FL 17 y/o Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #12

[Elley Mae]

It doesn't matter what any of us would assume, because George Zimmerman specifically said late TEENS.

iirc that was said by GZ after TM turned to approach him, before that he said he couldn't tell. It was after TM turned to approach him as well when he saw that he was black/african-american. wiki has TM as 6'4" so until TM turned to face him GZ know he was a teenager.

 

[LambChop]

She is 16. And why would she call 911 for something she is not witnessing and probably is not sure exactly where it's happening?

What is she going to tell them when 911 goes into a Miami base? She has no information just that she was disconnected and what she heard of TM's last words which prove nothing. We don't even know what she was priviledged to in her information about his family. TM's name is different than his mother's and she may not have even known that for sure. In any case it's not fair to compare what we feel is an appropriate reaction or how we would have reacted when we don't even have the whole story. jmo

 

[songline]

I think he would if he planned to shoot TM but it does not appear he did. It just appears to me things did not go the way GZ had anticipated and either got out of his control (like the woman he picked up and threw at the bar) and he reacted, or he thought his life was in danger as he states.

I think a few people here think he was out for blood. But I think he lost control of a situation he started with the call to LE. I do not think he ever intended to shoot TM otherwise he would have never thrown his hands onto his head (witness reported) as if "Oh, *****". Heat of the moment kind of thing is what I think happened, words exchanged and they were off. Does not mean TM was the aggressor. Because of the information about what happened when GZ was fired from his bouncer job (because he threw a woman in a fit of rage thing), I could believe GZ may have initiated the fight by grabbing TM. It is just as possible for that to have happened as it would have been for TM to have grabbed GZ. GZ knows the truth but we should not be hearing versions as more and more information is released that do not support his original statement as we know it to be. jmo

YES either TM or GZ initiated the fight. Maybe there is one secret witness that they do have who saw more then what has come out so far. And maybe there isn’t.
But I do not see that GZ is changing the story I see that more pieces come to light. but he always said he followed TM, and there was an altercation, and he shot TM. He never changed his story. just filling in the details as more questions are being asked of him.

 

[cityslick]

I live in the Bronx, Songline..funny, I don't feel nervous when walking alone. I'm Italian married to a Puero Rican...and I feel very safe in my neighborhood. All the kids wear their pants hanging, do rags, dreds...but they have no bearing on my safety...unless they actually come towards me, then your fear sets in...but people are people, fads are fads and one shouldn't go by what they wear to say someone is a or not..that's judging a book by it's cover and stereotyping....

I think someone living in a suburb might have a different disposition than someone living in a city, but that's IMO. You're around it most of the time, the person living in the suburb is not.

Remember stereotype = fear of the unknown.

 

[JeannaT]

I think many have not considered the fact that she lives about 250 miles away. She probably didn't have the address of the future step mom since Trayvon was visiting and didn't live there. I doubt she had Trayvon's parents phone number. My kids don't have their friends parents numbers in the phone.

My kid's friends could contact me fairly quickly if there was a problem as horrible as this, and they were the only ones who knew what happened.

I do understand, though, her hesitancy to get LE involved. I've had situations where I was worried about where my sons were but hesitated to call for help fearing they'd be found at a party with alcohol, or worse.

I think she was somewhere between worrying about him and not wanting to call the attention of LE on him.

 

[Elley Mae]

LOL GZ's brother sat there and lied and made some of the most ridiculous statements I've ever heard.

"If it's raining you wait 10 minutes, and then go out" UMMMM...George Zimmerman was out too...

People not from Florida don't always know that the rains there don't last but 15 or so minutes then it stops and dries out. I would think that as a native Floridain that is what he meant. GM was in his car.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

Seriously? Racial Profiling???

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...mily-alleges-racial-profiling-before-congress

Am I reading this correctly? Racial profiling refers to LAW ENFORCEMENT not private citizens (and remember, GZ was NOT acting in his NW capacity that night). What type of law do they want to have passed? That private citizens can't call the police and describe a person's race? Absurd.

 

[belle3]

He did the right thing by bringing his weapon. He has the right to protect himself and he didn't know what to expect.

http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/weapons/self_defense.html
Use of Deadly Force for Lawful Self-Defense
A License to Carry a Concealed Weapon is not a License to use it.


(snipped from above link)
Q. If I get a license to carry a concealed weapon, can I carry it anywhere?

A. No. To get a license you must sign an oath that you have read and understand the Jack Hagler Self-defense Act (Section 790.06, Florida Statutes). That statute lists several places where you may not carry a concealed weapon. You should read subsection 12 for a complete list, but some examples are football, baseball, and basketball games (college or professional) and bars.

A cool head and even temper can keep handgun carriers out of trouble. You should never carry a gun into a situation where you might get angry.
bbm

 

[HiHater]

iirc that was said by GZ after TM turned to approach him, before that he said he couldn't tell. It was after TM turned to approach him as well when he saw that he was black/african-american. wiki has TM as 6'4" so until TM turned to face him GZ know he was a teenager.

That's not exactly true...he never said he couldn't tell...

