

Chemical extracts were done on the paper towels, the tire well scrapings, and the carpet of two cars- KC's and the control from Tennessee. The extract of the two carpets was compared, but the test was considered problematic, probably due to cleaning chemicals per Dr. Vass. A VFA analysis on the carpet in KC's car showed one VFA, butyric acid, consistent with early decomp. The chemical extract done on the towels showed several VFAs consistent with adipocere, consistent with human or animal decomp. The chemical extract from the tire well show acetic acid, also a VFA, but Dr. Vass associates the acetic acid with chloroform manufacture. However, since Dr. Vass is analyzing the odor in the trunk, his final summary kind of lumps them all together with the LIBS, to explain the odor and support the air analysis.

The VFAs in the towels were extracted, or soaked in methanol, and probably filtered. The report doesn't mention any debris, but if there was IMO Dr. Vass would probably have referred it to someone else for further testing.

 

[steadychick]

Has there ever been any mention of the paper towels being checked for DNA. Since it appears the stain was cleaned with chemicals, it makes sense that any DNA was destroyed. But I'd think there is a good chance that DNA could be on those towels.

 

[celticthyme]

The wadded up paper towels found in Tony's trash in KC's car trunk might be as damaging as the duct tape. On them was a substance like pig or human decomposition. The substance was infested with maggots.



There was no fruit in the Pontiac trunk. It sounds like the flies from this e-mail exchange are "coffin flies" which would mean the maggots were baby "coffin flies". There is no mention of any other kind of flies

IF there were only "coffin fly" maggots on the paper towels and no blow-fly maggots, as Dr. Vass said, that is significant. It shows Caylee was probably put in the pontiac trunk alive.

Just putting Caylee into a trash bag would not have kept blow flies away.


In one of the last motions from KC's defense, discovery from the entomologist was specifically requested. Could the entomologist hold the smoking gun that will prove aggravated child abuse and murder one?

JOLYANA: This is the one piece of evidence I keep coming back to as well. I just keep thinking that this plus other corroborating forensic tests (of which we know nothing yet) are what put the DP back on the table . . .

ETA, Could this be part of the child endangerment/ aggravated battery charge originally, b4 the body was found?

 

[3doglady]

About 40 pages will be released to the defense. Most of those will be forensic entomology investigative reports, the state's court filing said.

From today's current news

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Maggots were attached to the paper towels. Hoping for maggots in the next doc dump.

Today, 10:47 AM
essies
Registered User Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,714

http://www.wftv.com/news/21231754/detail.html
Defense Wants Charges Dropped In Casey CasePosted: 5:40 pm EDT October 7, 2009
Updated: 6:07 pm EDT October 7, 2009
<snipped>

Also Wednesday, Casey's defense team got another 42 pages from prosecutors detailing forensic entomology reports from August 28 and December 11 of 2008. Those reports talked about the insects experts analyzed from the trunk of Casey's car and the scene where Caylee's remains were found.
__________________
Be the kind of woman when your feet hit the floor, the Devil says "Oh crap-she's up"!

Maybe today or tomorrow?

 

[Jolynna]

Evidence pulled from the Anthony family depositions includes Cindy saying that the laundry bag found in the Anthony garage inside a dog carrier inside a garbage bag USED to hold stuffed animals. Both Cindy and George said the Anthony's USED to have a bag JUST LIKE THE ONE Caylee's skull was found in. It was full of balls and kept in Caylee's room.

Now the bag is MISSING and the balls are in the tool shed. Cindy's deposition pages Pg. 524, 525, 526

 

[Jolynna]

I want to know about Teddy, the bear Cindy talks about in pages 407 & 408 of her deposition.

How did Teddy get back into the Anthony house????? First Cindy says Lee must have brought Teddy back from Tony's apartment. But, then almost like she suddenly realizes Tony probably never saw the bear, Cindy backtracks. She says she doesn't know how Teddy got back, he just did.

Cindy told Yuri that that Juliet took Caylee's teddy bear and some of KC's clothes from the Anthony house on July 3, the day Cindy was trying to meet up with KC at Universal. http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0730/20224513.pdf Page 68

That story is further verified by Shirley's sister e-mailing Shirley about how uncomfortable she (Shirley's sister) was over strangers going into Cindy's house when no one was home. Shirley's sister thinks Cindy should lock KC out. http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache...ee,+record,+07/14/08&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=us July 9 e-mail to Shirley

This evidence means KC took Teddy out of the Anthony house on July 3, probably after getting her tattoo, while Tony was gone. It was after Tony got back from NY that he said KC was having night sweats and bad dreams. While Tony was gone is when KC spent a night either in her car or maybe had a one-night stand. It is when KC wrote her Diary of Days. It is when Cindy was tracking KC down at Universal and sending Lee out to nightclubs to track her down. It is when Cindy had the week off and was calling incessantly.

