FL - 17 killed in Stoneman Douglas H.S. shooting, Parkland, 14 Feb 2018 #1 *Arrest*

[animlzrule]

I get what you are saying and I don’t disagree but at this point there has to be more to it. There is a problem. A serious problem with the mindset of some American youth, that you just don’t see in other nations.

Simple as that.

I don't believe that is true. There isn't a nation or region on this planet that doesn't have "youth" with serious problems, disturbing tendencies and mental health issues. We are the only nation, however, in which those disturbed youth have access to weapons with which to act out their fantasies and revenge plots, weapons capable of slaughtering dozens in an instant.

 

[Betty P]

With all due respect to this poor mother, that is shameful that CNN allowed that and aired that. But it doesn't surprise me in the least.

I'm sure they got her permission. She has a right to speak out to the nation if she wants, no matter how difficult it may be for some to hear it.

 

[mrsobrien]

As far as I can tell it has been a misdemeanor in Florida. And there are requirements. Like, "I'm going to go into your school and shoot you." That clearly fits. But, "One day I'm going to be a school shooter.", that may not be considered direct enough to constitute and actual threat.

I had a very educational chat with a police officer about this very thing a while back . My husband confronted a squatter in our apartment building. The squatter replied by saying he'd be back to kill us all. According to the officer there, that was not a criminal threat because it did not contain a specific plan. If the squatter had said something like, "I'm coming back on Friday to kill your family with a knife", that would have been an arrestable offense.

 

[Bernina]

You can't help those with mental illness unless they want help. If they stop treatment, whats your solution? He was over 18, an ADULT. His right to stop. Want to lock everyone up that has any type of mental illness and won't go to therapy or rebels against authority? That will be a VERY high population. Every child on drugs for ADD/ADHD, is that a mental disorder? PTSD, a mental disorder? depression? Its a slippery slope .... we will need 100X the mental health facilities (inpatient, involuntary) that we have now.

This country STILL stigmatizes people with mental illness. Until THAT stops, many parents will refuse to get "Timmy" the help he needs, or the adult who doesn't want to be labeled "crazy" by their significant other, children, and/or co-workers.

 

[FinallyRegistered]

This country STILL stigmatizes people with mental illness. Until THAT stops, many parents will refuse to get "Timmy" the help he needs, or the adult who doesn't want to be labeled "crazy" by their significant other, children, and/or co-workers.

And, it will prevent anyone who might want to purchase a gun from getting mental health help. If you tell "Timmy" that he will never be able to buy a gun if he sees a therapist, then we have real problems.

 

[kimlynn]

I'm sure they got her permission. She has a right to speak out to the nation if she wants, no matter how difficult it may be for some to hear it.

Sadly she is reaching out to a person that seems to lack basic decency and empathy for others.
I'm glad she spoke out though. IMO

 

[enelram]

Interesting tidbit from Orlando News tonight:

Orange county Florida Schools utilize a paid service to monitor all high school age students public Social Media Accounts.
The county school rep. thought this student would have been identified as a threat if he were a student here.

 

[cujenn81]

He really does have the deadest, most vacant eyes I think I've ever seen on a person. Worse than Bundy, worse than Manson. They are totally blank... nothing there.


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[CARIIS]

HOw much do these machine guns cost?

how much do these loaded magazines ( my notion of magazines is Vanity Fair ha ) cost

where does the money come from

tia

 

[fabvab]

The stats looks pretty good, don't they? Except students like this shooter are often disenrolled/rolled over to other programs/re-enrolled at another school in order to save the stats. We need to be looking at the rate of mental illness-- including the gamut of issues that affect our adolescents.

In fact I have seen first hand schools that report a 96% grad rate-- but the class size has shrunk by 30 to 40 percent from mid-junior year to mid-senior year.

Graduation Rates- I am in charge of graduation rates for a district and am not sure how a district could fake the stats. They start tracking this in 9th grade. If a student leaves your high school, and you can't provide proof that they enrolled in another school (in state or out of state) or left to homeschool, then that student counts against your stats if they do not graduate. It also counts against a school when students drop out and get a GED. In my state, I'm not sure how you could cheat the stats with computerized enrollment programs.

I also worked many years as a school counselor and can contest that many schools work very diligently to get help for troubled students. I have been involved with families that we took to court to have a judge force them to get their child mental health counseling or to continue medication for severe issues like schizophrenia or schizoaffective. I've called Child Protective services and LE and have worked hand-in-hand with both to get help for students. I had a Licensed Therapist on site who provided therapy students, but a parent had to give permission and be involved in the therapy. It is extremely frustrating if you don't have a parent who is willing to get help for their child. And you would be shocked at parents who do not cooperate. Some parents had their own mental health issues. Others didn't like the school's involvement and moved away...and I would pick up the phone and contact the next school to give them info. Sorry for the rant, but I promise some schools work very hard to get help for troubled students. And schools cannot tell other parents what all they have done to get help for a student.

It sounds like the shooter did have previous mental health services. But at 19, as an adult, he could make his own choices about getting help or taking meds.

