FL - 17-yo Boy Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #2

[LambChop]

My apologies to JeannaT, the board folk and to the mods. My wording was not intended to come off as an attack. Instead i'm kinda blinded by this case, because i see a victim... who can't speak for himself. And there's one reason why he can't speak for himself, because somebody stalked him, and ended his life. And that person is still free, and wouldn't even be under any scrutiny, if the family didn't keep up the heat of this case.

Trayvon was once me, 6'2 - 160 when i was 17. Followed around in stores, women clutching their pocketbooks closer when i'm near, car door locks hammer shut when you walk past people's car in the mall, getting stopped for DWB (Driving While Black) as well as in Trayvon's case WWB ( Walking While Black ), yes i've been stopped by police while walking. But i've tried my best to not even touch opon the potential racial aspect of this case, because to me, why he Trayvon garned the interest of Zimmerman is irrelevant. Everything that he did the moment he stepped out that car is.

I'm new to the boards, and i have to be mindful to be more "passive" in my intent to get a point across, so that there will be no confusion in the future. Thanks for the heads up, regarding my aggression.

Thank you for your post and don't stop posting, please. To understand the problems and try to keep this from happening again we need everyone's input and your input is particularly valuable. Thanks, again for posting. jmo

PS: I was born in Philly.....many, many moons ago though...

:welcome:

 

[Isabelle]

IMO, he did not want to give his apt number for the same reason he did not want to tell the police where to meet him, because he had already made up his mind, he didn't know exactly where to tell the police to meet him so they would have to call and find out because he WAS going to follow this kid, he was going to confront him, and with the 9mil tucked in his waistband he WAS going to throw his weight around and get some satisfaction because these A@##$ always get away.

I did find it strange that Zimmerman didn't want to give his address to the 911 operator?? Maybe so no one would know where to find him after he did what he was planning to do all along!

 

[Sensei]

Everyone else is assuming,So I am saying just because he was a teen does not mean GZ assumed he was unarmed.

Which makes the whole incident even more egregious. If he assumed that the kid WAS armed, or had a suspicion that he was how does he justify forcing a confrontation that could have resulted in a wild west type shoot out?

A shootout where innocent bystanders might have been shot? Was there some reason that he would not want to leave the detaining of an armed suspect to the Police? Or was he just determined to apprehend this armed suspect himself and cover himself with glory for the capture.

I can see no justification there, if he truly honestly believed that TM had a gun, then he should NEVER have attempted a confrontation.

 

[LolaMoon08]

I would really, really like to know why the Sanford PD has protected GZ to the extent that they have. There has to be a reason.

George Zimmerman claims that his father is a magistrate with the Virginia Supreme Court and that his mother is a deputy court clerk. I'll have to go through the other thread to find the link. Don't have that much time today, but I know it's there! It would be around page 30-35. I looked it up last night.

 

[Isabelle]

George Zimmerman claims that his father is a magistrate with the Virginia Supreme Court and that his mother is a deputy court clerk. I'll have to go through the other thread to find the link. Don't have that much time today, but I know it's there! It would be around page 30-35. I looked it up last night.

I saw that too.

 

[Rob774]

George Zimmerman claims that his father is a magistrate with the Virginia Supreme Court and that his mother is a deputy court clerk. I'll have to go through the other thread to find the link. Don't have that much time today, but I know it's there! It would be around page 30-35. I looked it up last night.

You are correct, this has been referenced quite a few times on here, but folks may have missed if they were knew to following this.

Also, we have 2 people, 1 dead, the other claiming self defense. Its too bad if we couldn't sum it up this easily....

1 guy is minding his business, on the phone with his girl. If the other guy just does the same thing, in regards to minding his business... is the first guy still alive today??? If that answer is yes, then there goes your "self defense."

 

[mikeysmommom]

No one would engage in battle with a 9mm in their waistband.

Very true!Maybe GZ did not throw the first punch since he was well aware of the gun in his pants or pocket.

 

[Belinda]

George Zimmerman claims that his father is a magistrate with the Virginia Supreme Court and that his mother is a deputy court clerk. I'll have to go through the other thread to find the link. Don't have that much time today, but I know it's there! It would be around page 30-35. I looked it up last night.

I have read that, but I am going on the assumption that Sanford PD didn't know that at the time. Possibly they did as George may have used it to toot his own horn with the department. If we assume they didn't know about his parents, what other reasons could there be for the egregious behavior they have displayed?

 

[LolaMoon08]

You are correct, this has been referenced quite a few times on here, but folks may have missed if they were knew to following this.

Also, we have 2 people, 1 dead, the other claiming self defense. Its too bad if we couldn't sum it up this easily....

