FL - 17-yo Boy Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #2

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LambChop said:
Wouldn't the ME's office do that???
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NORMALLY, a detective would attend the autopsy and gather the external evidence they feel is needed for an investigation from the coroner...clothes, bullets, etc. and the coroner is responsible for further testing of the body. He/she would also be responsible for a diagram and report of all injuries to TM's body and plotting the track of the bullet.

As far as we know now none of this was done by a detective. I'm very interested in what exactly the coroner tested with TM's body or sent for further testing and his reports and diagrams.

One of the first rules of investigation is to preserve the scene and collect the evidence. SPD only accomplished a BIG FAIL with this rule.

SPD did NO investigation at all...they accepted the word of the killer and aggressor on the spot. This case was not handled NORMALLY.
 
curl_in_progress said:
Details on GZ's domestic violence history. Very detailed and VERY interesting.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/21/2706141/trayvon-martins-shooter-had-a.html
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http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/21/2706141/trayvon-martins-shooter-had-a.html

He established a pattern of calling police when things were awry in his neighborhood, from barking pitbulls to potholes and suspicious people.

---------------------

Zimmerman... who's ex-fiance filed a restraining order against him...
His comebacks to her accusations:
My girlfriend slapped me, scratched me, tried to choke me because I was going to a party
My girlfriend came after me with a baseball bat because I went to a concert without her
 
LolaMoon08 said:
I wish the State Attorney's Office would release a statement on the evidence that they are sending to forensics? I think that we could put to rest a lot of the back and forth if we knew Zimmerman's clothes had been taken into evidence? I believe the silence on these simple questions is because the Sanford Police collected no evidence except for Zimmerman's gun and Trayvon's body.

Was a CSI team even brought out to the scene? Do we know if the bullet exited Trayvon's body? Where was the shell casing? If the bullet did exit Trayvon's body, has it been documented where the bullet was found and did they run any kind of trajectory (sp?) tests to determine how it happened? How far away was Trayvon's phone from his body when he fell dead?

So many questions that I could go on for hours!
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This information will be very interesting when it is made public. There must be a standard mode of operation for any shooting. Did they follow it? Was an investigation done and all evidence thoroughly gathered and logged? So far I am assuming not by what we have heard in the media. That in itself may be the undoing of the PD and assailants stories.
 
HiHater said:
Zimmerman and that woman were a match made in heaven...
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Obviously he didn't have a gun back then or she would be dead! George Zimmerman seems to have a pattern of playing a victim?
 
LolaMoon08 said:
:what:

5...4...3...2...1... someone will find a way to make this all the woman's fault!
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George Zimmerman is a BULLY with aggression issues. I think he absolutely thought he could confront Tray and push him around and detain him. So when Tray pushes back or defends himself and probably gets in a few good hits, GZ gets pissed off. I think that's why there is speculation of two altercations. In the first altercation GZ pushes Tray and gets physically aggressive with him. Maybe that is when GZ gets punched in the nose, if this alleged bloody nose story is true. Because remember, one 911 call from a man says they are fighting on his back porch. There is no screaming for help in that call. (If I remember correctly.) The fight somehow breaks up or Tray gets away. Then when Tray starts to walk away, GZ gets up pulls out his gun and goes after Tray again. This time Tray sees the gun and starts screaming for help which is documented in the 911 call by another neighbor. And we all know what happens next........


This is all my opinion and I am heartbroken thinking of the fear this child felt before be died.

ETA: If there were 2 altercations and the first one broke up for any period of time, then GZ should be charged with first degree murder. Because that means he went after Tray again when he could have run away. Except this time he had time to think about pulling out his gun before going after him.
 
It bothers me that the MSM keeps saying the shooting has sparked racial tensions. I don't see that. I see just as many white as black people standing for Tray. I think race played a role in the killing, but I don't believe it is playing a role in the response to it. Just about everyone is very, very angry over what was done to Trayvon. We have got to all get past any racial barriers and live together in harmony, appreciating and celebrating each other's cultures. All races, all cultures. It disappoints me so much to still see so much racism in this day and age, among many different cultures. We can do better than this. We are Americans!