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/326700-full-transcript-zimmerman.html

 

[hockeymom]

I don't have time to read through all the posts to see if this has been posted before,but on my local radio,someone brought up an interesting point,1st of all its very difficult to hear exactly what GZ says but its definitily "expletive something". The going thought is he used the word,"coon". For one thing,I have kids in their 20's,that is not a word typically used by this age group,but maybe in the south it is. Anway,according to my local radio, in the urban dictionary there is a word that sounds like "coof"(don't know how it is spelled). It means when a guy is being stared down at the urinal.(who knew?). Right before GZ,says whatever he says,he mentions that TM has noticed him and is looking at him. Just a thought. I think its very hard to hear exactly what he said anyway.
Also don't know if this has been posted but GZ only refers to TM as black after the dispatcher asks him. Unfortunatly some of the news agencys left that part out of the transcript.

<mod snip>

 

[JeannaT]

Hi. I have been trying to keep up with this case, but I know I have missed alot. I have seen it reported that the only things found on Travon was $22, a bag of Skittles and an ice tea. Has it been reported by LE if Travon had a cell phone on him?
I think this is important because if there wasn't a cell phone found, then how could of his girlfriend called him just minutes before. Also because if he didn't have a cellphone how could LE contact his family if they didn't know who he was?
If he was found with a cell phone, then it is very sad to think that it wasn't looked into right away to notify family.

Yes, he had a phone and was on the phone when the altercation began.

LE had his phone right away - now I'm stepping into stuff I don't know for sure - I believe it was locked and they couldn't get into it, and when he was identified the family refused to give them permission to unlock the phone so they had to get a warrant to do it.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

Prosecutors Subpoena Trayvon Martin's Girlfriend To Appear In Front Of Grand Jury

By Jen Heger - Radar Assistant Managing Editor

The Florida State Attorney's Office has prepared a subpoena for Trayvon Martin's girlfriend, who was on the phone with him in the moments before the unarmed African American teen was shot and killed by George Zimmerman, to appear in front a grand jury that will be impaneled on April 10, to determine if the neighborhood watch captain should be charged with murder, RadarOnline.com is exclusively reporting.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...lphone-girlfriend-subpoena-grand-jury-florida

It appears the SA believes this girl....

 

[Horace Finklestein]

LOL GZ's brother sat there and lied and made some of the most ridiculous statements I've ever heard.

"If it's raining you wait 10 minutes, and then go out" UMMMM...George Zimmerman was out too...

Well I can't comment on TM's brother's statement because it seems to be against TOS, so there we are.

 

[Concerned Papa]

He does. He says he (Trayvon) is in his late teens, and later when not wanting to give out his address, Zimmerman says "I don't know where this kid is at."

Not verbatim, but close...he says the word "kid"

You're right. Captain George DID know he was just a kid.

911 dispatcher:

OK, what’s your apartment number?

Zimmerman:

It’s a home. It’s 1950 – oh, crap, I don’t want to give it out – I don’t know where this kid is [inaudible] [3:40]

So an armed ex bar room bouncer chased down and killed an unarmed boy less than 7 minutes after first laying eyes on him, because he thought the 140 lb skinny kid was gonna hurt him?

Let me give you a little perspective.

At 17 years of age, I was 6'3" tall and weighed 220 lbs. Before my 18th birthday I suited up as a middle linebacker for The University of Georgia.

Captain George was afraid of a 140 lb kid? We had cheerleaders bigger than that.

 

[Isabelle]

I believe there are/were more psychiatric elements to this case then there are racial undertones. i.e., <modsnip>!

 

[SuziQ]

So often we read a story where a 4 year old called 911 THAT IS INSPIRING.
she is 17.

What does a 4 year old calling 911 have anything to do with this case?

 

[Isabelle]

Well I can't comment on TM's brother's statement because it seems to be against TOS, so there we are.

TM has a brother that gave a statement??

 

[Horace Finklestein]

http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/weapons/self_defense.html
Use of Deadly Force for Lawful Self-Defense
A License to Carry a Concealed Weapon is not a License to use it.


(snipped from above link)
Q. If I get a license to carry a concealed weapon, can I carry it anywhere?

A. No. To get a license you must sign an oath that you have read and understand the Jack Hagler Self-defense Act (Section 790.06, Florida Statutes). That statute lists several places where you may not carry a concealed weapon. You should read subsection 12 for a complete list, but some examples are football, baseball, and basketball games (college or professional) and bars.

A cool head and even temper can keep handgun carriers out of trouble. You should never carry a gun into a situation where you might get angry.
bbm

Not sure what you're getting at. He was legally carrying the firearm. If TM attacked him, he legally used it. I don't think GZ was "mad" or had a temper that night, there's certainly no evidence of it. He called 9-11 first, he didn't just start shooting.

 

[Elley Mae]

Hi. I have been trying to keep up with this case, but I know I have missed alot. I have seen it reported that the only things found on Travon was $22, a bag of Skittles and an ice tea. Has it been reported by LE if Travon had a cell phone on him?
I think this is important because if there wasn't a cell phone found, then how could of his girlfriend called him just minutes before. Also because if he didn't have a cellphone how could LE contact his family if they didn't know who he was?
If he was found with a cell phone, then it is very sad to think that it wasn't looked into right away to notify family.

Good Catch and Welcome to Websleuths that is a very good ? I do recall seeing that TM was listed as a John Doe when taken to the morgue. iirc jmo

 

[songline]

There was a transcript????? Where was this posted? I thought what we read was someone's opinion of what she supposedly said but it was not a transcript.

OPINION on what she said?????
hhhmmmm?

I believe it was a cut and paste.