At some point the teddy bear ended up back in the Anthony house. Did Lee bring it back...even though he says he didn't see anything belonging to Caylee and would surely have known as much as Ric M. about Caylee's beloved toys? Or did KC smuggle the bear back so Tony wouldn't see it and make jokes about not seeing Caylee around?

Ric M. told LE that the Mama doll and Teddy, the teddy bear, were toys beloved by Caylee.

Somewhere I read that Cindy sent a teddy bear to Ginette the psychic. But, in her deposition, Cindy denies communication with Ginette. She says she only dealt with somebody named Lucas.

 

[Kentjbkent]

Evidence pulled from the Anthony family depositions includes Cindy saying that the laundry bag found in the Anthony garage inside a dog carrier inside a garbage bag USED to hold stuffed animals. Both Cindy and George said the Anthony's USED to have a bag JUST LIKE THE ONE Caylee's skull was found in. It was full of balls and kept in Caylee's room.
Now the bag is MISSING and the balls are in the tool shed. Cindy's deposition pages Pg. 524, 525, 526

When I read that statement, it brought me right back to considering that Caylee may have met her end in her bedroom. I had actually backed away from this idea earlier, but when this statement came out, and Teddy "mysteriously" appearing back at the A home, I am finding myself being drawn back to her bedroom..

 

[lizzysf]

When I read that statement, it brought me right back to considering that Caylee may have met her end in her bedroom. I had actually backed away from this idea earlier, but when this statement came out, and Teddy "mysteriously" appearing back at the A home, I am finding myself being drawn back to her bedroom..

Well we know she was wrapped in the Winnie the Pooh Blanket from there..

 

[truckengirl]

When do we get the results of the insect experts that were released to JB a few weeks ago?

 

[LadyL]

That story is further verified by Shirley's sister e-mailing Shirley about how uncomfortable she (Shirley's sister) was over strangers going into Cindy's house when no one was home. Shirley's sister thinks Cindy should lock KC out. http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache...ee,+record,+07/14/08&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=us July 9 e-mail to Shirley

[snipped by me]

I had not seen those emails before. Those people sure do like to gossip a lot (and type in all caps?).

I found this part funny:

"THAT CASEY SURE DOES KNOW HOW "TO TELL A STORY"DOESN'T SHE??? I DON'T THINK CINDY BELIEVES HALF OF WHAT SHE SAYS."

 

[Kentjbkent]

Well we know she was wrapped in the Winnie the Pooh Blanket from there..

Yep...couple of other things that could also tie in (like lack of shoes), but I am waiting for more information before I lean back in that direction...

 

[Jolynna]

I think it is interesting that BOTH Cindy and George say they don't remember ever seeing Caylee in the shirt found with her body. Especially since there is a picture of Caylee wearing it.

And then Cindy says the ONLY clothes of Caylee's that are missing are is her denim skirt, the pink shirt George says he saw, sunglasses and the shoes George saw.

If the Wal-mart witness is accurate, then that part of Cindy's story might be too (because Caylee was seen with shoes coming out of the Wal-mart) and KC was reported to have said, "they haven't even found Caylee's clothes."

The skeptic in me says that the witness was probably mistaken, Cindy is lying and LP was just telling a good story. Or maybe LP was also accurate but the clothes were one of KC's riddles.

Cindy DID say that a usual course of events between her and KC was for KC to drop Caylee off at Gentiva in the parking lot. Maybe KC did intend to do that and couldn't get in touch with Cindy. So, as many here speculated, KC took Caylee to Wal-mart to kill time. Cindy said Caylee always had an extra set of clothes with her. Maybe the extra set of clothes, Cindy now won't admit to packing, was the "Big Trouble" t-shirt and the striped shorts? Maybe something happened to the clothes Caylee was seen wearing in Wal-mart and KC DID get rid of them between Wal-mart and Tony's (at around the time Caylee went into the trunk).

I'm not sure why KC would change Caylee's clothes to kill her. Caylee wasn't dressed the way I'd think a mom would purposefully dress her baby for burial. And I'm not sure why KC would throw away Caylee's shoes and other clothes. I mean, if you can drive around with a body in your trunk, why sweat over the messy clothes?

Wouldn't it be more natural to put the clothes with Caylee and toss everything together at the disposal site. KC wasn't worried about the ball bag or the Pooh blanket being traced back to her. What about Caylee's shoes (and maybe previously-in-the-day-worn set of clothes) made KC uncomfortable so she'd throw them away separately?


imo