ETA: I don't know whether race has played a role in Sanford PD's response, but I do question it.
 
curl_in_progress said:
George Zimmerman is a BULLY with aggression issues. I think he absolutely thought he could confront Tray and push him around and detain him. So when Tray pushes back or defends himself and probably gets in a few good hits, GZ gets pissed off. I think that's why there is speculation of two altercations. In the first altercation GZ pushes Tray and gets physically aggressive with him. Maybe that is when GZ gets punched in the nose, if this alleged bloody nose story is true. Because remember, one 911 call from a man says they are fighting on his back porch. There is no screaming for help in that call. (If I remember correctly.) The fight somehow breaks up or Tray gets away. Then when Tray starts to walk away, GZ gets up pulls out his gun and goes after Tray again. This time Tray sees the gun and starts screaming for help which is documented in the 911 call by another neighbor. And we all know what happens next........


This is all my opinion and I am heartbroken thinking of the fear this child felt before be died.
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I'm starting to lean toward two altercations...one thing I'd like to know is what exactly GZ had on. In the police report it says a red jacket. We know Trayvon had on a gray hoodie.

Someone had on a white shirt, and I believe that was GZ. At what point, as he was being attacked, did the red jacket come off?
 
Belinda said:
It bothers me that the MSM keeps saying the shooting has sparked racial tensions. I don't see that. I see just as many white as black people standing for Tray. I think race played a role in the killing, but I don't believe it is playing a role in the response to it. Just about everyone is very, very angry over what was done to Trayvon. We have got to all get past any racial barriers and live together in harmony, appreciating and celebrating each other's cultures. All races, all cultures. It disappoints me so much to still see so much racism in this day and age, among many different cultures. We can do better than this. We are Americans!
Click to expand...

I think the racial tensions are being stirred by the police/prosecutor's responses. I would be just as outraged if the victim were purple.

GZ did have a problem with young black males, whether that was because of racism or past victimization remains to be seen IMO.
 
Belinda said:
It bothers me that the MSM keeps saying the shooting has sparked racial tensions. I don't see that. I see just as many white as black people standing for Tray. I think race played a role in the killing, but I don't believe it is playing a role in the response to it. Just about everyone is very, very angry over what was done to Trayvon. We have got to all get past any racial barriers and live together in harmony, appreciating and celebrating each other's cultures. All races, all cultures. It disappoints me so much to still see so much racism in this day and age, among many different cultures. We can do better than this. We are Americans!
Click to expand...

I think race played a role in the response from Sanford LE? I listened to the rally last night and the community is angry with the Sanford Police Department. They are angry that this White Police Chief, Bill Lee, has been so vocal in defending Zimmerman to the media when it appears that there was very little investigation into the shooting of Trayvon Martin.

They are not angry at a whole race, a whole group, or anything like that. The fact is that Tray's race did play a role in his death and the response of the Sanford Police Department.

We can't get away from the fact that it appears race played a role in this whole scenario? But the Sanford Community appeared to be extremely grateful for EVERYONE, of all races, who have stepped forward!
 
Reader said:
NORMALLY, a detective would attend the autopsy and gather the external evidence they feel is needed for an investigation from the coroner...clothes, bullets, etc. and the coroner is responsible for further testing of the body. He/she would also be responsible for a diagram and report of all injuries to TM's body and plotting the track of the bullet.

As far as we know now none of this was done by a detective. I'm very interested in what exactly the coroner tested with TM's body or sent for further testing and his reports and diagrams.

One of the first rules of investigation is to preserve the scene and collect the evidence. SPD only accomplished a BIG FAIL with this rule.

SPD did NO investigation at all...they accepted the word of the killer and aggressor on the spot. This case was not handled NORMALLY.
Click to expand...

