FL - 17-yo Boy Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #2

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i.b.nora said:
There was at least one arrest made in the 2500 block of Retreat View Circle, on February 7, 2012 of an 18 year old black male.
http://florida.arrests.org/Arrests/Emmanuel_Burgess_7189120/
I do not know, nor have I looked for any further information on that arrest, or that individual.
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They didn't all get away...I posted the link to this before, here's a screenshot...

e62bdz.png
 
gitana1 said:
Well, to be fair, I didn't really get that impression. They showed neighbors around a table in a color slide and one was clearly black and one appeared to be Asian. The criminal with the mask seemed to have no color or be white.
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You were looking at page 5. I was looking at page 8 and they all appear to be white, page 9 is in color and the criminal skin is shaded where on page 8 there is no shading. As I said it appears to be subliminal. I'm sure there was no intention for it to appear that way but any materials that are distributed to the public should be sensitive. If I picked it up I'm sure others have, too. jmo
 
Reader said:
Thanks....Sorry, my sentence wasn't clear but I did mean the coroner/ME was responsible for the bullet tracking. Good example you gave of why this is so important. Where the bullet entered and exited, how close the gun was to TM's body when shot and the angle of the shot can tell us a lot about what was going on during this confrontation.

Another point I haven't seen mentioned so far IIRC...did Trayvon have any
defensive wounds to his hands or arms..also could show/prove that he was not attacking GZ at the time of the shot being fired.
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I hunted thru many articles, with no luck in order to determine if Tray was shot in the front. Heck, he could even have been shot in the back while trying to run away from Zimmerman with gun drawn. Tray laying face down, sounds strange unless Zimmerman turned him over or Tray was on top of Zimmerman while he shot him. And also at what distance was shot was fired.
I would not be surprised if Tray will be exhumed in order to get to the bottom of this. Did they even do an autopsy?
 
Belinda said:
I feel that this quote shows quite clearly that GZ was out to get somebody. Mad as hell about what? Potholes? A few burglaries? He wasn't going to take what anymore?
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He seems to have an anger problem.
 
CathyinTexas said:
Is following someone with a loaded gun illegal?
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Unless you are a cop or a licensed PI it is illegal to follow anybody in public places at all. It is called stalking. Further more once somebody starts running from you, it can be considered assault in certain cases if you chase them.

That is why Cathy I don't understand the people in here that say Zimmerman shot Tray in self defense. He was following, then chasing somebody who clearly was in fear of him. Even if Tray stopped running to fight him, by law Tray was the one who was standing his ground. And it is nonsense to think anything else.

On another note, I have a feeling that they will charge Zimmerman with 2nd degree murder and then cut a deal with him for manslaughter in exchange for his testimony against the Sanford PD. I think the Justice Department is going to go after some of the Sanford PD for their role in the coverup of Tray's death.
 
curl_in_progress said:
George Zimmerman is a BULLY with aggression issues. I think he absolutely thought he could confront Tray and push him around and detain him. So when Tray pushes back or defends himself and probably gets in a few good hits, GZ gets pissed off. I think that's why there is speculation of two altercations. In the first altercation GZ pushes Tray and gets physically aggressive with him. Maybe that is when GZ gets punched in the nose, if this alleged bloody nose story is true. Because remember, one 911 call from a man says they are fighting on his back porch. There is no screaming for help in that call. (If I remember correctly.) The fight somehow breaks up or Tray gets away. Then when Tray starts to walk away, GZ gets up pulls out his gun and goes after Tray again. This time Tray sees the gun and starts screaming for help which is documented in the 911 call by another neighbor. And we all know what happens next........


This is all my opinion and I am heartbroken thinking of the fear this child felt before be died.

ETA: If there were 2 altercations and the first one broke up for any period of time, then GZ should be charged with first degree murder. Because that means he went after Tray again when he could have run away. Except this time he had time to think about pulling out his gun before going after him.
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I think your scenario is plausible and I wonder why we haven't heard Nancy Grace call for justice for Trayvon. Maybe I missed it.
 