1 guy is minding his business, on the phone with his girl. If the other guy just does the same thing, in regards to minding his business... is the first guy still alive today??? If that answer is yes, then there goes your "self defense."

From your keyboard to -- yes, I agree 100%.

 

[daisy7]

100 percent plausable as your specualtion a few posts above it. Martin talking on his phone, not really paying attention to what Zimmerman is saying, thinks he hears a racial slur, whips around and attacks him. Prove that didn't happen.

If GZ is ever charged, HE will have to prove it did.

 

[LolaMoon08]

I have read that, but I am going on the assumption that Sanford PD didn't know that at the time. Possibly they did as George may have used it to toot his own horn with the department. If we assume they didn't know about his parents, what other reasons could there be for the egregious behavior they have displayed?

That is why I want the Department of Justice to get George Zimmerman's phone records for the night of the shooting. I want to know if his father was called at any time during the "investigation?" I think that needs to be ruled out.

 

[Sensei]

Very true!Maybe GZ did not throw the first punch since he was well aware of the gun in his pants or pocket.

Or MAYBE, he grabbed Tray by the arm, and attempted to stop him from leaving because he was well aware of the gun in his pants or pocket

Or MAYBE the gun wasn't in his pants or pocket but in his hand, which lead to the cries of someone pleading for their life...

Or MAYBE we could go on like this all day....if we don't want to stick to the most logical and reasonable explainations that is.

All we know is that the gun was in his waistband when police arrived, and presuming it was there when he confronted Tray, then it is probable that Tray saw that gun when he began questioning him.

 

[CathyinTexas]

Respectfully snipped for space.
If this is in fact the case, even more reason the PD should have taken pictures and his injuries listed in the preliminary report - which apparently neither happened.

Again, I cannot believe all of the failures by the PD in a homicide case.

First of all, I don't believe he was really injured. But if he were, he was the assailant, he was the murderer. Why would I care that he was hurt in the commission of a crime?

 

[LolaMoon08]

Or MAYBE, he grabbed Tray by the arm, and attempted to stop him from leaving because he was well aware of the gun in his pants or pocket

Or MAYBE the gun wasn't in his pants or pocket but in his hand, which lead to the cries of someone pleading for their life...

Or MAYBE we could go on like this all day....if we don't want to stick to the most logical and reasonable explainations that is.

All we know is that the gun was in his waistband when police arrived, and presuming it was there when he confronted Tray, then it is probable that Tray saw that gun when he began questioning him.

Or MAYBE Zimmerman did pull out the gun and the wrestling was Tray trying to wrestle a gun away from a mad man??

 

[Velouria]

George Zimmerman claims that his father is a magistrate with the Virginia Supreme Court and that his mother is a deputy court clerk. I'll have to go through the other thread to find the link. Don't have that much time today, but I know it's there! It would be around page 30-35. I looked it up last night.

Here you go, Lola

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[daisy7]

I seriously doubt GZ gun was in his hand,has it been stated anywhere that his weapon was out?Many teens are armed,could it be possible that GZ thought he was armed as well?

Can you please provide a link that states "many teens are armed" or is that your opinion?

Even if he was armed (which we all know he wasn't), it's ok to go shoot someone whom you think may have a gun and is not committing any crime? :waitasec:

 

[Sensei]

Or MAYBE Zimmerman did pull out the gun and the wrestling was Tray trying to wrestle a gun away from a mad man??

That is a likely as any other MAYBE, what I do feel is this,

I think GZ LIKED carrying that gun, I think he said he carried it for protection, but his behavior makes me believe that he liked carrying the gun, and that it was not going to stay hidden, he wanted someone to KNOW that he had a gun. I will not say that he was intending to KILL someone, but I do beleive that he attempted to stop and detain Tray until the police got there, and Tray was having none of it and fought back, and low and behold GZ has a gun.

If I had to speculate, and i do, that would be my best guess of what actually happened. Occams razor and all that

 

[CathyinTexas]

BBM. In what way? And if it is true about who his parents are, what could he or they do about it? Are they on the news throwing their weight around?

I think that is why the police chose not to charge him. His family is "one of them", so to speak. His Dad has been in the media defending him, but has disputed the facts, such as, he said GZ did not follow him.

 

[HiHater]

Very true!Maybe GZ did not throw the first punch since he was well aware of the gun in his pants or pocket.

Would a man who is "well aware" of the gun is his pants or pocket be pleading for help like that?

Logic.

 

[CathyinTexas]

Again, how do you know he wouldn't be walking around free? You're implying that the cops would care more about a white kid than a black kid...and would basically not care at all that a black kid was murdered? That's quite a baseless assumption. Where is the evidence that this is true?

Hopefully, it will come out as the investigation unfolds.