I guess things have changed because when my husband was a detective the ME did the tracking. I remember him telling me he had to attended an autopsy of a man who was shot twice in the head and they had to put the brain in a chemical to "bake" so it could be opened. At first they thought it was one bullet entering and an exit wound. Once the brain was opened there were two bullets which ruled out that it was a suicide. He said it was very interesting to watch how they do it. But I guess if only one shot was fired it would be easier to tell if there were an exit wound too. The victim was found down by the river in his car kind of thing. jmo
 
HiHater said:
I think the racial tensions are being stirred by the police/prosecutor's responses. I would be just as outraged if the victim were purple.

GZ did have a problem with young black males, whether that was because of racism or past victimization remains to be seen IMO.
Click to expand...

BBM - Exactly!
 
http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/NeighborhoodWatchProgram-SPDPowerPoint.pdf

I'm kind of offended by this presentation provided by the Sanford police for the Neighborhood Watch Program. On page 8 it shows a black and white picture (no color at all) of neighbors together and they appear to be all white and it's fine but on page 9 it shows a "criminal" on a colored page and the "criminal" is also in color and it appears to be someone of color. It's very subliminal in nature but I certainly got the message. jmo :what:
 
LolaMoon08 said:
I think race played a role in the response from Sanford LE? I listened to the rally last night and the community is angry with the Sanford Police Department. They are angry that this White Police Chief, Bill Lee, has been so vocal in defending Zimmerman to the media when it appears that there was very little investigation into the shooting of Trayvon Martin.

They are not angry at a whole race, a whole group, or anything like that. The fact is that Tray's race did play a role in his death and the response of the Sanford Police Department.

We can't get away from the fact that it appears race played a role in this whole scenario? But the Sanford Community appeared to be extremely grateful for EVERYONE, of all races, who have stepped forward!
Click to expand...

I am on the fence about the PD. I can't figure out if it is racism or GZ's connections that have caused the embarrassing response to this murder. Or a combination of both. I absolutely agree that race played a part in the murder itself. I see no way around that. It is what it is.
 
ScubaTwinn said:
Neighbor comes to defense of Trayvon Martin's shooter.

“I think any time you use a weapon, there are certain anger issues working,” Taaffe said. “I think he had fed-up issues. He was mad as hell and wasn't going to take it anymore.”

The last sentence upsets me.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...r-comes-to-defense-of-trayvon-martins-shooter
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This is what I want to know? George Zimmerman, in his calls to LE, states that his WIFE was the one who gave the information to the police about the suspects in the burglaries. Did Mrs. Zimmerman witness these burglaries? Did she call 911 as she witnessed these burglaries? Is there a description, as she is witnessing these burglaries, on those 911 calls? It appears to me that ALL black men were suspicious to Zimmerman and his wife? And I doubt that she was an eyewitness to these burglaries and just came to the conclusion... oh yeah, I seen some suspicious black guys walking down the street!

Also, when it comes to a point when a person is fed up... that person has the responsibility to back the *modslip* up! He was a ticking time bomb! Thank you, sir other neighborhood watch captain, you just proved this point!
 
Here's what TWO witnesses heard and saw:

While some neighbors were still on the phone with the emergency dispatchers, cries for help followed by a gunshot sounded in the background.
"The time that we heard the whining and then the gunshot, we did not hear any wrestling, no punching, no fighting, nothing to make it sound like there was a fight," said Mary Cutcher, one of the callers.
Cutcher said Zimmerman was confused after the shooting.
"He'd pace and go back to the body and just like -- I don't know if he was kind of 'Oh, my God, what did I do? What happened?' " she said.
Another caller, Selma Mora Lamilla, said she did not hear any altercation, but the teen cried and "whimpered" before the shooting.
She described Zimmerman as "straddling" the teen after the shooting, saying he was "on his knees on top of a body."
Click to expand...
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/21/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_c2
 
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