With the situation as it stands, I can't see this being drug out for another 3 weeks before the grand jury convenes. Aren't there instances where they can be called in to deal with a specific case? If nothing is going to be done until then, it is just going to continue to increase the anger of the community and the country at large.

ETA: Can the DA charge without the grand jury at this point?
 
Belinda said:
With the situation as it stands, I can't see this being drug out for another 3 weeks before the grand jury convenes. Aren't there instances where they can be called in to deal with a specific case? If nothing is going to be done until then, it is just going to continue to increase the anger of the community and the country at large.

ETA: Can the DA charge without the grand jury at this point?
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The DA chose to go to the grand jury, in my opinion, this was done to shift responsibility again. The ball was passed from the police to the DA and now to the grand jury. I think, I'm not totally sure, but I think that charges can be brought before and even after the grand jury. I'm sure someone will correct me if I got it wrong :)
 
While they keep passing the buck, the issue and the tempers get hotter and hotter. When are these people going to buy a clue?
 
It's just sickening. The whole deal, beginning to end just smells of no justice.
 
The "stand your ground" law and "castle doctrine" laws cover two totally different situations.

Castle Doctrine's state a person has no duty to retreat when their home is attacked.

Stand Your Ground states exactly that the defender has no duty or other requirement to abandon a place in which he has a right to be, or to give up ground to an assailant. Under such laws, there is no duty to retreat from anywhere the defender may legally be




tlcox said:
During the debate concerning this incident, some have brought into question the "Stand Your Ground" law, more commonly referred to as the "castle doctrine," which has been used by the attacker to pardon his actions.

snip

The castle doctrine as passed, clarified that individuals are lawfully able to defend themselves when attacked and there is no duty to retreat when an individual is attacked on their property

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012...er-not-covered-under-law-wrote/#ixzz1pn0YXGUL

Reads as if the castle doctrine stand your ground law primary sponsor feels that GZ was in the wrong and uses the word "attack" to describe the action.

Unless I am mistaken, castle doctrine should not apply anyway because regardless of who touched who first, GZ was NOT being "attacked" on HIS property.

This is why I am so angry with the initial police response that "oh, we can't arrest him, we aren't allowed - he claims self defense"

It is so not LE's call to make, it is a judge who will make that call.
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I have a few questions if anyone has seen the answers anywhere:

1) How long were SPD officers on the scene the night of the incident?

2) I know please say they have questioned Zimmerman more than once. Any one know the locations of said questionings? I assume one was at the scene that night.

3) Was Zimmerman ever taken to Police HQ at all that night?
 
rossva said:
I have a few questions if anyone has seen the answers anywhere:

1) How long were SPD officers on the scene the night of the incident?

2) I know please say they have questioned Zimmerman more than once. Any one know the locations of said questionings? I assume one was at the scene that night.

3) Was Zimmerman ever taken to Police HQ at all that night?
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1) We have no idea?

2) Obviously at the scene. See below.

3) Police say that Zimmerman was taken to the station for questioning that night. I don't know if they drove him, or if Zimmerman drove himself?

ETA: Don't worry! I am still going out! I'm leaving in 10 minutes! I can't stay away!
 
I think Sanford PD has been totally blindsided by the incredible response to this murder. They thought they could quietly sweep it under the rug. NOT! There are too many people who are outraged over this and aren't going to stand for it. I think they just figured that out. I bet there is some serious shaking in their boots going on in that town.

ETA: I tend to be very pro-LE as my mother is a retired cop. But, I have just been sickened over the behavior of the police department in this case.
 
jjenny said:
Well of course he is going to defend the law he came up with.
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There's nothing wrong with the law.

The problem is that some people keep trying to make this case fit that law or vice versa.

It started with the police, and continues, but police are not to interpret the law.
 
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