I read the shooter was FAS (Fetal Alcohol Syndrome), but I wonder if he was RAD (Reactive Attachment Disorder) too.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-5396665/Florida-shooter-19-fetal-alcohol-syndrome.html

 

[Kakidoll]

I don't believe that is true. There isn't a nation or region on this planet that doesn't have "youth" with serious problems, disturbing tendencies and mental health issues. We are the only nation, however, in which those disturbed youth have access to weapons with which to act out their fantasies and revenge plots, weapons capable of slaughtering dozens in an instant.

But who has access to violent games that they play day in and day out, who has access to the MONEY to buy the toys/gadgets/iphones at such young ages? Who GIVES it to them? Americans (and yes i'm one) are spoiled, greedy and disrespectful. They want it NOW or they throw a tantrum, so parents give in or don't care. Look at the violent games, the movies, the roleplay. More and more every single day. Time to start busting asses, going back to VALUES in the home and learning the word NO and using it. Take away the phones, the computer games, the online role playing and social media. Parents need to PARENT. Kids don't become this way overnight.

 

[enelram]

HOw much do these machine guns cost?

how much do these loaded magazines ( my notion of magazines is Vanity Fair ha ) cost

where does the money come from

tia

In his Instagram pic of a similar gun he was considering buying, it was $200 + for gun alone. I asked a ways back, where he got the money. He had more guns than just this one.

 

[PrairieWind]

I'm sure they got her permission. She has a right to speak out to the nation if she wants, no matter how difficult it may be for some to hear it.

Sure its difficult to listen to her blame the president for things that are not in his control and yell and scream. Airing this video accomplished nothing other than ratcheting up the emotion and vitriol that much more. That isn't helping anything.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Sadly she is reaching out to a person that seems to lack basic decency and empathy for others.
I'm glad she spoke out though. IMO

She was very emotional and has every right to be. She does deserve to be heard but I felt she was being exploited by CNN.

 

[FinallyRegistered]

Sure its difficult to listen to her blame the president for things that are not in his control and yell and scream. Airing this video accomplished nothing other than ratcheting up the emotion and vitriol that much more. That isn't helping anything.

What is helping? Just curious.

 

[fabvab]

had been diagnosed with autism.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/parkland/florida-school-shooting/fl-school-shooting-cruz-20180214-story.html




Everyone knows there is nowhere to put these kids

there are waiting lists for special placement

its resources there are none my experiences were from ages ago I hate to think about what it is like now

Nowhere to go...............................it is that straight forward sorry

I worked in special population academic setting first day saw a 14 year old run up and try stab his pregnant teacher with a pencil you cant have kids sitting on each other in class

class sizes in that kind of setting need to be small -- stimulation issues safety issues transport limits

he stayed there is nowhere else to put them and he was already in where placement was at

there are limits in juvenile jail you cant put kids on top of each other in bed

adult services are just as pitiful -- a invol hold now days is 24 hours if one is lucky and is dependant on how bad someone is hallucinating in a an admit office

if beds are full ( always) you cant put adults on top of each other in bed either same thing nurse to pt ration therapist to case loads feeding limits

there are no beds . chairs staff therapists maintenance paper pushers etc etc

were looking at him as a 19 year old --ignoring the past

getting kicked out is rejection to a child

needing special placement is shaming to a child

having to take meds is embarrassing to kids

always getting into trouble in school and home translates to being "bad"

angry parents feel like unloved

it is very complicated stuff -- remember all this started for him when he was young

there kids life builds up on them

they feel hopeless

when kids the stuff we as adults know is an effort to help to a child it is being abnormal bad -- shame guilt resentment humiliation feeling stupid peers reject and are cruel to another KID -- there kids - they absorb this stuff differently he was 10 11 12 13 14 15 etc \

we gotta remember this imo

jmo

Yes, it is hard to find help for these kids. Sometimes you'll find it, but then insurance will stop paying for the facility. Or the child starts a treatment plan and does well for 6 months...then quits taking medicine/stops therapy. It's a difficult path.

 

[Bernina]

HOw much do these machine guns cost?

how much do these loaded magazines ( my notion of magazines is Vanity Fair ha ) cost

where does the money come from

tia

AR-15 start at about $500, depending on the "political " climate. DIY kits are under $500.

There are different sizes of magazines (how many bullets they hold), so that price varies.

Bullets can be bought by the box or in bulk, prices vary.

 

[kimlynn]

She was very emotional and has every right to be. She does deserve to be heard but I felt she was being exploited by CNN.

Raw emotions but if anyone has the right to vent it is family and friends of lost loved ones. IMO

 

[Spellbound]

With all due respect to this poor mother, that is shameful that CNN allowed that and aired that. But it doesn't surprise me in the least.

Why? if the mother knew she was being recorded and would likely be on TV news, she gave her permission. We can’t just close our eyes to the pain and needs of the victims and survivors, or we ar sweeping it under the rug again ... and again .... and again. An endless chain of nothing.

 

[kimlynn]

Sure its difficult to listen to her blame the president for things that are not in his control and yell and scream. Airing this video accomplished nothing other than ratcheting up the emotion and vitriol that much more. That isn't helping anything.

It's past time to ratchet it up. IMO